Sony Vaio S Series - SATA 3 Investigation

Basically, we are aware the Vaio S has SATA 3 capabilities, but I'm getting mixed results.

Sometimes I'll get SATA 3 speeds in CDM or sometimes I'll get SATA 2. If you have an S series with a SATA 3 SSD could you please run Crystal Disk Mark and post the results?

If you get over ~250 MB/sec then you're running SATA 3, if its around 250 or below then you're on SATA 2.

Example of SATA 3 results (with Samsung 830 256GB):


Example of SATA 2 results (same exact computer as above):

 

Is there something we can do about this?

 

Hi I don't know if my crucial m4 works correct. The transfer data seems a bit low, doesnt it?

 

There are known glitches now and then with different SSDs and laptops. Sometimes an SSD switches to SATA2 for no apparent reason. Might be your case.

 

Normally I would say so too, but it appears most people with SSDs are getting SATA 2 regardless of brand, which is why it's odd.

 

Hmm the read speeds seem to be a little low, but the write speeds are spot on, the M4 doesn't have high sequential write speeds, but it's very rarely you'll ever saturate it even with it's lower speeds

 

Ah, so you guys are able to get SATA 3 SSDs to register (and thus work) in your 2012 Vaio S? Because I can't and yet I know for certain that the SSD I'm trying to use isn't defective. :-\

 

thank god i saw this post, i have an exact same thing with my samsung 830 ssd, anyone has any ideas how to resolve this issue?

 

Can you take crystal disk info? according to mine its sata/600 so certainly its SATA 3 so how can it be that the speeds are so slow ? there must be something else causing this?

 

Between the time of those two tests did you install any drivers or change any of the configuration of the OS?

 

ok guys i just spend quality time tring to talk to sony tech support and basically i was told that new sony vaio s 15 bios doesn't support sata 3 and they have no idea how to get it. So this really confirms that all new sony s models come with sata2 ... what a utterly big disappointment this is. Seriously sony ...

 

and more post on this... to confirm that sony vaio s is in sata2 you can check this from Intel rapid storage... see attached image...s

 

If thats the case then how did that user achieve SATA3 speeds once, and then the next time it was SATA2? It must be possible.

 

i cant comment on that all i can say is what my laptop shows... and there is no way achieve any greater speeds with sata2. am greatly disappointed...

 

i have a theory.
the intel panther point does support SATA3, but only 2 of such ports.
the only 2 SATA3 ports have been hardwired to the raid 0 internal SSD. (Available on 13A16)

If you did not purchase the 13A16, then you will be utilising the normal SATA connector which is hardwired into the SATA2 port.

I have a 13A15, and my Crucial M4 reports in Intel RST as 3Gb/s only

 

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i think the limitation is in bios but i could be wrong but this is what i read elsewhere

 

But did they told you that are working on it or that they'll just drop the leave it as it is?

 

They said nothing, e.g. they have no info at this time... sony tech support is one of the worst i have come across... it seems they are "google" in their internal database to find any answer. My good guess is that you wont be seeing any updates anytime near future. Overall I could live with sata2 speeds... in terms of speeds you would not notice the difference. What i can't live with is the sony orangegate. I am waiting my fedex return label and will be shipping it back tomorrow.

 

Interesting for sure. I wish I had caught this thread before purchasing. I just got my sony s 15.5, everything is good except this sata issue, I really can't believe we have to worry about stuff like this on a brand new ivy bridge laptop. I just sold a laptop that was a year old and sata 3 worked fine on it...WTH?

I got my laptop new today, put in my samsung 830 256gb and was pretty happy at first. I installed all of my drivers (and updated bios...oops) after downloading from Sony, then I checked the intel rapid storage just to browse, only to find what most of you found, 3g instead of 6g speed on the SSD. I did not verify whether or not I had 6gb before the bios update. I have rebooted several times, most reboots result in sata II, but I did have one reboot just a while ago that was 6gb. I have no idea why, but it seemed to revert back to sata 2 on the next reboot. See the images, 6gb and really great speed on benchmark, then reboot, sata II and half speed.

I called Sony support and escalated which was a total pain, I sat on the phone for an hour, then finally got to a guy that still didn't know jack about computers, but said he was sending the issue to engineering. They will give me a call back Monday or so...but I'm not holding my breath.

Still can't believe it doesn't just work, I deal with a lot of hardware every day and I haven't had any of even my sandy bridge laptops have issues, they are all older and running 6gb.

I wonder if the cable is just a little subpar...I haven't done a tear down to figure out whether I can replace it.

 

I feel for you ... I spend lot of time with Sony tech support only to find out they don't have no idea what are you talking about... This issue and the orange/ red issue (did u check that tread) made me return mine. Am getting Asus instead now ...

 

Yeah this is a total bummer, I just realized my has some issues with the headphone jack too, and mic. I really thought this laptop was the one.....nice and light, still powerful enough to dev on with visual studio.....

I think I'm going to go asus as well, it's heavier but they always pay attention to performance and everything will work. The cooling is quite a bit better on the asus too.... I guess that's why it's thicker/heaver .

 

Depends on which Asus you are talking about. The N56VZ has terrible WiFi (maxed out at 65 Mbit next to the router) and is really plasticy and flimsy. It's quite heavy too.

 

Yeah I suppose there can be issues with any of these...but paying nearly $1300 for a 15" laptop makes me expect a little higher quality. At the very least, we shouldn't have to worry about whether or not the laptops headphone jacks work, the speakers should be louder than my smartphone, and sata III should just work .

I like the form factor, weight, and screen though. Still trying to decide if it's going back or not.

 

The headphone jack problem most people get is most likely due to them not pushing them in hard enough. The first couple of times the jacks can be quite hard to push the headphone connector into. So try pushing it harder.

For me wifi is a much bigger issue than Sata III and speakers.

 

Yeah I understand your point of view. Another annoyance for me is the fan noise. I do a lot of visual studio development and simply compiling a small WPF project results in 3000-4000rpm fans. They do quickly quiet down, but its very similar to the issues I've had with macbook pros being crazy loud. At least it doesn't sound like a hair dryer like the pro did, and it does quiet down quickly right after.

The screen alone might be enough to make me keep it though....I love the screen.

 

I just got my Asus from xoticpc this morning and I love it. Is definitely heavier but SSD is runs nicely and the screen colors are very accurate. Am not sure what WiFi problems people talking about mine is fine.

 

Is it the N56VZ? Do you get 100 Mbit+ on your wifi? I haven't heard of someone that got that with the N56VZ.

 

Looks like I have a temporary 6gb Sata III fix for now. Here it is if anyone else wants to try.

Problem: If you boot the system cold or do a restart, windows will start up and be in sata II 3gb mode.

Solution: I put the computer to sleep, look at intel rapid storage, and it's now at 6gb and scores much higher.

Pretty weird behavior.

If it doesn't work for you, the only other thing I did with my configuration was disable the cdrom in the bios. To do that, click F2 on boot up, disable internal dvd.

I don't think you'll need to do this but I had done it previously and left it that way....which may be why mine is working when I resume from sleep.

I have tested this enough to confirm that every time I come out of sleep it's 6gb, on cold boot/restart it's 3gb.

Hope this helps and others can find the same result.

 

Hmm, that is quite interesting jlrosine. Almost feels like something is run at startup to disable it. What happens if you got SATA III speeds in Intel Rapid Storage and then choose "log out" instead of shutdown and log in again. Does the SATA III stay or does it go away?

 

It's 6gb if I logout/log back in too. The only time it changes to 3g is on reboot/cold boot, and the only time it changes to 6g is after resume from sleep.

 

Then it seems it isn't some software that's limiting it at startup of Windows. Seems to be something at boot, maybe something in BIOS? Either made on purpose by Sony or a bug. If it is the latter they could be able to fix it later on.

 

144mpbs right now in my office room (wifi is in living room), am not sure which wifi card you have because i upgraded mine for extra 30 dollars to Intels N 6235 and it seems have picking up signals i never saw in my area before.

 

Yeah it could be something buggy with UEFI too. It boots so fast I don't know how it figures out anything (hits windows load screen almost instantly).

 

Yeah, must be that. The ones over here seem to come with the Atheros card. When you say 144 mbps is that measured speed or what the link sais? I think 120+ measured speed is sort of a minimum of what you can demand today.

 

Wow, I tested the sleep theory and so far it works! 250MB/sec read speeds on a cold boot, and 500MB/sec reads after it resumes from sleep.

Weird!

 

Nice, glad it "worked" for you too. I'm hoping to chat with sony support engineers Monday or Tuesday and tell them about it. If they have steps to reproduce the behavior maybe they'll actually fix it. Sometimes that's all engineers need....a list of steps to prove they screwed up .

 

I can also reproduce full speed after sleep, so no issue for me as I would rarely do a full boot cycle as opposed to just closing the lid.

 

Yeah I might also use hibernate until they get the issue fixed, at least then I can tote it around without cycling the battery too, and not have to sleep for 6g.

 

Yep this is definitely all software related. I just bought the Vaio SVS1511 and have installed a Sandisk extreme SSD. On a cold boot it will achieve SATA 2 speeds and after closing/reopening the lid it will achieve SATA 3 speeds.

However, this only worked for me when disabling the CD drive as mentioned before. When I tried it without disabling the CD drive in the BIOS, the sleep/awake process did not work and SATA 2 was only possible.

Other than this issue (and maybe some others like quiet, tinny sound and quite a poor touchpad) I think it's a fantastic laptop and for me, the screen is the key feature. I never get tired of looking at it. One thing that's really annoying though is the inability to upgrade both RAM sticks and only being limited to one, as one is soldered to the motherboard. Why on earth would Sony do that?!

Is there any news from Sony Customer support yet about the SATA issue? My best guess for a solution is a BIOS refresh.

 

Really I thought that the touchpad is actually quite good for a PC albeit Sony could have used glass. I agree the speakers are abysmal. Sony soldered ram onto the board to keep the machine slim, a stack of two dimm slots measure to about 9.15mm in height.

We can always wait for someone to release a modded bios and then we could try and see how sony does this whole sata III malarkey. Ivy Bridge supports sata 3 and usb 3.0 natively, so it all must be in the bios/uefi. I don't belive that the ports are hardwired to be sata 2 as clearly you lot are getting sata 3 speeds. So we need a hacked bios to see what sony potentially disabled.

 

+1 to this, great touchpad, better than any laptop (apple included) i've used before. plus the moddability via synaptics sdk is insane, already cooked up absolute movement etc.

 

Wow, I was expecting more people to be with me on the whole touchpad thing. I don't know, coming from the touchpad on the Macbook Pro I just don't think this is anywhere near as close. I can be much more productive on the Macbook and sometimes I think that using a mouse slows me down on the Macbook, whereas on the Sony using a mouse 100% speeds me up in terms of navigating around the computer.

But tbh, I don't know about modding it or anything like that. I have just literally pulled it out of the box and am using the synaptics software built in. Just to note, I find two finger scrolling to be really dodgy and sometimes it just doesn't react to my multi-touch gestures...don't know why this is but if somebody could enlighten me, please be my guest.

The RAM to keep the laptop thin I can understand in a way...but my old Macbook Pro was just as thin, if not thinner and that had two removable RAM modules, so I know it definitely can be done (I think the RAM on that was side by side instead of stacking it on top of eachother that could be why).

Yeah so if somebody could let me know how I can improve the experience on the touchpad please let me know.

As for the whole BIOS issue (if that's what it is), I think more pressure on Sony from a number of members could be the way forward. Although I have done some investigating on the internet and have found that this exact same issue was reported in the 2011 range of S series laptops...and again the root cause of it (people say) is a BIOS issue. Sony "updated" the BIOS and it removed the SATA 3 speeds. So if those guys have been waiting over a year, I think we'll all be opening and closing our lids for a while lmao.

 

Yeah I'm not with you on the trackpad either, sorry . I love the sony trackpad, just sold my MBP 17 and I don't think the pad was any better. I think maybe you are just used to OSX and the implementation of gestures. IMO Windows in general is much faster to navigate than OSX, and I've used both for years, but I feel like OSX depends heavily on gestures/pad to be really good (mission control/desktop management etc). Even subtle things like the thickness/height of each window in OSX drives me nuts. In Win7 you can grab a title bar/window quickly because it's slightly taller, osx you have to be more precise and it's slower to manage windows and move around. Also, when are they going to implement alt/tab correctly? Bettersnaptool was a life saver on OSX too.....ahh crap getting off on a tangent here.

As for ram, I really don't care, 12gb is plenty. I don't see myself using 12gb on the laptop consistently and being peeved I can't have 16gb. With 12gb I can still run a few VMs and be ok.

I agree with you on pressure, I think if everyone here that really wants sata III to be implemented/fixed properly simply called sony tech support and escalated to engineering, we'd get somewhere. Instead of looking for an answer somewhere else that doesn't exist, use your time to force their hand to a fix.

Apple was forced/pushed to fix their issues too and they eventually got it right, but in 2011 the entire MBP line had sata issues until they fixed EFI. They had issues back when sata II was the big thing, and when sata III hit they repeated their problems, but have since fixed.

Get on the phone if you have some time, hopefully we'll get a real bios from Sony. And lets hope if they start hearing of more complaints/requests for sata III, they won't just disable it altogether .

 

Well, at least for me it took a couple of adjustments to get the two finger scrolling to the point where I feel it's natural to use.. but otherwise I'm not having problems with gestures not registering or otherwise.

However, are you comparing the touchpad experience of MBP with OS X to the touchpad experience of Sony on Windows? Because from what I've heard, while the Macbook touchpad is still one of the best touchpads (if not the best) for Windows use, it's not that amazing once you lose the additional support OS X has built in to improve the experience.

 

yes that's exactly what I mean. The integration of the MB Pro touchpad with OS X is amazing. Like I said I prefer it to the mouse for most things. But as soon as you use it on Windows via Bootcamp it becomes utterly useless (but I think that's down to Apple not wanting to support Windows effectively lol).

I'm actually getting used to this touchpad now, I've adjusted some settings in the synpatics software and have found it to be quite good. The width of the touchpad is a bit awkward at first but I'm sure I'll get used to it. It should have been glass though...the touchpad is a tad rough.

I think that's exactly what I'm going to do. I will call Sony myself and confront them with the problem. If others can do it too that will be great. Need to get this sorted!

 

Everybody with the SATA 2/3 issue, try uninstalling the Intel SATA AHCI Rapid Storage driver, let it work with the original Windows SATA AHCI 1.0 driver and see if it fixes the problem.

I've been observing incorrect behavior with the mentioned driver (messes up SMART data), it's very likely that the buggy driver messes with the SATA mode as well.

Please try it and let us know if it becomes any better.

 

I might try this later but I have my doubts it will work.

On a positive note, the screen on this thing is quite a bit better than my MBP. Everyone always raves about the MBP screens, I wasn't very impressed. I looked at the retina with the semi glare, I'd rather have this sony IPS matte any day. The max resolution for me on a 15" is about 1900x1080 or 1200 anyway (even that's sorta high for my eyes), so the retina doesn't offer anything to me.

 

Well the S15 screen is an IPS panel made my LG which exhibits the orange-gate issue, not a problem for most users, good graphic designers use external monitors that have close to 100% colour accuracy but that would also be cost prohibitive to put on a laptop. Mind you that this display is advertised as the vaio display 'plus'

The one that most people complain about including myself is the screen used in the s13p, it is marketed/advertised as the vaio display 'premium' when it is not, it's clearly worse than the s15 screen and some say it is worse than the standard s13 screen (768p). Most people again wouldn't have a problem with this display. Although personally I feel that it is misleading and cheating for sony to market it as the "premium" display. I bet this display is made by LG since LG makes the panel for the S15 so it would make sense for Sony to order more screens from LG to decrease cost and take advantage of economies of scale.

Sata III although nice to have wouldn't really have much of an impact on day to day computing unless yours consists of constant data transfer and heavy usage an example would be a web server. But again Ivy Bridge supports SATA III natively but sony chooses to disable this to force consumers to purchase their version of raided ssds which use sata III, this also naughty in my books.

 

I think you aren't being very fair/accurate. I'm not going to accuse sony of disabling anything purposely, I can't think of a reason why they'd do that. You think product owner at Sony are sitting around saying "yeah lets make our ssds work with sata 3 and not others, then once word gets out after we've sold some, people in forums will tell other tech people in forums that represent .00001% of users that actually know they are doing, and they'll return their laptops and get our SSDs...then we'll be RICH!" ?? LOL

I just want them to be aware of the issues with sata 3, who knows maybe they'll fix them in the next few months and everyone will be happy. Saying that sata 2 is just fine on a new laptop that you expect to get sata 3 on is a little ridiculous too. I paid for a laptop that supports sata 3 and that I expected sata 3 on, if I wanted sata 2 I would have saved $500 and gone with something else/older. I look at it the same way I look at power management on processors. Imagine if you bought a new ivy or sandy bridge i7 laptop that was an upgrade from a 1.7ghz "old" i7, and sony screwed up power management where it ran underclocked/75% of it's capability all the time. Sure...surfing maybe you wouldn't notice, but I will when running a VM or developing apps in visual studio while running VMs.

Sorry for the rant..just sort of sick of people acting like we should accept it .

 

In case anyone was wondering, sata 3 will be disabled if you remove the optical drive and install a second hard drive, and enable it .