GTX285m SLI vs HD 5870 Crossfire

Funny...we said like the same thing at almost the same exact time.

I agree though...Nvidia makes up the small benchmark differences with driver support and application customization.

 

Great minds think alike but fools never differ

Not sure where we stand in that statment though

 

that's because they're not using physX. They're using a software physics version, but not physx. The only way you can enable physx is through the use of an nvidia card.

Again.. 5870s.

Although I prefer their drivers, Nvidia cards have had just as many problems with the M17X and driver support as 5870s have had, and they had to live with it for a lot longer than we did.

 

I hope that they come out with bios support for Nvidia cards to somewhat future proof these beasts. I loved the 280m's in my late R1, I just didn't like the mobo. I think that the 285m's will be slightly under the MRHD5870's in performance and the support for SLI, PhysX, and Cuda will be great for majority of games att! You'll definitely have to let us know how goes the greens when you recieve your system Lozz

 

So does anyone have a computer yet with the 285's in SLI?

 

Monday....

 

so we will see how the 285SLI perform in m17x very soon...lol

 

Hey guys,

I have a system exchange currently being built. I originally had dual 4870s, but they gave me a bunch of problems. I was told I would be getting a graphics card upgrade for my troubles. I assumed I would be getting dual 5870s, but instead they upgraded me to dual 285m sli. So, I'm wondering, which are better?

Obviously, the 285's are more expensive, but aren't they based on old technology? What's more, aren't they only DX10 while dual 5870's are DX 11?

Which one benches better (after the latest firmware has been applied to the 5870's) and which one has better driver support? Does SLI or crossfire run more smoothly based on the current driver offers of nvidia and ati?

Do nvidia drivers need to be modded before alienware's 285s will accept them?

That is all, thanks for any input ahead of time.

I'm asking because, well, I don't see any reason why they wouldn't let me downgrade the cards after i receive the system.

 

The alienware has native support for the 285's but they are just slower in almost every way....and hotter and use more power.....

I would call back and demand 5870s

 

wait.. 285's are that new to the m17x that no one even knows how they will actually bench and whether or not they have any major issues?

 

New to the M17x yes. New, no. They are a gpu that came out early 2008.

 

So 5870's are only worse because of drivers? I thought the firmware update fixed that discrepancy?

 

They are not worse at all. The ONLY reason to go with the GTX 285 would be if you play a game that is

-optimized for nvidia over ATI (most of the "The Way Its Meant To Be Played" titles)
-using PhysX heavily
-if you need CUDA

Otherwise the 5870m's offer alot more performance in games and benches

 

^My thoughts exactly (beat me to it lol)

Just to spell it out, the difference is:

5870's

- More raw general gaming performance
- Cheaper
- Use less power so less chance of throttling under extreme stress or overclocking
- DX11
- No physx support etc

285's

- Performance is a bit less than the 5870's
- Old technology
- Nvidia has a history of good driver support (varying results on the m17x)
- High power usage, sometimes pushing the limits of the power supply
- Good SLI scaling
- The nvidia control panel has lots of native options that ati users have to get 3rd party software for (radeon pro)
- Physx/cuda support (for the few games that support it, making the physics and performance better)

The original m17x r1 had the option to have the SLI GTX 280m's (which are essencially the same card). It's just that they are a new option on this model revision.
There are no real reasons for getting the 285's now due to the recent news of an imminant release of the 460m's and the possibilities of the 470m's aswell. Overall between the 285's and the 5870's the 5870's are better and the 285's are old.

 

Just my to pennies (and not because i have a preference towards ati) but i would back the 5870's.

I would however, be interested to see how (or if) gtx460m/480m would perform in an R3 M17x if released as an option.

 

My 5870's have been on back order since 10/27. So tempted to just say F it and go back to Nvidia... *sigh*.

 

add 'alienware reccomended' to that list scook LOL.

apparently, alienware now reccomends you pay a $50 'special' tax with your M17X. They've also fixed the graphic(or rather copy & pasted it from the R1), showcasing how the 4870 is > 280... because that's just so relevent and no one will assume then that 5870 is also > 285.

for parts upgrade? People have had the cards on backorder for months when they initially came out, and Dell has seemed to always had supply issues for non-warraty service distribution. You might have a shorter wait for 285s, but that's because the demand is also less, and there's a good reason for that..

 

Can anyone post stable OC settings for the 285m's?

I've only had my R2 exchange for about 2 weeks now, but what a difference from the 260's in the R1.

 

stable results will differ from card to card.. There's no set number for every GTX285, or any graphics card. However, I managed 705/1155/1775 on mine.

 

I would expect around 700MHz core (so 1725 shader). 1155 is great for that memory, 1080 was as high as my GTX 280m's would go. I have a new set now and will have time to thoroughly bench them some day.....

 

Well, I had my 285m sli setup for a week, and it is already at depot due to freezing issues with all kinds of diff drivers..

 

You guys are talking about returning the laptops within 21 days, is that a free return period? If new cards come out within the next 3 weeks since I got mine yesterday, can I send it back get a refund and order a better system?

 

It depends on where you live. In some countries the return period is 21 days, in some it's as low as 7 days. Call technical support and ask what the deal is where you live.

 

that's not a good news. I sent the rep earlier tonight to change 285 to 5870. Now i need to either worry about it being too long due to the shortage on 5870, or to worry about having to go with 285 and experience these freezing issues.

 

There is not a shortage really, new orders will process. They just are not selling the cards by themselves.

 

that's great news!

i just saw plenty people who had claimed they were getting 285s switched to 5870 finally in this thread. And there must be a reason for it, hence why i switched to 5870 as well. it's like Japanese cars, no matter how they criticize on them, more people get them for a reason ;p

 

I'm having a situation here:

As I was enjoying the last days of my R1 which is being exchanged, i found it was not even capable of CoD Black ops. At first i thought it was FPS, but when i look at it through EVGA precision, i found that FPS maintains at 40-60, and sometimes 80. I realized that it's all that kind of spikes that was holding me back. What's more serious is i found that the freq/usage/temp of the second GPU is much lower than the first card. I assume that only one card is at work.

I checked NVidia control panel, SLI is enabled, i even make it to be always at maximum performance when using steam. I suspect this could be because I'm using a display through HDMI, and the second card is dedicated to providing signals to the HDMI display and the other one is taking gaming task? If this is true, i would be very frustrated, because I can't live without my 27'' display while playing game!

BTW, i have 2 of 260Ms. And no, i do not set duplicate or extend desktop, laptop's screen is always off, only HDMI display is being used.

Thanks fellas!

EDIT: i just tested it, disabling HDMI does not address the issue.

 

More likely is simply that there is not an SLI profile for the game. Make sure you are using the newest nvidia driver

The game is brand new....new games always take a couple weeks to smooth out with drivers

 

What's funnier is I get to use both cars in Team Fortress 2, but not CoD Modern Warfare or CoD BOps...

It could be the driver not being compatible or optimized for CoD engine or something?

Btw, i'm not using the latest driver, but i'm using the latest beta driver, the one dell released to address DPC issue. What should I do?

 

get the latest nvidia driver. that is your problem right there....look at when that driver came out vs the games you are trying to play

 

yes, the latest driver was released in August. I'm just afraid DPC issue will come back without that beta driver

 

All you have to do is load them and check

it is not like any permanent damage will be done

 

sigh. Installed latest driver, issue persists, and it brought back DPC latency

luck i got exchanged system.

 

What BIOS do you have on the R1? A03 or A05 are pretty much required to combat DPC latency - in conjunction with more modern drivers. The newer nvidia stuff is supposed to be rid of the DPC problems

 

A05, and the DPC issue had to be addressed by the beta driver after a year!

By the way, figured it out, it was sneaky NVidia's adaptive power management. Now both cards run at the same speed, while there are still plenty graphic spikes in the game. Gonna go back to beta driver and see if it persists.

 

Its the game, not the adaptive power management. Feel the air coming out of the fans, I bet money your left gpu will be pushing warm air and the right pushing cool. Take a look at the black ops discussion thread.

 

If you are seeing DPC latency spikes in the red or yellow with 260.99, its something else. 260.99 as all drivers released since NV incorporated the initial DPC fix have been free of DPC latency.

R1 280M GTX SLI here - 260.99, BIOS A05, NO DPC Latency.

CS, BlackOps has multiple issues with poor FPS and lag on multiple systems. This is the game. Patches have been released and there are still issues. Its going to take time.

Please move the BlackOps related discussion to the 17x BlackOps thread.

Lets get back on topic which is 285 vs 5870.

Thanks.

 

I got my new system with 285's in it today. I'm actually on the phone right now with alienware having my cards ahem, "downgraded" to dual 5870's.

I will say one thing though, the 285's have a sweet, new connector for SLI that seems much more secure. I wish ATI implemented this.

 

The M17 had a CF connector similar to the SLI one in the M17x, which I agree is worlds better than the current CF connector

 

it is the clip on rather than pressure installed which I agree is better, but the R1 had this on the nvidia cards too, so its not new. What is new is that the SLI cable is made from the same tapped together bits of wire like the CF cable instead of the flexiable PCB material like in the R1. If you rip it from the magnesium plate or are rough with it, the tape likes to disintegrate which then leaves you with exposed wires. It looks and feels as cheap as it is basicly.

 

is "pcb material" the golden/beige sand-papery like material they use to fill gaps and whatnot inside of the m17x and other computers/devices?

 

gaps? I'm not sure what you're referring to. They are paper ribbon cable type material I suppose, like this.

the keyboard ribbon cable is the same stuff, so are the Media and DVD rom reader cables.

 

I called Dell Australia today to ask if I could upgrade my ATI 4870's to 5870's, and they told me I couldn't.

Is that normal? I own an M17x-R2 model and I'm bummed because if I had waited a month I would have gotten 8GB RAM and the 5870 X-fire setup for less instead of my current 4GB RAM and 4870 X-fire setup now.

I guess that's how the cookie crumbles, but I figured I'd be able to upgrade? :/. If that isn't possible, is there anywhere to look online for cheap 5870 cards? I've no problem installing it myself.

 

Just order 5870's from Dell and sell your 4870's. That makes your life easier.

 

So it's definite that they will work in my model? I am guessing if you buy two that they also send the CF cable, too?

Thanks for the reply.

 

technically, the Slave card includes the cable as the package, so you don't have to buy two. However yes, Dell 5870's will work in the R2. 110% guarenteed

 

Awesome, alrighty thank you very much =D.

 

just to be clear, you need the master and slave 5870's to do the upgrade. I was sort of just being a smarty-pants.

 

I shall be clear, too.

I've only got two 4870's in my machine at the moment, if I ring Dell to order two 5870's, do I ask one of the cards ordered to be a master card and one to be slave card?

 

they should do that for you when you ask for a CF 5870 upgrade, but it doesn't hurt to be absolutely clear you need a master and slave.