*Official* NBR Desktop Overclocker's Lounge [laptop owners welcome, too]

I will have a "build log" of sorts soon. I am documenting everything as I go. Unfortunately, I have hit a wall with this CPU, even with this massive radiator and powerful fans. I wanted to see how far I could take it undelidded but Cinebench crashes on anything 4.9 or higher. Temps spike over 95C.

 

Yeah, you're going to have to use chilled water, AC or something more extreme for CPU benching. It should do OK on things that are not CPU intensive, like 3DMark and Unigine benchmarks, but forget about things like Cinebench or wPrime with normal ambient temps. Ain't going to happen unless you live at the North Pole, leave all the windows open and have it at or below about 45°F (7°C) ambient inside of the house. 7960X is the same way trying to bench higher than 4.9 using only normal ambient temperature cooling. Delid should help a lot though.

 

The interesting thing to me about that is that his RTX 2080ti is only 30% faster than his GTX 1080ti, and that's with the 2080ti at a pretty unachievable 2385Mhz! He also overclocked the snot out of his GTX 1080ti I assume, but his overclock on his GTX 1080ti isn't anymore unusual than what he achieved on his 2080ti? If that's the case then 30% faster is a pretty good indicator of Turing gains over Pascal - it's not very much! And that's in DX12 which favours Turing even more, gains would be less in DX11.

 

Hey gents,

Hope you've all been well. I've mainly been too busy with moving and work/work travel to get any hobby time in at all - may not change for abit . Glad to see all my brothers are well and still doing crazy sh#t.
I go for a quick sabbatical and now things are certainly tasty in CPU land. Can't say the same for GPU's unless I'm missing something about RTX?

Any wins in Laptop land?

This too disappoints me, mainly also due the the astronomical price.

 

Hey bro Tbone. Nice see you back. Only for a short visit? Regarding Laptop land... Not much have changed. Only the Clevo LGA laptops with Prema bios worth to buy. The rest is Tragic. When and if you have the time... Read some of the posts in the link.

 

Thanks bro. Good to be back (yes even if for a short while) - just going to have to lurk like around here like a creep for a little longer Always love some good reading, cheers bro. I might need get back on the laptop scene again to be able to get some proper use, from what I gather MXM is still in shambles too right? Nice 8700k I notice you've got in your trusty P870 - I'm sure that upgrade forced some people eat a little humble pie

 

Yeah, it's pretty stinking sad. I mean, 30% is not a terrible bump, but for the absolutely asinine beyond decency price it is truly poor value. I'll probably end up getting one eventually, but there is not the normal sense of urgency or itch to upgrade like there has been in the past. If the prices were normal, I'd probably even buy two. I really miss SLI, but at the current prices the thought of blowing close to $3000 on a pair of GPUs rises to the same level of stupidity as laptop 1080 prices. Just really idiotic, especially if the primary intent is to play games. And, I think the stupid prices and lousy availability might end up backfiring on the NVIDIOTS. As much as I despise AMD GPUs, part of me wants to just buy two Vega 64 to run in CrossFried and rack up HWBOT points based on hardware rather than nice benchmark scores and save the $1,000 per GPU for another day. It would absolutely suck in comparison, but so does paying $1,000 more per GPU. Probably won't happen because I hate AMD's pathetic GPUs so much, but the temptation to rebel against the nonsense still exists.

And, I am still not drinking the ray tracing Kool-Aid. I might be wrong, but I am calling BS on that and expect it to be just another stupid sales gimmick like DX12 and GameWorks. What's the point in jumping on features that are not currently relevant and only exist to be used as an excuse to financially rape people that can afford the hardware and exclude those that cannot or will not lube up for getting screwed so hard? There is no way in hell that the investment on the Green Goblin's manufacturing side warrants close to a 100% price increase.

Hey stranger! Welcome back. We've missed you, bro. Sadly, there is nothing worthy of interest or money in laptop land. As Brother @Papusan said, only the P870 merits consideration. And, it's overrated in spite of its vast superiority to all the jokebook alternatives. Just get something extra cheap that you can toss into a dumpster when it dies. My only laptop now is an old refurbished HP ZBook 15 that I bought online from Office Depot for $379. Unless or until things change, I've set my cap on laptop prices at $600. Not going to pay more than that for a BGA turdbook or an antique laptop with sockets and slots, and a new maxed out P870TM1 eats way too deep into my desktop hardware budget to even begin to take it seriously. I have no hope or expectation that this situation will improve... ever. The entire concept of high performance laptops is dead to me now. Might as well believe in leprechauns and unicorns. And, BGA gaming notebooks are all emasculated garbage in every price range.

If you feel compelled to waste money on a notebook for gaming, lower the bar, cut your losses and get this piece of crap for $599. At this price, accept it for the lame piece of trash it is rather than spend any more money. Brother @B0B always does an excellent job on his videos.



Personally, I wouldn't consider the $999 version because it's $500 too much for a BGA turdbook. Even the $599 version is too much, but it seems like the absolute best value for anyone willing to stoop low enough to buy a turdbook. Either the $599 or $999 beats the stuffing out of anything the retards at Dell/Alienware, MSI, ASUS, Lenovo, Gigabyte or Acer have to offer in a gaming turdbook. Tongfang is the only vendor offering appropriate low prices for BGA filth and decent build quality. This is what a Razer or Alienware turdbook should be selling for. Maybe Tongfang will put the rest of them out of business.

 

Want pay for dummy modules? What's your pay limits for this? Or just buy One real stick and one dummy? Maybe next will be a dummy GPU so you can show SLI

Corsair Vengeance RGB Pro Light Enhancement Kit are Dummy DDR4 Modules Techpowerup.com
Most gamers probably have only 2 out of 4 DDR4 DIMM slots populated in their rigs, with the vacant memory slots presenting an eyesore for some. Just so you don't have to spend an additional $170+ on a second Vengeance RGB Pro 2-module dual-channel kit to make your memory area look "complete," Corsair has come up with a $40 quick-fix, the Vengeance RGB Pro Light Enhancement Kit. These are dummy modules that look exactly like real Vengeance RGB Pro, and fill up the vacant memory slots on your motherboard.

These "modules" add a grand total of 0 bits to your system memory and are clocked lower than a tuning fork, but draw power from the DIMM slots to drive the RGB LED lighting that can run in sync with your real Vengeance RGB Pro modules. Corsair is using an addressable RGB setup, so motherboard-based software can control or synchronize them with the rest of your lighting. Corsair is offering these 2-pack Light Enhancement Kits in two flavors - black and white. Both variants are priced at $39.99. If you're buying pre-built desktops with Vengeance RGB Pro, insist on finding out if they've used one of these to make a single-channel setup look like dual-channel.

 

Ha, ridiculous!

 

what have we come to people?!?!? @Mr. Fox "recommending" BGA turdbooks and Corsair selling dummy DDR4 modules....wtf

 

And nobly the world goes down the toilet....

Gesendet von meinem ONEPLUS A5010 mit Tapatalk

 

Exciting times ahead! I'm curious where this will lead us....

Gesendet von meinem ONEPLUS A5010 mit Tapatalk

 

No, @Mr. Fox is not recommending a BGA turdbook. He is recommending spending as little as possible for laptops. I still despise BGA. Expensive BGA filth is worthy of rejection, and forever will be. If people are going to buy BGA garbage anyway, might as well suggest going with the least expensive options and do what we can to cause financial harm to the vendors of the expensive and equally pathetic garbage.

Think of it as covert operations or sending in the Trojan horse... AKA, taking the fight to the enemy, or fighting the war behind enemy lines. Destroying your adversary from the inside out. The end game is extermination, not peaceful cohabitation.

 

I agree with you no need to waste more than 1000$ for a BGA. OEMs will throttle the PC anyhow so that much power is simply wasted. Its time to get older Thinkpad or ProBook or Precision for mobility because I'm going for desktop to get full power.

 

Anyone else have their EK Vardar fans die on them? I've gone through five so far in about 8 months and I had one of their DDC pumps crap out on me. EK will/has replaced the bad ones but I wondering if the quality of their products are going downhill. On the other hand, none of my Noctua fans have died and I have some that are three years old.

 

Knock on wood, I haven't had any fan failures (EK or otherwise) so far. Hopefully, EK quality is not in decline, but I think they are overrated/overpriced in general.

 

This is vaguely related to this thread, in as much it's laptop performance related & some laptop owners post performance numbers in this thread (which is fine too). Looks like Alienware have got rid of the infamous tripod CPU cooling, at least on this model, and CPU performance is not too bad ( @Papusan they've been listening to you!): https://www.notebookcheck.net/Alienware-m15-i7-8750H-GTX-1070-Max-Q-Laptop-Review.374921.0.html

CPU performance pretty good with 65W of CPU load translating to mid 80's in temperature when tested with CPU only load, and Witcher 3 stress test is very reliable which is good; however, CPU temps still increase when GPU being used as seen in that Witcher 3 test, and CPU was in 90's with only a 39W load on the CPU - this is because of the cooling pipe bridge between GPU & CPU which enables better CPU temperatures when GPU is not being used, but gains start to evaporate when GPU is in use as CPU receives less cooling from GPU side cooling system with GPU in use. It's one loud notebook too, but at least they got rid of the CPU tripod design, which seems to have helped CPU temperatures & performance, but still compromised.

 

Nope. They just swapped the TRIPOD legs over on the GPU side this time And there is something called cherry picked units. The customers get this

 

Well, I was talking about the CPU and the fact it has 4 screws now, but I did notice that the GPU looks like it has 3 screws only, which I can also see in one your links there too.

 

Smoke and mirrors. Move the tripod to the GPU and hope nobody notices that the problem has migrated to the part that is most likely to fail and necessitate a motherboard replacement.

The winner here is the company. They get to sell more out-of-warranty $1500 motherboards or replacement systems (to those stupid enough to make the same mistake twice) due to the BGA GPU going tits up from being cooked to death.

 

Well nobody likes a tripod on their heatsink!

 

My setup is obnoxiously loud, seemingly impractical and far from budget friendly, but I love it. The MO-RA3 is a great piece of kit and at stock settings, I can comfortably use my rig without any fans. While it isn't for the average (or most high end) PC user, I can recommend it for the XOC'er to add into their cooling arsenal.

Spoiler: Radiator

 

I use 15v Power adapter (full speed) for my 3 EK-Vardar fans in my U3 mod and none have failed. Soon 3 years since I got them.

Awesome

 

Well, that's some serious radiator cooling! You got the fans in a pull config rather than push though, is that better? I would have thought push would be more efficient (but maybe louder, don't know)?

 

That's what I was thinking too!

Gesendet von meinem ONEPLUS A5010 mit Tapatalk

 

Inside a case, you can argue a couple of degrees due to push versus pull. Jayztwocent and many others have debunked push versus pull as having any significant impact on temps. What does have an impact is case fan location. This could turn into a rabbit hole discussion.

Fortunately, this radiator resides outside of a case. Open air, virtually no difference in temperature.

 

You would just about need to mount that gigantic radiator on hinges and use it as a case side panel, LOL. It would take a mighty big case to hold that one internally.

 

You've read my mind.

 

The Mora-3 is a nice setup. Did you get the 420 variant?

Either way, cooling is about what I get with my 3x480s most likely.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

 

Yes, it's the 420 variant.

 

Got an email from them... finally...

 

I love happy endings, in all senses of the phrase.

 

Definitely. I am pleased that they have stepped up to the plate to take care of it.

 

@Mr. Fox PTL Bro!

 

Did you call ASUS through your company or as an individual?
Usually most OEMs use standard Customer service unlike Corporate service which are very good and has less turnaround times.

 

This years gaming PC upgrade is almost done.

Currents specs are
i5 9600k @4.9Ghz
Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Pro Wifi
32GB (4x8GB) TridentZ RGB ram
Intel NVME 256GB x2 in raid-0
Corsair H150i Pro
EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 Ti FTW3 HYBRID
Corsair 460x Crystal case in black
Corsair RM750x

On the back side there are three random 2.5" ssd drives for games. Also I'm still waiting for a Corsair AX860i psu to arrive. Current rm750x goes with the old parts (i7 4790) to another build. SSD are upgraded to 1TB or bigger drives one by one when I either come across some great offers or really run out of space.

It is an RGB hell

Spoiler

 

Earlier this thread consisted of benchmarks exclusively done by Mr. fox,Johnkss and Talon. Now you can join as well.

 

Ha, well RGB Hell looks pretty good! You got GPU AIO as exhaust and CPU AIO as intake it looks like? No room to put CPU AIO on roof of case and use as exhaust too? If I think about it logically I'd try to have all AIO's as exhausts rather than dumping heat into the case, but I guess not all cases have room for that config. Also, some people have all the AIO's as intakes as it gives them better temperatures (I think @Mr. Fox was one). To me I like the logic of dumping all the heat straight out the case, but if I had such AIOs I'd test different configs to find the best thermal solution.

 

I'm sorry to tell you but the 360 rad in the front is an intake

Any suggestions?

So far I've only tortured this with Prime95 and games. Games run much better than before, which kinda was the reason for the upgrade.

 

As an individual. I think maybe it got routed to their corporate team because of the nature of the problem and how I took issue with the first clowns I spoke with that tried to blow me off and tell me it was not covered under warranty. I told them I would post pictures and video, and generate significant negative publicity on YouTube and at HWBOT, ASUS and NBR forums about it. Everyone after that was super nice to me. It may also have nothing to do with that and the first people I spoke to were just stupid.

That looks excellent. I love white lights on black hardware. For my personal taste, that looks better than any other lighting/color combo. It's like, " I'm here to kick ass and take names" compared to other color schemes. Plus, I can never make up my mind when it comes to colors. I like them all too much to pick just one, LOL.

I think having the CPU radiator as the intake is the right idea. If you push warmer air through the radiator, the water is going to end up being warmer. I always preferred pulling cooler air from outside of the case through the radiator best. The only down side is the back (output) side of the fans are less attractive. But, there were so many places to push out the warmer air from inside the case I suspect removing the warmer interior air was much easier with the View 71 case than a typical case with sealed side panels. An exhaust fan probably isn't even necessary on a case with so much ventilation and positive internal pressure.

 

Cinebench R15,Wprime,SuperPi,GeekBench 4 and Firestrike.

 

Perfect. Leave it like that. I think that is exactly the right way to do it.

Yup, those are all good. Cinebench R11.5 is just as good as R15, it just calculates the score differently. 3DMark 11 and 3DMark Vantage, Time Spy and Sky Diver are also excellent. Those stress the CPU more than most Futuremark benchmarks. Fire Strike is primarily a GPU benchmark. 3DMark 11 also pushes the GPU very hard with tessellation and will draw more power from the GPU, especially in test #1, than most benchmarks. It is also harder to get a nice overall score in 3DMark 11 with a weaker CPU because it does not ignore CPU performance to the extent that Fire Strike does. 3DMark 11 and Time Spy are probably the best tests of overall system performance including CPU, GPU and memory. They will also both fail (crash) if your overclock settings (CPU, GPU and memory) are not dialed in correctly. Fire Strike runs will complete much of the time with less than stable overclock settings.

 

I've been working on memory timings and boy, is it time consuming. I'm debating whether I should go with a better set of memory rated at 4000+ or continue working on the timings on the set of 3600 I have. The good news is I'm near Johnksss, only 20 points behind him in the Time Spy Extreme CPU score. @Mr. Fox are you going to be selling the Dark? If so, let me know.

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/5370421/spy/5393822#

 

About the RAM, what frequency and timings are you at now? Certainly in gaming you get most benefits for RAM only being tuned to a certain point (the sweet spot) and beyond that you don't get much gains, around 3200Mhz CL14/CL15 Dual Rank (not referring to Dual Channel) is pretty much the sweet spot, although the Dual Rank thing might not be beneficial for your particular system, but Dual Rank is a thing for Skylake/Kabylake when you've got 2 sticks of RAM in Dual Channel. Now for benchmarking and seeing gains I don't know how much you gain beyond the sweet spot I mentioned, I'd imagine there's still a sweet spot though - and I remember talk in this thread that some benchmarks have an affinity for RAM tuned in different ways: like some benchmarks prefer frequency, others timings, etc.

 

If the RAM sticks you have now are binned really well, they would overclock the same as those rated for 4000. Chances are they are not since they are not rated for 4000, but otherwise I believe there is no difference between two otherwise identical memory chips except for bin quality. Congrats on getting within striking distance of Brother @Johnksss scores with the K|INGP|N 1080 Ti cards.

I am not sure if I will keep the Dark or not. I like the EVGA hardware a lot. This sucker is definitely designed to take some serious abuse and built like a brick house.

I like the ASUS Rampage firmware a WHOLE LOT more. I have no issues with the random '00' Q-code at POST when pushing my overclock to the edge with the EVGA Dark. The EVGA Dark does just as well with CPU overclocking, but not quite as well at RAM overclocking. The lack of fine-tuning capabilities, especially with respect to memory, in the BIOS is probably the EVGA Dark's Achilles heel if I had to identify one thing that makes me miss the Rampage the most. That said, I am still overclocking the RAM without issues. The Rampage firmware is just far superior in almost every way... like pumped up on steroids, caffeine and high on speed all at the same time.

The Rampage also has a lot more hardware features than the EVGA Dark. The ASUS Rampage has tons more fan headers (which I do not need), includes WiFi (which I have no use for), more USB ports and headers, and the Dark has no RGB headers (not even one) and no onboard RGB features (which do nothing for overclocking, obviously). I miss the Rampage's dual DIMM.2 slots (I had to purchase two PCIe M.2 add-in cards for two of my NVMe drives since the Dark only supports two M.2 drives, and only one of the two slots supports 22110 NVMe. The second slot is limited to 2280. This is because the EVGA Dark has no BIOS settings for PCIe slot fine tuning, so the first dual NVMe PCIe M.2 card I purchased had to be returned and replaced with two single M.2 cards as there is no way enable PCIe bifurcation. I am using two PCIe slots for M.2 on the Dark whereas I didn't need to use any of them for this on the ASUS Rampage.

But, the Dark just works extremely well in spite of the missing features. It overclocks pretty much the same as the Rampage. Memory read/write/copy speed tests are a bit faster with the Rampage. And yet, I am also a bit skittish of the ASUS board now because of how it caught on fire and part of me thinks I should keep the Dark as a backup, just in case. ASUS support was a bit sketchy as well. I hate having to resort to threats to get them to pay attention and take ownership of their issues when I have a problem. It will be a month from start to finish before I get my motherboard from ASUS and with EVGA it would have been replaced on a cross-ship or advanced RMA with only a couple of days of downtime.

Tough decision, indeed. I'd love to have the extra cash though, so if I decide to sell it you will have the first crack at it, bro.

 

I think where I am ultimately landing is to keep the EVGA X299 Dark only because I think I can sell the new Rampage VI Apex I get from ASUS for more money, and combine that with what I can get for my record-setting water cooled power-modded EVGA 1080 Ti SC2 to help offset the cost of a liquid cooled 2080 Ti upgrade. But, I am tempted to keep the Rampage VI Apex. I am second-guessing myself about keeping the Rampage because I paid for extra warranty and no-cost advanced RMA exchange service in the event of a failure, so the EVGA X299 Dark is covered for 5 years (1801 days left on the warranty as of today). But, if I change my mind you still have first dibs on the Dark, bro.



Anyone here want my EVGA 1080 Ti SC2 (with the original iCX cooler and Hydro Copper block) before it winds up on eBay? I will even leave the power mod and Strix XOC 1.200V vBIOS in place if it is wanted that way. If so, ping me and I will put it up on NBR Marketplace for you. It still has 684 days (22 months) of warranty left as of today.

 

EVGA X299 Dark just beat my previous best ASUS Rampage VI Apex Cinebench scores...


http://hwbot.org/submission/4012996_

http://hwbot.org/submission/4012995_

 

And, here's some first place scores for Brother @Prema with his 9900K powered Clevo monsterbook... he's on a winning streak, spanking that bad boy and racking up points for the PremaMod Team.
http://hwbot.org/submission/4004603_
http://hwbot.org/submission/4004608_
http://hwbot.org/submission/4005251_
http://hwbot.org/submission/4004594_

 

Ha, that's just another reason to keep the Dark and sell the Rampage then! How come you beat your Rampage score with the Dark, what was different? I know you said RAM overclock was slightly worse on the Dark, so instead you could get a better CPU overclock on the Dark?

 

I guess so. I'm not exactly sure. Must have been a slightly more efficient CPU overclock. Didn't beat it by a whole lot, but every point counts. Maybe it was because my desktop got to rest for 3 weeks while I was traveling on business... it must have gotten lonesome and it was happy to be running wild and free again, LOL.