Asus N61Ja Info/updates

hardware-wise its not, asus leads.
same should be with battery life except when running on dedicated card, dv6t has advantage there, but then again, its card is way below 4670/5730. xps currently has only one major advantage and thats higher resolution.

now if someone cant stand lower resolution or using external monitor when working at home/in office, then the choice is obvious - xps, as for everything else, asus is better.

i'm xps fan, but until dell upgrades to ati 5000 series, i wont consider it.

 

I think the major difference is the warranty. The dell and HP both only have a basic 1 yr for that price. Also I wouldn't touch anything made by HP right now, most statistics say you have a 25% chance of having a hardware failure within 3 years.

 

I almost tempted to buy the Asus G51Jx-A1 w/ GTS 360m...blah so hard to determine what I want .

 

i second that. HP build quality is hugely in question.

 

That statistic is largely useless, especially if you are citing that lovely "<s>survey</s> study" by Squaretrade.

Again, it's more about product lines, as compared to brands. I'm willing to bet my Elitebooks against any model made by Asus. For that matter, I'm willing to bet my Elitebooks against any other brand's business class notebooks.

 

Elitebooks are business notebooks, they cost more and are more reliable. I was referring to consumer laptops which are the ones being compared here. You like your Elitebook, great, you payed more for that reliability. Yes I quoted the survey by Squaretrade. Do you have a reason to dismiss this survey? From all the research I've done ASUS's reliability is better on average than both HP and Dell with HP way behind.

Can you get an Elitebook that can compete performance wise to any of the laptops discussed in this thread at around the same price? If so please post a link.

 

Let's see. I picked up my 8730W with FX3700M, T9400, 4GB, WUXGA for 1130, with 3 year warranty. And in a chassis that I would gladly use to beat any Asus model into junk with. That beats the crap out of the G51vx price/performance for the matter.

Have you read the actual survey, instead of simply the summary? The survey makes no distinction between model lines either, be it consumer or business line. So would it be accurate to claim the 25% figure to apply towards all product lines?

Read these threads for an idea of the inaccuracy of reliability figures for surveys.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=435464
http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/deal-discussion/975796/

Actual survey link
http://www.squaretrade.com/htm/pdf/SquareTrade_laptop_reliability_1109.pdf

Squaretrade's own response towards articles rebutting its survey.

http://blog.squaretrade.com/2009/11/a-rebuttal-to-some-comments-about-our-laptop-failure-study.html

Judging from what you know of the different brands alone, would you say it's fair to make such an assumption? Would you, in any form, be able to substantiate the claim that you see as many Asus machines in the workplace as you would in a college setting for example? I doubt you could, even in an anecdotal form.

And if you paid any attention, you might notice that I own a variety of products from different brands.

I don't believe in being a fan. Every manufacturer and product line has its pros and cons, it is up to the consumer to find one that suits his or her needs best. Relying on imperfect findings such as the survey only denies options to the end user.

 

@dtwn

First I want to start off and say I was being sincere when I was asking for information the rebuked the Squaretrade data. As you may know it is difficult to sift through the good and bad data on these forums and the internet in general.

I know more about the different brands than you may think, but like anyone else I can only speak from my experience.

It looks like you got a really good deal on your 8730W. However to attempt to bring this discussion back to the N61Ja. People are trying to figure out if the N61JA is a good purchase.

From what I've read in this thread you can get a similar deal from HP (Envy) and Dell (XPS). Those were the product lines I was referring to when I was talking about the reliability and warranty. Can you link to the deal you got on the 8730W because from visiting HP's website the starting price is about 1600.

 

Exactly. Also, remember that it is a lot more common to see complaints than praises, especially at sites like NBR with users asking for assistance.

My point was the Squaretrade data is not conclusive. It certainly is a wealth of information, but it should be taken with a pinch of salt. To quote the Squaretrade findings without noting the lacking areas would be a disservice to both yourself and others.

Exactly, anecdotal evidence is simply that, anecdotal. My point about bringing up the different brands is that I'm not simply picking on Asus, I'm debating the utility of using the Squaretrade study as a guide for decision making.

I wish I could, it's an over and done deal unfortunately. It has been possible, however, to obtain the 8730w with the FX2700M, WUXGA and a decent CPU for $8XX. This deal has cropped up on Tigerdirect several times. While not equipped with a i-series CPU, the FX2700M's performance is only not very far below that of the 5730. You can purchase a FX3700M for about 300+ USD on Ebay and upgrade the 8730w as well, but that wasn't the route I went, since such an upgrade might void your warranty.

To be honest, the N61JA is a very decent model for the price. The only area lacking would be the resolution, especially on a 16" model, but resolution is very much a personal preference.

The Envy 15 with i5 could be bought at a similar price point a few weeks ago thanks to the HP coupon, but that deal is dead, for now at least. The XPS 16, on the other hand, has seemed to demonstrate some throttling issues.

Build quality wise, the Envy 15 is supposed to be rather decent, albeit somewhat warm running. If the N61JA follows recent trends in Asus models, it would probably be somewhat warm as well. The XPS 16, is more of a mix bag, you hear users complaining about build quality, as well as those stating that it's perfectly fine.

Between Asus and Dell warranties, the default warranty on Asus machines is better by far. While the other companies (Dell/HP/Lenovo) offer more warranty options, there is also a corresponding increase in price for these upgrades. If an extended warranty is important without the additional cost, Asus' default warranty is an excellent choice.

Another point to note is that the prices for Dell/HP/Lenovo machines tend to fluctuate substantially due to the different pricing in upgrades. Asus prices are relatively stable till new products are released. If you are interested in purchasing a machine from Dell/HP/Lenovo it might be best to settle on a configuration and keeping a record of how prices fluctuate to get yourself a better deal.

 

how does turbo boost work with core i5 does it overclock both physical cores and turn off hyper threading or overclock 1 core and turn off the other?

turbo boost is confusing.

 

Turns off one core and overclocks the other. Though I'm not sure if it can Hyper Thread while it Turbo Boosts.

 

HyperThereading has nothing to do with Turbo Boost so it still works on one core (just like it did in Pentium 4 D)

 

PowerNoteBooks has not yet listed this (N61JA-A1) model on their site though XoticPC started taking orders or may be also started shipping it.

 

I would like to mention that the i5-430m which looks to be the default processor is missing features of it's big brothers the i5-500 series.

Here is the direct links for what it does and doesn't support:

http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=43537

The highlights is no VT-d, Trusted Execution Technology, AES Instructions.

 

Yes..Then what we can do ?
The next processor upgrade of N61JA-A1 from i5-430M to i5-520M is $259 USD !!!
Where as the processor price of i5-520M itself is $225 USD !!!
Which means the price of default i5-430M is $ -34 USD !!!

 

Do you ever read? Or do I have to repeat myself again?

If the price bothers you so much, buy an ES or OEM CPU on Ebay and hope it doesn't void your warranty.

It looks almost like an i3 chip, with the addition of Turboboost.

 

That's why you have to ask yourself. What will you be using the computer for not just now but the life time of the PC. The blue-ray drive with that monitor is just stupid. Blue-ray is in 1080p and the monitor at best can do 720P, unless you have an external monitor. For me the no VT-d was the deal breaker since I run Virtual Machines, but if you don't then VT-d means nothing. As far as the AES it might help with encryption but for most user's its not a necessity.

I'd be curious to know what the difference in battery life would be between the i5-430m and i7-720QM. If it's 40 min or less than it's really not worth it IMHO to loose the quad core and speed.

 

in URPradhan defence on Xoticpc site if you customize the processor this is the price.

-Intel® Core™ i5-520M, 2.4-2.93GHz, (3MB L3 cache) ( + 259 )

 

I am fully aware of where he got his figures from, hence why I pointed out that the price he quotes

1) is in 1000 units.

and

2) Xoticpc doesn't purchase them at the price, not at this point of time anyway. Note that my earlier post from some time ago already mentioned Xoticpc when he first complained about upgrade costs.

Places like Xoticpc can upgrade the CPU for you with the advantage of having no worries about a voided warranty, at an extra cost. It may seem only fair if they include the original CPU as well, but that question has been rehashed in other threads as well. It may seem unfair, and if so, it is your choice not to purchase it from this particular reseller.

Note: This was his original post. Images did not carry over, but you can look up the original post.

And as explained to him earlier, it is not simply a discrepancy. No offense, but I tire of trying him to get him to understand that.

 

I Agree. I never really understood why Intel released the i3 chip.

 

A quick comparison of i5 versus i7 (720QM) reveals that the i7 does NOT support AES, for whatever that's worth, and Intel doesn't specify whether it supports VT-d or not.

Also worth mentioning here is that the i7 is the only one in the i series that supports DDR3-1333 RAM. For me, this would seem to be a big deal, as it makes an already fast chip even faster, and definitely sets it apart from the i3 and i5 even further.

I didn't want to pay the extra price for an i7, but I think I may end up doing just that. Nothing seems wrong with the i5 at all, but it looks like i7 is a much better CPU for (relatively) not much more money.

 

I don't really get it either, but it sure seems like notebooks with an i3 are a lot cheaper than ones with an i5. Go figure...

 

This post may shed some light on the dual core quad core performance debate that some of you may have.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showpost.php?p=5804678&postcount=7

Edit: Thread link added for extra detail.
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?p=5804678#post5804678

 

I think this info might me more important in a couple of months. Right now the i7-720QM seems to be far cheaper than the i7-620M in all the laptop configurations I've viewed. I'm sure that will change.

 

In fairness, it should be noted that this poster to whom you refer followed up the post you linked with the following:

So, once again, we're back to square one, where the CPU you choose is (and should be) based entirely on what you intend to do with it.

 

It's not in 1000 units... that's the price it can be got individually from somewhere like ExcaliberPC.

I actually asked a retailer about it, answer I got was that the labor + warranty preservation are why it costs extra over the price of the processor.

 

OK... Seems that you know lot about the number of orders XoticPC gets for customizations
So, if $225 is the price per 1000 units, then now tell us what is the price per unit only ? And also the price of i5-430M ?

 

Actually, if you look at the charts, it's the official estimated price from Intel per 1000 units, hence why you wil see 1Ku on the original image.

This is Intel's disclaimer about prices.

If the reseller is willing and able to sell it at the price, well, it would mean that whomever they got it from was able to get it at a even lower price. All the better for you as the consumer. Some resellers offer cheaper upgrades by using ES chips. And no, Gentech/PNB and XoticPC don't, not for their Sager units, and I doubt for their Asus units as well.

I don't need to know a lot about XoticPC's sales to give you that much.

How about doing your own search?

For us to purchase an OEM unit would be a fair bit higher, i.e http://www.provantage.com/intel-bx80617i5540m~7ITEP358.htm
257 on your chart, 287 shipped if you don't get taxed.
http://www.provantage.com/intel-bx80617i5520m~7ITEP359.htm
225 on your chart, 242 shipped if you don't get taxed.

And remember, those are Intel's official estimated prices for OEMs per 1Ku, they can choose to sell it for even lower or higher.

My main point is, making a price point comparison based on Intel's direct sale prices is pointless, unless you can obtain Intel's price directly.

Can you? Or for the matter, can the resellers?

If you want to find out what Intel's price for the i5-430m is, go camp this page.
http://ark.intel.com/ProductCollection.aspx?familyId=43483
I'm sure it will show up eventually.

Very true. That was merely a link to a post, and that post was not meant to be conclusive. In addition, as far as I could tell, while they did test multi threaded apps, performance would also depend on the number of threads the app you are using can support.

I wouldn't say square one per se, that post did provide some idea of performance figures between the i7/i5 CPUs for some programs, and if you know what programs you will be using, it might actually help.

 

Toshiba Satellite® A505-S6017 16" Widescreen Notebook Computer With Intel® Core™ i5-430M Processor With Turbo Boost Technology is for $699.99 (no discrete graphics, no usb 3.0)
http://www.officedepot.com/a/products/851967/Toshiba-Satellite-A505-S6017-16-Widescreen/

 

No discrete graphics means it's in a completely different market, what're you posting it in here for?

As for the price XoticPC gets them for, I would wager it's somewhere between $225 and $259. It would depend on how many they bought, no? (if they bought 1000, it'd cost them $225). As for the cost of an i5-430M...it's probably not being sold to resellers. Who in their right mind would upgrade to an i5-430M? The only people that would want to are those you are buying an i3, but anyone buying an i3 doesn't care about power.

Now then, the only good question to have popped up recently, that being why Intel released those silly i3s. It's probably due to the way fabrication works. The process to make the i7s and i5s isn't perfect, so every now and again, they get a dud. Sometimes, the dud is completely useless, but at other times, they still work. But it just can't handle the full clock speeds.

It's probably those working duds that become i3s.

 

Regarding HP's build quality... The reason why I ordered my N61jq is because my HP Pavilion dv9500 died on me last month... Now it's not that it's largely HP's fault as the problem was the 8400m / 8600m video cards which many of you may know are defective... The problem here is that HP is not willing to stand behind their products.... Even though they extended their warranty from 1 to 2 years (mine died 2 years and 3-4 months) they didn't even include all of the models that were using Nvidia's defective chips. They are being sued over this and I hope they lose big time. For example when Sony admitted that their laptops have defective chips (took them a long time) they extended their warranty from 1 year to 4 years. Now that's a long time. I won't be buying anything from HP again.

 

Just chatted with someone at xoticpc and they said that they are not offering the N61JA-A1 (I swer I saw it there two days ago) and that it is only a Eropean release. Did I miss something?

 

http://1toppc.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=N61JA-A1
you can always order @ GentechPC. I see powernotebooks don't have N61JA-A1 either?

 

Thanks! When xoticpc had it on their site, they had a wireless card upgrade that I don't see at GentechPC.

 

From http://forum.notebookreview.com/showpost.php?p=5814920&postcount=82

Bummer

 

XoticPC has removed N61JA-A1 from their site
What happened to those who might have pre-ordered it ?

 

It took me quite a while to decide on the N61JA-A1. My reasons may have been arbitrary but at least I had decided. Now I start over. The K52JR-A1 looks close.

 

GenTechPC still taking orders for N61Ja-A1. If you want buy from GenTechPC.

http://1toppc.com/Merchant2/merchan...=N61JA-A1&Category_Code=AS15&Product_Count=15

 

why are you looking for another laptop if a reseller is selling a model you want to buy?

 

I guess I was assuming that it would be pulled from GenTechPC too. I will call in the AM and verify they have it in stock.

EDIT: The Availability on GenTech is "Pre-Order"

 

Anyone else got their hands on this yet?

I'd like to know the battery life of this and more benchmark... I wonder whether it's possible to get 9k+ on 3DMark06 with certain OC settings. Did the card also downclocked as in G51J case?

Screen resolution is the one bugging me from buying this machine. Is there a way to change the hardware so I can get 1080p?

 

The only way to view higher resolutions is to connect the laptop to an external monitor/HDTV or to replace the laptop screen with a higher res panel.

 

Yes, but that'll completely void the warranty right?
Do you know those who replace their laptop screen got problems afterwards (related to changing the panel, of course)?

 

As long as you don't break the "warrant void" seal, your laptop should still be covered under the manufacture warranty. The only problems that i've heard with swapping out a screen panel are how the cables are sometimes not long enough to reach the motherboard.

 

I don't know how you guys can work with a 1080p 16" screen. The highest I would consider for a screen that size is 1600x900.

EDIT: So wait, is this laptop going to remain on sale at GenTech or what?

 

Where could you purchase and upgrade monitor. I don't think they make anything bigger for this model.

 

I have had this 14.1" A8Js for 3 years and always using it at 1440x900 (~120.4 DPI). So 1366x768 on 16" (98 DPI) is clearly a downgrade for workspace.

Heck G51 series 15.6" have most of the model on 1080p.

I'm also interested knowing where can you get the upgrade screen panel for this model. I know one guy here have their G51 panel changed from 1366x768 to 1600x900.

 

Funny thing it had been cancelled in Europe (at least in some countries) more than a week ago and at that time it's been still available in the US, so we thought it's US only version or sth.

 

Weird how the canceled the US model...I think a lot of people wanted that model.

 

A perfect competitor to this model launched by Sony E series (starting from $699.99) ! Though with weaker GPU but stronger CPU.

# Intel® Core™ i5-520M processor (2.40GHz) with Turbo Boost up to 2.93GHz
# 15.5" 1366x768 LCD
# Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium 64-bit
# 500GB Hard Disk Drive (7200rpm)
# 4GB (2GBx2) DDR3-SDRAM-1066
# ATI Mobility Radeon™ HD 5470 Graphics (512MB VRAM)
# Blu-ray Disc™ player
# $1019.99 USD