How far Alienware has gone backwards

It is very difficult to take action, if You have received a truckload of badly binned processors (Bad lot's). Much indicate this(different Vid voltage on a lot of the processors) as well as possible power settings that are on the berry-picking. This is like a plain silicone lottery in the real world. Some lucky, while many are unfortunate. Depends on how you look at it.

 

Have you tried the new Throttlestop and PowerCut? You might be able to OC your 4710MQ to 4.0GHz... Give it a shot and let us know..

 

Have to read through unclewebbs thread...papusan told me about that thread long back, I started it but became busy and couldn't even keep up with the pending threads alr. But I will surely continue from where I left.

 

never heard of powerCut, whats it like ? (course I could go google it...)

 

@King of Interns New isn't always better as you probably know https://eu.alienwarearena.com/forums/thread/126384/technical-support-1/alienware-17-r3-key-ghosting

 

Another sign of how far they have gone backwards is their resale value. It is nonexistent at this point. When you are trying to sell an 18 with 880M sli in basically new condition and all you get are offers equivalent to what you would expect if it was an HP, you know there are problems. People used to get in bidding wars for these things, now it seems even the average Joe views them as crap. Sad and frustrating.

 

Selling an AW18 ?

 

Trying to sell. "Trying" that's the key word here. Had 2 low ball offers from 2 different buyers and neither paid. So yes, I am trying to sell an AW18.

 

Not to make this a sales thread, but how much would you like ? AW18 is one hell of a laptop ! It has 3 Sata 3 6G bays, and a 6G mSATA, if you use the HD Caddy, you can add a 5th but its at 300mb's only. either way, very fast, both PCI-e are 3.0 16x so you can go nuts in 2 months with the Pascal when it comes out. I will need an AW18 to make them work and test them, so thinking of buying my 3rd one...you can get close to 1,000on XTU too with a Haswell mobile. That's pretty badass. Like a 6700K overclocked to 5Ghz is getting you like 1500 so in a way, mobile haswell is not far away, it's still overkill for gaming.

 

ALSO - it can use the Occulus Rift and do 4K from the miniDP port, has an eSata port too, and analogue 5.1 sounds (which TBH is close to like 80SNR so not too bad considering its a LAPTOPS ONBOARD SOUND....and as a feature for 5.1 about what you;d expect. )

even supports optical spdif out for dolby digital

 

Sorry, i derailed this thread hahah, but I just LOVE the AW18... it's so amazing. I've always been sad to part with it.

 

My AW 18 has only two (2) SATA ports available for HDD (or SSD), one (1) mSATA, and another SATA port filled with the DVD +-RW that gives a maximum of 4 hard drives.

 

Oh right, that right, it has 2 Sata 6G ports, Im thinking the M18X-R2 which has the same but has a third thrown in the middle which is sata 3 300mb/s only.

 

This means that Dell made a new Aw 18 with less sata slots than its predecessor. Great. And this has Dellienware continued with. The newer AW Echo models have only 3 disk slots, LOL. Next rebadged Aw models can have as little as 2 slots. Fits very well with 2 ram slots . 2 + 2 is a nice combination . Just as the last real Aw17 with socket hardware who had nice 4 sata slots + 4 RAM slots, Haha

 

Haswell is bad for OC. No unlocked BIOS. Ugly design. M18xR2 can do all the same/or better with much better design.

That's of course only my opinion

 

The M18x R2 is the best computer Alienware ever built. Shame nothing they made afterwards came even close.The Alienware 18 is an abomination, and the current series doesn't deserve to wear that alien head on the LCD lid.

 

I liked both the M18X-R2 AND the AW18, I don't really see how the M18X-R2 other than chassis was really better. Just better in it's day, perhaps. I had a M18X-R2 catch fire during a tech call when one of DELL's techs was vpn'd into the computer. Went through 5 M18X-R2's that year, before I got one that worked. But then it was good. (They kept sending me other people returned garbage which they CLEARLY did not test before refurbishing)

 

Lets see:
1. More hard drive space (2 sata III, 1 sata II, 1 msata @ sata II) vs (2 sata III, 1 msata @ sata III)
2. Expresscard slot (vs none on the alienware 18)
3. No NVRAM (vs retarded reset method on the alienware 18)
4. more accurate color reproduction LCD and response time (vs brighter and better viewing angles on the A18)
5. Stronger/prettier chassis (aluminum lid + base vs aluminum lid only on the alienware 18)
6. DMC slot (extra plug in) vs none on the Alienware 18
7. better fans and profiles (vs crap fans and profiles on the Alienware 18)
8. Bigger battery (12 cell on the M18x vs 8 cell on the Alienware 18)

Benefits of Alienware 18:
1. Newer chipset

That's it.

 

Don't forget that Ivy bridge is a far better cpu architecture than hotwell as well, so another extra plus for the M18x r2

 

I never had any hotwell chip got hot on me , not even once, even running at 4.4 Ghz all 4 core , non turbo ...depending on batches ....

 

what settings are you running on the 4940MX?

 

Do not forget that AW 18 has a power cap on the motherboard / bios. AWm18XR2 can use 2x330w. @Mr. Fox will newer forget this crippled function on new Aw18

 

1) The HDD is also Sata 3 on the AW18, giving you the possibility to do 4 x SSD @Sata3 6G
2) No one uses the Expressslots anymore. there might be an odd user here and there but its REALLY old and didn't age well. Was good for sounds cards back in the 90's
3) Resetting is not a feature. Bad comparison, and many never models have the same issue, not just Alienware's
4) The LCD's depended on where you got your Alienware delivered from, there were some directly from the USA with better LCD
5)The Magnesium Alloy chassis of the AW18 is super sturdy though, compared to the M18X-R2 which gets flimsy and slowly over time breaks apart.
6)The DMC was used for a non-useful WiHD option that never worked and caused alot of confusion. The best it did was allow some people to do some after market mods or turn it into a small usb backup drive via the mpci-e interface.
7) My AW18 never had the fans turn on, so wouldn't know. Never really got hot too, but mine was a gift from DELL to not sue them for the apartment catching fire during a tech call that I taped. It's the one I instantly beat Fox's XTU score with , and stayed at the top in Haswell for over a year. Sold it for $6500CAD. It was REALLY good quality. I forget but it was definitely cherry picked to be the best, which is what they promised too. I would give this one to the M18X-R2 cause I hear of fan issues on the AW18 alot.
8) Oddly the AW18 and M18X-R2 both lasted just as long on their batteries. Theres a C rating and Amphere rating missing from the batteries, as they only show their voltage and wattage which can be used to rate their amperes but not how many Amps they can discharge or charge at. It could be the AW18 had a better battery, but had less cells. There are also different Lithium types. Like we use 6 cell sub-C's to race RC cars, not 8 cell AA's(though in toys they do use the 8 cell/12V ones, we use that for controllers and remotes). The type of battery makes a difference. Also I can find 2A sub-C balanced battery packs that will kick the snot out of AA 2.5A batteries, for this exact reason. There's ratings that are not shown that are important to batteries, which explain how much discharge they can take/discharge and for how long before they cripple and snuff out and drop their voltage, I know for a fact the AW18's battery was better, but unsure about capacity overall either.
I would say inconclusive for the battery.

- Benefits of the 18 - haswell. Straight up 30% faster CPU ceiling. How can you miss that one. Even a stock 4900MQ is better then a 3920XM Overclocked to whatever you can get it too. Nevermind the power it drains on the M18X-R2 cripples the system.

-M18X-R2 had WAAAAY more issues with the daughter boards/IO boards, and the sound cards, and chipsets. This whole forum is LITTERED with issues from it. Much more then with the AW18. By a VERY large margin. But the M18X-R2 does look better brandnew, is more ergonomic to use, and feels like a oldschool alienware, which I appreciate. But the AW18 is more powerful.

 

Despite not being able to use 2 x PSU, there are higher scores out there , revealing higher performance with the AW18 then the M18X-R2, I guess, without having to use 2 x PSU and a bridge to rectify it all. The M18X-R2 would take as much power as a desktop computer with 2 PSU's. I would say, why not just buy a desktop, or a Clevo, or buy the even newer Alienware's and use a Desktop Graphics card with the Amplifier, because essentially, you have this giant brick which optional added to the laptop to get extra performance. The 2 x PSU and box you you use to house the rectifier and any components used in it, would be the same as having the amplifier, except, maybe the amplifier adds more options and offers even MORE power.

So, I would say, it's not fair to use that as a comparison either, and would argue the AW18, despite having a more efficient and monitored input power default setting, is still better in that regard. Your talking about being superior because you have to go out and waste hour son end to make an extra adapter to add more power and cost more money and need two PSU's to achieve the same as the AW18 without that. How is that better ??? It might be more interesting, more note worthy for those who are obsessed but it is NOT better. It is more of a waste of time and effort for very little gain.

 

1: I think you mean ODD. Never the less, same can be done on M18x R2, though at SATA II. Still more storage slots on the M18x R2, though they may not be as fast
2. I use expresscards thank you very much. I have a nice composite to digital converting card I use, as well as antenna tuner. works great, sits flush with the chassis.
3. Resetting is absolutely a feature. Apple makes a convenient key combination to do it. Alienware used to have the simple power drain approach. newer alienwares? Forget it.
4. No. All LCDs either came with the standard 18" or later on, the SuperPLS LCD which became the standard. Neither cover sRGB as well as the M18x R1/R2, and neither have as quick a response time.
5. I've had my M18x R2 and R1 open several times, never broken a single thing. Not flimsy, cheap, or weak by any stretch of the imagination. Don't be rough with hardware.
6. DMC is useful for extra internal USB -> attach sandisk fit USB -> instant extra storage. or an extra wifi card or whatever you wanna stuff in there. Point is, it's an extra expansion slot.
7. ....
8. Wrong. on iGPU, no AlienFX, I can easily squeeze 7 hours out of the M18x R2. best I can do on the Alienware 18 under same conditions is 5.5. Both batteries are lithium ion. I own both, took both to class, M18x R2 wins.


straight up 30% CPU ceiling...? Where did you even come up with this number? Haswell was maybe 5% better in single threaded applications, 8% on vector processing, and 6% faster on multithreaded, all of which become moot points considering it draws about 8% more power than ivy bridge. I know Fox has clocked his 3920XM at 4.7, I've personally hit 4.6, show me a 4930MX or 4940MX that can pull those numbers. Haswell was designed by an idiot, sorry to say. Skylake now is what haswell should have been.

 

So much hate for the two. in my opinion , if we were to look at the same class of " laptop specs " and not " desktop specs " on laptops , THESE TWO are the BEAST that no other vendor can get close to. We should stop comparing apples and oranges .. just a side note. I like both.

 

to each their own really. this is the internet, everything is simply an expression of opinion. In my experience, the M18x R2 has proven to be the better computer. Your mileage may vary.

 

Okay clocks mean little when comparing bandwidth throughput. Sure they have the same amount of cache per core the examples your using, but there's more to it then clockspeed. I have hit over 1,000 on XTU with a AW18 but I couldn't hit 800 with the 3920XM. Even though I could get as high as I wanted on the 3920XM I could beat it at 3.7-3.9Ghz on the Haswell in terms of performance. I also it 8 Ghz on the Haswell considering how stupid it clocks. I could do the same on the 3920XM but neither were stable or very usable at 100% load, obviously. Bandwidth matters. Your not going to hit 100GB/s with the Sandybridge Mobile. you can hit maybe 70-80GBs but the Haswell hits 90-110 easily. It there for is infact faster. While arbitrarily it can not hit the same high clocks, while stable according to what I've read on these forums, I've always been able to do more with a slight overclock instead.

I still think, the fact that the hard drive throughput bandwidth being capable of up to theoretically 2400mb/s on the AW18 and only about 1500mb/s compared to the M18X-R2 when in full RAID max drives possible, and the fact the CPU has 20-25% easily, more bandwidth, possibly 30% or more with the results I've seen on XTU, that for GAMING - not needing a adapter for a 2nd PSU - and the fact when it runs SLi BOTH cards run 3.0 x 16 instead of both 3.0 x 8 when in load on the M18X-R2 because of the sandy bridge HM77 vs hm87 chipset, I think - hands down, the AW18 is better.

However, I haven't seen both visually compared to each other side by side in terms of the LCD.... don't know really what I think thats worth.
The largest thing in my opinion, is how uncomfortable the AW18 is to seat your palm/wrist on.
While the M18X-R2 retains some features you would find on laptops from the late 90's like an Expresscard slot, or places to put a tunercard like the DMC slot which is an unpowered mpci-e slot (until system loads drivers anyways), and 1 more spot to place a slower then usual drive by today's standards, do not make it better than the AW18 for today. When it came out, sure, maybe, we all had extra drives lying around, and we all needed a USB more then we do today for sharing files.
even a tunercard seemed neat, or wireless streaming, but thats all been changed. The fact the CPU is still faster, and the GPU's faster ( at stock) and the harddrives can perform faster without bottlenecks, those are major selling points in terms of hardware browny points. an extra USB, an extra slower harddrive slot when you have 4 already, and a possibility to use a Xpresscard slot and a tunercard don't make up for them in a laptop. You can suppliment better options than the expressport with a USB equivalent, and it will be newer and more compatible with other computers, and same thing with the harddrive, you can always use eSata if you want more, and can daisy chan and half duplex or configure as you want if you REALLY need more space, really, you can do this on both, and have like 10 eSata devices ported through eachother, with an external rack. Since on the M18X-R2, your not portable, since your referencing clocks you need 2 PSU's for, and an adapter to compare with, the AW18 remains portable.

In the comparison, your talking about having your cake and eating it too, you compare the M18X-R2 as if it's portable in its best configuration, and easily accesible. But it's not. While the comparison I use the AW18 is infact portable and does not need special extra luggage. Also, Im sure to the point I'd bet my life on it, less than 1% of people would use the DMC slot or turn it into a USB on top of that, also, doubtful even 1% of them use a dual PSU mod, and again, even more doubtful that many used the Expressport at all, for anything but adding more USB's and only because they could find a cheap card to do it, when you can really just use a USB hub. did I mention the RAM is also about 2 x (Twice) the bandwidth on the AW18 too ? No, aye ? Well it is. That's a lot of extra performance. So, it is my opinion the AW18 is better now. While the M18X-R2 was beautiful and better looking, offered more options and was better in it's day, it's not as good today (unless your 1% of people OR you do not mind using it as a NON-portable laptop and hooking it up with dual PSU mods) - otherwise, handsdown AW18 wins.

haswell CPU on the HD intel alone, and on a boot from the mSata vs a M18X-R2 on it's HD Intel from it's lowest power consuming drive... would be interesting. Wonder if the 40% savings per performance would make a difference. I know on a plain we used it for over 7 hours, watching 3 harry potter movies in a row. That's more then 5 hours. I think i got about the same at best on the M18X-R2.

 

In my experience the 18 is inferior in more ways than it is superior. Even if we set aside the lack of features and focus on performance, the M18xR2 is the winner. Anything related to SLI overclocking the M18xR2 totally rapes the 18 with the ability to use dual 330W adapters. I've never seen anyone with an 18 achieving 3DMark 11 or Fire Strike scores anywhere close to what guys like myself and @johnksss were able to achieve with the M18xR2 outfitted with the same GPUs. Dell should be ashamed of how crippled the 18 is with a puny 330W AC adapter. For anything past 680M SLI that's not enough power, and even 680M SLI was too much for 330W if you pushed the envelope.

The 4930MX is an excellent CPU if you get lucky in the silicon lottery and work hard at keeping it from overheating and throttling. It's probably safe to say there have been more losers than winners in the lottery, and most folks have never undertaken the effort required to keep it cool enough for meaningful overclocking. Alienware has always been better than their competitors in terms of cooling and 4930MX has been a horrible mess for many Clevo owners with poorly engineered and sloppy-fitting heat sinks.

I've never seen anyone demonstrate even one example of a 4940MX CPU that was worth crap... seems they are all turd CPUs. Not saying there is not a good one out there somewhere, only that I have never seen one. There probably are a few good ones floating around and being wasted because most notebook gamers with an Extreme CPU don't have a clue what to do with one. But, all I have seen are bad examples, and it's probably the WORST mobile Extreme CPU Intel has ever released. Interesting to note, it was also the LAST mobile Extreme CPU. That's not Alienware's fault. 6700K in Clevo FTW... nothing better available anywhere in a current generation notebook, and totally spanks the life out of any Alienware in terms of CPU performance. Power draw is lower than Haswell or Ivy Bridge mobile Extreme, so shame on Alienware and Frank for taking the position that using a desktop CPU in a laptop doesn't work well. It works extremely well if you actually pay attention and do it right. And, X79 is great in the Panther, too. It only doesn't work well when you have a mental block, decide it can't and don't even bother putting forth the effort.

The mod-crippled BIOS on the 17 and 18 is another thing they should be ashamed of. Shackling customers with Secure Flash cancer is a scourge and a criminally insane act of violence against their once loyal enthusiast customers. I agree, the M18xR2 looks much better. I've never had anything fall apart with the chassis on the R1 or the R2. I just sold both of mine (R1 and R2) and they are nearly flawless and both look almost brand new in spite of all the business travel both were subjected to. They are built like a brick house, and so is the 18. However, the way the 18 is put together (excluding aesthetics) is outstanding. It is built really well and the design of the chassis in terms of layout and simplicity is superior. I love how much easier it is to work on compared to the M18xR1 and R2.

 

The older M15x of mine felt a lot more sturdy than my new Alienware 17, that old chassis is super strong.I really should have taken better care of that old machine...such noob me. I presume the same applies to the AW18 vs M18x R2. I never owned one but always wanted one...the M18x R2's sex factor is #1.

Even the M17x lineup is superb, R4 was a top class machine this all was before the Dell going private thus uncompromised true Alienware DNA. These legacy machines are top notch best looking and well made machines, even applies in 2016. Gimping began with 2013 haswell machines and post haswell, a.k.a echo (a former echo left behind the beasts Avenger, Avenger MarkII, Viking, Ranger, M15x, idk what was the code name of M17x R4, curious to know..) they are non existent to me.

 

M17x-R4 = Voyager

 

Even the choice of names was awesome !!
Thanks man +rep

 

I do have to agree all the legacy Alienware were and are still awesome, I can't deny that. Even people who did not knew what Alienware was, but them seeing the design they know that it's a beast of a machine, even without having to see the specs. I am hoping for the best of their next model.

 

M15x is viking?

 

Viking = AW 18
m15x = I believe it was Quick Silver

 

Was there a codename for M18xR1 and R2?

 

M18x-R1/R2 = Avenger
AW 14 = Mariner

 

Yes, AW18 = Viking, not M15x
AW17 (Haswell, non-BGA) = Ranger

I believe all of the BGA models are Echo, but I don't remember for sure. I stopped paying attention when they went BGA.

 

Yeah I think its Echo - Like a long BGAAAAAAAAAA

 

LOL - BGA for Kool-Aid drinkers... drinkers... drinkers. Is there an echo in here... here... here?

 

So a question to all experienced members

What machine in Alienware's lineup can run Maxwell (single card only, but AW18/M18 is ok) + Windows 7 but still retain the ability to switch between optimus/fully dedicated?

 

None, because there's no official OEM support need INF modded driver.

Spoiler

I was an optimus user for a long long time
Optimus mode sounds good on paper for battery but when you launch any good load the CPU temp ramps up very quickly due to the iGPU and CPU at work atleast on haswell which is known for its super heat-up due to FIVR. Coming to the performance the dedicated GPU power doesn't get properly utilized with the optimus mode.

PEG mode is what the Alienwares should have shipped with but luckily unlike all other junkware machines the Alienware retain full PEG mode with the switch, A dedicated HW button independent of OS would have been a uber cool thing..

Get an M17x R4 if you want an Alienware maxwell because you have the EC control with custom values that work using HWinfo and on Ranger they don't because of some issue with Maxwell to EC communication. Plus the R4 bests AW17 in every way except the SATAIII ports limitation, Still much better choice

EDIT

 

Yes, yes. I know that the optimus mode is cancer, but I need it for school purposes. Since I'm willing to risk performance for battery life while on campus.

The dedicated PEG/MUXer is a plus, which I can toggle when I return back home and ready to play some games on an external 144hz monitor.

So even with M17x R4 maxwell + win7, you have to choose between PEG and optimus mode upon installation. And cannot switch between PEG/Optimus?


How slow is the 3930MX compared to the 4930MX?

 

Isn't it faster becuase it can overclock higher?

 

3920XM/3940XM can easily keep up with a 4930MX/4940MX, and beat it in some cases depending on overclock.

 

I'll hunt for an R4 then, thanks for advice.

 

4930MX is a great CPU, but only IF you can get lucky enough to land a good one in the silicon lottery. 4940MX is garbage... I've never seen even one example of a good one with awesome overclocking results posted anywhere. The challenge is keeping them cool enough. Haswell is a blast furnace CPU and only good if you go out of your way to keep it cool enough not to have thermal throttling problems when overclocked.

 

4940mx @4.4ghz on all core really really stable isn't good enough?

 

I really want to know what your voltage/TDP is stock clocks the 4930/4940 burn up 47-52W, I can't imagine at 44x4

 

My Alienware serves me well! Nice rant but..irrelevant!


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