M17 OC Benchmarking - The Next Generation!

Are there problems with 4850's in combination with an xtreme cpu?

 

I would assume you would have the same issue with the x9100. A P9700, T9800 or T9900 would be your best bets.

 

After looking at the intel site i got this information:

T9600, T9800 & T9900 = 35 W
P9700 = 28 Watts
X9100 = 44 Watts
QX9300 = 45 Watts

So basicly anything above 35 W is a no go?

 

most likely yes. but remember the cpu will only use what it needs. running 4 cores vs 2 may make the difference there. or just stay with the 3870 and the better cpu. tough choice

 

i havent got a qx9300 si i can only go off what im reading but

it does stutter even with 1 3870 installed ( so i doubt its the cards type )

is it the same as desktop is it the rail that carrys the power to the processor thats its just not powerfull enough. i cannot remember its been so long when i used to do desktops but i remember the powersupply sometimes wasnt powerfull enough to run a newer graphics card. so it needed a new power supply

how much power (current amps) does the laptop pull altogether does anyone know.

becuase its pointless increasing the volts.

its like buying a transformer from r.s being 240v and 2 amp if what your plugging in is 240v and 2.5 amp the voltage will drop because it cannot deliver the current.

bit like when your car battery dies 12v if you test across it but as soon as you put any load on it the volts drop.

im just trying to get an understanding of this ..... am i in the right ball park.

as im curious now... and if z is right that shocking that the boards too weak.

 

I never had any stuttering issues with my 4850s and my X9100 multiplier overclocked to 3.325Ghz.

I'm guessing despite theoretical TDP being that high, actual power draw is generally much lower (2 vs 4 cores!), especially if you get a low VID chip.

 

ive just been looking and flexronics state that tdp up to 55w so it should be able to cope with the quad @45w

 

That is good to hear, thanks Alex. Now i know what my CPU upgrade will be and it will make my M17 an even bigger monster !

 

Yes, my qx9300 with the 3870s worked fine.

 

but you have problems now mandrake do you with 4850s?

 

just to state the obvious q9000 is a 45w tdp cpu.......

 

what you have to remember is the quad will normally draw more no matter due to the four cores. the dual under the same clock conditions will draw less. even if both are rated the same 44 vs 45 the dual will get to that point far less and for less time than the quad will. and yes the power section is only a small 2 phase design even the cheapest 30$ desktop boards are always at least 3 or even 4

 

It's a shame that's almost impossible to modify
Improved power regulation would fix the issue from what you suggest.

Quite sad really that it looks like the whole M17 quad stutter was actually a hardware fault, not the heat issue that was believed for so long.

Makes you wonder what they were thinking really!

 

Seems like they where not thinking anything lol.

 

but im sure when these things were being checked that the qx9300 was even underclocked lowerd fsb so the quadcore cpu shouldnt be using its max potential but yet we still had stuttering ?

 

well remember this system was NOT designed for the 4850's it was built around the 3870's. and of course they will not run the qx9300 overclocked. now all of the systems for me i have tested or owned with the extra shim on the nb and the qx9300 with 3870 crossfire ran fine no stutter. even overclocked some i had no stutter.

when i pushed the cpu to its upper limits yes i saw some. with the 4850's and the quad it stutters. stock or oc'ed. my bios' i did were both using the 3870's for testing as i did not have the 4850's here. anything i can do with the bios does not fix the issue totally. i did lessen the effect some with lowering voltages and adjusting some power settings but then the cpu is not very stable nor does it oc very far. the person at flex i used to deal with himself a long while ago said these were never originally intended for major overclocking. im with the people that said there was a reason for aw to stop selling the 4850's so fast...

 

Thanks
that was very helpful
I will drop the idea of getting 4850 for my m17
& wait for there next new Laptop in 2010
hopeing it will have Usb 3.0

 

any chances of reworking the bios for 4850 in mind?

 

Correct.

QX9300 + 3870s = OK
QX9300 + 4850s = Not OK
T9900 + 4850s = OK

 

not really much to be done. just the fact that it just cant supply it with the power it wants. not much except lowering everything in the bios i can do but then for sure no overclocking and possibly even underclocking will occur..simply because ill have to run things below what they really need and the system may not even be stable. i tried with the 4850 system i had here for testing for two days going down some for the cpu, nb ram etc and even then the stutter got better but i still had it every once in a while. but the cpu was at stock speeds and i also did not test stability either which may be effected. it seems to rid this issue the power would have to be turned down so far as to possibly even effect stock speed stability.

 

cheers z that makes sense, i was just picking your brains lol...

1 more question z

do you know how may things run on the same power line as the cpu and if so do you know what they are

thanks for your hard work anyway as well....infact everybodies hard work.

 

I don't understand why single 4850 still will get the stutter even though the power consumption of single 4850 will be way lower than the 3870s. That's what bother me now

 

let me pull out the board and check for you later. ill let you know. i have to go through the board again as i dont remember.

it could prob be remedied if someone wanted to mod the board itself. cost wise imo not worth it. if you can do it yourself then i could prob help with the design but the board would still have to fit in the case etc so it would need specific sized components etc.. prob would get pricey

 

the cards are not being fed enough starved if you will. doesnt matter if its one or 2.

 

hi z i was looking and 3870 is 55w
4850 is between 45 60 w no one knows it was supposed to draw less power ( alledegdly)
new mobility 5870 is rated at 60w

but like you said if its that tight then .5w per card might be the killer if it was 60w

 

Just called Alienware twice. They have no 4850s available. Either that, or both guys were blowing smoke up my butt.

 

Definitely is the 4850 that causes the unwanted stutter. When I load up my machine with both Furmark and Prime95 the machine started to stutter and then I closed Furmark and run only Prime95 and the red bars are gone in the DPC latency checker. In conclusion, I noticed that when the 4850 is load up to 500 core and 800 memory then the stutter will occur. The motherboard just could not support the voltage to both the processor and the graphics card on LOAD. Which mean neither your processor and graphics card can run on full load on the same time. Guess I should go back to 3870 it should solve the problem.

 

It Can with mine and my quad

 

Did you check with DPC latency checker see if its any red bars

 

yes there are red bars but they where not there on b14 how ever the red bars don't cause stutering or lagg

also cheq that powerplay is enabeled i noticed there was minor stutering when i had powerplay disabeled and when i was on the batterie i was only having a long stuter as experience until i enabeled powerplay the 3hours trip befor chrismas made me discover that


i just installed intel 5300 and the dpc is terrible

 

I don't believe the red bars in DPC cause lag. I have it on my M17x with the QX9300 and I have zero lag or stutter on my M17x.

 

no dpc caused no stuter and i just de instaled and updated vers of the driver from intel and it's back down

no what i'm saying that having powerplay disabeled in CCC caused micro stuter pluged in and HUDGE stuter when on batterie

 

Just noticed something related to the stuttering problem. I don't know if this has been mentioned before or not. I have an M17 w/ a QX9300 and 2x3870s. I installed the .29 bios and have overclocked to 3.06GHz with XTU. I'm running Windows 7 Ultimate 64. When I boot up, one of two "themes" will be in effect. If it is my normal (third party) theme that I have set, there will be no stutter. However, other times I boot up, a different theme (I think it's the default one with the blue window borders and all) will be in effect and the stuttering will occur. I've tried to change the theme when the wrong (default) one shows up, and it doesn't change. I don't know what the connection between the stuttering and the messed up theme might be, but there is a consistent coincidence between the two problems. Anyone have any idea on why they might be happening together?

Thanks,
-Rob

P.S. Also, if it boots up correctly and isn't stuttering and has the correct theme and I SLEEP the computer, when I start it back up, it has both the wrong theme and the stuttering problem again. Very annoying. Any ideas?

 

the presssure the complexity of the theme put on the systeme like vista theme put more pressure on the systeme then win7 one

 

Btw granyte, how much do you score in vantage & 3dmark06?

Merry Christmas!

 

well i got weird 1
p8400 2x 4850s win 7 ultimate

vantage with crossfire disabled 5600
vantage with crossfire enabled 7100
vantage with ati ccc not installed just both cards running 9.12 drivers i get 7300

i wish i could just run crossfire driver without ccc

 

Kcuk, whats your GPU score?

 

i had that issue from the intel 5300 card with the msi i have. i went back to my atheros card and dpc is fine now... make you wonder

 

propper drivers with 9.12 catalyst ... i had wrong drivers installed i get

vanatge 7382 gpu score 9660 cpu score 4323

 

Seems about right, your CPU score lets you down a bit but the GPU score i think is about right (or is it?)

 

Yeah, non tweaked stock drivers for 4850's will score around 10k gpu in vantage.

 

Can someone point me to the most up to date drivers for the 2x3870 setup? I haven't updated them since I got the machine, and I'm sure they're out of date. Also, apparently both of them don't work together in Windows 7 Ultimate 64, but they do in Vista 64.

Thanks,
-Rob

 

ati 9.12 just google it

 

I think I am going to sell mine.

 

Merry Christmas !!
Mandrake are you selling the laptop or just the 4850s?

 

Probably the whole thing. One person has already contacted me about the system but I still need to think about it a little more.

 

Think I can hit 11K GPU?

 

Mandrake is it possible to flash 4850 to 4870?

 

I'm assuming you mean the other way around and my guess is no. Way to risky to try it.

 

and another run.