m15x: 8800M GTX display driver update

Here's an update regarding the driver downclocking issue. This will probably be more information than you care about, but too much information is better than too little, yes?

167.55: The shipping driver. Works just fine.
167.61: The last 167 driver which doesn't downclock.

I'm in the process of testing 171, but my current suspicion is that the last 173/174 driver is probably 173.62 (which is actually older than 167.61). A high priority bug has been filed, and I'll be following up on that, although I may need to give up my system (that I only got yesterday!) for debugging. Which would suck.

P.S. If it isn't obvious by now, yes, I do work at NVIDIA. No, I'm not going to help you with your specific problem if it isn't what's listed above; I have enough work already. So don't PM me about information, please. You're not going to get any.

3/31: Looks like responsibility lies on both sides. Can't really go into the details, though.... However, this holds true:

NVIDIA can provide a fix for Windows Vista SP1 and after.
Alienware would need to provide the fix for Vista pre-SP1 and Windows XP.

Most of us are/will be on Vista SP1, so that fix should be forthcoming.

4/8: A developer's come up with a fix that works on the m15x... but then breaks SLI systems. *sigh* I'll probably need to poke again to see whether there's been any progress since.

4/15: I've finally been able to test an updated driver that should work on the m15x as well as SLI systems (it was actually ready on the 11th, but other things got in the way), and it looks like it works. So hopefully they'll be able to get that checked in and start building release versions of the fixed driver.

5/5: Nyceis has tracked down a driver release that has the issue fixed (link here). Everybody, go get it!

 

what are you saying? which driver will fix everything and where can i download it? also how do i install an older driver? im confused. thanks for the help. can you just tell me also if the 8800m gtx is able to play crysis on high detail?

 

A clarification. This is the driver underclocking issue, not the heat-related underclocking issue, where people were saying that any newer drivers would leave them stuck in the lower core/memory frequencies. Just in case anybody reading this misunderstood the original post.

 

I've been trying to find that driver and I honestly can't. Best match is 167.51.

 

Thank you Sogarth for your efforts
I for one would be ecstatic if we no longer have to rely on AW to release drivers!

 

I dont get it, 167.61 is not avail anywhere?? and MS just released the newest driver i believe.

 

Ah, but therein lies the catch (unfortunately). Thing being, due to various NDA issues and all, I'm not in a position to actually release any files. I believe I'm okay with the information I've released so far (particularly since it's by and large information that matches what's already available here, barring specific driver release versions), but I'm definitely not in a position to bypass the channels for driver releases....

 

i wish alieware would produce a driver for win xp, both sager and dell have drivers for win xp, alienware dont. Thats called high-end company with care about their customers? hmm....
i'd appreciate if someone finds a solution, im actually willing to donate some money to that person.

 

Well this is actually very interesting. plz keep us posted Sogart.

 

Ah gotta love working for the corporate man! Don't worry i know what you totally mean to much legal tape to get the goods out ha i work for the corporate man too!, but thank you for your useful information!

 

If you guys install the modified drivers from this page http://www.laptopvideo2go.com/drivers/vista you should be able to test whether it works for you. I used them with my XPS M1530 (with a 8600 GT) and it really improved gaming performance.

 

well some people already tested them and they actually didn't work good as the graphic card was always underclocking. Somebody fom this website was already here and tried finding a solution but so far nobody was successful

 

I had many problems playing my favorite game FFXI with the 167.55 drivers that came with my m15x and 8800m GTX card. I recently loaded in the 174.51 Vista drivers and wow! MY FFXI now plays amazing which is great. But I am stuck with the downclocking problem which sucks for other games. It bugs me that alienware is not more responsive to posting these drivers for us to try or Nvidia. I mean if they are out there then let us try them. Post them as Beta and let us try them. We may like or not like the result but at least we have something to work with. I am stuck between playing one game well and downclocking, or playing several games very well,and one game my fav not at all. Another option would be great to try.

 

Did people with the downclocking issue change their driver? and Does it happen only when playing Crysis on Max res?

 

there are two different downclocking issues. Themain issue is that the graphic card downclocks when it get's too hot.
The problem we are discussing here is another. When you use drivers different to those from the AW-website your graphic card will ALWAYS run in stealth mode. This happens with every single driver except the one from AW.

 

hhhm, what if install those different drivers from laptopvideo2go and try to overclock it with Riva Tuner to 540/800? Has anyone tried that?

 

No the OC is locked via the Video Card Bios. You do not have the option to OC using any OC'ing tool.

We are Shafted until AW releases new Video Drivers. Althoug the Sager/Clevo are are having the same issues.

 

AW is working on it now ..we will see an update in the next week coming . hope it will solve the downclocking and update the driver.

 

Hah. Good luck. I've not even seen a fix internally yet (there's a dev looking at the problem), so as I said before, I don't think you'll see anything beyond 167.61.

Mind you, I don't know whether this is exactly the same problem as what's affecting the Clevo machines. It could be....

 

Sounds like Nvidia needs to issue a recall.

 

What is more ironic is that Alienware is owned by Dell so why do they not provide their customers the XP drivers like their parent company Dell does.

 

Huh? A driver issue that doesn't affect any existing officially released drivers for the 8800M GTX requires a hardware recall? How does that make any sense?

Jeez, I try to be helpful, and people say things like this...?

 

We appreciate the heads up for sure Sogarth, I guess people just get frustrated when it takes 6 months to a year to get a good stable driver to work with the video hardware. Its nothing new, but always takes some getting used to. Video card manufacturers always produce the hardware before they have stable drivers. ATI is the same in that regard. We just have to play a waiting game, but it would be nice if AW would make the newer NVIDIA drivers available to us for download.

 

yep, there is one big issue with F.E.A.R. and its definatly the drivers that messes up, damn 1!!!! driver for any needs while nvidia have hundreds!

 

Is everyone else out there happy with their video driver? Are there no other F.E.A.R. or FFXI players that are pissed off with the slow frame rates? 167.61 apparently ahs ben out for a while yet we get nothing from Alienware. I have called Alienware several times and they can;t tel me anything about when they will ahv a new driver out. If youguys want a new driver, please call and bug em. thx.

 

Dont worry about it some people are just ignorant. Thats why people like you and me are here to help. Which I would like to thank you for.

 

Thanks Sogarth,

the information is appreciated... too bad not everyone can appreciate that.

There is one thing that's always confused me, and I have no idea if you'd know why.

Why do video card companies leave it to the notebook manufacturers to release drivers? just about every company seems to do this... and i'm failing at understanding why.

seems like a system, just like any other (just tiny), and it has a northbridge which interacts with the GPU/CPU/RAM... so why not just release northbridge drivers for the mobo, and leave it to Nvidia/ATI to release the mobile driver packs?

so confusing.

 

My understanding is that it's mostly historical.

Desktop drivers have always been released primarily from the manufacturers, since people originally went out and bought video cards, instead of getting their entire systems from large companies.

Notebooks, on the other hand, have always been driven more by the large companies, and they have more specific requests regarding the presentation of drivers. Taking Dell as an example, they have very specific behaviour they want all of their driver updates to take. That, and from what I understand, once upon a time, driver packages (or at least installation packages) had more differences between them, so back then, it was important to get packages from your manufacturer. Now? Not so much.

So yeah. Historical. Doesn't make sense nowadays, but...

 

Thanks for the help Sogarth.

I appreciate the help you are giving.

BTW: Hardware recall? ROFL- the 8800m uses less power than the 8700, makes less heat, and (really important) owns ATI mobility items.

Thanks for the heads up. FTP trigger-happy folks... get to finding those driver versions.

 

Thanks. at least i know people "in the know" are just as baffled about it as I am... I totally understand the historical aspect.

It used to be that laptops were highly customized pieces of technology... and had extremely unique characteristics. now, like you said, not so much. the difference between the 8800m GTX on this laptop and one from say... seger or something, is nil, if any. unlike in the past.

 

I have had issues with FEAR on both my Desktop with 3 way SLI and my Toshiba SLi1 laptop and on both I went into the device manager and simply disabled any listed HID Compliant Devices and that fixed all my FEAR performance issues and this is regardless of the drivers I use and it works in XP and Vista as well. I am doing this trick on my XPS M1730 when it arrives in about a week. I read this fix on a forum about a year ago and have used the trick on any sli computer I own and it worked every time. I hope this helps someone or hope someone that plays FEAR will try the trick and see if it fixes their problem too.

 

@Sogarth

Did you say that NV is working on a new driver that solves the downclocking issue with the 8800GTX in general (not the overheating related one)?
As far as I understood the case, all drivers since a certain build are causing the 8800M GTX to downclock (some kind of driver-bug).
Does that mean, that AW can`t make a working diplay-driver for the m15x as long as NV doesn`t solve the driver-bug? Or does AW develop its own drivers from scratch?
As far as I know NB-companies only modify some sort of core-driver for their systems they get from the hardware manufacturing companies (AMD/ATI&NV)?!

Thanks for the help
Paendrag

 

Yes, NVIDIA is working on a fix which will address the driver issue, and your understanding is correct that drivers built after certain dates all have this issue (multiple dates, since 167/169/171/174's codebases all received the code checkin on different dates).

All installation packages are provided by AMD/Intel/NVIDIA. Alienware validates GPU drivers, but doesn't code them. So notebook companies don't directly modify anything for GPU drivers - they may request specific changes for their hardware (which are then implemented in the .inf files), but they don't program anything.

As a result, Alienware, if they've noticed the problem themselves yet, really can't do much about this until NVIDIA fixes the problem first. Well, I suppose they could provide an old 167 driver, or put more pressure on NVIDIA to get a fix faster, but that's about it. And about that latter, remember that you can push people only so quickly.

 

Very interesting. Thank you for the quick reply and explanation.

Paendrag

 

Thank you very much Sogarth for the info.

Altougt it is kinda sad when you see the progress newer drivers have made in performance. (167.55 are no serious performers)

Hopefully we will see a fix soon and finally unleash the full potential of this notebook.

 

Cheers for keeping us in the loop Sogarth.

 

Sogarth thanks again for all this info and insight. Would it be more beneficial to keep bothering Alienware for these updates or as consumers should we start calling Nvidia to try and put pressure on them. What in your opinion is the better avenue to take?

Thx

 

From what I know, putting pressure on Alienware to put pressure on NVIDIA would be the way to go. As a corporate customer, they'd have more pull than any of us would.

 

Do you have a bug # or ID we could pass along to AW to ask them to ask nVidia to fix?

N

 

Thanks much Sogarth.

 

Hehe maybe I can get another note together to send to engadget

 

In this case, I'm not convinced that would be productive, but... it's up to you, really. Just leave me out of it if you go that route.

 

Quick note: looks like it's being partially bounced back, so that responsibility now lies on both sides of the fence.

 

Great. That cuts our chances of a fix in half if two companies have to do something about it. This is *not* a good sign....I'm not too happy about paying $3000 for a machine with an inability to use new drivers. I think thats cause for a 100% refund if I don't see anything by the end of my 30 days.

N

 

Actually, most of us are in pretty good shape, surprisingly. I'll explain slightly:

NVIDIA can provide a fix for Windows Vista SP1 and after.
Alienware would need to provide the fix for Vista pre-SP1 and Windows XP.

Most of us are/will be on Vista SP1, so that fix should be forthcoming.

 

Ah, That definitely brightens the discussion a bit....In that case, 3 cheers for NVIDIA! Bring on the fix!

Thanks Sogarth!

N

 

Any idea when Vista SP1 will be available on Microsoft's Windows Update site? This isn't directed at Sogarth; just wondering if anyone knows, because I'd like to install it ASAP, if possible.

 

I've had it available for me via Windows Update. I kept installing all of the available updates, and when none were available, I did a manual refresh (the Check for Updates link), and then SP1 popped up.

 

Hmm...do you recall the approximate size of the SP1 file on the update site?

EDIT: I have the Home Premium edition.

 

It's also here in a standalone file:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...6d-5ebb-413b-89c9-cb3d06d12674&displaylang=en

N