For the first time since May of 2007 I am without an Alienware Laptop!

I suspect it will be a BGA version, probably a sad 6700HK or 6700HQ. If they really do actually go through with it and do the right thing like Clevo did, then it will definitely deserve some attention.

I think this whole mess is a social engineering/marketing experiment. If it's "ok for notebooks" it will end up being "ok for desktops" as well. Remember, Gigabyte, ASUS and MSI are the leading desktop motherboard makers. If their customers that buy notebooks don't have the gonads to draw a line in the sand on BGA filth, there is no reason they should believe that their desktop customers will be any different. Anyone that is not worried about this should be. People really need to start paying attention. Greed and evil, self-serving, intentions are the driving force behind this and it would be naive to think they won't try to screw desktop fanboys in exactly the same manner.

 

could you post a link please as i cant seem to find one that doesn't have a BGA processor

 

I'm sure you can afford it, and the Razer blade 14 2016 is a great machine with good feature set for its size(with the optional core), But it is wiser wait for the Pascal refresh. The 970m isn't good enough for 2016 titles and you already have a beast of a laptop and a desktop while you wait. 1070m should be good enough to make the Razer Blade VR Ready by itself(subject to optimus being dropped/supported by VR) if it's close enough to its desktop counterparts.

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i read articals about this every few years but it would massively hurt company's that produce mother boards but if Intel deiced to do it there is nothing that they could do about it

i know the articals a few years old but still:
http://www.extremetech.com/computin...dly-prepping-soldered-desktop-chips-after-all

already doing it in nucs skylake R:
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-skylake-r-i7-6785r-i5-6685r-i5-6585,31726.html

 

what drug are you taking?







also, I spotted the MSi Z170 laptop in a thread (msi section of this forum), idk if I can actually find it again. but I'll try


EDIT:

MSi GT62 / MS - 16L1

http://www.xoticpc.com/force-msi-16l1-11-016.html?

http://www.xoticpc.com/force-msi-16l1-11-009.html

MSi Z170 laptop (seems to have strong vrm array, look at pictures) 970M and 980M model respectively


TI: https://www.techinferno.com/index.php?/forums/topic/8711-can-msi‘s-new-model-16l1-use-gtx980/

NBR: http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/msi-gt62-does-it-exist.785981/


MXM and Z170 socket, seems like MSi's answer to the Clevo P7x0xM series. Shame not many know about it.

@Mr. Fox - what do you think? Going to give it a shot?

 

awesome thanks! that looks like a beast for a 15 inch bit short on ports but there is a lot of stuff in there & its got a full num pad!, but 4k screen

 

Another thing to consider is that the machine only has 2 ram slot, so the only practical upgrade is 16gb (some people may need more, who knows)

4k screen... meh, 980M isn't really capable of driving AAA titles beyond 1440p
plus it's going to be a pain to see icons on a 15" 4k laptop, unless you scale the display up. which I don't like to do

Edit: and only 230w psu, why?

980M = 135w
6700k = 100w

cutting it very close on component, and that's not including the PSU efficiency and other component power consumption

 

Wow! I am shocked, but in a good way. That is great news if the sucker is not shackled by crappy firmware. It would have to be a minimum of 17" for me to entertain the idea of owning one, because I hate small laptops.

Even though I am very excited to see MSI do this, I am no longer an early adopter of anything. The risk of spending good money on bad garbage has never been greater than it is in today's world. HOWEVER, if an MSI vendor out there wants to send me one of them to run through the wringer and public document (or ridicule) what it is (or is not) capable of achieving in terms of extreme overclocking performance as Eurocom had me do with the Sky X9, then I'm definitely interested. Otherwise, I will patiently watch others spend their money and wait to see how that turns out first. With a P870DM-G at my side, there is no reason to feel compelled to spend any more of my money at this point.

At any rate, thanks for the link. I am pleased to no end to witness MSI finally doing something right where a notebook's CPU is concerned... I guess there really is a first time for everything, LOL.

 

yeah i would not like not be running on that with such a low wattage PSU gona have serious issues. On the m17x r4 i had to go up to a 330w psu & i haven't even tried to overclock the 980m yet

yeah not a fan of 4k screens in laptops as we have no single card that could drive one well enough would much prefer 1080p IPS HDR with some form of Gsync / freesync it would have to be single card as look at how good multi gpu support is at the mo

& yeah windows doesn't scale well at those resolutions at all

 

ask xotic for a review unit? if they say yes, you don't have to pay for a new laptop and only pay for shipping back.

as for the BIOS (not vbios), you'd probably have to pay svet a small amount of money to unlock the bios, or prema
svet has been behind the msi laptops for a bit longer compared to svl7/prema iirc





also about the screen size issue



I almost went blind trying to read what was happening on the 13"

 

With a screen under 17-inch and single "M" (as in eMasculated) GPU the offering of desktop CPU alone isn't enough to captivate my attention. But, it is absolutely a step in the right direction on the CPU. I hope this is merely a glimpse of greater things to follow. It's too bad they don't offer at least the 200W GTX 980 desktop on MXM GPU. If they release an improved variation of the MSI Titan with 6700K, unlocked/unlockable BIOS and 980 SLI, along with 660W+ in power supply capacity, then I might want to get my hands a review unit.

 

Purchase that Alienware! You can have portability as well as Desktop Performance when using the Alienware Amplifier!


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OP already has an area 51 for desktop performance, and the graphics amplifier is not exclusive to alienware laptops any more now that thunderbolt 3 has come to almost all gaming laptops with eGPU enclosures and BIOS updates coming soon(The Core from Razer is already out). btw that is a neat set-up you have there

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I'd still take the P870xM over the MSi Titan with desktop socket.

The mechanical keyboard is just too silly to use on a laptop.

Also, fox. How did you manage to run a 980M past +180core? I used +50mv and +200, no matter what I couldn't pass the first set of 3dmark Firestrike benchmark without crashing to black screen (have to hard reset). It seems to have passed the first test, but couldn't exit the program without crashing.

Temps below 85c.

Can you not?

 

Yeah, P870DM is going to be hard to beat by anyone unless they go out of their way to do it on purpose. And, I agree... the Titan is really dorky looking with no palm rest.

980M cards are terribly inconsistent, and their inconsistency is exaggerated by garbage drivers. I've had two die, four that have never overclocked at a level that meets my expectations, and a 970M that is a piece of trash (same black screen issues when overclocking). NVIDIA QC is horrible and they are building them with weak components. The only way I can overclock 980M cards far enough to do anything impressive is by keeping them freezing cold with AC cooling. Otherwise, I have issues with black screen lock-ups, too.

 

Good to know, I won't push it any further then.

 

I think they simply cant make them better on such a small amount of space. The minimum amount of VRM's are used and the card is already bigger than a standard MXM board. Its just a stretch too far I suspect.

 

Weren't most of the laptop already equipped with soldered hardware for more than 10 years? Only some socketed CPU's. But it was not super common to find MXM boards in laptops back in the days either.

I think it will be okay as long as the PC gaming market is a strong market.

 

yes , once you go 17" + , you don't want anything smaller.

 

I think I clocked + 245mhz on the core on the one 980m gtx card I have left , that is about to be sold to one of the member.

 

Maybe that too. My 980M pulls 130w at stock running division / witcher 3.

Winning the silicon lottery eh?

 

actually was 225mhz

 

Still a good 45mhz more than me

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/11936241

 

Yeah, BGA is not new. It has been around for years. Only the notion of using BGA on something pitched as "high performance" in a notebook is a new concept. It was and continues to be irrelevant for mainstream consumer notebook trash. I never cared before because I had plenty of superior options available. It's totally unacceptable for something that is supposed to be special. It will never be OK to me on something that needs to be regarded as excellent and priced on the premise of being something excellent.

 

Go buy one lol...
Guess Im spoiled by build quality.
Again I have two desktops with 980ti(s).
I do game on the go but mostly do video and audio production so it was more important to have a lighter laptop with a decent on site warranty.
Besides If I told you how much I paid you would do what I did too.

 

In all fairness, laptops were always BGA, then they moved to a modular design thanks to some competitive engineering like a decade ago, and it picked up a bit, disappeared then came back and became popular thanks to ASUS and MSI and ALIENWARE.. but even the high end gaming laptops 10 years ago and before were always BGA.. it's really just a new thing, but it is the standard by which we demand performance now. More so because we can change the GPU when it dies or needs upgrading more then because it lacks power being BGA. HOWEVER - the CPU is entirely new, high end laptops almost ALWAYS had removeable full desktop versions or mobile versions. having them BGA in "gaming" laptops is not acceptable, because those ARE infact retarded and gimped.

issue still remains, you get little to no value from experience , buying BGA because when you go to replace the defective part - your replacing everything. So, essentially they are disposable laptops but priced as if your going to keep them for 10 years.

 

Agree 100% with all points. And, the last bolded part at the very end is one of the major reasons why is it most unacceptable. Designed exactly like mainstream consumer trash, but poorly priced as if it were actually something special. I mean, like c'mon... if you want me to accept BGA, at least give me a legitimate reason to consider it, like making it 60 to 70% cheaper since it is a throw-away turd and then I might not want to tear your head off and poop down your neck quite as much.

 

BGA processors and GPU are a bit smaller and always have some cache or something disabled on it too, and because its smaller, it yields much cheaper costs and more efficiency from the ASIC upwards, meaning they can produce 5 BGA cpu's for the price they make 3 regular desktop equivalents. Thus profit margins have NEVER been so high on hardware before. We're not talking the 4-5% great news percentile, we're talking 60% profit margins.

 

Yup, and the fact that they are not passing the savings on to the customer is proof in and of itself that BGA is a greed-driven design play. Sell it for the same price even though it is grossly inferior, make the machine disposable and essentially impossible to repair or upgrade and sell more overpriced trash. Honestly, they may as well just go ahead and solder the RAM modules to the motherboard at this point and epoxy the chassis shut like an iPhone. They could use ejectable flash memory for "storage upgrades" like an Android tablet, too. I might have been born at night, but it wasn't last night.

 

So Mr. Fox and other enlightened laptop users, if I wanted a small laptop and my choice was between the 13 and the Stealth which way would you go?

 

you should go Eurocom's Clevo. Buy now. Save Now. Be thankful later.

XD

 

Clevo has small laptops?

 

I would get whichever one has the most powerful CPU and GPU configuration available and NOT GO higher than 1080p. 4K is miserable to use even with a 17 inch screen.

 

I would agree here and even go so far as say in some cases 4K is a huge marketing tactic. I have a 4K TV but only use it on 1080p. Now with that said it is a superior panel and has awesomely low latency.
When it comes to PC / Laptops I would say that the benefit comes with a cost that isnt balanced. I would rather have a 1080p panel going at faster frames then something "more sharp" going going at a lower FPS. Another thing is that you would need a fairly large (TV Sized) screen to really get a worthwhile benefit from 4K.
This is one of those things where 1080p is solid, why not enjoy it while its in its prime.

 

yes, my wife uses a "SHARK4" very small, very thin, very powerful, it's BGA, but it last 3-4 hours on battery doing whatever she does (which is facebook gaming or playing divinity original sin)

they have NP155RF-1 or such as well... basically 6800skylake quadcore with 960/965M video 2cm thick, 17" screen but very thin.... weights like nothing... but its not a 13" tablet like the Alienware13

 

I am not a gamer, I still despise BGA. And do other high performance applications with laptops. Locked down, restricted BIOS I also equally hate. I also hate frail and flimsy. And I believe if you want real high end gaming, lug the load. If you can't do this, join a Gym, work out, and lose the foolish BGA. Real men use laptops with Socketed CPU, lots of RAM Slots, and MXM GPU. JokeBooks, TurdBooks, HobbledBooks, are for wimps! Be Proud you are a Gamer, or a High Performance laptop user!

 

Oh I am sure I have lugged around my huge gaming laptops as much as any real man, lol, but now I want a small gaming laptop to take to Mariner's games or the movie theater etc.. The AW 13 fits that bill.

 

Razer Blade . love this baby.

 

+rep added. <join a Gym, work out, and lose the foolish BGA> A very good advice!!

 

Why do you want to take a laptop to the movie theater? Why do you want to take a laptop to a sporting event?

If he lost the BGA and got some sockets and MXM he wouldnt need to join the gym; He could just lug around his bulky heavy desktop replacement laptop.

 

The Razer blade is a much better choice as bloodhawk suggested, or atleast get an XPS 15(the better Dell in my opinion), 45w quad core in a slimmer and lighter chassis vs 15w dual core, need I say more? Even the Inspiron 7559 has a quad core+960m combo
Also expect new laptops/updates at Computex less than a month away(Pascal )

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THe Blade would be nice, if it didnt burn itself up after an average gaming session.

The XPS15 on the other hand is a great productivity laptop. Not so much for gaming.

 

The XPS 15 games as well, (if Not better) than the alienware 13. Also the blade has sorted temp issues with the Skylake update (based on reviews)

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The XPS15 had some throttling issues, not sure if those are resolved. The Alienware 13 doesnt have those issues.

The blade 2016 is still not delivered. So you and me both do not know if those issues are resolved. But the 2015 model was piss poor. Batteries die within a year and prevent the machine even frrom working at all for various users. How to get a new battery? Send it back to Razer and pay big bucks. THey should have made a 15inch version for better cooling and more space between the battery and the really warm parts such as the CPU and GPU.

 

The throttling issues on the XPS 15 have been fixed to a large extent through BIOS updates/bug fixes, it isn't a design issue. Many user's are happy with performance.
You're right about my knowledge on the razer blade 2016 though, my thoughts were based on this review.
http://www.laptopmag.com/reviews/laptops/razer-blade

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Thats good to hear they resolved the throttling issues. Because overall the laptop is great.

Ah that review. I have read it. But couldnt take it serious when I read this

"This rather diminutive laptop kicked out a steady 57 fps at its native resolution (3200 x 1800) on Ultra as I hacked and slashed my way through The Witcher."

Unless it is the first witcher or the second witcher game from year ago. It is impossible that the modern WItcher 3 would run that well on that GPU. Even a desktop 980 has trouble keeping 60fps in each location on fhd. 3200x1800 would be a slideshow.

 

I think they actually meant the first Witcher , it may also be a simple typo though I doubt it.

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But why would they test it with a 9year old game? So it makes in terms of performance this review a bit strange.

 

Probably to experience 4k 60fps gaming

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Weird. I haven't had any temp issues with the stealth so far.