gave back my gigabyte aero 15 what shall i get? dell xps 9560?

as a little NOTE, the top spec MacBook pro 15, is 1100 dollars more expensive than the top spec xps 15, which uses latest gen parts unlike the MBP using last generation parts...fyi

 

Sigh, this is why brand loyalty is dumb. people neglect fundamental design flaws because apparently a slight on their device is a jab at their honour. Eh, @hmscott ?

 

I am not brand loyal at all....As I said, I have many different notebooks including macbooks...You FAIL to realize that it's not a design flaw it is functions as intended...blowing the doors off the MacBook pro in video editing...please try again! I think there is a fanboy of apple in the house since you are complaining against video proof of the MacBook pro getting outpaced by the cheaper better xps.

 

SIGH! what are you 4?

 

So you're trying to tell me that VRM modules running at 120*C is a-okay for them? guess again, that's 5*C under thermal shuttdown for the VRMs. Not the components, the flipping power delivery. That's horrible design. I don't recall a single other laptop which has suffered from this for multiple revisions of the same system.

1050 3DM Graphics score is around 6000 with a TDP of about 50W. Meanwhile, the RP 555 scores 3700 with a TDP of 30W. You see the difference yet? These are 2 different classes of dGPUs and the fact that the R555 performs better in video editing than the 1050 is not hardware but because of software. FCP is a vastly superior suite when compared to ANYTHING on the Windows platform. Hence why even a basic MBP can outperform a mid-high end desktop in video editing/exporting/importing. It's got superior optimization and no amount of fanboying will change that. There is also a reason people buy the MBP for colour accurate work - it's got a delta E of 0.8 compared to the 6x higher values of the XPS. You see, the XPS delta E values are H O R R I B L E for anyone making money with digital art. The colour range is there but the accuracy is not. And if you factor in the expensive calibration hardware needed to bring that down to reasonable levels and even then it's higher than the baseline on the MBPs. Hence why you don't see professionals using the XPS but opting for a better screen in the form of the MBPs or a 10-bit DreamColour display.

 

Trying to insult me won't really get you anywhere.

 

DITTO....you tossed the first stone there buddy! And besides, I don't need to "get anywhere" my points are all valid and proven! OH, there it is...the apple fanboy pulling out apple marketing terms...dreamcolor. I do see more photo professionals and video professionals using both xps and surface devices more than macbooks and imacs now....sorry...try again. and besides, stop running silly useless bench marks trying to see how hot you get your pcs and use them as intended....you will find a much more satisfying experience of doing things instead of seeing if the f$%King temp will rise another degree. Again, XPS = FASTER than MacBook. XPS=Better screen than MacBook although Dell keeps their marketing jibberish to a minimum when discussing their devices unlike Apple and said fanboys of apple who spout retina and dream color and other marketing useless terms from the supreme ruler. I guess I am resistant to the Koolaid.

 

hah wow that all escalated quickly. Never a dull moment at NBR

 

ha ha...some people hate being wrong....he's one of them.

 

I really love how you don't fact check anything. DreamColour is HP's branding of their 10-bit displays typically found on their ZBook workstation line. It has nothing to do with Apple. But that's to be expected when one's goal is not to argue and have a conversation but to engage in pointless trolling.

 

Also - fun fact. Testing on my personal machine, running a game like CS:GO gives me thermals around 80-83*C. Looping Unigine Valley only gets me to 80*C. So your claim that benchmarks result in higher thermals are actually not correct. In fact, even looping 3DM FS still results in thermals under 80*C. So no, ignoring design flaws in a device's cooling is a bad idea. Poor cooling results in premature hardware failure. The power delivery should always be kept under 125*C otherwise the machine will shut down. Hence why it throttles at 120*C, An issue so common that it prompted several laptop outlets to cover it and explain how to solve it via cooling modifications. Yet this blatant fundamental design flaw was not addressed by Dell. And I cannot accept that and, in good faith, recommend this laptop to a person knowing that it is a flawed design. It would be like recommending Razer.

 

You should proabbly sell the macbook and get yourself a XPS. Macbooks are way to overpriced and don't offer that much. You'd probably be better of with a windows based machine. I mean aren't you at least slighlty annoyed that you have to carry a dongle around to even plug in something as basic as a mouse?

Also the MacOS is an annoying OS, I don't know why I have to read dumb sale offers from the stupid store. It's annoying. I even had to drill holes in my macbook plate to get it to cool to a reasonable temperature.

I have a schoolmate who has a Macbook Pro 2015 13", it gets 72c when watching youtube. Those things are designed to die.

 

LOL, too funny.

In response to your GTA video, I have no idea how mine would have handled stock it since I've never played it. I agree that the VRM needs cooled from the factory, however I never had any VRM throttling on my XPS even running prime95 for a full 24 hours. I never really had issues until I undervolted and repasted the cpu/gpu because it was able to run at full speed the whole time while running things like realbench.

My experience with my wife's MBP has been less than spectacular as well however. Speaking of high temps wearing out components faster, her CPU seems to always be up there in temps...

 

I don't know if this is fixed yet, nor do I know if your wife has the model in question, but I heard that all 2017 models with the touchbar are a complete utter bugfest. Any statements on that?

 

Judging by the NBC articles, it appears to be a lot more common on the 6700HQ/7700HQ. Makes sense since they are generally a bit more power-hungry and we know the VRM heat is due to waste from the power they are supplying. As for CPU temps - this is a place where I don't fault the XPS. My reasons - I've not seen a CPU cook itself to death since the early 2000s. The heat threshold intel have at 95*C for throttling and AMD have at 85*C (I think that was on Ryzen at any rate) usually prevents damage and, judging by the NBC article, MBPs should level off in the low 90s (not good by any means but not critical either)

 

Fixed that for you. I believe most issues got ironed out before the 2017 refresh.

 

72*C is nothing. You should also mention that the fan speed remains at idle levels during that workload.

 

Harrumph!, what did I miss?

Oh yeah, Dell / Alienware laptop's suck!!

Was that what you needed from me?

 

Kojack is sooo helpful, especially if you are "4"...

 

Noone can blame you for thinking like that. Dell does have nice notebooks such as the XPS 13, but they have downright catastrophic things like the new Alienware or other XPS models.

 

It's true, it takes a lot of fail to get me to condemn Alienware, to watch carefully anything you buy from vendors Dell and Alienware.

Alienware and Dell have worked hard to attain that status... it's sad, and I welcome their deliverance from failure whenever they start delivering good customer experiences out of the box.

Actually it's only Dell and Alienware that set of the alarm bells whenever I hear someone thinking of buying one - heroically diving between them and the Buy button.

Know your product before you buy it, and you can make a considered purchase.

Otherwise it's a blind roll of the dice, like when buying Alienware.

 

I mean, the AW I can somewhat forgive. They at least tried to rectify the situation by speaking with the community and doing something (smaller pads). If the next generation has redesigned CPU mounting for the cooler, all is forgiven. As for the XPS 15. It's a second generation of them having overly hot power delivery. I don't expect them to survive a torture test with flying colours but at least be able to play GTA V without parts of it touching 120*C. It would have been simple to just add 1mm thickness, use the cooling to cover the power delivery (like my own GL502 has a whole heatpipe over them, /shameless brag). Then I would not have batted an eye but this is not acceptable. If the 3rd gen of the XPS 15 9500 series is the same, I'm going to start classifying the device alongside Razer Blade 14s as overpriced crap.

 

You see now why this thread has been going off the rails for 2 days now?

 

Yes, the XPS 13 is a very good 13" ultrabook. Thankfully it doesn't suffer from the thermal issues plaguing the 15.

 

Please all stop spamming the thread along with off topic or unsupported opinions. I had to delete alot of content, while some relevant was there it was to much of a cluster to edit it all out.

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Dell-...HD-InfinityEdge-Notebook-Review.156462.0.html

So before buying a dell notebook, try to see if Dell fixed everything and if not, what issues still remain and if you can life with it. It's a bit of a hit or miss when it comes to dell. So I think the best thing you can do is inform yourself before buying, maybe on other forums etc.

Overall I like the design and the parts themselves, but it seems Dell struggles a bit when it comes to power management, cooling and such.

 

The way I look at it....Comparing the XPS 15 to the MacBook Pro, the throttle/thermal issues should not even be taken into consideration. The XPS blows the doors off the MacBook Pro while doing video coding. EVEN IF THE XPS is throttling, IT'S STILL FASTER! add in the better screen, touchscreen, more upgrades, etc. NO contest. I have no issue with buying an XPS 15. NONE.

 

If we don't take any throttling issues into consideration, then the MBP is faster since it has the option for a 7820HQ which is objectively faster than the 7700HQ found in the XPS 15. Additionally, the feature-set and optimization of FCP make the MBP a better editing workstation. As evident here where we see that even a dual-core 4th gen ULV i5 can edit video without a hitch in FCP. Nothing such is possible in Adobe.


If the XPS starts throttling then it becomes laughably slow. It also has an objectively lower-end panel in both the 1080p and 4K models. Having touch is not needed on the MBP since you already have a better trackpad. I agree, there is no contest, the XPS 15 is an objectively worse device now that I think about it.


Basically, for anyone looking at video editing and deciding between XPS 15 in Adobe or MBP 15 in FCP - the MBP is about 10 times better. So yeah, I repeat what I said such a long time ago. There is a very good reason for the XPS 15 being cheaper. Several actually.

EDIT: Oh yeah, the 2017 MBP 15 has better battery life than the corresponding XPS 15 models. You may not like it, but it's a fact. Here is the proof. XPS 15 lasts for 7:14 while wi-fi surfing while the MBP lasts for 10:44. That's a near 4-hour advantage for the MBP. I guess it's better than I thought before. Who knew.

EDIT 2: Oh yeah, the XPS 15 uses PWM across all brightness levels so it will cause more fatigue during prolonged use. The MBP only uses it under 200 nits so you are less likely to suffer from eye fatigue or eye strain with the MBP. Yeah, that combined with the ghosting makes me wonder why I've been confused thinking that the XPS 15 had a high-end panel. Eh @hmscott

 

Any laptop that thermal throttles is a waste of space, it's self throttling behavior takes away the full service of the parts you spent good money to get.

I had to stop getting Macintosh laptops years ago because they all thermal throttled on me during work.

Much like this little guy:

Water Cooling the Macbook 2015 - Increased performance or dead Macbook!?


If the Dell is thermal throttling it's CPU under use, it should be avoided.

 

Then the same thing should be said of the MBP...

 

I did say it...re-read the whole post, and watch the video.

Geez, I posted a video showing a MBP thermal throttling, and said I stopped using Mac laptops due to their thermal throttling when doing my work, how much more can I possibly say?

I think thin Mac and Dell laptops that thermal throttle the CPU and GPU under work or use loads, and any other thin laptop that thermal throttles CPU or GPU under normal use are worthless, and need to be returned for a laptop with better cooling - one designed to provide full performance of the parts it's made of by providing full power and cooling.

 

Perhaps Apple will do the smart thing and add the i7 8550U to the new MBP 2018. That way, it won't throttle since we're talking about a 15-18W ULV, not a 45W H-series CPU.

 

Right, you posted the video on the MBP. My whole point with getting involved with this thread and going back and forth with Don was how could one recommend a MBP with known thermal issues when you're not recommending the XPS for thermal issues. The screen and touchpad are user preference and don't fit into the mix as does the OS.

 

I'm not recommending either. I just pointed out that if these two devices are the only options for some unknown reason, the MBP's thermal issues are less severe and it can usually hold clockspeeds around 2.5GHz under heavy load on both CPU and GPU.

 

I'm sure Apple will figure out a way to make it thermal throttle

 

Nah, the current cooler will handle 15 + 30 fine. if it can keep 40 + 30 near base clock.

 

Would you recommend this for video editing / reliability? I'm looking for a machine I don't have to take apart or worry I'll get a broken machine shipped to me. I'll be traveling all year and have no time for that. But I do want it to be competitive in terms of video editing power and color quality. I only do light gaming (top down rpgs Pillars of Eternity style) so I'm not too worried about that aspect.

 

How much are you willing to spend? The first question. Second question, what software do you use to edit your videos? Third question, how comfortable are you with simpler tweaks like undervolting with Intel's XTU tool and tuning GPU voltage by yourself? Fourth question, what kind of colour accuracy do you currently posses and what do you need? Fifth question, how many hours of battery are you expecting?

 

I want to spend between 1500 and 2500.

Adobe Premiere, After Effects, Photoshop

I don't have any idea what undervolting or tuning GPU voltage means, I'm sure I could figure it out, I just don't have prior experience, but as I will be backpacking across another country at the time of using this computer and occasionally without reliable work space, I'd prefer not to have to deal with a lot of post-purchase modification/technical issues.

I currently work on a Macbook Pro Mid 2012, but I only do basic editing. I'm looking to up the quality and intensity of the videos this next year, which is why it's time for an upgrade (plus this thing is losing steam). I don't do a lot of fine color work, so it doesn't need to be the best of the best, but if I do need to do some color correction on a video, I'd like to know I'm getting decent quality.

It would be great if it ran for around 5 hours of actual work. I don't do a lot of battery powered editing right now, so it's hard to say what is reasonable. I'm generally always plugged in, but I won't be as much this next year.

 

Well, a few fair warnings. If you use Final Cut Pro - you're never going to get anywhere near as fast on a Windows device. It's actually not possible. The export times and renders on FCP are so fast due to software optimization. For Adobe - you will see an improvement but I can't say how large.

Undervolting with XTU is quite simple. You dial in a negative offset (since current Intel CPUs are way way overvolted by default causing them to run warm) and stress test. If it's unstable, the machine will crash. Reboot and change the setting to a less aggressive undervolt. Say you start at -50mV. That's fine. You go to -80mV. That crashes. So upon restart you dial it back to -70mV and apply that. It's mostly about taking a day or two to tweak it. It usually reduces thermals by a good 6-7*C. It's definitely recommended as it also somewhat improves battery life since you basically use less power for the same tasks.

5 hours under load in video editing is going to be hard to pull off. If you mean less intense work such word processing, excel number crunching and general productivity. Easily manageable.

Which country are you buying from btw?

 

I won't be using FCP.

Doesn't sound too complicated.

I'm not sure what to expect on battery life. I rarely do long stints off cord. A few hours of streaming video on battery would be nice and maybe a couple hours of actual video editing.

My biggest priority is really just reliability. I don't need the top of the top machine, as long as it's reliable and not likely to cause me constant problems.

I'll probably end up buying from Australia. I'm trying to get the most out of this MBPro, but I have a feeling it'll die during my trip.

 

Mote, get the xps 15. It is an awesome device...don't mind the thermal cowboys here. The thing rips the MacBook pro a new asshole in video editing and encoding.

 

it doesn't beat the MBP in video editing, unless you use the same software on both. Also the thermal problem isn't small at all.

 

It works fine for 30 seconds and then becomes next to useless in order to not melt its own power delivery

 

Thermal cowboys incoming......Exactly YOU USE THE SAME SOFTWARE the dell smokes the MBP....MEANING ITS FASTER.....wow. You guys have problems with reality.

Don....not as useless as the MacBook pro it flew past in speed while doing the conversions...

 

No, not as useless. Worse. As we've already discussed, a MBP running at 2.4GHz is about 3x better than the stock XPS 15 running at 800MHz

 

Anyways....keep playing with your little tests and everything. People actually USEING their xps machines KNOW DIFFERENT than you running silly benchmarks...Like I said, XPS = FASTER than MBP...and other machines. You can claim what you want. The truth is that it's faster. Put two of the devices side by side, running the same software doing the same thing the xps is MUCH FASTER....I know that's hard for you to comprehend since your little benchmarks and desktop racing would make you think otherwise. REAL WORLD USE says something completely different. Thermal Cowboys hi-HO!

 

And I imagine this 14-page thread consisting of real-world users is a bunch of people making up problems for the hell of it?

XPS 15 9550 throttling making the machine unusable.

 

I'll just chime in here that a quick google search shows Macbook pro owners going through the same issues. It's not just my wife's MBP that has issues...

The XPS has issues, but if you don't think the MBP does as well, you're in denial (an no not in Egypt)...

 

I'm not saying it doesn't have issues - I'm arguing with the statement that the thermal issues on the XPS 15 don't affect performance - they clearly do.