have you considered a switch to mac...which way did you go and why?

I've always owned PC..I know them and understand them. I like that I can find applications, lots of hacks and work arounds for my particular way of working or current needs, lots of freeware...and with that comes lots of wait, freezes and reboots.

I'm going to buy a new laptop. It will be Core 2. It will have 2 gigs of memory and a lovely 17" monitor. The biggest question for me is, is it time to give up rebooting and switch to mac.

The reasons I wouldn't switch:
- I know PC, Mac is unknown...this will be my only machine and it will be used for work (graphic designer)
- I can't use 2 external monitors...the only reasonable workaround is a large widescreen, I currently have 2 19" monitors.
- It will be a bit more expensive. This only comes from the software, the hardward initially is pretty even. Though I can imagine adding things will be more expensive on a mac.
- I've heard some things can be a pain in mac that are flawless in XP. For example something as simple as reading from a thumb drive.

The reasons I would switch:
- I hate how slow my OS is. It crawls, freezes and I know that I need to reboot at least every other day. My friend who has a mac forgot his password because he hadn't rebooted in months!
- It's fast. This was a 2 or 3 year old macbook and applications opened quickly, I could bounce back and forth. Things that would take my 3 year old desktop a while to go back and forth between.
- I don't play games which seems to be the only downfall I can find.

So all that too say, if you've considered or made or decided not to make the switch what did you find out? Am I missing any pros/cons?

Thanks a ton!

 

My brother made the switch recently and then switched back. It's not that the Mac wasn't a good machine; it was just that he knows Windows inside out and backwards. He quickly realized that he didn't have a lot of time to really learn a new OS and know it as well as he did Windows.

This was before Mac's use of Intel processors. Now you can buy a Mac and dual boot Windows. Best of both worlds.

 

"you'll wish you had done it years ago, it really does work better"

Working better is subjective.

 

I'm not sure what the difference is between a Mac and a PC nowadays. If you installed OSX on a PC and plugged in a one button mouse, you could call it a Mac, right?

 

Running OSX on PC is awesome. Tricks everybody out to see it running on a Dell.

 

is that morally subjective? or is it subjective on an objective basis?

 

For me I like stuff to mess with.

With OSX there isn't much tuning required.

I like viruses, spyware, and malware.

Gives me a challenge to fight.

And it never gets boring because they just keep getting better.

Long live the infected PCs!

 

[Somehow I got a double post here]

 

If i could do it all over again, i would have a MBP 15" in front of me right now. Get a mac, you can put any OS you want on it. If you are so afraid of change, then dual boot XP on it.

 

I can run OSX on my PC right now. Why buy a Mac?

I never liked the taste of apples anyway.

I like oranges.

 

The legalities of OSX86 are questionable. I've tried it before, and am not comfortable working with a hacked together OS, let alone taking the time to make all my hardware work.

 

It's hardly a "hacked together" OS. It's pretty much a nice little science.

And the hardware aspect isn't hard to do at all if done right.

 

Yes, JaS is quite the programmer, I have a lot of respect for the people behind the whole scene. There is definitely a niche for OSX86, but for the typical computer user, it is too much hassle.

 

I sense some sarcasm. I'm not so wrapped up about viruses, I'm protected, I stay away from junk...I just wonder if they (macs) really run smoother, with no delays, no reboots.

 

Well, there are some 'exaggerations' Apple uses. Mac OS X does have viruses. Mac OS X does crash. And I personally think Apple (and some Apple users) shouldn't think of themselves as 'higher' than Windows users.

I don't think Vista is a 'copy' of Mac OS X. They're both operating systems, they both look nice. They both crash less, are more secure. But each has its own style. I like Vista. I like Mac OS X too.

But, Mac OS X is really nice graphically and other things. Spotlight is a really nice feature, you can search for anything on your computer in less than ten seconds. Vista has this too, but XP (which most people are still using) doesn't (I think you noticed ).

About the 'taking too long to learn how to use Mac OS X', its actually not that hard to learn. Read Switch 101, a tutorial by Apple, and you basically already know how to run a Mac.

I read that manual, and the first time I touched a Mac (an iMac in my school, if you really want to know), I already knew how to use the OS, where to find applications, files, folders, and how to customize the Mac, etc.

To everyone out there that dismisses my post as 'fanboy junk', I'm a Windows user, I don't own a Mac. The only time I use a Mac is at school. And I like Windows too, as I've stated. I personally want Windows Vista more than I want Mac OS X. But Mac OS X is a great operating system.

To mbuckingham, Mac OS X doesn't exactly run smoother. Windows Vista runs very smoothly now. Mac OS X does have to reboot, but not as much. Some people say they can run their Mac for a week, just putting to 'Sleep' when not using, but never really shutting down.

 

it would be nice if you can have both

 

I said "Screw 'em both! I'm going Linux!" And thats what I use :GEEK:

For graphic design though it doesnt really matter too much which you choose. I'm in the same career as you and I use both every day back and forth and theres little difference.

 

About 6 months ago i was so close to getting a MBP just because i wanted to tinker with something new. My better judgment kicked in and i ended up getting a Dell instead. Why you ask? Well the price to performance was a big thing. I had a hard time biting the bullet so to speak buying Intel hardware for around 2K (the MBP i was looking at the time) when Dell's were less than half the price. Then i thought about the fact that each time a new OS comes out in the Apple world, they make you buy it again, there isn't an "SP" so to speak.

Then I got to thinking about what i would use it for, and it came to me, the same things i was going to use Windows for. Sure it would be fun to mess with a new OS, but at what cost was i willing to spend? If i had multimedia tasks i was looking to run, than maybe it would be another story, but alas i was just looking for the basics in my laptop.

Then comes the looks. I must admit, Mac's look awsome. Their PC's look great (i bought a Lian Li case that almost mimics the look). Their monitors are amazing. And the MBPs look fantastic, not to mention the black Macbooks! But upon further review, the MBP's with the x1600 which i was looking at practically burn your legs. I had read the heat output was insane, something i was not interested in. The battery life wasn't stellar, and the whole one button thing i just can't get out of my head.

So once i weighed all my options, i thought better of the idea. Being someone who hasn't used OSX much, i really wanted to "want" it. But after some serious thought, it just wasn't "for me". Once the day comes that i can install OSX on my PC (and i mean mainstream) i might consider it. I certainly can't fathom buying one at the current prices given the price of PC hardware.

I didn't vote because it's a valid question you ask. The 2 replies just don't encompass how i feel about it. If you feel you need it and it will give you an edge in your computing, then by all means go for it. If you're on the fence and honestly have no need for it, hold off.

 

you are really a LINUX FANATIC!!!!

 

lol, yes I am!

But for graphics apps, there really is very little difference between windows and Mac.

 

I'll be sticking with a PC for the next few years. When i have the cash then i'll buy one Mac and try.

 

I have a Sony desktop (2 years old) now with Vista, a Sony SZ now with Vista and a few months ago bought my sister-in-law an iMac C2D. I use the iMac once in a while and I have to say that it all comes down to preference. Some people find OSX easier to use and some prefer Windows...it really comes down to what suits you better.

However, as stated above PLEASE don't make the tragic mistake and buy the Apple ads that make it seem Macs are completely stable and foolproof. You don't have to believe me, check out the Apple forums and you get an idea of the type of problems you can have with a Mac.

Apple OSX forums <-- Can actually be fun reading

Here's a few samplings:

imac is freezing, get screen which tells me to power shutdown

Update crashes programs

Crashin on wakeup

These were a few I found easily, there are literally hundreds of thousands more.

 

lol I know I've read those forums before and a lot of the problems are hilarious!

it's not hilarious that someone is having a problem...

it's hilarious that Mac marketed themselves in such a way that everyone believed they didnt have these kind of problems....

 

Where's the "Looked at Vista, decided it was crap infested with DRM that treated me like a criminal just for using it, looked at OSX, decided I wanted a mouse not designed for use while wearing mittens, then decided on Linux" option?

 

Lol, rat-flail!

 

I wish there was a way to put a custom link from my avatar to the rat-flail source (careful, some language that might upset the more delicate of you in there)

 

hahahahahaha @ comics.

I agree. more poll options!!

 

Just curious, what issues did you run into with DRM?

 

Sucka: I haven't experienced syphilis first hand, but I know it's bad for me. I hate how the activation and all legitimate paths to buy media electronically basically treat me like a criminal for buying it (limits on burning it to CD, where i can play it, what devices I can play it on, etc) or have the possibility of it being enabled in the future (unable to use non-HDMI displays for HDMI protected content). The operating system is designed to make this as functional as possible for the media companies, with no regard to how it may affect the consumer's own usage rights, and homie just don't play dat game. It's EASIER and MORE FUNCTIONAL for me to "steal" media and software than it is for me to get it and use it legitimately. I'm not even talking cheaper. I own a number of games that I get cracks for just so I can run them without the CD in the drive, eating battery life and causing unnecessary wear. That being said, I buy 2-3 DVD movies a month, and a new game every few months (which will stop with any DX10 games). So, I choose to vote with my wallet and not buy into the restrictions that I have absolutely no guarantee aren't going to be enforced at some arbitrary point in the future.

 

The DRM issues will be worked out soon enough for those using Vista. Just a little longer.

 

What do you mean "worked out"? ANY DRM is bad for the consumer (and the media companies if they had half a clue about what they were doing). I see no way of this being worked out except by wholesale removal of "functionality" that does nothing but treat legitimate customers like criminals and doesn't even actually do anything to stop piracy. Someone serious about copying media isn't going to be hampered by any DRM. It only takes one smart person to crack it once, and it's out in the open.

 

Fair enough. Based on your comment i assumed you had a problem, i understand the downfalls of DRM, but have yet to see/have an issue with it.

 

It's unfortunate the legit people out there will be hampered by DRM, trust me i understand that. But can you really blame companies for wanting to protect their interests? The whole "msoft/music/movie industries can't stop piracy, so just give up" argument doesn't fly with me. As much as i hate DRM and all the anti-piracy measures that affect legit people, i understand why they do it.

 

My problem is ideological rather than functional. I'm enough of a geek that I could probably do some of the encryption cracking myself if I put my mind to it The problem is that they have legislatively bribed those interests into law (think Disney and copyright extensions), and that "piracy" is free advertising for artists. All DRM does is preserve the RIAA and MPAA's positions as a distribution and advertising channel that screws over the artists, and make it hard for legitimate consumers to play their media on their hardware as they see fit, and adds many hurdles to the design of new hardware, limiting it's functionality in many cases. Many artists have found that they get MANY more people attending their shows as a result of the free advertising that they get from releasing their music to the world. If someone "steals" it, they probably weren't going to buy it anyway, and it just may convince them to go to the show or buy something from the band. Even the bands recognize this (each of those words is a different link).

The industry isn't learning the lesson from the French Button Makers. I can't blame the MPAA/RIAA for wanting to keep their gravy train running, but I CAN blame Microsoft (and the legislature) for acting against consumers as a whole.

 

LOL I was browsing through the comics in the link, funny stuff!!!

Here's one that's all too true about CS:S.

 

I faced the same question several weeks ago when I was looking to replace my old HP Pavilion notebook. I liked the idea of OS X and thought it may be a good time for a change. Among other things, I figured that a Mac would work better with iTunes.

Finally, I stayed with Windows, buying the HP in my signature. Why? The main programs I use are Window-based: Nota Bene and BibleWorks7. I could run them on a Mac, but if I'm going to run a Mac with a Windows OS, why not stay with a Windows-equipped notebook? (BTW, I'm in a similar quandary thinking about migrating to Linux.) In addition, I would have to buy a copy of XP to run the programs in Windows on a Mac. Paying extra for an OS is not really high on my want-to-do list.

As far as iTunes goes, I ripped 7 CD's on my new notebook the other day and it did not lock up once. In three weeks I haven't seen a blue screen. Also, the machine I bought was about $600 less than a comparably-configured MBP.

Bottom line: I'm not sure it matters that much any more whether you use Vista or OS X.

Bill

 

I'd encourage you to look up the amount of threads on NBR about Core Duo based macs overheating...

 

So is it just good marketing that I thought that Macs don't freeze up and require reboots like a PC running XP? I prefer XP because I know it...OSX is pretty, as are the macs...but the only reason (if performance really isn't better) I'd switch is because of looks.

I do multitask, especially with Photoshop, Illustrator and InDesign.

I only put two choices because that's the only 2 I am considering. I'm leaning towards staying with the PC...just not sure I really gain any real world benefits, just that good feeling of being the cool chic designer with a MBP.

 

Yea, the whole "Macs dont crash" crap is just marketing. So is the no viruses thing too. From my experience, Macs crash a LOT, even the newest ones. I havent personally seen a virus in one for years though, but they are out there.

 

And Apple won't be able to cope with these new virus and spyware threats that are BOUND to infect their systems.

They're going to have to enlist the PC community help because Apple hasn't really developed anything to combat these threats.

Apple moved to Intel chips.
Apple will eventually beg PC software companies to help them out with upcoming threats.
Apple will be the same as anyone else.

 

Heh, my switch actually revolved around web application development. In order to test websites, you have to be able to test on Safari. Thus, my problem began, that I had to use a crappy mac on campus (I do application development for my university) and I really couldn't stand using them. They were slow, and improperly setup (due to netboot issues).
I've always been very anti-mac. Very... even more anti-MS, but I at least gave both credit where credit was due. So last fall, when my tuition loan came in, I needed to buy a laptop. After playing with a friends MBP, and now having the ability to do EVERYTHING I needed on a Mac, I decided to take a leap.
It's been fun. A bit bumpy. But I really am glad I gave OS X a good honest try. I feel... freed from some of the confines that Windows has put on the system... I don't get the same problems.
this also allowed me to move my desktop (which was a semi-gaming rig) over to a Linux server. So I now got to learn 2 new operating systems and had a blast doing it.

Would I buy another PC? Maybe... only for gaming though. There just is no reason to own a normal pc in my head. I plan to purchase a Mac Pro and use it as my workstation and pc gaming center. And still have my linux file server.

Part of the problem of switching to mac, is getting over what is hype, and what is hyper anti-fanboyism. Yes, mac have problems. No, they don't have free roaming viruses. Yes, they do have a single mouse button, but they support multi button mice, and the laptops allow you to right click in a fashion that will very quickly feel MUCH more natural than on a normal track pad. Yup, they sure run a bit hot. But the heat issues were fixed back in august, when they replaced the batteries, logic board, and redid the thermal pasting. The SMC updates also helped. I've used units from both pre and post fix, and there is a MAJOR difference. And reports show that the C2D units run even cooler, with higher clocked components.

And yeah, it's a bit weird trying to find software out there for the mac. There is a ton, and a large free-ware community, not as large as windows, but from my experience so far, it's been much higher quality. Now, software cracks... those were difficult to find for a bit...

And yes, my experience is that Macs do have lockups too. Though, it's hard for me to gauge, since I think I have a bad unit, and just have never got around to talking to Apple about it. Right now, I think most issues are revolving around none UB programs, such as Flash, that are causing program crashes. But, this is expected as part of the switch.

But yeah, my main reason for switching was so I could easily test my web app software in all browsers for css support. That and curiosity. And I didn't want to spend more or the same money for a Dell Latitude, Sony, or IBM. If I'm spending 2k for laptop, I wanted to get something really new, not just in terms of hardware.

 

this is too long...LOL... but nice detailed explanation...

 

The processor has nothing to do with it. You can make malware for Intel or PowerPC, or whatever. They can't enlist the help of the PC community because the system architecture is so different than the Microsoft architecture that the "lessons" learned on Windows are useless on a Unix style machine. You're living in a fantasy world, though. Apple's systems are much more robust from the ground up than Windows is, and their only plausible threat is people explicitly running dodgy programs. I've done more than enough research into both systems as a developer to know this firsthand.

 

I was obviously not talking about direct ports to Apple, Pita.

 

Nor was I. I should have clarified, by "system" I meant the software, the operating system. If you don't understand the Unix architecture and how OSX is designed, you don't get how it's pretty much impossible to do anything to the system unless it has been explicitly run (such as a user running a program, and giving it the root password to install system-level changes) or comes in through a service that has been enabled explicitly (such as an email server that runs as root, and is subsequently compromised, but no such servers are installed by default on OSX). OSX already HAS learned from Windows' mistakes. Your predictions of doom are misplaced, because viruses and spyware are quite hard, if not impossible, to get into an OSX system without explicit user intervention, which you can never protect against. Macs don't have wide open services like RPC installed by default listening to the world on an external network interface.

 

ummmm...why? Mac's hold what a best estimate of 8% of the world PC market. And Safari makes up at best 4-6% of a sites browser activity ...and those are generous estimates (actually a fast check for the last 18-months of data and Safari is around 0.9% of all users visiting all my client's and my own sites.) Why should a developer give a rat's rear end about taking time to test for those users?

My target client and customer market does not contain sufficent revenue potential to waste a single mouse cliks worth of time testing against any Apple OS or browser. Let them come to me and adjust their non-standards compliant behaviors...otherwise I am losing money if I spend any time at all working around Mac related issues.

If I had a room full of developers maybe I could justify letting one developer spend 2-3 hrs/month working on any issues related to Apple systems.

Cripes I would be better off spending time coding for MSNTV/WebTV users...so, I cannot buy the issue of NEEDING to test against Safari at all.

 

So it's okay for you to ignore Safari because 0.9% of your users use it? I'm sorry, but that's ridiculous. So you're saying that if your site suddenly became incompatible with Safari you wouldn't care? That sounds like some great customer support you have there... Customers should never be ignored simply because they're the minority IMO.

 

I just checked http://www.macvirus.org/database/1, and they haven't added a new Mac virus to their database since 2005, and most that they added in 2005 were from before 2000... before OS X.

Another link on Mac viruses:
http://antivirus.about.com/gi/dynam...slistfind.asp?findWhere=001&findTxt=macintosh

 

Limited resources and..... can't please them all.

 

As long as you design your sites to the standards, then it's Apple's problem. But if you design them to be IE specific, you're part of the problem ActiveX on the web should die. If you want a cheap way to test for mostly Safari compatibility, you can use a Linux liveCD with KDE, and use the Konqueror browser, as it uses most of the same rendering as Safari (they based Safari on the kweb program)