are we gonna see a new Power Media Dock for the z?

really bothers me that it has a crappy AMD Radeon HD 7670M in there. Thats as powerful as the geforce 330 i had in my Z11...

thinking i should get the z, and lay off on the power media dock till they upgrade it, but is there any word that they will? did they JUST upgrade to this 7670 with the ivy bridge updates? or is it still old?

 

Stupid uneducated text removed here - look to pyr0's explanation below

 

yeah sorry, didn't wanna look, ty though <3

 

Technically, the lightpeak connector can have a bandwith of 10Gbps... which is enough for more than just a 7670m... I think sony was impressed with the hd4000 and wanted to make more profit with a cheap oem rebadge of their old 6650m ... I think we might see thunderbolt with a new kepler PMD for next year's z4 with haswell...

 

No offense but you don't know what you are talking about. Don't spread wrong information!

A thunderbolt/light peak link provides 4 lanes PCIe 2.0/3.0. Compared to a regular 16x PCIe interface, a 4x interface gives >85% of the raw fps performance of a 16x link (have a look in the eGPU thread).

If you could hook up a current gen Z a top-end desktop GPU (680/7950 etc.) via the given LP interface, this would easily outperform the most powerful mobile GPUs in 17+ inch gamer notebooks. Furthermore, using an external screen saves a lot of bandwidth, so performance increases even more.

My "good old" 2010 Z1 with a GTX460 hooked up through a 1x PCIe link (!!!) (expresscard) outperforms the current PMDs by two times. I can play most current games with high-ultra settings @1080p.

At the bottom line, the LP/TB interface is more than sufficient to run and almost fully utilize high performance GPUs. If we had TB to PCIe or (Sony)LP to PCIe interface boards, we would be able to transform a TB ultrabook/MBP/MBA or the current gen Z's into desktop-class performing gaming powerhouses. Sony's silly proprietary light peak solution won't see any after market product (sony failed as always, they had better implemented TB) but we will soon be seeing eGPU-capable TB/PCIe products. Take my word: In less than a year, any ultrabook with a desktop GPU hooked up via TB will make a PMD'ed Z2/Z3 look like a piece of crap in terms of 3D performance.
I won't buy a Z2/Z3 as my beloved Z1 still runs like a champ and looks like brand new. But if somebody had a broken PMD and would donate it to the Z hardcore community, we would hack it up and reflow a PCIe 4x extender board just for the kicks and as a PoC. I am sure the Z and eGPU community will drown in drool. Until then, the PMD will forever be the weakest and most ridiculous part of the overall Z2/Z3 package.

 

sorry; honestly very sorry.
I didn't mean LP in general but isn't this the case with this specific PMD connection?

 

pyr0: if I understand you correctly, a desktop GPU has considerably more oomph than a similar mobile GPU (plus more juice from the power supply), which is why the combination hooked up to a Z1 is so effective, even though there is the 1x PCIe bottleneck.

So what are your views on ViDock and equivalent kits?

Personally, I'm not keen on going with any more Sony proprietary technologies. Sony left us out in the cold when they dropped support for the hybrid graphics technology. Once bitten, twice shy. There is every likelihood that they'll do the same with LightPeak.

 

The limiting factors regarding performance in the Z2 example are (ordered by highest to lowest performance impact):

1. Utterly bad sony drivers for the PMD hybrid graphics implementation
2. Poor game engine programming (especially in pc games which were converted from game consoles) that lead to unefficient bandwidth utilization resulting in stuttering upon texture load etc.
3. PMD's Radeon 6650M chip is simply weak, it's just a low-mid class GPU
4. The LP connection lowers theoretical max performance of the GPU by ~10-15%

Desktop GPU: More transistors, more shaders, more amps, more oomph. More everything. Easy rule. Kepler GPUs are super efficient (a GTX680 can be run with a 15$ xbox power brick, that's awesomely portable) and will make eGPU even more interesting for the average poweruser/gamer. I have my GTX460 stuffed into an ultra-slim homemade acrylic enclosure which is about the same size as an external 3.5" HDD enclosure. Silent, powerful, portable. I just love it.

[My personal opinion]
ViDock (Villagetronic trademark) is dead. VT obviously does not keep up in the current development, which is thunderbolt, and it stands out for their bad customer support. Their C2 "standard" is vaporware and will not ever get implemented by mfrs. Prove me wrong, VT.

Community is everything. This is the way to go. DIY is cheap, customizable, available. Ppl that do not have the courage to put some 200$ equipment together, go buy some gaming notebook or prebuilt desktop. But then you are stuck with mfr support and drivers. Nowadays, community support is far superior over every manufacturer's. xda-devs is probably the best example on the net.

We will be going thunderbolt in the future. HDMI is not enough for high-res displays and we want more bandwidth for external devices (even USB3.0 starts to bottleneck fast SSDs). Thunderbolt covers both. Let's face the truth: Intel rules the market. What they give us, we'll take. Other than the ridiculously priced TB cables (courtesy of apple), TB is a great idea. Prices will go down as more devices and applications flood the market. First thunderbolt-PCIe devices are already in the making / few overpriced products (Sonnet) already hit the market. TB laptops are still in the coming. If the new Zenbook UX31A had TB, that would have been my new toy.
[/My personal opinion]

High probability. Sony's LP PMD is already dead. Z3 refresh brought nothing new other than newer drivers. We could 'jailbreak' the Z1's proprietary crap, but can we do the same to the Z2/Z3? It's up to us. Sony won't do anything about that.

 

thanks pyr0

 

Would be cool to see PMD with desktop-grade GPU, I am not even sure why Sony decided to put mid-class mobile GPU into docking station in the first place.
Ordered mine Z3 without PMD. This will keep me out of gaming for a while .

 

Do you guys honestly believe the Vaio Z will be refreshed with a new GPU?

I don't. I mean the Z1 GPU was never updated in its three refreshes, why would the Z3 be any different.

 

I don't think we are talking about the Z2 internal GPU being refreshed, just the GPU in the PMD. That is more likely. It is a lot easier (and cheaper) to redo the PMD.

 

Interesting point. Are Sony known for their progressive updates (especially on the Z)?

 

This is within the capabilities of third party vendors. Problem is, how many units can they expect to sell?

 

it isn't due to proprietary link b/n Z and PMD - no one is allowed to (legally) replicate it

 

Which is why I've suggested occasionally that Z users might be better off if cash-strapped Sony sold the Vaio busines to someone with the insight and resources to restore the Z as the once and future UltimateBook.

 

So is the PMD with the 7670 card the newer updated PMD or is there still an update rumored to be coming soon? I read earlier in the thread that there was an update that the US didn't have yet. What graphics card is in that version (if it exists).

 

I believe this is the 'updated' PMD. I love the concept and the convenience but the video card is a joke.

 

Totally agree. It should have been a beefy nVidia GPU, with provision for expansion up to quad SLI. Weight and size be damned - if it is good enough people will buy one for each location where it is needed (home, office, etc.).

 

Or at the very least, a GPU that can do anything. Putting a mobile GPU in a box with a DVD/BD drive is such a waste.