HeadJack noise problem PINPOINTED! Solution on the way

Wow I'd like to thank you all for finding out the problem. I have done this fix, and the noise is almost completely gone. Instead of the really annoying beeping and twirping sounds, it is this really low background noise that is barely noticeable.

Note that I did exactly what B2TheEYo did except, I didn't tape up the wireless detector, and i just taped the topside of the metal and the area around the screws for the sound card.

I looked at the underside of the circuit board and took a picture. There is definitely a line running through the screw hole area and continuing to another point. Whether this is an intentional ground or not, I have no idea, but it certainly seems suspicious. (I have taken an undergraduate ECE course).

Its funny how I spent over 5 hours with useless Dell Support, having them tell me the same bull**** about disabling my wireless, removing the power supply, and being a windows vista problem.

They even attempted to mail me a replacement motherboard to have me replace myself even though I told them not to (Indian tech support not understanding english). They also sent me a replacement laptop, which had the same problem, and one of the dreaded AUO screens. When I sent it back, they attempted to charge me for it even though I told them it was still broken.

I am never buying again from Dell if I can help it. But I love you guys for sparing me the hassle with dealing with Dell again, or living with a broken laptop.

I think someone else here said it was ironic that you found the problem that Dell's engineers still haven't found out after half a year. I'm starting to think that they probably haven't been trying to fix it.

 

Awesome stuff temp321.

I don't let these things bother me to much, I'll be a repeat customer to Dell, more so if they never go through the screen fiasco again. As far as tech support goes, when I really think about it, I haven't found a customer service/support ran by any company that was impressive. Pretty much all uneducated or ignorant and even at times, simply just don't care to listen; seems to be the 'standard' for those areas of business.

That or I always end up with duds...

onlycurious, now I'm immature? I'd like to see how you handle things when you stay up all night working on a guide and risk frying your laptop and then people tell you that your bad misguidance and have a poor hypothesis of the issue/results. Meanwhile taking into consideration, theres a step by step guide and people saying that had success.. Yup, you're not the least bit insulting/ignorant right now.

If you read my thread and this one, it's explained pretty clearly in a dumbed down fashion so everyone understands. Interference in bottom chassis - goes through screw/audio card = causes the noise. If that's not clear enough then shame - because no ones gonna bother writing up a 6 page documentation on the scientific reasoning why it happen. You got a fix, something Dell can't even give you so be eff'n happy you ungrateful ass.

But you know what, I'm tired of your crap. You've contributed nothing but hate and ignorance to our goal. Then make things personal by insulting my maturity. So, I'm ignoring all your post from here on out, period. End of story. Not worth the effort. I'm gonna take people's advice, move on and ignore your ignorance.

EDIT: oh, another thing, maturity? That's why you were hinting back a few posts that someone with 1 post said it worked? I assume you were getting at one of us made another account and did it? LMFAO, ya k, real mature on you're account. K, I'm done encouraging you anymore, not worth the crap I'll see later.

 

"Risk frying your laptop"? Why is there a "risk" when you have "built, serviced, and maintained notebooks and desktops"? Yes, there is a risk in trying to repair any electrical device, but that shouldn't have been a problem for you, right? Since you know what you are doing. Can you restate your first sentence about the misguidance & hypothesis, it doesn't make any sense. Read my posts, I wasn't insulting anyone and you shot back with hostility.

If you read my posts, which you neglected to read thoroughly because of your temper, you would know that I have been saying your rationale behind your "solution" does not make any sense. It was pretty much an attempt to get a discussion going but you just became hostile.

"You got a fix, something Dell can't even give you so be eff'n happy you ungrateful ass."? - Obviously this is not a fix... reading through the thread it is not working for some people.

Hate and ignorance? Read my posts again. I wasn't hating and I was being logical.

I never said anything about you guys making an account and making that post. YOU gave that idea, which seems very plausible at this moment to be honest. I was rather hinting the lack of credibility of the user.

Oh, and I took a look at YOUR post but decided not to post this in there because I knew you would start flaming. But in your GUIDE about the headjack phone noise, you should mention to everyone that the thermal compound should be reapplied after the heatsink is taken off. If you've been "building, servicing, and maintaining" computers, you should have definitely known that. Trust me, it is RECOMMENDED, call any of the thermal compound manufacturers or any tech.

 

I think that's one of the FEW places where you lost your credibility.

 

While I am sure there is a use for metal rings around screw holes as I have seen them on a lot of PCBs, I have never seen one with a wire (PCB trace) leading in and out of one.

 

Is there a picture available with this visible? I've been wanting to see this...

 

Wow, PLEASE STOP fighting! Band together and get Dell to resolve your issues. I use to have the ability to build/service/repair a laptop or a desktop BUT just because that is so doesn't mean that when I purchase my brand new computer I want to have to service and repair it. My hands get numb now so my activities are limited.

Encouragement is a good thing. As long as it is needed (some people are self motivated and ONCE shown the way trail blaze) and that there are no strings attached. Remember, "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink, so if his thirst is quenched it is because he chose to suck it down"

Puppets are dependent on strings.

 

Wow he's hopeless. Here, I'll go into a detailed explanation since he's have such a damn hard time getting over what he think doesn't make sense and just seeing that IT does WORK. One person said it didn't work out of like 7-8 people, and in that case, that one person likely did something wrong.


Heres you're explination
Look at the last batch of pictures of the 1400/1420's audio card as he holds it. You'll notice the steel rings where the screws go, now look closely, see the copper/steel line etched inside the circuit board along the edges? It runs all along the card, kind of like a outline offset inside a few mm. Now look at the other pictures, The audio jacks are attached to the dame same etched line in the circuit board that touches the screw rings (likely the jacks ground). THAT'S how the interference gets into the audio jacks. Now do you understand?!

The motherboard, modem, WiFi catcher, LCD, they are just a few of the things connected to the same mag-alloy casing. Obviously one of, or all of the components grounding to the same source, is causing the interference. No, I don't know the exact contributor, I don't have the diagnostic tools to tell nor do I have spar parts laying around to swap in and out to study.

Point is, if you close off the ground for the audio card to the mag-alloy casing, the noise is gone. If you open it back up again so it does ground to the mag-alloy, you have noise. Don't believe it if you want, it's been tested a handful of times, with/without tape, and with/without the bottom mag-alloy casing. Same results every time.

If this still doesn't make sense to you, then you are hopeless at learning. OR can't comprehend simple English.


Now that I review this guide, I think tape needs to be applied to the whole underside of the audio card, not just the rings because I don't know if the other parts of the card have any contact. n19htmare is better suited to answer the question since he is the one that fixed the 1400/1420.

But you can keep making it personal and taking cheap shots all you want onlycurious. If I don't have any credibility because I explained the situation to you a number of times, actually, other people have a few times also - then so be it. Frankly, I don't even know why I bothered explaining it 'better' to better suite your standards. But hey I got no credibility, remember, so why you even wasting your time acknowledging my posts?

 

Onlycurious, please stop thread crapping. The point is that this "solution" is a step towards SOMETHING. we didn't GUARANTEE a fix, we merely provided our positive findings. If you don't think it's gonna work and you think it's bologna, DON'T DO IT.
and a few people who were willing to try it, did get reduction in the noise. Others are just not willing to take apart the laptop (not really an easy task). But those willing have tried and they saw some positive results.

this my fourth time asking you to explain why every time I take the tape off and screw in the board I get the noise and every time i put the tape on and screw it in I get no noise? You have yet to offer an explanation on this "phenomenon".



I'm attaching couple of pics of the board... it's clear that the trace that goes all around the board ends up at the rings. these rings serve many purposes, from grounding to strength. My guess is that it's used for grounding....(see the trace on the back side, the ground connection of the 3.5mm jack is on the trace that goes to the ring).
So rather than grounding the card and isolating the sound, it picks up interference from somewhere and just spreads it all around the card.

If this was an easy fix, more people would have tried it... but since it requires a bit of work, people just dont want to do it. the handful of us that did do it, have a 85%+ success rate.
So please, Don't thread crap because I do not want my thread locked.

 

Thank you n19htmare, for posting pictures of what we are talking about and explaining further, what we have been trying to tell him for the past 4 pages.

MOVING ON - now let's improved the fix and solve everything entirely.

There is a small 'tape hiss' like sound, which I believe is normal because I've experiences it on a lot of systems. But one user pointed out it might be from the lack of ground. But the hiss is way better then the standard noise, regardless.

On the 1400/1420, how far is the express card metal housing? I think if we can isolate that housing from the mag-alloy (apply small pieces of tape to the feet that sit on mag-alloy). We can thus ground the audio card to it, and BOO-YA issues is 100% solved.

Theoretically speaking.

Comments?

EDIT: Okay just reviewed pictures, that'd be more easier with the 1520/1500 because the audio card basically sits on top of the express card housing. So maybe we can try grounding the audio card to the heat sink on the 1400/1420? Possibly even to the palm rest's metal (review under keyboard). Or, run a tiny, shielded cable and just ground it to the express card housing.

 

It's possible that grounding the unit to a different spot may fix the problem.

I'll solder on some wires tomorrow to the 3.5mm headjack ground connector and start playing with it when I get home from work later today.
hopefully find a good grounding spot.

It's possible a new ground will lower the noise floor and may even get rid of it.

 

Awesome, I'll rip open my laptop and try the grounding to the express card housing idea.

n19htmare, wouldn't it be awesome if Dell hired us as the go to guys for these stupid small issues.. And we charged a like.. $100 hourly rate.. Mmmnnmm.. think of the systems I'd own with a nearly doubled rate increase to what I doing now... A guy can dream right?

Time to rip my baby apart and test my idea.

 

i called dell coz i dont have the balls to disassemble it. They say they just got the solution for it and they are gonna come to my house and replace my motherboard with the new one with some 'shielding'. Anyway if it doesnt work, i will ask the tech to tape the headphone jack as you guys said. If it works then good for me and the tech. I am from msia btw. The new part is comin this friday. The guy on the phone doesnt sound like an idiot, partly because i went straight to the point and show him this site

 

ROFL, Solution my ass.. They scammed our fix..

Would you be able to take pictures of this 'shielding' or new motherboard compared to the old one, side by side - if it's no trouble?

It'd be a big contribution in my opinion. Keep us posted!

You showed him these threads?.. I bet in the warehouse you could hear all the engineers slapping there foreheads.. lmfao

 

yea i will be defo asking whats the diff between the old and the new if it actually fix the problem. Have to wait till Monday though~

edit : oh yea the guy on the phone said they are gonna replace every inspiron with the new motherboard, dont know if he's ****ting me or not. If thats the case then if i dont call they will probably call me to replace it. Good news for inspiron users, at least in msia for the time being if its true.

 

I followed the instructions at the start of this thread to the word, and took even further measures of my own to add extra layers of insulation. No need to imply I'm just messing around and claiming it does not work because of some amateur error (I'm an electrical engineer by profession, so I'd like to think I'm avoiding silly errors).

Anyway I might give it another go this weekend with the audio module dangling outside the casing to see if it is indeed a problem with the screws, or whether my (noise cancelling) headphones are just uber-sensitive. The reason is that I find the interference disappears completely when my hand is very close to the LCD screen (not necessarily touching).

 

In for grounding locations. Good work guys.

 

It's quiet possible the problem varies if you have newer rev' parts? Give it a shot again and test by removing the mag bottom and such.

Yeah my isolated/noise canceling headphones are super sensitive too, so I could hear the noise terribly before I fixed it.

 

To the OP/b2 guy, thank you guys for trying, by no means am I saying this thread is useless. From the beginning I have been trying to get a discussion going about how this theory seems a bit off. It's even more odd that an electrical engineer cannot solve the issue when following the guide you guys have provided. And about those new pictures about the stuff leading out of the board and going around it, there is no way they would use a conductor to do that, I'm positive it is an insulator as well, hence that should have no effect.

To deadsimple, I had no idea you were an electrical engineer, please give everyone some insight on what you think is the issue. I have taken Circuit Analysis 1 and Circuit Analysis 2 at a university, and that's probably one of the main reasons this doesn't make sense to me. I am not an electrical engineer, I am an intern as a software/computer engineer with a very nice company (EXCITED lol), hope they offer me a job after this.

Anyway, I hope somebody can find a solution to this. If Dell uses the same solution by taping up the metal rings, I apologize to the OP/b2 guy. But like I said, I was trying to get a discussion going. Good luck guys.

And to deadsimple again... something informative about what's going on would be nice. Thanks.

 

Coolio - let us know how it goes. Dell will be busy replacing mobos over the next few weeks if this is the case!

Oh and BTW from your other post, don't expect Dell to call you. Unless it's safety related they won't bother to offer to replace unless you ask.

 

I only mentioned it to convince people I was less likely to make silly mistakes when following the instructions at the start of the thread. I'm not implying I have any sort of deep down understanding of the problem. In fact I've never studied audio interference sources in detail, since my specialisation was not in the area of audio for study and for work (it was actually in communication systems: RF, modulation techniques, etc).

Despite this I might pull out a CRO and multimeter to see if I can learn a thing or two about the problem. A quick search on the net shows this to be a common problem:

Link 1, Link 2

 

We learned about interference when we went over mutual inductance and capacitance. Then we learned about interference again when we were going over op-amps and ac power supplies depending on phase-angles.

These two classes I took is required for electrical engineering majors (at my school anyway). I just remembered learning about them and thought you would have a greater knowledge about it since you are already in the industry. Sorry for assuming...

Who knows, I'll get my notebook soon enough, we'll see if I have the same problem.

 

Oh you (and I) certainly learned the basics of that sort of stuff, but I think an electronics technician (or repairman) would probably be able to do a better job of finding the problem (maybe even at a glance). Seeing as they would have seen dozens if not hundreds of different variations of audio boards and interference problems, something that's more useful than just theory in this situation!

Anyway I'd have no problem playing with my laptop more, if it weren't for the fact that I'm stuffing up the screws permanently. I wonder if they are commonly available from the hardware store ...

 

Why are you jumping on onlycurious's skepticism and insult him for it?
Insulting people is the best way to convince them. Not!
I have skepticism too, and I'd rather be skeptical and have a little bit of wariness and then be wrong. Why? If you guys are right then more power to you.

Better than opening it up and messing it up

 

Good find, but just at a glance I can tell those a AC grounding issues - nothing to do with the notebook itself.


onlycurious, frankly, all I can bluntly say is theres a metal to metal connection between the screw rings to the grounds on the audio jacks, end of story. That easily enough head room interference to travel.

As far as this noise issue. It's solved. Plug the metal connection to the chassis for the audio card and issues is gone (has to be 100% plugged to be successful). s of the moment, I'm tracing what is the contributors to the interference. And on both mine and my girlfriends 1520's. It comes from the touch pad.. Seems to be the palm rest portion of the machine.

If I can get rid of the floor noise, I'd be laughing but all my machines, stereos, theater systems have 'floor noise' so, I'm just gonna live wit it. Can't hear it unless you got like $100+ ultra sensitive isolated ear bud headphones.

Regardless, this stupid homemade hack which has had a higher success rate then anything that Dell has contributed I might add; does the job. Skeptical or not, just review both 14" and 15" guides, I think one out of 10 people didn't have success but theres a huge margin for error and possibles why it failed.

I'm getting access to some uber high-tech tools next week so we might have some interesting results to set it stone why, where and how this interferences is coming to be.. As of the moment the only fix is to follow the guide - or - do documented unsuccessful motherboard exchanges.

 

I'll look forward to your review with your high tech tools. It's not a huge nuisance to me so yeah

But if there's a 100% fix, I'm all for it.

 

Well, 100% fix would be unrealistic considering they have multiple different revision-ed machines out in the world. Our luck, the problem can vary between the revised components.

We'll see the results me and my friend can get. His shop has got all the fancy $100,000's worth of diagnostic tools..

 

Obviously, I'm not asking YOU to do that. IF there is such a thing as slightly things causing the same problem, hopefully someone will be able to fix that. I'm NOT downplaying your efforts and seriously hope you have the solution.

Maybe you should sell your guide to Dell eh? Eh?

 

LMAO..I've considered patenting the fix and selling it--but meh.

Frankly--I just want computers not to have these issues. That way, we can focus on doing some better hacks. Like for example.. Modding the case with LED's and such... LOL

I've turned old routers into computers before so, fun.

 

It worked for me on my Inspiron 1420.

Thanks heaps guys

 

B2 I know this is weird, have you contacted Dell? two pieces of tape could save the company alot of money on part replacements, man hours, ect...

 

I don't know if n19htmare has, but I've thought about it. Even if I wanted to I wouldn't know where to start. Obviously calling technical supports management isn't gonna do the trick.

Advice on how to get the word to them?

Although, Dell hasn't been on my good side recently so I don't know why I would bother to take the effort right now.. LOL

psyllium, Awesome I love hearing success

 

Well now the buzzing is gone... but the audio skipping has gotten FAR worse... heh

 

the audio skipping may be another issue not related to this.....

Does it happen all the time....example when you're playing a game? or only when you are listening to music?

Does it happen only when you use headphone or does it happen even if you use the built-in speakers?

 

Actually, its odd.

When I first boot up the computer and get things rolling, I get skipping on the headphones and speakers, but now that I've listened to about 10 mp3s.... nothing. Weird.

The jack fix is awfully nice. I still get a slight - and i mean SLIGHT - hum, but I can't hear the CPU doing its thing at all.

I did manage to forget to place 2 tiny screws however.... oh well...

And of course my audio just skipped a bit...

 

if it happens on the built in speakers too, then there are other issues.... see if there any driver updates available

 

I had the skipping/pop kinda sound when I played video games. It stopped after a driver reinstall and playing around with settings.

 

I have Vostro 1500, and each time I plug my earphones into it, I'm hearing a weird noise .. I guess this is the same thing what this thread is all about.

Is there any other way to fix it, other than taking it apart? o_o

 

Nope.. lol

Look in my signature, theres a link to the 1500/1520 guide.

If you want, you can have Dell do completely unsuccessful motherboard replacements.

 

From this post you do seem to have some knowledge of electronics, but when you say you took the classes at school, do you mean high-school or college??

Because I am an electronic engineer and have just been doing work on using 3rd Order Low-Pass Butterworth Filters to filter electrical noise from within a circuit, however my work was on using a purely software based solution.

And the concept of this fix is very simple! and it DOES make sense! Those metal rings that the screws touch are there to ground the board to the casing (so it IS connected to the rest of the board, unlike what you think!).

Now when you add insulation between the screws and the matal rings, you prevent the board from touching the case, and therefore prevent electricity from flowing between the two items. If the source of the electrical noise is the case (which it seems to be), then insulating the 2 devices will prevent the electrical noise from being transferred into the audio board, and will fix the problem!

You also mention the "green insulator", the only reason that is there is to prevent solder from sticking to places when they manufacture the PCBs, because the contacts on the board are made by dipping the board into a solder bath, and you only want the certain parts coated in solder, not the whole board! So that "green insulator" has not other real purpose in all honesty!

I have tried to explain this in laymens terms, I hope this helps you understand....

Before you ask me why it hasn't worked for xxx, it might be that they are getting interference from another part of the system or the interference from the case is sufficient enough that simply removing direct contact to it will not suffice and the audio board needs to be properly shielded (electrical noise can travel through air) OR it might just be a dodgey audio board!

The only bad part to doing this is that the audio board is no longer grounded, and if there is a surge within the board, it will simply fry instead of being sent to ground!

 

Bravo H3rmaN!

+rep

On the bad note, I shouldn't expect the card to get surged. Very little power used to run that little thing and power headphones/speakers. About the wattage of a battery. lol (1.5v or so)

If the machine was to get surged, the audio card will the least of you're worries!

Always use a surge protector people regardless.

But bravo man. Well said.

 

The noise on my XPS 1530 is worse when it's plugged into a surge protector LOL. Has anyone tried this solution on an XPS 1530? A tech replaced my motherboard today but it did not fix the problem, in fact it got worse. No tape, etc just a straight motherboard swap. A refurbished motherboard was supplied so I have asked for a replacement laptop, mine is under 2 weeks old dammit!

 

Or a surge by an electrical shock from your finger when you go to plug in your headphones...

 

The card is grounded to the motherboard with 2 GND (ground) cables.. lol



If you're getting noise from your AC adapter, and the AC adapter doesn't have a ground that's you're problem, not the motherboard. And a surge protector shouldn't cause problems. Their designed to stop electrical surges obviously, otherwise it's not difference from plugging it into the wall.

It's possible you're electrical wiring in your house has interference or is as they call it 'dirty power'. If that's the case maybe you should get a special surge protector that filters the garbage out of the electricity.

Either way when the AC is contributing to the problem, it's obviously has nothing to related to this fix/thread.

Try swapping AC adapters.

 

Hello lads,just thought i'd let you know that this problem is vast and worlwide,i couldn't find anyone who had a so called fix or a bone fide answer to the problem..............until i stumbled onto you fellas. I watched the numbers of brave happy people steadily grow and have just completed the process on my 1520.........complete success in an hour and a half (it was my first time !)you boys have found a cure that eludes Dell's finest,so, thanx again and keep up the good work,it is very much appreciated,ciao

 

^ Now that's a success story.. LOL

 

Good to know. I am scared to take apart my computer with 23 months left on the warranty

 

I kinda did. My new 1530 needed a new case since the orig was warped badly. While out, I told the tech about my headphone issues, he was happy to have a go with the tape. Sadly, the 1530 is totally different from these machines. The headphone jack is not a seperate unit, but part of the motherboard. It appears to sit on 2 metal pads which ground it to the case. I did try putting the tape over these pads to prevent grounding. I'm not sure if that's all that's needed (probably not) to prevent it being grounded, but either way, it may no change to my noise. I can try and post a few photos I got in a few days if anyone is interested.

Currently I'm on Dells case for a new laptop and they can keep sending me new ones until it's not there. My brothers HP has ZERO static and interference, and I gather other people have 1530's with no issues.

 

lol Sure, HP doesn't have bad screens or interference in the jacks, but they have crappy warranty services, and the chassis is all plastic and cheaply built.

As for you're 1530 issue, there are more grounds then you can possibly name on a mobo. Usually the top section of the case touches the mobo too, so anything that contacts the mobo will have to be taped. But honestly. I donno if you wanna unground you're motherboard if you're power supply is only 2 prong.

 

It's 3, but I'm not doing this, Dell can fix, sort or I'll return it. Others have 1530's that are ok apparently.