Finally Dell confirms M11x refresh!

Good points, I smell my next Christmas present to myself coming now

+1 rep

 

What about Q3 2011? Probably a better model at that point

 

what about Q1 2012? the world might end because the new alienware model is actually alien technology.

 

Actually, you can't tell by paper or by just computation.its like hey, its the same. Plentium 4 3.0GHz and a Core 2 Duo 3.0GHz but seriously, its a big difference.

Alienware will not make a update just for nothing, it must be something.
"Expect the unexpected"

 

I'm holding out for the 2038 version. I figure it'll be a good laptop for when I retire...

Seriously though, if you need / want the laptop, it's not unreasonable to wait a few weeks to see if Dell comes through with the Arrandale CPUs. Otherwise I would never plan to buy a certain laptop 9-12 months from now, who knows what's out there.

And if the revised core ix series are improved that much then us first genners will have something to look forward to that we can run in the face of the second genners...

No, they won't make an update just for nothing, but considering the SU7300 and SU4100 are no longer manufactured, it may be due to availability as well. I agree clock speed isn't the whole story, and for the desktop and mobile Core ix clock for clock are faster than Core 2 Duo or Quads, but there's nothing solid for the ULV's.

 

@Grandie and All, if you look in the m15x benchmark forum, harrythefish benchmarked his m15x with i7 and the gt240 and the screenshot of
3dmark06 is below. m11x owners with tweaking are almost at the 3dmark benchmark of m15x owners with entry level graphics. His score was 7105. Again this is entry level here. And this is not game benchmarks. Remember it takes a less powerful card to crank more fps @720p then @900p or @1080p. The m11x does fine as is right now for most games. Again.. I say most games. If they say 33 percent more performance that is 1/3 more power. Therefore I expect 33 percent more fps in games before I make those type of claims!

3DMark06 result 21-5 on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

 

most games are heavily depend of GPU and some games use a lot of CPU power but doesn't mean a 32% increase, you will get 32% more fps. some games doesn't even much use CPU at all. what i expect is on applications or softwares like HD movies, Adobe CS5, CAD, and high CPU usage apps.

But surely a 32% increase can play 1080p lagless especially with turbo boost.

C2D 1.73GHz VS I-Core 1.73GHz = I-Core gets 32%

but since I-Core can turbo boost up to 2.4GHz(as an sample)
you might get even more than 32% compared to C2D

 

1) Actually CPU performance does scale relatively well with clockspeed. As Anandtech's original m11x review pointed out, there's roughly 25-32% scaling with a 33% increase in clock speed.

Bear in mind that when the SU7300 in the m11x overclocks it ramps up the FSB and the memory from 800Mhz to 1066Mhz, so the memory bandwidth ramps up by the same amount is the core speed.

2) That's a faulty analogy comparing it with SLI because you have the additional overhead rendering alternate/split frames. A better analogy would be comparing single GPUs solutions which ramp the compute power. The comparison would be between the Radeon 4870 and the Radeon 5870 which doubles the stream processors from 800 to 1600. Unsurprisingly, you see a comparable scaling in performance.

3) I am perfectly aware that ramping the CPU speed doesn't ramp real world performance by the same amount. I assume you would agree with me that the same logic also applies to a core i5-powered m11x also? What is your point?

Either way the comparison between an overclocked SU7300 and the new core i5, based on the data we have available, does not look like a game-changer from a performance or power consumption point of view. If the core i5 would be overclocked then, yes, that would make a difference. But as I have pointed out a) an overclock seems less likely given the i5 already runs with turbo boost and b) an overclock on the i5 will have a disproportionately higher impact on power draw give its higher TDP.

People extrapolating wildly here based on faulty data. As I intimated before, this is a storm in a teacup.

J

 

1) I completely agree that if there is a generational change between processors, given the same clock speeds, you should see a difference in performance.

The argument I am making factors this in. I am arguing that, based on the data we have available, an SU7300 overclocked to 1.73Ghz appears to give similar performance to a core i50-430M clocked at 1.2Ghz (and turbo boosting on single-core up to 1.73Ghz).

On a clock for clock basis press coverage suggests that the core i5 is 30% faster, but that's not the point I am making.

2) I agree with your argument that Alienware would not make an argument without something. However I would agree with htwingnut that "something" could have a broader implication beyond just a speed bump. It could be higher battery life. It could be a lower BoM (bill of materials) for Dell. It could be to standardise their notebook processors on Arrandale (purchasing efficiencies). It might even be to bump up the raw CPU power, but do not assume that is a given.

J

 

I was hoping they will make some options for m11x GPU. Seriously, i didn't like the GT335M no DX11.

 

pst, even a Su2300 (1.2ghz) with hardware decoding (4500mhd) can play 1080P just fine without any problem.

 

why do you care so much about dx11? short of somehow magically jamming in a 5850 in the machine the rest of the dx11 cards are not really powerful to even utilize dx11 effects.

 

i5-520um ULV only boosts to 1.87GHz max with 1 or 2 threads. Asus uses an additional "Turbo" feature to boost it up to 2.4GHz. It isn't an Intel designed feature. Alienware may or may not do something like this. And what is 32% more powerful? SuperPI calculations? File compression, video encoding? What? Giving a blanket 32% means nothing. From what they're saying in the Asus forum there's little difference in real world performance between UL30VT (SU7300) and UL30JT (i5-520um).

Not only that, from my experience with overclocking, a 25-30% CPU overclock would usually result in maybe a 1-2 fps boost in performance, depending on the game of course. I don't doubt it will be an improvement, but it's a minor one. People are thinking this is going to turn the M11x to have M17x performance or something.

 

A Mobility HD 5650 is more than possible but you won't get nVidia Optimus.

The 335M is the best case with the features that it provides and for this form factor.

 

Would a Mobility HD 5830 be an option? Power consumption is only 24 watts and is basically a slower clocked 5850.

 

I was in a bit of a rush in my previous post. There are a wide variety of options in the Mobiliy HD 56xx and 57xx line up. ATI is just using the 400 shader Redwood core with various core clocks and GDDR3/5 types.

I haven't done much investigation into the Mobility HD 5830 but it's possible if they're already using a nVidia GeForce 335M. Though I'd be more interested in what sort of bulk deal nVidia is giving Alienware/Dell on the 335M. They can probably get it for a lot less than a comparable ATI GPU.

nVidia is more than likely pulling a fire sale for Apple too so they can stay on board their mobile lineup.

 

@Jon Tseng - where does it say the memory speed is increased when the cpu is overclocked? I have seen bios revisions that say it is corrected... However I have seen other cpu-z screenshots (post a03 bios) that say it is not.

Since the bios is for both the 4100 and the 7300 either one would have the same features as the other.

Thanks,

StevenX

 

This whole thing makes me twitch considering I ordered basically the day before the "news" broke

 

You have to increase the front side bus to overclock the SU4100 and SU7300. The memory clockspeed is derived off of the FSB. It's entirely possible that Alienware lowers the multiplier from the stock 4x (4 x 200) to a lower 3x (3 x 266 MHz). You get ~800 MHz DDR3 from that.

Otherwise you're taking the RAM up to 1066 MHz. (4 x 266 MHz)

I've learned to play the waiting game after dealing with Apple for the past 5 years.

 

Hey man

See manual p.49 http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/Alw_lp_M11x/en/mm/mm_en.pdf

Now bear in mind overclocking the FSB doesn't definitely mean memory speed is increased (you could also lower the multiplier and run the memory at previous speed). However I would be surprised if they were doing this given 1) It would be much simpler just to run the memory slightly hotter. 2) 1066 isn't a stretch for a lot of DDR3 and 3) Tangential, but I recall there was some uncertainty at time of launch as to whether OCing was covered by warranty; I have a suspicion the reticence from Dell on this may have been because memory (more fragile) was also being OCed (someone correct me, but do the US versions only have DDR3 rated at 800Mhz while memory in the overseas m11xs is 1066?).

J

 

@Jon Tseng -
1. There is no manual overclock for the m11x. This is confirmed and reconfirmed. You would have to modify pin 14 on the cpu/socket to unlock it. Then you would have to have someone setup a program like SETFSB (PLL) to make it work properly.
2. When you overclock the cpu in the bios, by setting the OC value to (ENABLE) it does not Oc the memory at this time.. unless someone can take screen shots with the m11x in cpu-z or something to prove otherwise.
3. North America (m11x) models come with 1066 ddr3 ram, mine does. I had to pull it out and reseat it when I received the laptop, day one, minute one, with the Alienware techs on the phone since it was a bit loose, caused by shipping and it would not boot up at all...only a black screen with a bios beep code.

Best Wishes,

StevenX

 

Your first sentence is correct. However, how you have come to those figures is not.

Please see my post here.

All RAM shipped with the M11x (whether U.S. or Europe) is 1066MHz Samsung RAM. Whether in standard or OC mode, it runs at 800MHz due to the memory divider configuration (mentioned in the link above). I have no idea why they configured it this way, but maybe as you suggested, they decided to limit the RAM to 800MHz on overclock mode to reduce heat output.

 

Might be a likely reason, as the RAM seems to get warm on it's own already.

 

I wonder why your link didn't work for me. Yes, the memory ratio can be changed independently of the of the front side bus in order to maintain an effective memory clock of 800 MHz.

 

I don't really care about the CPU upgrade. I mean, yeah, it'll be great to have an i5 in there, but really, for what I'm doing with it (mainly for school), even an su7300 would be perfectly fine.

The one thing I really am hoping for, and one that I haven't seen too much discussion of on this post, is the possibility of at least one usb 3.0.

and with the new announcement that MSI plans to make more external laptop GPUs (eventually going to USB 3.0-based), this would be awesome.

Computex 2010 Preview: MSI | bit-tech.net

True, it won't make or break the new m11x, but all these small improvements might just make an already beastly laptop just that much better.

I mean, with USB 3.0 you could have all of your games on one external hard drive, get a smaller (and cheaper) SSD inside the m11x, and you've got a much storage for much cheaper.

 

This whole refresh is killing me. While I don't need the M11x right away I don't really want to wait either. I've already canceled my order but I'm hoping some additional information will be leaked before the sale price is over. If the only upgrade is a similar speed CPU and optimus I'd just stick with the current M11x, especially if this meant a increase in price.

Does anyone really think the new M11x refresh will be able to beat the M11x with SU7300, 4GB RAM, 500GB HDD without going over $999 CAD. $1099 is really my cap for this size of a machine. But I can get the specs listed for $999 and I don't think the refresh will be in the same price range.

 

Huh? I don't think anyone suggested there was a manual overclock?

Very interesting. Having checked it on CPU-Z and Everest I stand corrected on this front!

This doesn't change my core assertion, however, that an OC'ed SU7300 seems to get within touching distance of a stock-clocked Core i5-430M. This means that unless they are going to throw a 2Ghz+ overclock into the refresh (which would likely whack battery life), it seems unlikely it will be a game-changer...

 

Frankly, no. The processor alone - even if just an i3 - would add at least 100 onto your order. I'd just stick with the R1 and get an R2 with i5/i7 at a later date if you truly wanted to upgrade.

 

It would be up to Alienware to charge us more. They aren't paying more to get the parts from Intel.

 

An i3 may be around the same price as an SU7300, but an i5 or i7 would certainly add onto the price.

 

I am thinking that the i3 is going to be $50 more than the SU7300.

 

I don't know what prices Alienware is getting the SU7300 but you're going to need to match it with at least the Core i5 430/540UM to achieve price parity. At least going by the list price.

I can imagine the Core i3 330UM replacing the SU4100 and the Core i5 for the upgrade. It should allow for a healthy margin.

 

Anyone read the PC Gamer review on the M11x?
After reading it, I doubt I'll buy a r2 I'll just buy a cheap used r1!

 

That certainly would be my hope and desire if Alienware follows suit with pricing in that window - it'd make it all the better.

 

i am definitely going to look at the more powerful CPUs, after all they are the one item in notebooks which tend to be non-upgradeable. i can always add more Ram or swap out HDD.

 

Which issue had the review?

 

For once I agree with a habs fan!

 

Aahah!
it's in the new one, July 2010 I believe, I received it today.

 

Thanks. I let my membership lapse, I just renewed. I last got March one.

 

Is it a review of the refresh? Is it positive?

 

Very positive of existing M11x.

Review here:

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/2682/m11xpcgamerjuly2010pg92.jpg

 

Sweet! I look forward to buying it on the stand when it comes out. I used to have a subscription for years but then felt that the mag started pandering to games and issues I had no interest in. However lately I have started buying the mag again as it seems to be maturing lol

 

So I just got done reading this whole thread and I'm still split and could use a word of advice. I want an m11x, the most important things right now are battery life and my having it for the summer. (I can't see getting an R2 untill mid July at the earliest after waiting till E3, waiting till its up online, waiting for it to ship) I was in the store ready to buy one when I decided to do a little more research and found out about the refresh. 999 is my absolute max and I can't see myself getting what I want from the refresh for that price. Should I take the plunge with an R1? I can still pick up the R1 at a store down the street, maxed out at $999.

PS. The game I play most are WoW and garrys mod. So I can't see waiting for a better processor when the the 7300 is already fine.

 

woah, where can you get the R1 maxxed out for only 1k?

 

hes dreaming

 

I would honestly wait for the M11X R2. It's just weeks away and will be well worth the wait.

 

I'm with Joe. Wait it out bro. It's so close. In fact, chances are after the refresh you can probably get the R1 even cheaper if you still wanted it.

 

Thats a good point, after seeing how the battery life holds up with the new processors and the extra cost they tag along, I'll make my decision if it's worth the wait or I'll just buy a cheap R1.

 

Go ahead buy the R1. Save some money and get the su4100 have had mine for about a month and a half and love it! When buying a computer buy it for what you need now, not what you think you need two years from now. Is the I chip going to be a game changer or a wash? no one can say for sure however we can say that the price will increase as time goes on. Buy it now and be happy

 

Again, i5 ULV is showing comparable performance to SU7300. i7 definitely an improvement, but depends on cost and battery life.