Gtx 460m?

Yeah I mean like an alternative. Intel is one but if nvidia is "The Way It's Meant to be Played", Intel is "The Way It's Meant to be Scared" lol. I have seen some folks playing Crysis with intel cards I can't call it playing, all the shader effects and such eyecandies were killed by intel. Anyways sorry for hijacking the thread

 

@Lozz, maybe you are right from the point of marketing.

but as a consumer, exspecially for those who actually knew the rename schemes, nvidia is just lying.

remember destop 9800 GT and 9800GTX? mobile versions are the same chips with same numbers of cores, although the clock frequencies are low but they are using the same chip.

why this cannot preform in GTX200 series?
because the size and power consume and heat problems?
those are problems of the arcitecture, they are nvidia 'a faults.
not a proper reason for them to rename the 9800GTX+ to fake GTX260m and 280m

i know this is not illegal, but also not ethical.

 

Is there any date of when nvidia is debuting there gtx 460m?

 

This site is placing it under the 5870 which is pretty disappointing.

 

the Nvidia Geforce Go 9800GTX uses 112 Cuda cores, the desktop version has 128. Granted, that's closer than the 280M variants, but it got the full 128 cuda cores and a modest clock speed update, which is all we can expect from a new generation. 16 more CUDA cores, a process reduction, 85mhz core increase, 213mhz shader increase and 150mhz ram speed increase is pretty nice for staying within the same thermal package *and* improving power consumption.

in nvidia optimized games a 285 *will* edge out a 5870.

 

Most new games are going to provide better optimization for ATI due to "obvious" reasons such as ATI "romancing" game developers with his cards..
However I'm still worried about ATI's own support for drivers. ATI has a bad reputation for the drivers

 

Well theres still the no Pychsix (spelling?) perk with Ati cards. If you have Ati you need a really good processor, Nvidia can get away with a bad processor.

 

Ati does not have Physics engine but DOES have Stream which works more or less the same

 

it was much worse when opengl games were more abundant. opengl support on ati cards has always been bleh, not sure about now though.
do not underestimate nvidia's marketing power, they've proven their strength in this department many times over. nvidia's problem has been delays. almost every release for the last 2 generations has been delayed. i personally think from a business standpoint, ati/amd have not taken enough advantage of this. if things were reversed, nvidia would pounce.

also about physx, while a single card can do it and run the graphics at the same time, the performance hit is quite large. the best use of physx i have seen in any game is in Just Cause 2.... the water looks absolutely gorgeous. the frame rate on my 260m however stops me from using it all the time.

 

I must just have a really bad processor, its not working too great on mine. But Idk how my Nvidia 240 did either.

 

Its what I was talking about. nVidia is acting so slow lately :S and I don't know why but I also feel like nVidia's drivers are getting crappier.. ATI has already crappy drivers now nVidia is getting grappier too.. so we may be doomed soon lol

 

Source is already planning on becoming one of the first very big openGL engines, Ati's going to have it rough if that happens. The whole Directx 10 and 11 fiasco's haven't helped Microsofts Api either.

 

openGL is fantastic on the ATI pro cards, guess how Maya and AutoCad operate .. and in that field the FirePro is the current leader

 

how about for the non pro? shouldn't need a pro/quadro for decent opengl performance. i remember support being horrible in that department for ati or has amd made ati shape up?

if so, good. i'll know what to get when i have the $

 

well in high end GL apps like maya the Gforce AND Radeons get raped in rendering performance .... can we say over 500% faster on the pro cards

but once it is should not be hard for ATI or NV to instate that performance into the desktop cards as they use the same GPU's just the consumer models are nutered.

 

If only if the 5870 were available officially for the M15x!

Should I get the ATI 5850, or the NVIDIA 260m or the 460m with a M15x?

 

... or wait for the new revision?

5850 is an underclocked 5870 as far as I'm informed, you can clock it to 5870 speeds an more, just check out the threads in this forum. It's a pretty great chip for gaming as it seems.
If you work a lot with video rendering, photoshop or similar I recommend the 460m, because of the cuda technology which is really great for such tasks. The 460m also is a great card for gaming. Don't go for the 260m if you don't have to. It's a good card, but 460m is a lot better.

 

You're in luck. The Dell 5850 is virtually indistinguishable from a 5870 when overclocked; in fact, the 5850 in my M15x is a better, faster card than the true 5870 in my Sager 8760.

 

Overclocking on more than an intermittent (benching) basis is bad in notebooks. That is true no matter who makes your GPU. It's one thing to bench once in a while, but in a limited heat and power environment, it's not a good idea on a long term basis.

Meaning you should base your choices on how things run at stock, for any long term "will I be able to live with this level of performance" decisions.

 

^^

​

In a perfect world, we would all have Clevo x7200's configured with a 980X and 470M/480M SLI to satisfy our gaming/computing needs and preferences. In the meantime, extracting the best available performance from more modest equipment through configuration and overclocking (where practical) is both cost effective and fun. Heat, not overclocking, is the threat to notebook components. Watch your temps. So long as temps remain within safe zones, overclocking it not "bad" or dangerous and represents no threat to your computer. Increasing an installed 5850's clocks to 5870 stock clocks (700/1000) or somewhat beyond is a complete non-event in the life of a M15x other than a measurable improvement in its graphics performance.

 

If you OC keeping temps normal, correct clocks and correct voltages then there is no problem.(There are formulas, math basis, and circuit analysis to measure that.)
Sometimes companies like Nvidia, ATI, intel, AMD et etc put lower clocks and lower voltages to keep them at an "user safe zone". It doesnt mean that if you OC you will break your componets.

 

edited for correct-ness..

if by correct you mean stock, then yes. Otherwise higher temps and higher voltages will result in decreased silicon life. this is an absolute and undeniable fact. When it becomes a 'problem' is relative, the chance a normal failure will occur versus a silicon failure due to any of these variables is far more likely. I've had at least 3-4 cards die now while on stock clocks and voltages. To suggest that anything above what the card normally does in terms of voltage and tempreatures would do 0 to core integrity is false however. The 'safe' zone is the stock zone, anything beyond that is going on Theoretical Design specifications and unspecific general knowledge. Nothing more.

 

This is 100% false. Probably ought to do some research on electromigration. And then while you are at it a bit more on the various methods of breaking down the insulators in chips and just at what rate that happens.

OC'ing constantly lowers the lifetime of the components. Laptop components already have a shorter lifespan than desktop components. Burn out a few hundred chips and you'll better understand that. Temperature control can lower the amount of deterioration sustained, but the speeds and temps of a chip at stock are based on a certain predicted lifetime. It is not forever. Never is. Increasing beyond that level lowers the lifetime. That's a pure fact. What OC'ing circles contend is that for the lifetime of desktop parts, you may never notice the decrease because advanced users replace parts faster than they burn out. However, notebooks you will notice it and it is an expensive road to tell someone it is safe to travel on.

 

Sometimes people talk and talk btw Lozz is correct here. But honestly I might not know about electrmigration but afaik with my electronics knowledge is that companies design a range of use for their componets (military equipment has a broader range). That means those components can tolerate slight increases of voltage, increased clocks etc, they use formulas for that, they design and calculate a curve of function for the device, they ALMOST never use the optimal performance settings, they opt for one that is often "safer" for the regular consumer use. Thats why you can see those "super clocked editions" . It is not all matter of burning dies, cpus,gpus or whatever electronic device you could imagine. Instead it is matter of bussines. Dont get me wrong I get the point but trust me I have designed some micro devices (Im an engineer) we always try to add to our designs a broad range of operation, yep you can decrease the life of the components but if you are good modeling you would notice that with a small OC you can barely decrease the lifespan by less than 10% and to be honest that is not much. Sorry for the grammar I wrote this with my cellphone .

 

Like MexicanSnake said, stock voltages are often actually too high, just to be "safe" (read: stable in all chips produced)

Core 2s undervolt nicely, and my MR5870 runs just fine at lowered voltage via a vbios flash (1.05v instead of 1.15v).

My point being that stock isn't even what's ideal for a given chip, since each is very slightly different in tolerances.

 

How do i overclock the 460m and the most important. How do i install new drivers ?
Get the message the hardware is not compatible from the 260.99 drivers from Nvidia. !!?

Help me

 

You can use MSI afterburner for example... a friend of mine uses it with this card and it works perfectly.
As for the driver installing issue I have no idea.

 

^^ I sencond this man, MSI afterburner is a great tool, it works perfectly it even displays info about the performance rates and stuff.

 

But again, how about the installation of the driver ?!?!?

 

INF mod it the drivers. But they should work outright - did you download the desktop drivers instead of the Verde Notebook drivers?

EDIT: yeah, they should work. It's right on the supported products list (laptop drivers, at any rate )
http://www.nvidia.com/object/notebook-win7-winvista-64bit-260.99-whql-driver.html

 

"This graphics driver could not find any supported hardware" ?????

 

I had exactly that issue, you have to use the ones from the Dell site:

Drivers and Downloads

 

Driver 259.64

3DMark Score
13393.0 3DMarks
SM2.0 Score
5918.0
HDR/SM3.0 Score
6199.0
CPU Score
3235.0
Game Score
N/A
GT1 - Return To Proxycon
51.34 FPS
GT2 - Firefly Forest
47.3 FPS
CPU1 - Red Valley
1.04 FPS
CPU2 - Red Valley
1.6 FPS
HDR1 - Canyon Flight
61.47 FPS
HDR2 - Deep Freeze
62.51 FPS

 

Put this over to the benchmarking thread with some pictures and you'll make some people very happy, for example Inap

 

Basically there exists two ways to oc your video card nowadays. The first is Software-based oc, which let you use some user-friendly softwares like nvinspector, afterburner, amd gpu clock tools, etc to try your own desired clock without actually modifying the card. In short, it's fail-safe and usually doesn't do much damage even if you oc'd so much that your pc would strike.

The second one is hardware based oc, which is far more dangerous and requires a lot more knowledge and experience to pull out safely. This approach introduces softwares like Nibitor, Fermi Bios Editor, etc to you, allowing you to extract and modify your own video card's bios(basic functioning firmwares about how the particular hardware works) to give it a boost in performance or give it a homegrown medal of energy star.

As of my case, I tried both, and have found out that the second has to be based on the first since the oc'd clocks can be checked for safety using software oc, and then you can flash the oc'd bios to your card.

Though, if you plan to do so, you'd better be ready to learn a lot in the progress. Start with googling "Fermi bios editor" and you should be able to find an article teaching you how to oc step by step. Enjoy your risks...

 

I just noticed something- the 460M only has a 192-bit memory interface. My 260M has a 256-bit.... that's kinda odd. The 460M still performs better, but it's weird that it's memory interface is lower.

 

Its because the 460m is GDDR5 and the 260m is GDDR3. Memory bandwidth makes a big difference with the performance. The 460m has 1.5GB memory across six 256mb chips whereas the 260m has 1 gig over 8 smaller 128mb chips ie 6x32bit=192 vs 8x32=256. Hope this helps.

 

Video card memory bandwidth is calculated differently using different type of memory, for example a 192bit GDDR5's effective bandwidth is Memory clock*4*192/8 and a 256bit GDDR3's effective bandwidth is Memory Clock*2*256/8. That's why with 625mhz and 192bit memory controller, GTX460M has a effective bandwidth of 60G/s.

 

Ah, haha, thanks for clearing that up guys

 

need help here. got AW m17x r3 . ordered ATi 6970 , they installed nvidia gtx 460m ! cant install drivers included in resource cd and the ones on dell website . when I try to install it says you have to install an intel driver first . is it means the IGP then its installed and device manager shows no problem with it ! my notebook is practically useless for now!!!

 

You need the 460m driver from the dell site.

Drivers and Downloads

However, I'd be asking Dell to replace the 460m with the 6970 as the 460m is no way near as good as the 6970.

 

thanx jarv for the reply I did try that and couple of other drivers .the problem is it doesnt even install the driver and say: you have to install an intel driver first!

 

Sounds like you might need the chipset driver first. All the drivers you need are here:

Drivers & Downloads

 

Anyone know how to voltage unlock the 460m?

 

You can't, the folks at mvktech have established that it is already using its highest volt value.

 

I saw the 460M on ebay for $300 (incl shipping) is it worth upgrading to for the price on the M15x?

I'd like to spend less than $500 on a new graphics card (i'm still using the 260M)

 

Hey I'm getting the 560m and it's way more bang for the buck if u want a good gpu, here's where I got mine, and for further info have a browse through the 560m thread by dutchess63. Good luck

NEW 1.5GB Nvidia GeForce GTX 560M MXM 3.0b VGA Module | eBay

http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m15x/602655-m15x-gtx-560m.html

 

ah! Thanks!

I saw they ordered new thermal pads too. Do you recommend it? where did you get them from?

 

I didn't order, I was told the old ones were good enough, i'd suggest use the money to buy better thermal compound and repaste your Cpu+Gpu, btw i'm still waiting for my 560m delivery should be arriving soon

 

ug. I never did that before. Are there instructions on here somewhere?

congrats!