Vaio Z monitor test - a very common defect?

Hello all


From reading other posts I have a sneaking suspicion that all vpc-z models have a nasty problem resembling ghosting. I noticed it myself today after having used my computer for about 6 months now. I was not aware of it before, though it may have been a problem from the beginning.

It is not a problem restricted to specific software or settings. It occurs in both speed and stamina mode and in all applications displaying closely spaced vertical lines. Horizontal lines do not pose a problem.

Please open the attached png image file in fullscreen (at 100%, not resized to fit the window, if you see a magnifying glass with a plus in it, click it). On the right you will see black vertical lines, on the left you will see boxes of different colors. If your screen has the defect these boxes will appear to have similar vertical lines. You will see though if you block the vertical black lines that they will disappear on the colors too.

This is not a fringe or negligible problem, for people who work with graphics it can be a serious nuisance. In any case it is a flaw of the hardware.

I would be very happy if all Z model users could check to see if they have the same issue, then we can establish this as a common problem and hope for a fix.

 

I hate you. I was happy with my VPCZ115GG until now.

 

Yes, although not very prominent, the effect is clearly there on the 1600x900 display of my VPCZ122GX/B.

 

It's an artifact of the Vaios having 6-bit screens, and have to dither to approximate 8-bit. The dithering method they chose is affected by what else is on the screen.

AFAICT, of the "high end" machines, only the TT had a true 8-bit display.

 

That is very good to know, wish I knew it before I bought it...

So I take it that ALL Vaio Z models probably have this flaw, and that it was probably not an unintended flaw, but a necessary evil of an otherwise fine, perhaps superior, dithering method?

Would you know, if it is a case of dithering, whether it is software or hardware? I mean is a nonsurgical firmware update or display driver update from Sony a possible remedy? I take it that the specific dithering method Sony chose is not necessarily used by other manufacturers, and thus this problem might be a specific Vaio Z issue?

 

I'm not quite sure what I'm looking at. **scratches head**

 

Do you see vertical lines over the colors on the left? If you do, you have found the problem. Make sure you look at the image in full size.

 

Interestingly, there are some guys that voted not to have this issue. In each case, I think in VERY rare cases you will get distorted image like with this test image in REAL LIFE.

 

I also noted that the appearance of vertical lines in the colors isn't immediate (with the first appearance of any vertical lines on the display). It is only after a certain percentage of the display contains the vertical lines. If I cared about it more, I'd spend the time to firgure out at exactly what point they appear.

 

Didn't vote as I don't have a VPC-Z, but my VGN-Z (with 1600x900) shows ghosting too. First thought it was my eye playing one of those funky visual tricks on the brain, but the issue seems to really exist (was ruled out by physically covering the vertical lines with paper and looking at just the colours).

I recall a thread a while back where a VPC-Z owner here saw random ghosting when he had cmd.exe opened, along with notepad (with something typed inside with a specific font), all while having IMG17 set as the wallpaper background (an official wallpaper under the Windows 7 Architecture theme). Back then some other VPC-Z users (not all) were able to replicate that issue, though if memory serves correct the issue was more prominant on the 1080p panels than the 900p versions. That ghosting, I was unable to replicate on my VGN-Z.

 

My 1920x1080 Z does seem to exhibit some straight lines on the left, but in now way is it "black" as you described. It's just some purple-ish colored lines sorta like what you see from dead pixels, but doesn't really bother me much. I'm using 1600x900 resolution now btw.

 

Mine seems to be ok, Z13 Uk model, but now I'm slightly worried. Will get another opinion on this as my eyesight is not the best.

 

The lines on the right are black but the ones on the left are different shades of the colours of the boxes.

Thank god I don't spend all day looking at pictures of lines The "problem" goes away when you zoom in beyond 100%.

 

Actually I didn't mean to say that the ghost lines appear black, but that they are in the same spaced pattern as the black lines. On my screen too, the ghosted lines appear as distortions of the colored boxes.

Though it is not a major problem for all users, some will encounter it often.

If you work with CAD software and you use hatches, you may frequently use patterns as these. That was the case when I discovered this. Earlier I had noticed that some websites with diagonally striped backgrounds would have distorted images too, I passed it of as html gone bad.

The earlier post about notepad and the Lucida Console font I think it was, was just one example where the problem presents itself, it probably has nothing to do with notepad or the specific font nor the specific background. Probably it was easily detectable because Lucida Console is a very clear font, notepad has a white background, and the desktop background had the perfect brightness to display the artifacts. It is most clearly visible with midtones.

Should we notify Sony of this to make sure that they realize the problem? They probably know it already, but haven't told us because they felt it was insignificant. Yet, I paid about $2000 for my machine, and I love it, but this disappoints me, and I think I am entitled to expect that it would be free of such flaws. At the least I have learned to look for a true 8bit display next time.

Incidentally, Apple was sued in a similar case about 6bit displays. The case was settled out of court, but it perhaps made Apple think twice about wording in their advertising.


Read here: Apple quietly settles MacBook 6-bit LCD screen lawsuit -- Engadget

 

I don't think this is a 6bit vs. 8bit issue, just some anomaly or design flaw with the Z's panel. I have many other 6 bit panel packing laptops and none of them exhibit this behavior.

 

Don't see it on my Z13

 

Yeah, it's not happening on my Aspire One A110 netbook, which probably has a 6-bit panel. So either it's the dithering algorithm, or something else... some interference perhaps. Seems weird, cuz the internal LCD is hooked up via DisplayPort as far as I know.

 

Hardware. It's the display that does it -- it receives data in 8 bits per colour from the graphics card, and then displays it on a screen that physically only can handle 6 bits per colour.

Yes, the screen on the Z is crappy. It has poor viewing angles, is almost impossible to calibrate, and while it has a large colour gamut, it's missing a lot of nuances within that gamut.
But then again, few laptops have really good displays. It's one of the most expensive components in a laptop, and keeping the price down is necessary to stay competitive. Dell Alienware has a couple of models with really good displays, and Asus had one (discontinued now, alas), but overall, you can choose between crappy and crappier.
The sad thing is that this trend is moving on to desktop displays too. Consumers (spit!) vote with their wallets, and aren't willing to pay the premium for IPS and 8-bit. They want bright colours, not correct ones, but most of all, they want it cheap. So people don't buy quality, and quality disappears. Consumerism at its finest.

 

Different 6-bit displays use different algorithms. Each has its own strengths and weaknesses. The one in the Z works well with high contrast and smooth gradients, but not on a combination of the two. The one used in my Dell has problems with bright images, where temporal dithering becomes noticeable as flicker. There's no one algorithm that's "best" - they all have trade-offs.

One good source of information on display problems from someone who even uses a Z: jbarnes' braindump :: Debugging display problems

 

Woah, Z having a crappy display? Not trying to be rude, but that's one of the most outrageous statements anyone could every make. I can accept that you call the Z's display as being weak (I mean physically), but not the display itself being crappy.

A laptop display, to most consumers, or even enthusiasts, is about "how good it looks", and not "oh its a 8 bit display with 2 trillion colors and an amazing 178 degree viewing angle with 3 times normal saturation!".

Point being made, first there's almost no scenario where you'll come across a photo like what the OP posted. Second, we're discussing something that's way off what an average consumer should even be worrying about.

I am very happy with my Z's screen. Just not the screen's strength itself.

 

Same here. I see know vertical lines whatsoever on the colored portion of the image. Why do some do it and others do not?

 

I would add that, although the paper thin screen is easily bendable, if you bend it fairly hard, it immediately goes back to its normal shape and there are no tell-tale problems with the image, and the structural integrity returns to what it was before you bend it. You have to really abuse the lid/screen to cause permanent damage. This seems like much ado about nothing - both this alleged image problem and the physical vulnerability. Yes, this $3,000 instrument requires care, but it's not exactly fragile. Look for weaknesses in any premium notebook and you will find them, but ask the dozens of people who have been posting to these threads for over a year and see if any of the experienced owners/users report catastrophic problems.

 

View the image full size, not resized to fit your screen. If viewing in Firefox, for example, click the image to unshrink it (cursor shows circle with plus sign inside). Then look at the coloured bars. If there are more that say 2 inches of thin black and white stripes showing on your screen, the coloured bars will also show faint thin stripes. If you cover the black and white stripes with another window, or resize the browser window (not resize the image) so that the black and white stripes are not visible, then the faint stripes on the coloured bard will disappear.

The image provided is one that demonstrates the problem. Once you know that a problem exists, you view every image with suspicion, wondering what effect certain parts of the image are having on other parts of the image. For graphics designers/ architects/ interior designers etc. this is unacceptable. That is the point of this thread.

It is good that this matter has been brought to the forefront. E.G. when you send images to clients, it is important to have an idea of how things will look on their screens; you can ask them to view the images on a proper monitor or TV screen before rejecting your designs outright.

 

Z13 w/1080p and I don't see it...

 

I also dont see it.

 

Are you sure you're viewing the image at native size? What program are you using to view it?

 

Try 900p using the default windows photo viewer and full size it. Z13 with 1080p (native) screen and I see them when viewing it full size @900p.

But then again, this proves that you need to adjust and mess around with settings in order to see the screen to exhibit distortions. In order to prove that an item is faulty you don't mess around with the item until it exhibits a fault. The fault should be inherited in the item itself.

 

This happens on my Z13. The lines are noticeable, but not well defined. This also occurs on my X200T, but the lines are even less noticeable than the X13.

 

yes I see it, VPCZ134GX, Core i5 460M chip

 

VPCZ11, 1080p, clearly visible lines screen-wide

 

LOL I am retarded, please ignore one of the "No" and add one to "Yes". I voted "No", because I ran this test on my 23" LCD Monitor first LOL. Realizing my stupidity I ran it again on my Z and yeah I do have it.

FYI: I have the VPCZ1 with the 1920 x 1080 resolution screen.

 

Ok, I've had four friends look at this on my Z13 and none of us can see an issue with the display.

 

LOL Someone please post a how to video.

 

Make sure you are at native resolution - I know my screen won't show the lines at 1600x900, but will at 1920x1050

-Peter

 

My Z13 only has a max res of 1600x900.

 

VPCZ1390X (SonyStyle USA purchased)... 1600x900 display.
I can see the lines... inside the (left) coloured portion of the image running vertically just like the right half of the image (plain black and white lines)... and when I output to my dell 24" LCD i do not see them.

so yes! i am confirming the problem.


Good thing i've never seen this problem before, or atleast become aware of it for it to bother me. But atleast now I know.

i'm pretty happy with the Z's screen so far though, it's bright and high-res, and isn't washed-out looking like most other lcd out there...
especially for how thin and small it is, it's good.

i plan to get a IPS display for professional work as always though.