S-XPS 1645 AC Power Throttle Issue Investigation

I would have to say that that would be incorrect as I believe the issue was only reported about 2 weeks ago and people who have received their computers with-in the last2 weeks are still reporting that same issue, you need to have someone who just received it to reply back to him as he is incorrect.

 

Gaming/GPU intensive tasks shouldn't be affected too much with the proc's multi slowing down to 7x. Maybe some games that are CPU-intensive, but I don't play many RPG's anyhow

As long as the i7 does what it should during CPU-intensive stuff, then I am ok with that.

I guess, IMO anyways, I don't see too big a problem

 

Well I got it just about yesterday and I would like to run the tests but since I'm not home and dell wouldn't just hurry am going to have to wait until the 26th...

 

NOTE: this info is for the Studio XPS 1640/T9600, RGB LED, ATI 4670.

I just ran a quick test using Furmark and Prime95. And the results clearly show that the 1640 also experiences throttling when pushing both the CPU & GPU.

Results:

Furmark+Prime95, mains power:

700-1600mhz, 266.00x3.0

CPU temp: 63-65 degrees C


Prime95, mains power:

2793mhz, 266.00x10.5

CPU temp 78 degrees C

 

In lesser and older games, like say, WoW, the slowdown only translates into a lost ~10 fps or so.

In newer games that utilize multi-threading, like TF2, the difference is as much as ~20 fps.

I just did a test with Dragon Age: Origins, and the fps drop was about 12 fps (according to FRAPS).

Strangely enough, the frame drop didnt't happen until the CPU fan kicked in...could this be the culprit? I never noticed that till now.

EDIT: Or is it the GPU fan?

 

Yeah. Would someone who received the laptop after Nov. 15 confirm this? Whether the problem still exists or not?

 

Yes it exists. Received laptop Nov. 18 and it had 80% of its parts upgraded Nov. 20

 

Thanks! Writing to Dell again now. Would be better if more ppl with laptops shipped after Nov. 15 to comment on this please.

 

Laptop recieved 1st Dec, problem definitely happened for me. Had an engineer out who was told to replace the whole motherboard, but he refused as it simply wasnt the right environment to do it in, and he'd never even seen this machine before!
I did get a 130w adapter though, and I havent run any 'proper' tests since, as I'm happy that my games perform as they should now, and the adapter runs sooo much cooler, its lovely

 

As I previously said, a resolution specialist said the engineers are working on a solution, most likely a mobo + BIOS update, and it will be free for all of us. ETA she said is 3 weeks. I'll call in after Christmas and ask.

 

This might be a stupid question, but why on earth do you have two, and why is one on ebay?

 

Thank you! Anyone else?

Yeah... the problem is, 1st, Dell is now telling me they've fixed the problem (probably bcuz don't wanna give me the 130W), and 2nd, I won't be back to states until August, so need to get it now.

 

Here's my story.

In June 2009, I got my 1st Studio XPS 1640 with the ATI 3670 GPU. A week later, ATI 4670 is released for SXPS 1640.

I sold my 1st and got the SXPS 1640 with the ATI 4670. This laptop got a mobo replacement after BIOS failed, and same problem again.

I got a brand new SXPS 1645 from Dell. Works and is what I have now.

2 days ago I got another SXPS 1645 for some reason. This is on eBay.

How did you know I had more than 1 SXPS 16?

 

I was told that they started researching into this a few days ago.

 

Yeah, umm, fred - you do know that if Dell sent you a system like that they will be able to come back at you for it?

They might not catch it for a few weeks but that system probably was tagged with an exchange PO. They will charge you the full amount for it and if you don't pay then they will send it to collections (and your credit rating will take a hit).

 

OK I guess I should just ask them to check on the status of that system's service tag? Anything else?

 

Don't you think selling it when they already gave you one is a litte shady?

I guess, if it was me, I would hold onto it for a few months before selling it Make sure you cover yourself before selling it and then Dell coming after you.

That's all.

 

OK, hold on.

I logged into my Dell account, and I saw that my exchange laptop was finally shipped. Turns out that the exchange laptop was the one I am selling, and the current one I am using isn't even under my account on Dell.ca?

 

I think they sent you an extra lappy

I would just hold onto it for a while before you do anything crazy. lol

 

OK lol, how long should I hold onto it for? I am thinking until say Jan. 2, 2010?

 

:::Last post then back on topic:::

I would hold onto it for about 4 weeks.

 

OK that's exactly 4 weeks. Thanks, good heads up!

 

the newest GTA is Cpu hog. i upgraded to i7 820qm from core2duo p8600, and i want every mhz that was advertised to me. i mean, i paid like 350 or something just to go from 720qm to 820qm.

Dell, i'm watching every Megahertz.

 

You will also notice that you won't get the last 266 MHz on quad core 100% CPU load because your mobo's AC socket can't take as much power as necessary.

 

thats it

in an act of self destruction im headed to the apple store

 

C0% not at 95% and 12x multiplier means squat. That means, though the CPU is running at 12x, it is NOT being stressed. Run the test again and check with CPU-Z to see the clock speed. Or run wPrime and compare the numbers; you'll see the CPU is fastest when at 100% C0 state. I think Clock Modulation kicks in and you get the low C0% state, which may or may not be recognized with CPU-Z. Either way, C0% state must be 100%.

C0% state is how hard the CPU is working in reality. Load, like seen in the Task Manager, doesn't portray this.

 

Guys..
I was using a killawatt to monitor the power consumption of the laptop while gaming. I noticed that at idle that I was using about 50W, but as soon as graphics kicked in, the wattage jumped over 95W for a brief moment, then settled around 60W. At this point the CPU frequency was cut to 930 Mhz, and remained there until I minimized the game, then it would climb back up to full speed. Anytime I brought the graphics back in, the CPU would throttle back.

The game would not be turned off during this time, AI was still playing and sound was still going, meaning the only thing not being done was video rendering. These seems to be a power problem, not a CPU heat issue, the GPU pulls too much current and the overall system reacts by cutting the CPU frequency. Switching to battery I get better performance, but the CPU will still throttle some.

Does anyone have the smaller 6 cell battery? Could they run test to see if it is more likely to throttle then the the 9 cell.

 

err, at full load, on four cores, my cpu stay at 1.86ghz, the lowest rated speed for this cpu.

im not sure what you're on about, i was replying to someone who said games werent that cpu intensive.

 

fred u lucky mofo. lol umm i dont think there is a difference between the 2 battery's because the current and voltage are standardized by dell for the laptop. the computer would tell if it is drawing from the A/C or the Battery and if it seems to draw more from the battery i dont think switching batterys will help. maybe you should plug some wires in the wall socket and connect them to the conductors where the battery touches. =) have fun.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=me-BrPwvWFM

^ this fun video ad show this baby playing games for about 3 seconds =)

 

The thing I never understood is HOW this is able to throttle the processor if the power load gets too high. The hardware itself has no mechanism that does this, the processor can throttle itself when it hits thermal limits but thats not what we're seeing.

I know on a desktop machine, if your power supply is insufficient, it doesn't gracefully throttle the CPU down, it crashes hard and your PSU might explode. So what is the mechanism that does this on the laptop? I would assume that, once a power limit is hit, it's too late for the software to do anything to rectify it, unless it's got some huge capacitors.

 

What you need to remember is that laptop power is WAY different than desktop.

For example, in an MXM-type slot the gpu can only draw what the interface will give it. In contrast, a desktop gpu pulls power directly from the PSU.

The 4670 is needing more power but the motherboard isn't giving it enough juice.

Hope that helps explain it.

If there ins't enough power to go around, the mobo has to do something to keep it within it's limits.

 

This is what I'm not really clear on, the mobo does what exactly? The only thing we see is the CPU throttles down. To throttle the CPU I imagine it has some status registers you can set to request a lower clock rate, something the software on the machine would have to do, BIOS or whatever.

 

Once that system tried to draw 95W, it had to do something.

My guess is the entire system slowed down and since the proc can scale easier than the gpu during gaming, it choses the cpu.

 

eblock, it lowers the multiplier to the core.. 7x appears to be the minimum for this system. I can do this on the fly by adjusting CPU registers..

 

oh hey i remembered.. theres a program that will keep your cores overclocked although i wouldnt recommend having it clocked up all the time. i forgot what it was called but it worked for the sxps 1645 on a forum or such. if you permanently overclock the cpu to 21x on all 4 cores (8 virtual) and make the stuff give it juice would that make the mobo draw more power or decrease the GPU to compensate for the lack of power. Either way it seems like we need a new power supply (pref 130w from dell) and a new mobo and a new firmware update for the mobo and bios flashed. Lots of work for dell but if they say "it is resolved" or we'll get right on it who are we to say "NO your not !!! STOP LIEING TO ME :'(.

 

my mobo gives it enough juice, when on battery, or 130W. so it seems that my mobo is fine, i just need a 130W to game.

 

Some are reporting that the 130W PS is not resolving the issue entirely.

So, IMO, Dell needs to revise the entire power situation with the mobo.

 

m15x seems to have its price dropped. config m15x for 2174 matches a 2057 config but the m15x does come with a better cooling system + m260 but lacks the RGBLED so its fair to say dell has lowered the m15x. personally im in it for the rgb led screen so as long as something has the yum yum display im good with that. m15x price doesn't include bluray combo or a 9 cell battery. m15x still seems slightly overpriced. Also, reports that say the m15x has throttling, latitude throttling and other dell laptops "throttling" have been a hot topic for a while. Is it time to ROAR?

 

Well, just spent the greater part of 2 hours with Dell on the phone. First, I get an agent willing to send me a 130W adapter, but as he's filling out the requisition order for me, he puts me on hold and lo, and behold, the call is "dropped".

I call back and get another agent who keeps escalating to his supervisor who keeps telling me, no matter what I say, that they cannot send me 130W adapters, under any circumstance, as it could cause system damage and shutdown.

Can anyone here tell me someone I can contact that will send me the adapter? I'm in Canada (Toronto, specifically). Or something I can say directly that will convince them? I'm getting tired of dealing with their terrible representatives.

 

The throttling seems to be common in i7 systems, but I am not sure about the Envy.

 

Based on what are you making such claim, I asked the same for different HP forums DV8t and Envy reported their results which were ok.
Envy
DV8T

I assume that the other DV series will be the same as they are identical.

Even if it turns out to be valid for i7, how can DELL interpret it for the latitude and XPS 1640 users. And why there isn't a solution for them so far. This was the main reason behind my decision to send it back.
I believe that the problem is simple and does not affect all the people, but if they fail in providing solution for business people who bought Latitudes in November 2008, why would they be able to do it fast now.
Link to their official reply in their forum for the latitude series

 

Interesting, for me I don't even need to run Furmark. With just Prime95 running, I can only hit 12x multipliers with the display brightness on low. If I turn up the brightness it fluctuates between 10 and 11x.

 

Thanks for that. +rep given.

The Envy uses a 150W PS IIRC, so yeah this is def a power issue.

 

Yes and I'm betting we need a new power adapter, a new motherboard, and an updated BIOS. All because of Dell's "cut and paste" engineering and obviously screwed up testing methodology, or lack thereof.

Edit: Are there any other Core i7 Dell laptops with this issue? Such as the Studio 15 or 17?

 

The mobo might be able to handle the increased power with a BIOS update.

We may never find out though. Dell doesn't always fix these issues. Class action, anyone?

 

Well I've talked to Dell reps about it and they say the BIOS update will be available soon. I tried to get a date and the guy guessed around the 15th, who knows. I'm always skeptical about BIOS updates fixing anything, it's going to magically increase the capacitor sizes on your motherboard to deal with 150 watts?

 

No, but the caps, resis, transis, etc may already be acapable of handling a higher load.

The engineers working on this system will be the only ones who'll know if it'll work or not.

 

I'm down for that, if we don't get a fix soon.

 

Envy uses a 120-watt. Then again, it has two hard drives, a Radeon 4830, and 4 DIMMs. That throws the idea that HP gave their i7 systems more power - it's being used elsewhere. I bet this turns out to be purely a problem with BIOS power management.