M1330 Display Issue (Vertical Lines on Reboot & Crash & Vertical Lines)

I just upgraded to A10 before i did the test. However i think A09 did this too because i did some similar testing (with the A09 Bios) using rthdribl and rivaTuner showed the GPU declock itself also.

 

It would be nice if someone could find out what the maximum allowable temperature is for our GPU, and what the dell recommended specs are for the cooling system (if any exist) For example... What the idle temps and max load temps are supposed to be at a given room temperature.

 

I don't know about recommended specs but I get 66C idle, 101C full load at 25C ambient.

 

So you get 101 absolute max at 25c ambient? Do you know if your GPU de-clocks itself at a certain temp? It seems my GPU de-clocks itself when it hits 103/104. 105 is absolute max i have hit as of now. My lowest idle was 77c and my ambient is about the 25c also

 

My GPU has never gone over 101C and it's never throttled itself.

 

No, I am getting these problems and was wondering if I could get swap for a 1530 system (not the heatsink) instead rather than go through all this in 6 months time. Unless someone tells me that it won't happen again but it seems like Dell are just giving out refurbished motherboards which will experience the same problems in half a year.

 

Let me iterate my experience with calling Paypal support. Thats definitely US because the first person I got connected had such a thick accent that I literally had trouble understanding any word he was saying...

I am the customer right? Number 1 right? Well the 'customer support' lady didn't think so.

I got that after staying on line in a ISD call for > 30 minutes (atleast Dell has made that arrangement for you that all you got to do is call a TOLL FREE number)

The lady says - Sir, it is not my problem if you cannot understand my accent. I rofled... and said, connect me to your supervisor. I was put on hold, and after around 15 more minutes, I just cut the call.

The second time I called, a proper guy picked up and I went over the issue with him and resolved it, without problem.

Did I stereotype my one experience with a stuck up Texan (or whatever you call people from Texas) and generalize it to all Americans? I didn't.

I stay in the same city as Dell's head quarters in India (I doubt you have any international knowledge... so I won't bother saying names) and I usually get NBD service (after talking with techs from Singapore) and I can CONFIRM that there is NO XPS technical support from India. I confirmed that from another Indian tech who visited my place to change my palm rest.

Oh and btw, the tech from Singapore ([email protected]) who i got connected to was quite knowledgeable. But I knew much more than him... I wonder how is that possible, since I am from India?

Yea I agree... we stereotype amongst ourshelves ROFL.... so can't really accuse you people to catch on the vibe. Was just correcting a fact.

Which company hasn't ?

I got my brand new Dell XPS M1330 around 2 weeks back, and the motherboard is also a A00 revision.

 

What ambient temperature do you find yourself using the laptop in most (estimate) ? Do you live in a temperate climate or a cold/hot one?

Its interesting that your GPU gets proper cooling and doesn't need to throttle itself... Also what software did you use to get the gpu's temperature? It seems to me that I8kfanGUI does not give the right temperature until you calibrate it... Nvidia's NVMonitor and RivaTuner show me the correct temperatures (since they both show the same value) while I8kfanGUI is ~22c lower (until i calibrate it)

Funny thing is... My one of my desktops in the same room has a fanless Nvidia 7300GT and i put it through all the same stress tests and it only hits like 82c max! and it idles at 64c in the same room which is around 25c. The GPU in my M1330 idles at the same temp that my desktops GPU hits at full load! And its fanless!

Good job Dell!

Maybe i should ask Dell for a new heatsink(with new thermal pads)...

 

I asked Dell if i could get a refund for my laptop and they said I'm past the 21 day return limit or something like that. So i doubt you can swap unless you owned it for ~21days. But who knows, maybe you can get lucky if you keep fighting them on it.

But more than likely they will just send you a new (refurbished) motherboard and a tech to replace it. It wont take too long if your in the US. (I don't know how long it takes in other countries though) Last time it only took them 2 or 3 days total :-(

 

I'm just worried that I'll get a replacement motherboard and in six months time, I'll get the same problem..

 

Yea, I think most of us are in the same boat

We should seriously fight them for a free extended warranty...

 

What they should do is provide a more permanent fix, like modifying the heat sink for better contact with the GPU after they replace the motherboard.

 

101 w/25C amb is not bad... of course this is all relative until you define "under load" a bit more precisely (please).

For example, I've managed 104C in 24C amb using 3DMark06 *. I try to keep my place at 22C whenever possible and 3DMark06 usually gets pegged at 99C under these conditions...


EDIT* My bad: I hit 104C playing Portal while the GPU was OCed to 450/675. My highest recorded temp @stock speeds was 100C.

 

I'm afraid a better heat-sink will not do the work. I think it's a motherboard/gpu build fault from the start.

 

They really should... Too bad no one at Dell is listening...

 

I'm still curious what the maximum acceptable temp is for our GPU. My GPU throttles down when it hits 103/104c and its really annoying because it cuts back the speed by like 1/2 and consequently i get 1/2 the FPS in the simulation/stress test. Its a good thing I'm not really using this laptop for any gaming because i would be one very unhappy gamer! But then again who uses a 8400GS for gaming anyway... Not very many...

But my point is, Common Dell you design and sell a laptop that can't even run its GPU (and probably the CPU) at full speed in normal ambient room temp! (when under load)

 

The motherboard/gpu might of had issues from the start, and there might be some faulty boards out there for sure. However if the GPU and other components don't get cooled properly then damage might occur over time. So it does go hand in hand...

 

I've never even installed a game on mine and it's happened 6months on.

 

I was talking about the high (abnormal) temps in the mobo/gpu assembly. Those temps are not normal and Dell should have tested it more before releasing the M1330 to the customers.

I agree that having high temps will lead to failure in a short period of time.

 

Same here... However, after the symptoms came back for the first time on the 2nd(current) motherboard... I started beating the crap out of it with GPU stress testing programs sadly... My GPU doesn't wanna die yet, even though the replacement motherboard is on its way...

Its crazy though because my computer had all the symptoms on Friday and now they're gone! But the temp's of the GPU are still quite high and it keeps throttling down to prevent damage.

 

24C generally, but rarely below.

Summer in Bristol, UK.

Under load is running HL2 Lost coast for 25 mins and recording max temp in HWMonitor, which seems to generate more GPU heat than orthos+3dmark 06 in parallel.

 

Believe-you-me, I tried to find out via nVidia's website, etc. what the thermal operating range for the 8400M GS is but unfortunately they do not supply such info. I've been involved with several threads involving temps incl:

O/Cing the 8400GS

M1330 Temp Probes

GeForce 8400M Temperature

since way back when because the M1330s GPU temp has always bothered me. In fact, I had already posted in this thread a few times before encountering the problem myself - call it premonition, or more likely, an educated guess.

I'm still tracking this thread very closely because, among other reasons, my new Mobo will bring absolutely nothing to the table when it comes to resolving this overheating problem...

 

Thanks for the links to the threads... I will try to read though them to see if i can find anything of use...

Did you apply additional thermal compound (such as arctic silver) onto the thermalpads/heatsink? I am curious if this helps... I read some posts with people trying it but i don't remember what the outcome was...

I think when i get this motherboard replaced, sometime this week hopefully. I will try to apply some Arctic Silver 5 or whatever its called. I already ordered some on newegg along with their cleaning/prep solution (for cleaning off the chip for the new compound)

I also ordered a notebook cooler for kicks... I don't know if it will help but i guess it won't hurt http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834998052

Do you know of any other good ways to help keep this beast cool?

I saw that modified heatsink/heatpipe that some one posted earlier in this very thread. Looks interesting since they claim it lowers the temperature by so much. It would be nice if we could all pressure Dell to redesign the whole heatsink/heatpipe so it makes direct contact with the chips like it should.

 

I notice my M133O gets pretty hot, and I've seen it in the 90s (GPU-Z and others' reports), but I rendered an AVCHD movie in Pinnacle Studio 11 overnight and more, and, while it did clock down pretty soon after it started, the render completed successfully without smoking the laptop, so I think that says something about Dell's engineers knowing what they're doing.

That doesn't mean there aren't better options. But to say that it can't handle itself is a bit unfair, I think. I have mine since September, too, BTW.

 

Does anyone know if I can buy Dells extended warranty + complete care for like 2 years or so? I think i need to extend my warranty since i dont have very much faith in this laptop... And besides i rather pay like 200-300 bucks now as insurance... Just so i dont have to buy this later on down the road http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/...c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=D057F&mfgpid=192266

Actually... They should extend all our warranties if they really believe M1330s don't have issues with cooling...

 

Hi, Im having the same problem as you with Dell wanting to transfer service tags and taking forever. Have you made any progress?

 

Sadly, I have to join this club. As a few of you know, I'm over in Okinawa, and purchased this as one of the first batches released. I do have to say that Dell's XPS support really does rock. They believed me right off the bat and had me run their diagnostics over the phone. The gentleman heard clearly the beeping noises my computer made during the test that told him the motherboard needed replacing.

They have now put up a request to international mobile support to relay a fix out here in Okinawa. The military has told me that since Dell lost the military contract, their overseas support still works well. I will have to wait until tomorrow to start seeing the ball roll since memorial day weekend has pretty much shut things down in the states.

I do hope that Dell made some modifications to the newer board to help keeping this from happening again. If not, I'll probably have another board swap-out in the next 9 months.

Until then, I won't be using Vista's animated background and full Aero.

 

This thread seems to have got off track. Th original post was
"Today I started having an issue with my M1330 display after having the system for 4-6 months. When I was working (running lovely Vista-Hell) today the screen just went black, then vertical colored lines started filling up the entire black screen and the computer crashed. When I reboot the same thing happens on start-up until the login-screen appears. Any ideas? I haven't updated any drivers since I got the system. Is my video card on its way to the grave?

Thanks in advance. I will update the video drivers to see if that helps."

Im interested to hear of more people with this problem and how Dell is resolving it. The other isse that I am at least one other are having is getting support for my XPS outside of the country it was purchased.

 

It's all still on topic. The only fix is to replace your motherboard.

 

It's unlikely to be a permanent fix though, as it sounds as if there is no difference between the old and new revisions, so we can only assume the same problems will start six months after installing a new motherboard.

I'm seriously considering asking whether I can just swap to the integrated graphics chip to save the hassle.

 

I had the motherboard replaced (refurbed) and the same problem still occurred. Dell sent out a second replacement mobo that's getting installed today.

 

#1 Congratulations, hope it's a good movie

#2 I'm not sure what part of rendering video places a load on the GPU but even if it does, I don't think it qualifies as a GPU stress-test.

#3 Having built enough PCs and having replaced enough stock GPU coolers, I can and will state that Dell's R&D underestimated the cooling requirements of the 8400M GS.
Reviewing the HSF design of the M1530 clearly shows R&D knows how to cool a GPU, but decided that it was unnecessary to take said steps for the M1330's "on board" as well as discrete graphics solutions.

Well, some of us have proof to the contrary...

 

I got an automated call 15 minutes ago from Dell saying my motherboard is delayed :-\ so much for fast service. Meanwhile my motherboard/gpu still doesn't wanna quit...

Does anyone know if there is a reversion newer than A04 for the motherboards? I had a Version A01 when i got the laptop, and i currently have a A04 which gave me the symptoms of death a good few days ago, but it still works but i don't trust it...

 

None of it as far as I'm aware.
Movies are 2D and don't require any 3D rendering.
Rendering video is CPU intensive, not GPU intensive.

So is cooling going to be a problem for the onboard X3100 as well?
I haven't seen any reports for X3100 temperatures in the M1330.
Does the X3100 even have a temperature sensor the way the 8400M does?

 

So far only happened to 8400gs and shipped before February.

And only happened twice to tom_88 and Nine99.
tom's case was replaced 6 month ago so first replaced board was shipped before February.
I don't know when Nine99 replaced first time.

But if more people see the same problems after February shipped 8400gs then this is major design issue.

My board was replaced 2 weeks ago with refurb a01.
I like to know if you have same vertical color lines problem with after February shipped 8400gs.

 

Today should be a nice hot day outside in Phoenix... I'm going to charge up my laptop and take it outside for some stress testing to see if this sucker finally dies... (i have a replacement motherboard on it way, so why not...)

I already hit 101c in the de-clocked (low power 3d mode)... It should be fun to see what happens when i take it outside to 90+ degree heat

 

bought my 1330 in september .. experiencing the same
gpu or mo issues.

 

Hi,

what I meant to imply was that Dell was satisfied with the same HSF solution for all M1330 Graphics options.

Furthermore, there's been no report of an X3100-equipped M1330 going belly-up and I doubt that there will be.

Heck, I'm not even sure that the X3100 is even a separate chip - and not just an extra "section" of the GM965 Northbridge...

 

Add another one to the growing list of owners with this problem. I purchased mine last November and the vertical lines crash started showing up about 3 weeks ago. I called XPS Tech Support a few days ago and it couldn't have been a bigger waste of 2 hours. I am planning to give it another try tomorrow while being more informed due to reading this thread and being more aggressive about a motherboard replacement.

Also has anyone had any luck talking Dell into extending the standard warranty due to this this problem? Like others in this thread, mine stated failing approximately 6 months after purchase and I am really concerned this could all happen again 6 months later when my warranty is up.

 

Unfortunately, I (we) haven't seen nor heard of any changes that would improve the situation aside from maybe a GPU firmware/BIOS update that might automatically down-clock the GPU if & when it reaches a certain temperature.

My replacement "A04" mobo came with an 8400M GS loaded with [video] BIOS version 60.86.45.00.40. Unfortunately I didn't log the vid bios version of my original A01 mobo, but I'm betting it was the same...

...maybe a few other members can report their vid. bios versions (avail. via the BIOS screens or nVidia drivers under "System Information").

 

Believe it or not... I constantly see my GPU throttle down to the "low power 3D" (275mhz core, 300mhz memory, instead of the full 400mhz core & 600mhz memory) whenever my GPU hits 104c (and it hits that 104c every time i run any bechmarking/stress testing software)

Oh btw my Video bios version is 60.86.45.0.40.

 

What's your Video BIOS revision?

Why do you refer to those reduced speeds as "low power 3D"...???

 

My Video bios version is 60.86.45.0.40.

I refer to them as such because thats what RivaTuner shows them as (Both in the over clocking menu,without any over clocking turned on. It also shows the speeds drop when my GPU hits 104C in the Hardware Monitoring feature...)

 

OK so i messed up a little... You need to enable "overclocking" to see the default values. Here are some screen shots from my system...

But as i said... My GPU will drop from "Performance 3d" mode to "Low power 3D mode" when the core hits 104c







These are the default settings to my knowledge

 

Ok, fine, I have the same "default" values too, but I've never had the GPU automatically down-clock during load. In all fairness, I haven't seen it hit 104C, either *. I've come close, but that must be the pre-set limit... .

Can I assume that you experienced the down-clocking when you didn't check the "Enable driver-level HW Overclocking" box too?

Anyways, my GPU runs @432 / 601.71 when under load, then drops to 297 / 300.86 and finally down to 182.25 / 3.48 when idling (for core and memory respectively). At least that's what RivaTuner reports...

EDIT* I've never seen it hit 104 or under-clock at STOCK speeds but it did just that at exactly 104C when I OCed the GPU & Memory to 450/675!

 

Yup... It downclocked with the "Enable driver-level HW Overclocking" turned off

 

This motherboard situation is really confusing/irritating me. As i said before... I had the symptoms return a couple times last Friday. I got really mad, called dell and got them to send me a new board (which is delayed but on its way)

And since i made that phone call this laptop hasn't given me any problems since. However it does overheat and de-clock itself as i mentioned. Now the tech is going to come to my house and think I'm crazy for replacing what seems to be good motherboard.

Sigh... If he chooses to just replace the motherboard anyway then i guess i will let him. At least then i will have parts that haven't been stressed as much hopefully.

Now if i called this whole replacement off... I bet this motherboard would crap out either way...

:confused2:

I wonder what kind of motherboard they sent... Hopefully its another A04 or newer... I realized when they replaced my first motherboard to the current A04, The power jack is a lot more loose than the old one. It seems to make contact just fine and it doesn't loose it. However i am concerned that it will wear out pretty soon and i will need a new jack/motherboard.

 

My M1330 is first gen...probably A01 as I ordered the first day orders were taken. The Video BIOS version is 60.86.45.00.40.00 and I'm using A10 BIOS.

I think that the card is not overheating, but rather the thermal change is causing the card to become dislodged somewhere as when my motherboard runs awhile, the problem stops, much like the XBox 360.

 

Unlike desktops, The nVidia GPU is soldered right onto the M1330's mobo. As for your dislodging vs. overheating theory, I'm afraid I don't buy it.

What you need to do is to run a 3D benchmark, such as 3DMark06 and observe the mean and max temps of the GPU (using RivaTuner, for example). If it reaches 100C or more during the test, then you most likely have an overheating problem. If, by some miracle, your GPU logs a mean temp. in the high 80s and maybe peaks around 95C, then there might be other reasons for your problem... .

Btw, I thought the 360's ROD was (also) a heat-related issue...?

 

nVidia designed the mobile 8400...ours...to go well over 100C (I don't have the source document around). This really surprised me when I found out. They did put in a temp cap at around 110C to drop the clock and the temp, regardless of the operating system, drivers, or even overclocking software. Another technician and I was able to confirm this.

Even though it's soldered, it's still susceptible to thermal stress. The chip can take the stress, but I guarantee the board is going to warp a bit and either crack the chip or damage the circuitry links anywhere from the chip mounting point to crushed circuits inside the chip itself. The fact that my card seems to only function at medium temps (not cold, not hot) tells me that at least mine has suffered from some thermal stress damage. I get vertical lines at low temps and high temps with no functional display. I get clear display when the temp is warm and then a wavy blue horizontal lines just before the GPU hits the high end temp.

Anyhow, we all know the motherboard can't handle the that temps and GPU probably shouldn't be tied to the CPU on the heatsink.