Windows 8.1(Blue)Free Update

Today at the JP Morgan Technology, Media & Telecom Conference in Boston, Tami Reller shared with the audience that the update previously referred to as “Windows Blue” will be called Windows 8.1and will be a free update to Windows 8 for consumers through the Windows Store.

Windows Keeps Getting Better

 

Sorry but that article seems to be M$ begging to users to start upgrading and or using windows 8. The essential statement of "We know is stinks but if you upgrade now we will be sure you get all the new updates that will hopefully one day make it usable for you". After all the Hoopla and seeing what they did after the beta with all the user input they had, well simply I do not believe them and most consumers and business have the same thoughts.

As they say, "Proof is in the pudding". You want us to believe in Win8 fix it to what people originally wanted and what it looked like we were getting before the other shoe dropped.............................

 

I don't even see where Microsoft is admitting they're wrong with Windows 8 (the interface, that is), and all I see overall is "Buy Windows 8 laptops now, and you can eventually update!"

Still sticking to trusty ol' Windows 7 for now.

 

No more like they refuse to admit they were wrong. Could you image the bigger blacklash if Ballmar admits oh we thought we could think for you but guess we were wrong. I have yet to hear those in power admit they were wrong or begin to address the problem. Most don't or want a touch screen they want a computer to boot up and get to desktop and start using it. And mouse/keyboard still run the world....rather they should make a slow evolution from W7 going to W8 and that will bring users along and adopt it more faster but doing such break without any kinda of help is one way to kill a new O/S faster.

 

Correct, problem is you can update but there is no promise of what the update will yield. It is more of them saying "trust us it will get better". Sorry M$ I do not trust you after what you did on the release of Win 8 from beta...........................

 

I agree with TANWare that other than it will be free (which isn't too surprising; this seems like a smaller jump than 2000 or ME to XP), there isn't much new in the article. Still good news, but nothing groundbreaking. The bigger questions still remain things like will you be able to boot to desktop without 3rd party software? And generally, why should those who've preferred 7 so far jump on the 8 train with 8.1?

It's also nothing new that Microsoft's trying to get people to adopt their latest version. Same thing happens with IE. But you can't really blame them. Most software companies would rather have their customers on the latest version.

I second the sentiment that it's best to wait and see on promises of improvement. I learned that when it comes to OS'es when Vista came out. And it seems like we're still rather lacking in details as to what 8.1 is actually going to have. So I'm still sticking to trusty old Windows XP for now.

 

@Apollo, I'm curious since both your systems run XP, do you have any plans for next year when Microsoft stops patching and supporting it? Will you continue to use XP anyway, upgrade to Windows 7, switch to Linux, buy a new system with a newer operating system, or something else?

 

Mary jo Foley who has predicted many changes with MS with her inside sources says 8.1 will bringback the start button but NOT the start menu. The general consensus is the start menu will probably not come with 8.1. However, Mary Jo's source did say MS could change that decision. At this point I would be very surprised if MS caved in that much and put in the start menu. That would provide an option to completely bypass metro and possibly ruin any traction they may have to get developers to code for metro. MS may not have time to re code W8 to have a start menu being that elements of the control panel are currently spread across both interfaces which is in itself an epic failure. IMO, MS will take a huge hit either way if they provide a start menu or just a start button that links to the metro start page.

 

So I guess still no Aero glass...

 

They also would have to fix Desktop Windows Manager. DWM was working in the RC but with the RTM M$ broke it. I am not sure of what the reasoning for doing this but it was done.....................

 

Windows 8.1 estimated to launch in late October

Notebooks featuring Microsoft's new Windows 8.1 (Windows Blue) will start volume production in mid-September with the official launch of the operating system estimated to be around late October, revealed sources from related ODMs.

However, the sources believe Windows 8.1 is unlikely to largely attract consumers into purchasing new PC products as there are already many third-party applications available to modify Windows 8's user interface and functions. Unless Microsoft is willing to further lower its new operating system prices, the sources believe the software is unlikely to have any major positive effect on consumer demand.

Although Microsoft is currently providing licensing subsidies on some Windows 8-based devices, the program is only available for products with display sizes of 11.6-inch and below, which is not helping notebook players to promote their Windows 8-based notebooks.

 

As anything I will believe this when I see a full version of W8.1 that has a start menu and desktop setup that and only that will bring back the users and IT people back to Windows. Otherwise they will stick with W7 until WX comes out to replace the debacle W8 created. And one point not all current laptop are touch screen of which Metro was made for and loads as. I like to keep my screen uncluttered and with icon I used and need not what they want me to use and have. That should be a no brainer for M$ to figure out after all this time but I guess being so big one tends to forget about the users that got them where they are now.

 

I highly doubt we will see the start menu return. Not yet anyway. Eventually 8 will have to cater to desktop users and enterprise. Especially as W7 life cycle nears its end. But for now, 8.1 will feed the mess that is W8 and the most unintuitive UI ever created will continue to exist.

 

As annoying as the W8 can be at times, nothing compares to the UI for the Xbox 360. That is by far the worse UI I have had to deal with. Trying to find something on that UI that's hidden thru layers of sub menus is beyond painful.

 

I was going to guess that the "most unintuitive UI ever created" would probably be some obscure variety of Linux. I understand some people don't like the switch from start menu to start screen, but "most unintuitive UI ever created"? Hit the start key, start typing the name of the program you want, press enter. Just like Windows 7. You may not like how it looks, but that's a big heapload of hyperbole in that post.

 

Problem is that you don't always remember what that app or program was called. And even Windows 8 throws programs under sub menus in the start screen. Even if you typed exactly what you want it doesn't always put it as the first choice. Just type Windows Update and it hides it under another submenu and shows a half dozen other apps. I don't like programs trying to think for me. Just show me contents of things that I type.

 

Well, considering that there are other ways of finding it--desktop shortcuts, pinned programs on the taskbar, and pinned programs on the start menu--that hardly makes it the "most unintuitive UI ever created." Especially since Win 7 had the same issue with its start menu search.

Upon further reflection, I'm betting the most unintuitive UI ever created is some variety of command-line UI, maybe something like MS-DOS but even harder (I'm sure it's out there; I just don't know what it is). I used DOS for years and never felt remotely comfortable with it, and I can't think of much more intimidating for a first-time user than seeing "C:\>" and nothing else on a black screen.

 

tl;dr: I haven't decided yet. Summarizing this became enumerating the possibilities and their likelihoods.

I haven't decided yet, and probably won't until early 2014. Switching to Linux is unlikely, as I run a lot of Windows-specific software, and for the most part like Windows (in particular XP). There's a small chance I might run Linux with the Xen hypervisor and Windows in the hypervisor, but it seems like more work than just running Windows in the first place with little benefit. Might make it easier to switch between 7/8 and XP, though, and still give XP the performance that running XP Mode in 7 wouldn't give.

If I were to upgrade, I don't know if I'd get 7 or 8. It may depend on part on how 8.1 looks when it's out. I never seriously considered upgrading to 7 because I still consider it basically Vista++ - better than Vista, but more or less the same under the hood (after all, 7 really is version 6.1 internally). But having used 7 at work, it's not that bad when it works. I might not mind running 7 with UAC totally disabled, and making sure not to install anything to C:\Program Files (to avoid Virtual Store completely). The application compatibility probably still wouldn't be as good as with XP, but I think some of mine were related to the laptop in my sig and wouldn't affect my desktop.

I might get 8 with Start8, though. I did seriously consider picking up an upgrade license when they were $40, but I was unemployed then, and I didn't need the upgrade, so it wasn't a justifiable expense. I might pick it up if it goes on sale again - at worst, I could seriously try out 8 and see for myself if I like it in practice. While not a fan of the Metro UI (though a few Metro apps, like Fresh Paint, are cool if you have the right input tools), I generally like the few desktop changes in 8. At $40, it'd be worth giving a chance versus the standard upgrade price for 7/8.

I might continue using XP anyway, too, at least for awhile. I'm not really concerned about 1-3 months after the end of updates - it's farther out when it could start to be a serious liability. But eventually, there will probably be programs that I want to use that require 7, too. I've been pleasantly surprised so far by how easy it is to keep using XP - it's rare that I run into programs that require Vista or 7, and most of the programs that do require Vista or later are Microsoft ones where I can just use an older version for now.

I'm also skeptical that Microsoft will actually end XP support in April 2014, given XP's current market share. Which is another reason I'm not in a hurry to decide. When Windows 98 had 27% Internet marketshare at its originally-scheduled end of support time, Microsoft extended its support by 2 years. XP will likely have more than that next April (worldwide, including in China), so it wouldn't surprise me if its support is extended.

I won't be replacing my desktop, as I just built it in December 2011. The hardware on it is more than capable of running 8 (though it has no touch screen), and it's kind of ridiculously powerful for XP. So it may well see an OS upgrade at some point. The laptop, on the other hand, might be replaced. It's 5.5 years old, nearing 6, and while it's done well and is trusty, isn't so new as it once was. It also hates Vista, even though it shipped with it (and probably won't like 7 or 8 as a result), so it's likely to remain on XP as long as it works. I may end up replacing it, upgrading the desktop's OS, and keeping my current laptop as my for-whenver-I-need-XP machine. It's already my only option for 16-bit programs. But only time will tell.

Yeah, it's kind of a pickle. Traditional users want the desktop back at the center of attention, but that would effecitvely kill the Metro marketplace. It's interesting following the Windows 8 saga - although the seas are rough now, it's hard to say if 10 years from now Windows 8 will be seen as a ME-like failure or the beginning of a new, successful Windows era.

 

Metro sucks. ZERO usablility with a keyboard/mouse. Horrible use of screen space, looks dumb on anything larger than a tablet....ridiculous on my dual 24's. Besides that, with Aero being gone, the 'desktop mode' looks worse. I have a licensed copy of Windows 8 and still use Windows 7. I was set with that Start 8 program, but the use of space is awful and lack of Aero makes things look bad.

The entire concept of Metro and its full screen apps is completely idiotic on desktops or laptops when actual work is trying to be done.

Metro should be an optional interface that is unseen by desktop users and the default of tablets.

Windows 7 until Aero and a Start menu come back.

 

Pirx, we have PowerShell for that. Someone is still want to live in the past. We have HP-Unix server that is last of its kind on my network. It is kind of difficult to operate if you ask me. I think Cisco command line is a whole lot easier if you ask me.

 

Cisco's IOS isn't exactly as generalized as a full-pledged operating system. But I agree, IOS is fairly easy to pick up and use.

 

You are right, but PowerShell can do a whole lot and easier to use than Unix command prompt. That is my point in this topic. GUI on either Windows 7/8 or Server 2008/2012 is practically executed PowerShell in the backend. PowerShell just unleashes what can't be done on GUI.

 

In the end, everything is just 1s and 0s.

 

Pirx, please don't forget about my post. I still want to play with you.

 

Warning- mysterious act of rude posts vanishing may continue.
Equally mysterious act of infractions appearing- possible.

 

Back on topic, the update may be free but the question remains as to weather it will qualm the present critics and then if it will be a mandatory or an optional update. This especially once released, will 8.0 be offered where 8.1 will be an upgrade. This mainly as some rumors are floating the apps providing the start menus may break along with some of their options to go direct to desktop with the 8.1 release.

 

Whoa, so are there two updates, 8.0 followed by 8.1?

 

8.0 should be the stock release. 8.1 or Blue will be the update. Now once 8.1 is released it could be considered the standard release or just left as an optional update. If it becomes the standard release and breaks the start button apps or their ability to keep metro from booting first this could become an issue for those other companies now producing those start button apps..................

 

..well, there was Commodore DOS. A huge seller at the time was, you guessed it, a CBM Dos helper cartridge! MS-DOS was way more friendly

 

I have no idea what CBM Dos is until I google it. LOL! I guess I was not born yet.

 

It was the disk operating system built onto the disk drives (and tape drives) for Commodore computers.

The user never actually saw CBM DOS, it was something the computer and drive used to talk to each other. This is part of why the Commodore disk drives were very expensive for the time.

 

The issue behind all this is MS's API's. It's too restrictive and developers hate it. Now there are new studies showing that users of W8, for the most part are not utilizing metro apps, which deters developers further from coding for W8. I think the argument in favor of the new modern interface starts to crumble if the apps themselves are weak. I've heard of some uninstalling every modern app and making the start screen a custom start menu for their desktop apps. Which I think is a good point to bring out that with some work one can drastically gut the modern UI and customize to their own liking making groups for their desktop apps etc.. Which is one of the reasons that I've always liked MS OS's giving the user the ability to customize. Eventually I will buy a W8 system but like every OS MS ships, it takes a year at the minimum for the coding and hardware to catch up. But there is no way I'm going to jump the gun ahead of 8.1 and Intel's new line of haswell cpus or AMDS for that matter.

I'm from the camp that will customize W8 to my liking. Unfortunately, for most users, they will not take the time, or know how to do that and deal with W8 as MS presents it. For these people, W8 will be a painful experience and nothing short of putting an off switch to metro will make them happy. Forcing MS marketplace with a screen full of useless metro apps is not going to go well with the traditional desktop user. But to MS's favor, at least for those that know how, you can purge most of that out. Even my galaxy tab with Android Jellybean can't do this. Many of the google apps that ship with that device are part of the android system.. and can't be uninstalled. I've got a good 10 to 20 applications I would love to uninstall to free up system memory and Google will not allow that. So in that regard, Google is worse then MS.

 

Other than my personal issue with DWM and Aero Glass the majority here can get around other Windows 8 issues. The problem lies with the fact that we here are the overwhelming minority. My other issue with Windows 8 is all the casual users that are frustrated to no end and I can not really help them without being there. With windows 7 I could close my eyes and over the phone tell them 99.9% of the time what to do. With all the custom programs and methodologies I need to be there to operate or at least tell then user what to do for each step.

 

You can always use Team Viewer for WAN or SCCM remote tool for LAN or you can have virtual machine to simulate the software that user is using. I can't really close my eyes and tell user exact step on troubleshoot process. I am more like visual learner, so I have to see the screen.

 

For those interested in restoring Aero Glass to Windows 8, please take a look at this: Aero Glass for Win8 RC1 - MSFN Forum

It's still in development, but the Release Candidate currently available is working nicely. Attached is a screenshot of it in action.

 

I most of the time can from anywhere close my eyes with Windows 7 and get them to the fix. I prefer at the time to be in front of my machine and mimic the steps without applying the solution. When I do that it is usually easier to explain what the user sees on the next screen. Sometimes the dialogs or tabs are more easily explained/understood as well.

There also is a hack (not a 100% fix either), again M$ should fix this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Well, since they broke this intentionally, what are the chances they will fix it? And, yes, there are a number of serious issues so far with all attempts at re-introducing Aero Glass into Win8. As far as I know, Stardock is working on this for a couple of months now as well, and they can't get it off the ground. They'd really like to get their WindowBlinds product to work in Win8, but Microsoft has done a fairly good job at thwarting any attempt in that direction. So that's at least one thing they seem to be really good at...

 

And I use window blinds in Window 7 as well. Thought I would use it more than I do, occasionally I like to change things up a bit. I know the broken DWM is causing them, and many others, a fit................

 

Welcome back, Pirx. I mess up my Windows 8 yesterday too. I guess I push it to the limit. Reformat seems to fix it perfectly.

 

The usually exceedingly well-informed Mary Jo Foley has an article on some of the important changes in Windows Blue. So, as we already knew, boot-to-desktop will be an option, and there will be a Start Button, enabled by default (in fact, apparently this one cannot even be turned off...). Of course, that Start Button will bring up the dreaded Start Screen, with a slight twist, however: Users can opt to have the Start Button immediately produce the "All Apps" view of the Start Screen, meaning none of those useless tiles, and more space for apps. Of course, that All Apps view will still be the flat mess it has always been, but at last there's a minimal improvement there. Note that users will be able to arrange the icons by usage, allowing the most commonly used apps to be first. So there's another little bit of functionality of the good-old Start Menu making a comeback. In addition, and somewhat importantly, users can choose to use their desktop background as the background of the Start Screen, rather than those lame backgrounds that they are currently restricted to. This will make for a smoother transition between the desktop and the Start Screen.

Overall, there is some progress here. In fact, if we now could have a hierarchical All Apps screen, with a user-definable hierarchy, then the Start Screen would have regained a little bit of the functionality of the Start Menu even. Not the same, but a start (pun intended) at least.

 

Can't wait till MS brings back Aero glass in Win 8.2 .

 

I'm with you. Waiting...

 

Anyone else experiencing a bug where they can't go to page 4 of the thread, where Pirx had posted a recent article about what changes Blue is bringing? I read the article before the threads were joined, but now I can't get back to page 4 of this thread at all (clicking on 4 brings you to page 3).

Anyway, I think it's good news. All are good examples of refining and improving the existing Windows 8 concept.

 

I have no problems getting to page 4, try clearing your browser cache. It's also possible you were trying to access page 4 at the moment it was moved.

Also, yes it is good news and not just for those who like Windows 8 this time.

 

I can see page 4 just fine.

 

NP seeing page 4 here...............

 

Cleared browser cache and now I can see page 4 fine. Huh. Never had anything like that happen before.

 

No doubt, it is good news. Just not good enough...

 

Start Experience Changes

If you are familiar with how Start 8 looks and works, this will look awfully familiar. Here, confirmed for the first time, is the Windows 8.1 Start button.



In Blue: Start Experience Changes | Windows 8 content from Paul Thurrott's SuperSite for Windows

Desktop wallpaper on the Start screen

As Mary Jo Foley reported, you’ll be able to use your desktop wallpaper as the Start background too. It looks like so:



However, this is off by default and needs to be enabled.

 

That looks really good. One of the nice things about Launcher8 on Android was having a background behind the tiles. It will also further improve the aesthetic consistency between the start screen and the desktop.