Thoughts on EU Microsoft Anti-Trust Suit

For the life of me I cant comprehend how these lawsuits are allowed to continue, Imagine if you can having to buy an OS, and having now way to surf the web, or play any sort of media files/movies/music...it all just seems really weird to me

One part of the suit is because internet explorer is bundled with windows....well DUH...yeah thats really what I want, to order a new XPS and out of the box have no way to surf the web

And I believe the other one has to do with realplayer, and them angry that windows media player is bundled with the OS, again its just ridiculous

 

It is very complicated and I will not pretend to understand all of it or even agree. The bundleing you talk about would have little or nothing to do with your end user experience. Keep that in mind. Those are integrated in the OS and Microsoft said we can't remove them. The suits say well that gives you an unfair advantage. You could still get your explorer and media player with what the EU and even US wanted. Always remember MS is not your friend, I mean if they forced me to take Office for free I might think so. But no, it makes them money so they sell. The others don't so they "give" them away. I think the argument is it stiffles competition. So anyway IE and the way it is packaged has nothing to do with you being able to surf the WEB "DUH"

 

Yeah that's pretty much stupid.

MAC comes with all his software suit too. Linux comes with open office and FF...

 

I guess I just cant really understand bundling being an unfair advantage, when I bought xp mc 2005 it came with internet explorer but I installed firefox right away...I just cant see how thats hindering competition when the best web browsers you can get are free anyway

Same with windows media player, I use media player classic for all my avi and dvd files, so in a way it really wouldn't affect me, but your average user wants there computer to do that stuff right out of the box

 

No you are wrong!!

Windows OS should come with every browser that was ever written. It should include by default the hundreds of differ types of media players that exist. Who cares if the install will be 15x ...4GB DVD Discs.

 

But there should be a browser coupled with OS like IE to download other stuff.

 

as far as it matters to me, the only thing that would be illegal is IE being the only compatible browser

if opera or firefox or whoever are mad that people are too stupid to try anything but IE...... well, then again, who competes for customers too stupid to use anything but IE? i wouldnt even want them to touch my software

same with the media players, WMP is the slowest and most resource hogging player on the market, you would need to specifically code a program to be able to out less perform it, i would never get mad at the ppl who would rather use dimwitted software over mine, those people just arent good customers

 

Dimwits are a large percentage of any customer base. So while I understand your point, if considered throughly eventually you would have no choice but MS MP and IE. So think about that.

 

I completely understand, there is a huge market share of people who are complacent with what ever they see first, but getting rid of the first option doesnt fix anything.

There just is no reasonable way to accommodate the third party, period, they will always rely on word of mouth as the key advertising until they actually start advertising

Im a FF fan boy, and i love WinAmp like a first born, people see me using it them and see the features and want to convert (most of the time), i got all my friends using FF you know, and thats the way its been working or will work. I think a possible fix would be something like when you first start your computer, you have a list of browsers to choose from and download, that way, before you ever log on, you have the fair playing field..... but even than, anybody and everybody who dont have there software included can sue, or even worse, there would be a list of a couple hundred browsers

 

So in Europe I can choose to have ie7 preinstalled on a mac?

I do understand the part about making it hard to remove ie from a windows system, but then if it ever becomes easy I assure you NBR Windows section will be filled with people asking how to restore their internet in their other computer because they accidentally deleted the explorer....

 

very bad example to use here. Try to buy a bmw and tell the seller not to bundle the blaupunkt and see. Sure, u r free to choose, just fork out extra €€€€

dont gloat here buddy, try to sign up (or search) for an ISP other than ur freedom to take what the monopolist telecomm in each european country giving and see

????? then noone would be succesful

actually, they were pondering what would it be cheaper; moving the office from Redmond to somewhere in continental europe, because here NOONE, i repeat NOONE, can (allow to) sue a corporation, only suing individual(s) with dictated preset compensation/damage!

It is really a "ridiculous concept to many but it is highly regarded by most Europeans"

cheers ...

 

Thats one thing I do not understand...YOU HAVE A CHOICE..if you do not like IE you can download firefox, opera, or any other browser of your choice..same with media player, there are a bunch of different playes that you can download for free.

With your logic If I am buying a Audi, Audi should give me a choice of a bunch of different wheels to have on the car...there are many aftermarket companies that make wheels for an Audi so I should be allowed to choose from all those companies because thats the fair thing to do and Audi has a monopoly on wheels for there cars

 

Bundling IE with Windows is one of the best things done by microsoft. I don't want to buy a CD to install some other browser.

 

I disagree that there is no reasonable way to accommodate the third party. Actually I think it is far easier than Microsoft would like us to believe...

IMHO the EU and US anti-trust authorities aren't aggressive enough on OS makers to be competitive. I don't think the OS market is a true competitive market (due to the high barrier to entry) and as such has to be heavily regulated. Otherwise consumers loose out and Microsoft has abused its position to the loss of the consumer, sadly.

The general trend is MS bundles it into Windows and kills the industry associated with that technology. Windows Media Player is a good example of that. I'm not a huge fan of Real Player, but before MS bundled WMP (especially WMP 7+ where the focus was streaming media) Real had a healthy business in streaming media. Now advancements in streaming media have slowed quite a lot. Luckily things are starting to get better with Divx HD streaming.

A good way Microsoft can accommodate the third parties and benefit their user base the most is to unbundle a lot of features and integrate a software delivery service similar to the ones used in Linux based OSs like Ubuntu.

Microsoft could allow the user to choose between all of the top browsers, compression utilities, etc. in a software repository. The software would be listed in the repository for free and shown to the user ranked with the top rated software at the top. That way the top software would be what the majority of people believe is the best. By not charging (like the currently do for Windows Marketplace which lacks any real integration) they'll also allow community-supported software equal footing.

So the argument that they can't do anything is a lie, but the reality is they won't do anything without legislation forcing them to do so. That hurts the computer industry as a whole.

For those unfamiliar with Ubuntu here is a screenshot of adding software: http://www.ubuntu.com/files/GutsyImages/Installing-Software-Graphic.jpg

 

The difference is that Linux is oriented more the advanced users while Windows is used by newbies.


But why aren't they sueing the OEMs for crapping in bloatwares on computers?

 

I also thought of this, and it's a very good idea you came up with.

But the fact remains that your still downloading then installing. This just provides a easy GUI type of way to do so, rather than search for them.

I think many Software companies want their apps actually included in the install already. Kind of like a manufacturer's recovery Disc does. Or kind of like how FF is already included with many Linux Distros.

 

Agreed, everyone would prefer bundling, but I think something along those lines are the best tradeoff.

Something like that wouldn't prevent the OEM from bundling the most popular apps in a specific category with their machine or the like either...

It also wouldn't have to depend on IE or any browser and the only downside would be potentially downloading your app, as you stated, but that isn't too much of a hassle as internet connections get constantly faster.

It isn't a perfect solution, but I think something along those lines would be in the long term best interest of the industry. Its sad that MS won't do it until lawmakers make them and lawmakers won't act while their pockets are being lined (though the EU seems to be on the right path).

 

The EU has much more restrictive and much more strictly enforce laws about abuse of a monopoly and anticompetitive behavior.

MS has what amounts to an effective monopoly on consumer desktop operating systems. They have been leveraging that monopoly to push adoption of their other products- IE and WMP notably. This understandably annoys people who are or would be competing in those markets. This sort of behavior is generally not looked upon kindly by the European Commission (the group in charge of enforcing competition law).

I don't see why everyone is whining. These aren't new rules the Commission is making up to apply to MS, other than the part where they are adapting them to software instead of other markets. They aren't applying the rules indiscriminately or unfairly.

Basically the only complaint is that MS and lots of people don't like the fact that the EU has more restrictive competition rules, and would prefer a more free market approach. Since we don't live in the EU, our opinions aren't worth much to them and MS knew what the rules were when they decided to play the game, they don't get to whine now because they got caught breaking them.