Upgrading my Ranger

If that AC adapter is plugged in, that transparent plastic should be lit blue as well

 

The adapter's tape always covered the blue LED area, I'll check tommorow to see if the blue LED works or not as I'm doing things and this thing will shut off in like 20 seconds if its unplugged.

 

Was playing GTA V, and now I'm starting to think that I did end up getting a dud heatsink . 89C vs 97C on different cores, somethings up. I just really hope that the contact plate is flat enough for me to apply liquid metal in the near future...

EDIT:
Will do some testing tomorrow and will see if anything is wrong with the heatsink as I still have 7 days to email Cicichen. I don't know though, the heatsink seemed fine when it shipped, so I'm thinking that the bracket on the MOBO is just crap or something. I'll figure it out though.

 

I ran out of TFX, I luckily had enough for 1 more re-paste, but I can't really re-paste any more lol. I had noticed that the previous TFX pumped out, but there was still quite a bit in the middle. I also checked the CPU bracket and it seems that the bottom left peg is slightly lower than all of the others, but not by very much.

I inspected the contact plate and couldn't see any large dents or bends, so I think its alright, so I'm assuming the culprit might be the CPU bracket.

 

Okay, now XTU isn't openeing, I have uninstalled and re-installed it, and now it only gives me the option to adjust the bus clock. I've heard something about newer XTU versions not working well with older CPU's. I’ve tried downloading a bunch of older versions but they all either don’t work, or just give me the option to only adjust the bus clock. @Clamibot seems to have a working version of XTU, would you mind telling me what version it is and where you got it from?

I'm sorry for spamming this thread, but I just keep having problem after problem, and I can’t find solutions.

 

Scrap xtu for throttlestop

 

That’s what i’ll probably do, the only issue is that I don’t really know how to fully use throttlestop. I’ll probably read a bunch on it tonight to figure it out as it seems that it’s a lot better than XTU, but the learning curve is quite steeper.

 

Everything xtu removed over the years throttlestop retains.

I wouldn't mess with xtu, it's more an afterthought for Intel imo

 

Yeah, I learned the basics of Throttlestop and its starting to make more sense. I'm currently running at 4ghz, but I haven't stress tested anything as I fear that will thermally shut down the laptop.

 

There is no MXM power limit on Ranger at 130W. I posted this many times here. I pulled over 140W+ from 980M itself with high voltage vBIOS, it might be due to the vBIOS or something with Pascal aftermarket cards interacting with the EC ? not sure just guessing.

The EC is a mess with the fan controls, many use the Unlocked sBIOS with MX CPUs but I think only 2 people got the DPTF BIOS level Fan control on the AW17 and 18 Haswell platform. I do not have an MX CPU to try that out, the BIOS shows the option but I didn't want to mess with it and DPTF software is also there for AW17 R1 platform, not sure how relevant it will be, since the fans operate at EC-BIOS level not the OS level unless we are talking about HWInfo direct control with ECs, maybe it operates like XTU ? dunno. Also on XTU, it's bloatware trash and messes up your OS permanently until you re-install Windows again as it changes the CPU BIOS registers and keeps them in the OS memory.

M17x R4 has a CPU power limit cap vs Ranger probably from the conversations here as for Ranger, I do remember @Papusan 4930MX pulled 110W+.

Also 1080 and up GPUs in this chassis and Haswell 4C8T platform IMHO it's not that worth for the heat plus power when you are limited to 1080P panel, Haswell cannot handle that GPU without CPU bottleneck unless OCed to 4GHz+ all core and again another massive power+heat spike from CPU. As for the Power limit on the platform, I think the DC jack/mobo has a max limit, it won't pull over 270-300W or such couldn't remember, the M18x R2 doesn't have this limit afaik. Not sure about M17x R4.

I bought a Delta PSU directly from Dell for $180, the original PSU no bs no strings attached, works fantastic it's been 5 years also Dell has an idchip on the mobo the modded PSUs won't be recognized properly, why are you using franken PSUs lol, get a real Delta PSU Dell branded asap.

Once I get a Desktop and fully transfer all of the data, then I will try to mod the Heatsink and others if possible, personally do not want to go dremel route on this machine. But a HS mod would be great, the ebay HS were always a damn hit or miss. A shame that these guys didn't put a 3Pipe HS while AW18 got it.

 

Yeah, it either has something to do with the vBIOS on the Pascal cards, or it may be that the 1070 has a different pinout than the Nvidia guided MXM cards as MSI were on their own with Pascal and beyond.

Agreed that the EC is terrible on this thing. I always used the fans at max speed through HWInfo and have moved to Throttlestop to OC the CPU instead of XTU.

When I was outside in the cold night a few weeks ago, I think the highest amount of power the CPU pulled was also around the 100 watt mark at 4.3ghz all cores IIRC, but I'm not 100% sure as this was a few weeks ago.

I know that the bottleneck would be insane, but I'd like to just get the 1080 working for the sake of me being able to say it works .

Well, this laptop was bought used, and the PSU was some Flextronics one that I now realize was dogshit. Right now, until Reciever gets me his 330 watt one, its either extreme power throttling and battery use while gaming, or its a constant 50 watts max on the GPU with no frame spikes/bad frametimes or battery usage, I'd rather go with the latter.

I respect Cicichen, but he is too hit or miss. I'm hoping my heatsink isn't bad as even with TFX, it starts pumping out at the 2-3 week mark.

 

Hey, I'm sorry for this late reply. I would've replied earlier, but I stopped getting notifications for some reason. I use XTU version 6.0.2.8. I got it from intel's site directly, but I don't think you can download it from there anymore. Fortunately I still have the installer. Here is a link to it on my google drive: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1DEnoOC6zabcm858G3qu8oHHqSmgz0tQS/view?usp=sharing

I know a lot of the people on this forum strongly dislike XTU, but I think it's an awesome tool. I much prefer it over throttlestop since it's more straightforward and simpler to use than throttlestop in my opinion. I've tried using throttlestop a few times, and I really don't like it.

 

Was a bit bored and decided to test my brothers Quest 2 on the Ranger, but wirelessly. Despite having my castrated 1070, and a dogshit wireless card, Pavlov VR ran surprisingly well. I was getting around 30ish FPS which was alright. I believe if I upgrade to something like an AX200 or Killer 1650X, and get the new PSU for the Ranger, that I will be able to play completely wireless VR quite well.

The reason I say Pavlov VR ran surprisingly well is because I'm used to playing VR games on a 3gb 970m with a 6700hq. Best to say that was a nightmare.

 

Alright, I just bought some Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and these foam dam barriers that @Falkentyne has recommended for others to use (thanks for the recommendation!) I have some random electrical tape in a cabinet (no clue where it came from and when it was purchased) that I plan on using, but would it be alright to use it? I know that Super 33+ and Kapton tape are recommended as they stay normal under high temperatures, but could my "generic" electrical tape be fine under the same scenario?

 

Super 33+ tape is only $8. And it's very thin and has excellent adhesion. I wouldn't recommend generic tape at all. Some of that stuff is beyond awful.
3M Super 33+ and 3M High Temp Polyimide (Kapton) tape is of the highest quality and well worth having (the Polyimide tape is also essential for solder masks).

 

Alright, I'll order some Super 33+ then, thanks for the feedback!

I just hope the heatsink isn't ****ed, though, if it is, the electrical tape and the foam dam should be able contain any spillage

 

The 330w power supply arrived today, and I decided to try out the Heaven Benchmark at max settings. I know this isn't the best benchmark, but I'd like to wait to do Firestrike until I have my liquid metal on the CPU.

Here is the score, I don't really know if this is good or bad, but I know it's a hell of a lot better than my 970m


EDIT:

Okay, I got kind of bored and decided to do both Firestrike and Timespy, here are the results.

 

Just a little tuning and you should be able to hit 17,500 GPU score

 

Yeah, I was only pulling like 100 watts at max, so I think I have a bit of headroom.

 

I'm so damn close, I did 300mhz+ on the core and 150+ on the memory. It still seems to say power limit throttle when it goes above like 102-103 watts, and I haven't seen the GPU surpass 103 watts, dunno if this is normal or if its something else as I thought the limit was like 120ish watts, but I may be wrong.

 

Try +500 memory, unicorns were able to hit +1000

 

I’ll try, but I’m worried about the VRAM getting too hot as the 4 chips closest to the VRM’s aren’t covered by anything. My 40mm mini heatsinks are above them as the main GPU heatsink is indented where the memory chips are.

 

Nah vram was never a problem, its GDDR5 not 6. VRMs are only an issue because they are densely packed together for the heatsink most would use with it.

You mean to say you have no contact at all on the vram though?

 

No, The 40mm aluminum heatsinks I have don't contact the area of the main copper heatsink where the VRAM chips are. I do have contact between the VRAM chips and the main copper heatsink with a thermal pad, as I should have.

EDIT:
500mhz on the VRAM causes quite a bit of artifacting when idling
Now 250mhz is causing artifacting. I think this is because the card was heavily used prior to me installing it in this system, hence why high memory clocks just don't work

 

samsung or hynix?

 

Samsung

 

I cant remember what mine was lol

Time to program the vbios for 115w since it doesn't seem to be boosting, but well if it works OK for now then no harm no foul

 

The boost was at stock in the screenshot as I had since restarted the system. I’ll do more testing tommorow

 

Okay, everything has arrived for me to safely apply LM, but I must ask, would it be a good idea to lightly sand my heatsink so that the LM doesn't soak into the copper as easy, or does it not really matter?

Anyways, I have a small plastic piece of tupperware that I will get the LM ball into, and then I'll use the included Q-tip-esk thing to transfer the ball onto the CPU and heatsink. I'll make sure to cut out the foam I ordered to ensure it isn't affecting the contact pressure.

 

Got the LM applied, and booted, but as soon as I loaded windows, it shut off. I’m hoping everything is fine and the laptop still gets to the BIOS, but I’m going to tear down the laptop again and see what the culprit is. My biggest guess is that the foam dam is too tall allowing the CPU to overheat and shut off.

 

Sorry for the spam. It seems like little to NO contact was being made. It seemed 1 little ball was connected and that was it. I’ve tried to cut the foam thinner but I just can’t. I remember @Falkentyne saying something about using thermal paste as a barrier. I have a ton of NT-H1, and may end up using that. Would this be a good idea or no?

Here are some pics of the disassembly:

 

The foam isn't the problem here. It's cut as thin as possible so the resistance it's going to add is going to be negligible.
You just have bad contact. I've seen this happen before. Usually this happens if you use a combination of electrical tape, conformal coating (nail polish) and barriers at the same time.
Each layer of anything you have around the CPU substrate reduces the amount of space available.

What's that bulge under the tape on the top? That's sticking out a lot. Is it higher than the die? Do you have something under that tape on the bulge? That can't look good. If it's equal height to the die itself, that's going to cause a problem.
Your foam seems to be outside that bulge, but I would suggest looking into what's causing that.

 

That is native to the CPU, just the two rows of diodes (not sure of the proper name if it isnt that). Though I cant say if its just the tape though...

For mine I just used a couple of layers of glue

 

I ended up saying **** it and went and used my NT-H1. Everything works great now and my temps have dropped like 10-15C. I noticed that the foam would bulge out the sides when looking at the heatsink with the foam. And when I touched the heatsink after turning the laptop on, it wasn't hot, meaning the heatsink wasn't making contact with the die.

I took quite a bit of pics on what I did and may post them here later, but I hate blowing everyone in this thread up with a wall of text.

Here is the pic of my line of NT-H1 that seems to work well

 

You don't need this foam barriere if you handle your laptops in normal behaviour. I have never use it and all my laptops/pc's works as day one.

 

I know that, but I was and still am quite paranoid about LM as it was my first time applying it and that all of my repastes in the past had spilled off quite quickly. (Though, when I tore the laptop down earlier, the TFX I had last applied DIDNT spill off and was on quite well.)

I’m going to keep an eye on everything, but I think it will be fine.

 

I think I managed to trim the foam down to about 0.2mm, so thin that you could easily rip it apart if you picked it up. So maybe you had it too thick. The NT-H1 will work though. I prefer something even thicker like Thermalright TFX or Arctic Ceramique 1 (Not 2).

 

Yeah, I ran out of TFX and just had NT-H1 laying around as I got a huge amount of it for dirt cheap. I may do something in the future, but I think everything is doing fine now I appreciate your help!

 

If you want to increase the longevity of your LM application, you should pre treat the heatsink by spreading the LM on it first, and then letting it soak in. Afterward, you can apply LM to the CPU die and heatsink and it should be good for multiple years.

 

Okay, now that I'm able to do 4.0ghz all cores without worrying about a thermal shutdown, I must say that Emulation on this machine is a lot better than my 6700hq/970m. I play quite a bit of Mario Kart Wii online on Dolphin Emulator, which hits the CPU pretty hard, and I haven't seen a single frame below 60 whereas I would get constant frame drops when loading in textures or if there was a lot going on with the GL502. Well, this thing destroys my GL502 in general lol, which I intend to sell as I despise that thing. It thermal throttled all of the time, the 970M was the garbage 3gb BGA one, and the build quality was sub-par.

This project is mostly done, but I will be sure to keep everyone updated and will continue to try to break @Reciever's Firestrike record, and in the winter, I'll try to break @Papusan's CB R15 4930MX record. I appreciate everyone's dedication to helping me out and teaching me a lot about this laptop, your help has extended this Ranger's life by about 1-2 years, and I will be extremely thankful for that, so Thank You!

 

Oddly enough I am back on the 1070 on my desktop now lol Gone full circle, but technically yours would out pace mine given a high enough overclock

 

Did you end up selling your Radeon 7, or did you end up using it as a mining slave?

 

I think it's time for me to order some LM because I'm getting tired of having to reseat my thermal paste once every few weeks. I've historically been against using LM on my machines because of its electrical conductivity, but I've done other things to my machines (like giving them a bath in soap and water) that surprises people that know me well since they know how careful I am with my stuff.

That and I really want to push this thing as far as it'll go. What I really need is one more GPU upgrade to an RTX card on this thing so I can play my newest games at 120 fps. Chances are I'll probably end up getting a Clevo X170 before that happens (cause we probably won't get an RTX card for this laptop).

 

Yeah, the only scenario in which one can test an RTX card with the Ranger would be finding a for parts HP Zbook with a Quadro RTX card, or some less knowledgeable person on E-bay selling one. Both of those options look grim though .

I plan on trying the MSI 1080 with the external power connector on this laptop when this machine falls out of my daily use, as it seems to be the only option to allow more power to the card. Hopefully by then I will have more skill when it comes to soldering and electricity in general

I may get a lower spec X170 once I build a desktop to allow for portability when needed, but I'm not too impressed with the current cut down mobile offerings, hence why I decided to re-build this 7 year old titan.

 

I still got it, going to keep it even when it no longer makes a profit, just one of those unicorn cards lol

Someday I hope to find some of the older unique cards too

 

Alright, all of the sudden my Package temps shot up, I've stress tested the machine and no shut off, but its thermal throttling. I've restarted a few times and this issue still happens, anyone know what's going on? I'm hoping its not the LM deciding to die as I dont have the LM right now, but I find this odd because everything was normal until like 15 minutes ago when the package temps shot up.

EDIT:
While idling, HWINFO and TS both report the CPU package temps rapidly jumping between 40ish C and 80ish C, still trying to figure out whats going on, I hope the LM hasn't damaged anything.

 

Okay, it seems the damn LM dried up or something, it looked all weird when I unscrewed the heatsink and when I tried to use a Q-tip to spread it, the Q-tip absorbed literally ALL of the LM. I then tried seeing what would happen if I tried to spread it out on the heatsink, but nothing happened on the heatsink (probably because it’s all absorbed into the heatsink by now.) I may be able to get the LM later today, but could anyone tell me what the hell happened?

The image attached is when I used a Q-tip in the right side of the CPU die, the upper left was untouched.


EDIT: Okay, I think what happened is that the LM got absorbed into the copper because I tried using a Q-tip with and without alcohol to get it off of the copper, and it wasn’t picking much up. I’ll be able to get the Conductonaut later today, but when re-applying, should I add some ontop of the current LM on the copper, or should I only apply some on the die? Here’s a pic of the heatsink, sorry if it’s a bit blurry.

 

The LM got absorbed into the heatsink, hence my suggestion you pre-treat it first.

Welp now since it got absorbed into the heatsink, your next application of LM won't. That second application will last a lot longer.

 

Re-applied the LM and the same damn issue is happening. The cores will idle at like 35-40C and the package and GT cores will be at 40-80C rapidly switching between those two numbers. I can't pinpoint down what the hell is happening and I can't find anyone else who has the same issue.

This is what HWINFO gives me when I play a Youtube video:

 

Interesting. Does a cinebench run cause a thermal shutdown? If not, the sensor for the package temperature may be messed up.