Z2 Owners Damage Warning - Watch those memory card slots!

Heads up!

There is absolutely no reinforcement around the metal cutouts for the memory cards! Result, dented looking front of your new $3000+ Laptop. SERIOUSLY SONY?!!!!

 

^What are you talking about exactly? Did you damage yours somehow??

 

I keep my laptops well protected. It is was bumped, it was by my hands.

 

you made this bump by simply pushing it with your hands? Wasn't this suppose to be reinforced carbon chassis?

 

Yep, got mine damaged, too... I remember I saw it in the middle of a meeting and the look on my face was something like "W..T..F..."

Really cheap

 

Thanks for the warning.
Mine are still fine...perhaps because I leave my cards all of the time inside and rarely take them out.

One corner of laptop got dented though...

 

Take the bottom plate off and if it doesn't snap back into position on it's own, bend it back?

 

mine too but i use tweezers to bend it back, not perfectly nice but acceptable

 

Due to regular use? Ca you post pic?
This is really unbelievable and definitely unacceptable! For premium materials used and even more premium price.... I guess Sony did too much of a weight reduction. I mean, the whole purpose of Z - "built for road warriors" is questionable now. And this is after few months of usage only...

Not reassuring.


Cheers,
Miki

 

Say, do you know where I can buy the bottom plate? Do you know the part number by any chance?

 

I figured out what caused the issue. When my clients meet with me at the office, we sit in large padded armed chairs. I take notes while resting it on one arm. It seems the pressure from typing is causing flex in the bottom frame and the slot/s to collapse inwards.

I am not a heavy handed typer and feel this is absolutely and issue for you couch surfers.

Be carefull!

 

Probably can find on the sony parts site. Don't be surprised if it's $300-400....

 

^
I couldn't find it at their site.
I got a pic and part number from Zoinks.
I also contacted them with the part number/description and Sony have no idea what I am talking about.
Any suggestions?

 

I don't know...if I spent that much money on a laptop, me having to bend something back that never should have been bendable to begin with - especially so easily - would be just about the furthest thing from what I think of as "acceptable" is it could possibly get.

I remember when Sony produced much higher quality stuff. I might even buy from Sony again if they could find a way to return to those days in their approach to business. Heck, I'd even be willing to risk having to deal with their abysmal "Support" if I thought there was a good chance of getting quality from them out of the box.

Keep in mind, this is supposed to be a premier, top-of-the-line laptop that could be bent by casual finger-only contact. Something of this claimed caliber should be built with something stronger than egg shells.

 

That's the kind of thing that makes me really rethink my plans for getting a Z22.

 

Wow, this is no joke.. I just played around with mine and it's pretty darn soft. Anyone tell Sony about this?

 

That's one more reason to stick with the well-respected Z1, Everyday! and Always, at least till Sony Replaces its ty Z2, with another MUCH BETTER Iteration, Outside and Inside.

 

Same issue here. The culprit is the marrying of two incompatible materials in terms of flex: Carbon reinforced thermoplastic vs an aluminium plate. The only extra bolstering the plate has is around the keyboard area, where it's been crimped to turn it more into a shell than a flat plate.

If the notebook was actually made out of 'carbon fiber' you'd possibly see less of these issues as it would be less prone to flex and therefore less likely that the flex would be transferred to the aluminium top plate. Still, it was definitely a design oversight not to mould a supporting tab into the bottom plate around the bottom of the memory card slots.

Sony's decision to have the aluminium top plate is a cosmetic / tactile one. Clearly some people over there thought the '10 Z approach of having a warm / 'cheap feeling' plastic palmrest combined with the aluminium top panel didn't go far enough, but they had to reconcile the incorporation of the more tactile-friendly but less weight-efficient aluminium with lowering the weight, so it became more of a plate than the shell of the '10 Z, and therefore more prone to deforming. Since the use of aluminium in consumer electronics structures is to promote a feeling of 'metal solidity' to the user - regardless of its inferiority to materials like carbon reinforced thermoplastics in a structural sense - this can be considered a fail.

But I don't think any of these issues should necessarily put you off a Z2. In normal use it is basically structurally sound. The real issues are of the GPU arrangement and the godawful keyboard if you're going to spend any time typing on it. Thankfully for me, it's just a mobile adjunct and one of many such adjuncts.

@FrinkTL: At least with Sony it's just a minor part. With Apple I'm occasionally bending the whole thing back into shape

And while there's occasionally a place for my Z13's there is no doubt that I choose to carry the Z2 most of the time. It's only when I need to do something OpenGL-related but still want something lightweight for the rest of that day that I dig out the '10 Z.

Still, it is interesting that like the '10 Z but in a slightly different way this time, it again feels like completely different people are working on the top (plate) and bottom of the notebook.

 

All considerations taken, let's not forget this is a 2000+ bucks product!!!! No such issues should be present! Otherwise why not buy a 500€ Acer - it certainly has no such issues (of course lacks other qualities but is 5 times cheaper!!)

I am absolutely dissatisfied with all Vaio 2011 products I've seen so far! They lack both design and quality!!

The only good thing (but not perfect) I've seen so far is the YB - at least it has the good old design and feels solid. At the same time has a reasonable price.

If I was to buy a laptop this year - it definitely would not be the 2011 Z or S.

Pity, pity....

 

Honestly, I think they've always had one glaring fault in one way or another for a long time. 2008-2009 was definitely a bad time though. But you buy them for what they cumulatively bring to the table.

However, I can absolutely sympathise with people who're saying they're not going to upgrade. Unless you're a 'lowest possible weight' like me, what they've dumped to achieve the stunning weight, runtime + on-the-move-performance combo is of really debatable benefit, especially with the b0rked HD3000 as I'm finding out. I'd assumed that the IGP wouldn't be a whole lot different to at least something like the 320M for e.g. my visualisations, so it wouldn't be a huge step down. That assumption on the basis of the supplied drivers turned out to be definitely incorrect.

But personally, I'm also much happier with the aesthetics of the Z2 than the Z1 and not just because its thinner. That, and the weight plus the overall performance is enough for it to be a definitely step-up from the Z1 for me for general-purpose mobile use and for it to be a keeper despite the issues with the design revisions.

 

All this said and qualities considered, the main question is - Are those qualities combined with the quite major defects and problems really 2000+ bucks worth!? In a time where you can buy a pretty good machine slightly compromising weight for even under 1000!

Sorry but to invest the money for a car in a laptop I would definitely expect it to be nearly perfect, at least what everyday usage requires. And the chassis deforming just like that or hinges constantly unscrewing always makes me ask - "Were those machines EVER tested? Ever USED by a developer? The quality ever assessed !? Or am I buying overpriced electronics straight from the assembly department!?"

At the end of the road when you buy a chair you would expect to be able to sit on it without it deforming or breaking. Why can't we expect to be able to work on a state of the art laptop without it deforming from normal operation?
We are all obviously willing to pay for quality being owners of Vaio and we do!

I am really satisfied with my 2010 S and I really hope I will be able to keep it much longer as I honestly wouldn't know what to buy today if I have to.... it wouldn't be Sony I fear...

Let my opinion not be understood as "hating" - I just feel sorry for Sony going down this road and hope for a better 2012!

I see you are also an Apple owner. I am generally no fan of apple especially being as commercial as they are, but how do you assess their build quality in comparison to Vaio?
MacBook pro is considered a tough machine, isn't it?
Are such quality issues present there too?

 

I would recommend you read the second half of my post here.

 

I do realize that - it is me that always says "don't judge quality by the price"..... but the configuration of a Z is by far not aeronautical technology if you'd excuse me! You can find similar in a 1500 bucks laptop. Which means that you are paying the extra 1000 for it being a VAIO.
So what is it that we consider so valuable about it being a VAIO? - Design and Quality. While design is a matter of personal taste, quality isn't really! And if you find that it is "normal" for any laptop and especially for one you pay extra for the quality to bend and deform from normal usage, we should obviously no longer consider Vaio a "premium" brand but actually a "cheap manufacturer"...

Don't forget that a laptop manufacturer actually has only a few things to take care of:

1. Compatible configuration
2. Adequate cooling
3. Durable construction

So I would never blame Sony if my HDD goes bad - it is a Hitachi HDD and not Sony! And so are almost all other components - Intel, Atheros, etc. etc.
So all a laptop manufacturer needs to ensure is the compatibility and quality of the construction! Why is that so hard to achieve for a company which has long history in the field? It shouldn't be!

 

I think that's the wrong way to look at it. It's not a question of, if you spend a certain amount of money, then it's all rainbows and unicorns.

The Z2 has a certain attribute set (sub-3lbs, full-voltage processor, FHD display) not available in any other notebook. If those attributes are important to you and you can afford/are willing to spend the price, go for the Z. If those Z-specific attributes are not critical to you, then don't. Don't buy a Z because it's the best made laptop. To use the car analogy, if I buy a Ferrari, I'm not buying it as the most reliable car on the market. I could get a bunch of far more reliable cars for less money. What I could not get for less money is the special attributes of a Ferrari.

 

I'm willing to bet the door handles won't deform from normal use, either. That's my take on it.

I do wonder if the sheet battery is used, is this issue moot? The bending slot cover?

 

I don't think the Ferrari uses a sheet battery.

 

http://www.laptop-power-battery.com/img/mid/NAC012.jpg

definately more of a sheet than a block. kk, more of a thick tablet...


(acer brands their useless and underpowered laptops with the "Ferrari" logo. Of course, this is totally not what I meant initially, lol).

 

I'll echo what Louche said. The Z is still unique. The problem perhaps is that it's unique only if you know what you're buying.

It's considered a tough machine by people who know nothing about engineering - i.e. tech writers and reviewers. Apple expertly capitalises on the expectations of laymen as I've said elsewhere. They invested big in utilising a structurally inferior material / construction method, but one that feels so much more premium to most people than Sony's interpretation of 'carbon fibre' (which is at the end of the day, fancy plastic) - and it's paid off in a huge way for them.

Everywhere now there is this completely unfounded myth that the Apples are tough machines, because they're made of metal. And in the end, as long as it's good enough most people - especially the Apple demographic - is not going to notice any difference in ultimate drop resistance, etc. It *is* true however that a Crapbook will shrug off everyday scratches better than a Vaio - for a time at least, until the anodising wears off.

Sony does definitely need to take more from Apple in terms of how their products will be perceived by e.g. Fine Arts types, not engineers. Because social networking and lazy journalism means that more than ever, perception and marketing is king - and it's the reason Apple are printing money right now.

Sony can explain 'flexy screens help absorb impact on drops and will permanently deform / crack much later than e.g. a rigid structure like the Air ' but in terms of perception, it's not going to cut it with an average guy who will equate rigidity with strength. People who perceive products like these in a truly informed way about every element of the product are one in a thousand - or more likely, far rarer. It's pretty clear for example when looking at his reviews that even people like Anand Shimpi aren't in that category despite their accumulated (in a narrow niche, one could say) experience.

I think if Sony wants to continue on the carbon tip on their flagships, they need to drop their interpretation of 'carbon fiber' and go 'real carbon fiber' - i.e. thermoset, on the outer casing. It will increase costs and require a large upfront investment (as Apple likely had to make with the Unibody transition), but vastly improve consumer perception of the products. Mind you, flagship volumes won't support the economics of production - they will (once again like Apple) need to roll it out across a far bigger portion of their notebook range for it to be viable.

 

That's a really interesting take. I hadn't thought of it that way before, but you're absolutely right. Of course, the same issue applies (or should) to anything you buy.

 

...From where I am standing even uniqueness can't justify low quality, can it.

Following the car example given - let a car be as unique as it could be, most powerful engine for a small size, best aerodynamics, state of the art.... I wonder how many people would tolerate that expensive purchase if something breaks off every time you get it on the road!?

A car's main feature understood by default is the ability to be driven and we are not talking about extreme conditions here - just driven on a normal road... as all other cars. It can be the most unique car in the world - if it can't drive - it is no longer a car and basically - unusable.

So unless you are keeping your Z in a frame and showing it to everybody as a miracle of today's electronics, a defect like the subject of this thread is usually considered a pure "show stopper"!!

As said - if Ferrari releases a car with unique features, whose door handles fall off every time you open the door and this on ALL of this model.... Explain to whoever you want that your car with ripped off handles is absolutely unique Yes in fact it is - it would be the first car that can't be useful as a car!

Could give you many other examples. Even Apple's iPhone a while ago - unique phone, but every time you put your hand on it it was loosing network coverage !? Awesome!! What kind of a "unique" phone was that if you can't use it for what it's main purpose is!? Most people did not buy it just to play Angry Birds, as unique as that was... they were also hoping to be able to use it as a phone. All complains were absolutely justified and apple was forced to fix it!

 

The Z2, depsite its flaws, doesn't exactly have the door handles ripping off every time you open the door. It can incur some dings through handling that are not disabling. So the door handle analogy is sub-perfect to say the least. While the door handles are unlikely to come off the Ferrari, I would hope that pretty girls who climb on the hood to have their picture taken, or for any other reason, are careful. It's easy to dent the body.

If I buy a Ferrari, I know its going to spend a lot of time in the shop, far more than the Z2, most of which will not require any repairs in their lifetime.

To quote Volgelbung, know what you're buying. And I would add, and treat it accordingly.

 

well.... why don't you just buy the motherboard with all stuff on it then? This way:

1. Much better cooling
2. Lower weight
3. Smaller size

and if you "know what you are buying and treat it accordingly" it will last forever and you will have the most unique computer.

Sorry. To me a product can be unique ONLY if it first fulfills its main purpose.
And that's the point here. IMO such a defect contradicts the above. Obviously you don't think so... your right.

And referring to girls being careful when climbing on the hood is out of what a car is made for, whereas putting a laptop on your knees or uneven surface or putting a memory card in it is actually the main reason for having it on first place, isn't it.

 

They haven't fixed it by the way (as of a late-production 4 at least). It's just that people got used to it. Perception & marketing again.

Ultimately I'm discussing this with someone who's not bought a Z of any generation if I'm not mistaken (correct me if I'm wrong) so I'll just answer 'er... no' to the above. Good luck looking for unicorns - I've said why Apple caters a lot better to the kind of demographic you seem to represent.

I've owned every major iteration of the Z, (still own a couple of '10 Z13's) as well as the TT, SZ, TZ, G, etc, and I've also said what the issues are in this thread. I've furthermore said why this memory card slot business is not a deal-breaker, but rather I see the things I referred to as more of deal-breakers.

 

Not true This is kind of my job..... I'm quite sure I know better than you what was fixed and how, unless you are in the same branch, but based on your comment - you aren't

Yes, you are wrong. I owned the 2010 Z for a few months.

 

There are many satisified Z2 customers even if they discuss ways the Z could be further improved or design tradeoffs they don't care for. Some of them own other notebooks and use the Z on a situational basis while, for others, the Z is their main notebook. Thus, it does fulfil its main function.

I thought attracting pretty girls was the main reason for having a Ferrari.

 

If you see it that way no wonder you would be satisfied with a car that doesn't drive or laptop that can't be used anywhere out of the desk
You are basically not a car/laptop "user" but a car/laptop "adorer" who doesn't actually use them but is just happy to know they have something unique inside

Anyway... didn't want to provoke 10 pages of this discussion. I just see such a defect as a reason to return and buy something less unique but useful. I am among those who uses and needs a laptop for work and pleasure 12-14 hours a day at home, in the office, on the road, etc. and wouldn't be satisfied with such a low quality...

Obviously not everyone is like me and that's fair enough I have a colleague who is really satisfied with his Acer which he only uses to check his email once every weekend on his desk at home. He says it's an eternal machine... and why wouldn't it be I just wonder why anyone would need any uniqueness for that

 

Thought I posted this earlier, but minus the emotional/spiritual debate going on here, anybody try bending the aluminium back to its original state?

Should be a trivial fix.

PS: Ferrari's are phallic augmentation devices, I hope to afford one. Soon.

 

^^ whoops, thread derailment. ZoinksS2k, get off!


But yes, people have tried.

 

Refer to Post #9

The old Z came with a screwdriver for the right hinge... - the new one - with a tweezer You're in fact right it's getting lighter and more portable each year If we are lucky we might be getting only a needle for repairs next year or the one after

(Joking)

 

Sometimes it best to tolerate cosmetic imperfections that have no functional abnormality than to try to spend money and time on something that potentially can be a cause for more trouble.

 

Just checking in here. Is the debate that the Z isn't well built and is overpriced because a 20mm x 3mm piece of aluminum can bend if you push it just right? Are we arguing over the overall design capabilities of Sony due to this? I'm just glancing through the thread here and it sure seems that way.

All high tech products have some problems, period. IF the problems with a particular product are a showstopper for YOU, don't buy it. IF you are looking for a high tech product that is absolutely perfect - you will retire very wealthy, because you'll never buy anything.

This thread is out of control IMO.

 

No, Apple never did fix the iphone 4 antenna. Redesigned in a later model, yes? Fixed for the model with the problem? No. (the problem was overblown in the first place IMO).

While we are talking apple. Power buttons commonly break on iphone 4 (mine did). Trackpads are known to crack on MBP. There are reliability issues with SSD's in certain models. So...Apple sucks at designing products. Right?

Alienware M11X had hinges that fall apart. Dell and Alienware suck at making products. Right?

My new car is prone for having fuel pump failures (HPFP). BMW sucks at making cars. Right?

And on and on we go.

 

^^ The Alienware M15 (before the "All powerful") line had the exact same issue. It took three m11x generations (yep... three) before partway through the R3 revision, Dellionware finally fixed the hinge issue (or so they say, lol).


However, the point is, for a 2000usd laptop, a poorly designed SD slot is a helluva oversight. Does it mean Sony sucks? No, I think that would be overgeneralizing. It means they are overlooking some little things, however.


Does having a fuel pump failure mean your car is bad? No, because your car is likely sourced from many different manuf. (like the 2009-2010 Toyota car brake issue - it was an US based design/manuf. company that supplied the brake pedal system at fault). Does it mean BMW could of done better? Yes. If they have the fuel pump failures for the next two revisions of your model, due to using the exact same fuel pump with the same engine, then we can say somewhere in BMW, there is an idiot. Or a collection of idiots (same as Dell, lol). But overall, BMW will likely always be BMW. Just like Sony is still Sony. They get great concepts, great HW, and sometimes poor execution. Does that mean Sony sucks, or are you interpreting our discussion as such?

 

Actually, I tend to unconsciously use the "grip of death" on my iPhone 4 regularly and for me it is a real problem. As the call disintegrates I need to be aware that that is indeed the problem and shift my hold.

 

I'll just contribute to the derailing

Before I eventually abandoned the 4 (had three all in all, I managed to get a shattered one - literally laid on a table - replaced and then I dropped in the toilet so had to replace myself) in favour of Windows Phone, I had consistently crappy reception (even after the 'fix') across all of them, even when cased.

 

Get off what? Yo Momma?

I think the placement of the memory card slots is part of the problem in addition to the flimsy design. I find tend to go for the center when pushing it to re-position the laptop on flat surfaces.

 

I'm fairly certain the initial flex is caused by the entire plate being deformed by the bending of the lower case, but if you want to prevent bending by the slots being pushed in by fingers while eg. opening the machine, I guess you could buy two things - An M2 -> MS Duo adapter, and a MicroSD -> SD adapter. If you insert these into their respective slots and keep them plugged in, they should stick out of the slots - though shouldn't be too much - and should prevent you from pushing the thin strips of aluminium by accident on an everyday basis. Bonus of course is that it'll give you added card flexibility (although yeah, I dunno anyone who uses M2 cards anymore).

And even if they're bent already, having the adapters obscure the slots might take your mind off it

 

Yeah right Samsen, bending of the entire plate is just a "cosmetic" issue, that has absolutely no influence over the Motherboard bending too and it can only "cosmetically" damage it This was exactly why my Fujitsu-Siemens died! Base flexing, Motherboard went bad. But I was also told that the cracks near the hinges are "cosmetic issues" that are not covered by the warranty!

A cosmetic imperfection is a DVD-drive bezel being a little loose, not the laptop base flexing when not used on a table!

 

Back to memory slots issue: I still don't get it - does it bend from pushing it with your thumb (insert/remove cards) or by resting your hands/palms on the palmrest area, creating excessive force to the bottom of laptop?

I never had such problem with my 3+ years old VGN-Z590 (though I had other issues discussed in other threads).

Can anyone please disclose it for me, as I'm waiting for Z22 to arrive, so I want to know proper care

Cheers,
Miki

 

The thing is, it's designed to flex - at least the body is, and the aluminium plate is a compromise point as I pointed out before.

The problem with some discussion base-points is that, as I referred to, some people just don't know what they're buying into and go on and on about something they aren't looking at themselves. I'm not defending it, but just don't see much point in people who moan on and on about products they don't own, and aren't considering buying.

I show pages and pages of posts regarding your S during 2010 in the Sony forum. About the Z? Zip. Is my search-fu failing me?


@miki69

This is the issue. HTH