Dell finally speaks out on the NVIDIA FAULTY GPU bug...

well if it concerns you that much, you can just send it back.... isn't dells policy 20 days total satisfaction guarantee? meaning if find ANYthing you don't like with the notebook, you can send it back.

 

ta-da , gpu-z is correct. (rivatuna).

Could other people please post check their gpu revisions using GPU-z?

 

So, from my attached screenshot you can see that mine is rev A1. According to the hardware ID that windows has enumerated from the device. The device would of been programmed with this information at the point of manufacture. Not something Windows would do when it installs the driver. How does GPU-Z get its info is the big question, is it from look up tables or directly from the device in the same way windows does?

 

Yeah I guess I'll have to. Really puts a downer on getting a new laptop though..

 

Happy now?

Rule #1: dont trust MS
Rule #2: dont trust nvidia

 

So what are we looking for to ensure our video card is not faulty?

 

Test early on by playing a very graphics intensive game while on revision A08 of the bios. Download the World In Conflict game demo or something of the sort and play a game on it for many hours. If the FPS drops considerably in the middle of the game, artifacts, etc. then there is a high chance it is defective. If not, then you can upgrade to A09 for additional cooling, otherwise, send it back to Dell.

The key is to try to notice any problems early on so you are less likely to encounter problems in the future. Remember, the warranty "replacement" that they send you if your GPU does die is a refurbished, meaning it would be the same as if you had purchased your notebook at the Dell outlet for a substantially cheaper price that you originally purchased your notebook for.

 

Would a little bead of thermal paste save the chips from failure? Or is this "packaging" material something else? Screw letting the heat bake it off and make it fail, I would be looking to upgrade the cooling somehow. Anyone?

 

I'm having overheating shutdowns/problems while running WOW even when running it on lowest settings. I have m1530 with A2 revision according to GPU z.

 

I dont think you get the whole problem here. There is NO test.

Its not a overheating problem. Its a defective material within the chip that will fail in the long run due to temperature fluctuations.

Notice how overheating isnt a listed symptom?

Its either working or its failed. Though more heat will contribute to the problem

 

I am convinced that there is indeed a serious problem chipwide, as Asus seems to be affected by this too.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=272527

 

HP knew a year ago... so... Nvidia. Tsk Tsk.

 

Should I be concerned about the 8600M on my 1720? So far it has not had any problems but it has been less than a week since I got it. Using Riva tuner, whenever I check my temperature it rarely goes over 61 degrees celsius. Somehow I don't feel it is correct. Is rivatuner an accurate gpu temperature monitoring program?

 

I have a Vostro 1310 - ordered in April, delivered in June. I ran the HW monitor test and it shows my graphics GPU at around 60 degrees centigrade at idle and up to 97 degrees centigrade when running 3D mark 06 benchmark software - is that about right or should i be concerned?

This screenshot was taken after running the benchmark software while it was cooling down. I had also already upgraded the BIOS to A10 about a week ago, and can't say I've noticed the fan coming on at all.



The spec of the 1310 is:

T9300 CPU
250Gb H/D
NVidia 8400GS 128Mb
DVD writer
4Gb RAM
Vista Business 32bit

Cheers

 

Ouch 78C and you mentioned 97C - I'm no expert, but I think 78C is too high as it is! My 1530 is 65C idle, and 70C after a gaming session. I guess I better get the latest bios tonight.

 

So I sat with one of my German colleagues and we reviewed that heise.de article. Unfortunately I was not able to glean much more information than what we already know; this may have something to do with my lack of electrical knowledge. It seems that because of the inadequate heat transfer capacity, hairline cracks can/will develop in the PCB board or housing (not sure which). I believe this may have something to do with the small "soldering balls" the article refers.

I'm very interested to know which part revision supposedly corrected this, and comparing it with a visual check of my own laptop.

 

He shouldn't be concerned about the 78. My 8600 hovers at 80ish when gaming as well, and has ever since I bought it almost a year ago. The 97, though, is something to be worried about. I've only got to 91 degrees once. Usually my fans only let it go to 88. Depending on the configuration, I'd be more worried about the components around the card then the actual card itself at that temp.

 

My 1420 runs around 61C idle on the video card. That worries me. I'm going to have to play with the heatpipe.

 

mine idles in the upper 60s and reaches 95-97 under load

 

Wait, I also have a G84 A2 revision. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? I still have time to return this but I think it will probably not be a problem because I have a 4 year warranty...

 

I think the Vostro 2510 launch demonstrates Dell's commitment. Even knowing the majority response customers have over a BIOS fix for the GPU issue, they still launched a new Vostro using the 8400M GS card. You would think they would hold off the launch until this issue is resolved.

http://www.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/laptop-vostro-2510?c=us&cs=04&l=en&s=bsd

It is business after all, so I guess the sales factor and customer ignorance factor took over. Keep in mind, those mom and pop type/non technical customers have no idea about this whole mess.

 

Is the Vostro 2510 a Studio 15 in disguise?

 

Its a defect in disguise lol

 

Lionel Menchaca posted a 3rd update to his BLOG post...

This just confirms what I originally thought Dell would do. The BIOS updates could also account for another factor. The possibility exists that new units with one of the affected GPU lines may ship with a GPU that is unaffected and 'fixed' but the BIOS patch is being pushed to cover a 'faulty' GPU if one is installed via routine warranty work (i.e. part replacement). Pure speculation on my part though...

 

The least Dell could do is just give everyone a free extended warranty. It wouldn't cost them anything and it is easier than a recall. None of us likes the feeling of waiting for something to fail. Of course a recall would be better, but at least if we had an extended warranty, we could rest a little easier...

 

Nvidia needs to man up and fix the problem no matter what the cost. If they do not they will lose more customers and future profits.

If it was just a batch of chips that was affected it could be traced. I think it’s all of them and we are sitting on laptops waiting to grenade. Hope I’m mistaken.

As a fix they want to lower performance and blow a fan what a joke. When I ordered this card it was suppose to be ddr3 memory and got burned on that by dell, now they want to feed us another performance hit. I guess I should have sent it back then.

.

 

Ok, lets not make up reasons to blame Nvidia. Fact is, the Inspiron 1720's 8600GT is by default, DDR2, and not DDR3. Dell is not going "lets throw in DDR2 cards into the 1720's now after the announcement." and Nvidia is not going "lets lower down to DDR2 since so many people are complaining about the dye packaging issue".

Inspiron 1720 came with DDR2 8200GT's ever since the beginning.

Feel free to complain about the defect, but don't spread it onto other things that don't apply.

 

Dell advertised the 1720 card as having ddr3 last year when in fact all the cards for the 1720 were ddr2. I am not blaming Nvidia for that.

I am more pissed that I excepted the machine as is with less performance than dell advertised and now with the driver and bios Band-Aid it’s going to be more of a dog and may still fry at any time.

 

I agree.. HP is offering free extended warranty. Dell should definitely do the same. It would make their consumers feel a little more "safe" about their product especially with the gpu problem.

 

has anyone called dell and got a free extended warranty? sure as hell am going to get a answer on this. My GPU has to be defective considering it shoots up to 95C when gaming

 

Tried it just for the sake of trying it... rep told me they cannot extend any warranty, but if the system fails within warranty, they will replace it with a certified refurb. :/

 

Wow.. same with me here in Italy!!!!

And in fact the lady even told me they don't have any options for warranty 'upgrade' as well!!! and if I want I would have to buy a new warranty... Hmmmmm....

 

The way I think of it, its like a car. When you own a car for many years, it wears down, gets old, requires maintenance, more and more maintenance to the point where the costs are better spent on a new notebook.

I don't think paying to extend the warranty is really practical since for one thing, if the GPU is gonna fail, its gonna fail.

Another thing, what you get is a refurb replacement, which means you spent money for your system + extended warranty, when in the beginning you could have just bought the same system from the Dell Outlet.

Another thing, why would you want to pay for an extended warranty, when it is Nvidia's fault and Dell should be using Nvidia's money to cover extended warranties in the first place?

 

I Know, at least for a car, you will get many years of driving pleasure and maintenance cost is expected. But for a laptop, you may not know when it will fail, one day after the warranty is over, despite paying a premium price for it?

Based on the explanation given, its look like it was due to material defect, which is a "across the board problem" and not limited to certain range of GPU! which means, ever if DELL would replace your laptop with a new machine, the new GPU would still be a defective one, unless tomorrow Nvidia would make recall!

Have you ever wondered that the new BIOS other than changing the fan profile, it also "slowing down" the GPU peformance, so that the heat generated by the GPU is lesser? I have upgraded my XPS 1330 with the new BIOS and the graphic performance deteriorated substantially. But I am an Engineer and don;t know how to benchmark this! Anyone out there interested to prove me wrong?

 

And in the UK I'm pretty sure that if a defect is deemed to be down to a design or manufacturing flaw the company is responsible whether the car is still in warranty or not. Dell should treat it like that - they then have the best of both worlds, they only have to replace ones that actually fail rather than a full recall of every machine (which we all know they aint gonna do) and they maintain a decent perception from end users. If anything but the GPU fails out of warranty - tough. If the GPU fails then they replace it.
HP have done it - Dells turn me thinks.

 

Nvidia has fixed the dye issue, question is if Dell is still ridding of the current defective stock. So you can't really tell.

The new bios isn't "slowing down" the GPU performance. Lessening the amount of heat generated is better so the GPU can perform better than it is, because if it increases the amount of heat generated... its more likely to artifact, crash, etc.

Its strange that graphic performance deteriorating substatially after upgrading to the A09 bios. It contradicts a lot of things. Maybe try reinstalling drivers?

How has the graphic performance deteriorated substatially? Do you notice more lag, etc?

 

Well, after the BIOS updates, there was no "substantial" deterioration in graphic performance and in fact not even a bit... *at least* it looks the same to me, haven't notice any difference whatsoever and neither have I come across anyone reporting this either.. this is the first time!!! Hmmmm....

 

The Bios update does nothing to the video card - that would need a vid card Bios update. The Bios update just changes the fan behaviour.

 

There is no such thing as a "Vid Card Bios Update". It does affect the video card because the bios make fans go on that cool down GPU.

 

i have an xps m1530 in the build stage for now... has been in that stage since 21/7/08... and still its taking forever to build it... maybe has something to do with all this? i talked to tech, and they said they realeased the bios update in prevention and optimization of the system but that the issue has been solved and addressed by dell engineers.... so they told that there's no problem and that i have 2 years of warrantly that even covers me internationally... so... lets hope de best... i dont think dell is covering up or ignoring a mess like this.... the thing could just ruin them.... i think there are a lot of card defective, but not ALL of them... it just doesnt make sense that they keep selling this things.... both nvidia and dell has a lot of years of experience in the market and fabrication process, so i dont think they are just gonna mess all this years of work with a mess like this one...

 

Well, in my limited experience with speaking with Dell reps, I'd not be inclined to believe a word they say. Not that they're purposefully dishonest, but that they generally seem ill-informed in the extreme. Some seem inclined to simply tell you what you want to hear, or what they think will get you off the phone the quickest.

That said, I do believe that the entire run of 8xxx chips are affected by the defect. I don't believe it was some isolated batch, or that the materials and process were changed at some point. One article I saw said that nvidia had something like a 1,000,000 chip backstock on these chips. I doubt that they've even been in active production for quite awhile. When nvidia has said that the problem has been addressed, I believe that they mean with later chip models...not with the 8xxx line. When Dells says it's been fixed, they mean the bios update. No one has ever specifically said that the current 8xxx chips are different from the previous ones, and I've got to believe that there's a reason for that.

Of course, the vast majority will probably never fail. A 'higher percentage of failures" might just mean 6% instead of 2%. Who knows?

 

All video cards have their own Bios that sets up the parameters of the card like clock speeds etc. Doesn't matter whether the components are seperate or on the motherboard - it still has a video bios. My video Bios version is 60.84.50.00.01 Many peeps with desktop cards flash the bios to a better cards bios to unlock shaders etc. "Updates" aren't usual but my point was that it would need a video bios update to implement performance changes.

The System Bios update does not affect the performance of the GPU in anyway - just the behaviour of the system fan.

 

There is something called a video card bios update. If there wasnt then all the programs out there that allow you to download it from your video card and change the fan speeds and gpu and memory settings for the video card wouldnt work at all.

 

My bad. Yes, the Video Card does have a bios of its own. The point that I was trying to make was that the BIOS for the CPU upgrade does affect the video card because of the fans that are blowing towards it.

Considering it is a die packaging problem, making a BIOS update for the GPU itself would be impractical as it basically means knocking down the performance a few levels so that the card will not have any problems. How much of a performance decrease is not exact, but you will most definitely not be able to play Call of Duty 4 or whatever games you play at max settings with the 8600GT at max settings anymore should Nvidia decide to do that.

I wish they would call the Video Card BIOS something different that doesn't include the word BIOS in it.

 

The thing that's confusing is - if HP can fix the defect and also give people extended warranties for free, why can't Dell? I guess they are trying to find the cheapest, most half a**ed fix possible by not doing the same.

 

Version: A09 Other Versions

Fixes and Enhancements
Fixes/Enhancements
------------------
1. Update GM965 Graphics VBIOS from 1466 to 1588.
2. Update Intel CPU family name.
3. Added enhancement for thermal control.

I am willing to bet that this update will lower performance. Has anyone run any benchmarks?

 

Sorry I'm asking if you already answered this question but how did HP fix this issue?

 

Well this is just lovely. My 1440's 8400 is idling at 67c according to CPUID Hardware Monitor. Think any Dell techs would notice if I cleaned it off and put Arctic Silver on it? :|

Bleh... I bought this laptop so I'd have at least ONE computer that didn't need tinkering with or worrying about.

 

Wow... the 8400 in my Inspiron only goes into the low 50s under load. I say call tech support.