ATi Mobility HD 6000 series Roadmap

The 470M performs about the same as the 480M, just that it's 75W not 100W.
There are benches in the Clevo thread if you want to take a look.

 

New "Power Containment" function revealed as part of Cayman presentation.


Yfrog Photo : yfrog.com/emfot023j - Shared by simbus82


AMD's new OverDrive Utility should allow users to over/downclock by just setting a TDP and allowing the card to automatically adjust the clocks to reach that power draw.

There is also the potential that this could lead to a form of "TurboBoost" for GPUs that will transfer the power from unused SIMD blocks to increase the clocks of blocks that are being used.


Very exciting stuff since it should mean that we get that 100W AMD mobile card....though we'll probably have to set it to that TDP ourselves.

 

Hm. Interesting. I wonder how long it'll take before NVidia makes something similar (assuming that they're even in a position to do such a thing). Either way, this should really shake things up if it does come to mobile.

 

GTX580 has hardware on it that searches for certain programs and limits the power draw in them.

 

yup but the nvidia version is ment to hide thingto the user not to allow control for the user

 

That's something I'd consider totally different. I mean NVidia basically copying what AMD has, which is probably going to happen eventually at least in the desktop market.

 

I'd almost be willing to bet money, that AMD will disable that functionality on the Mobility line.

 

@Phinagle

I don't think we will see another 100W card.
The fact that Nvidia dropped its 480M and is currently replacing it with the 470M is proof of that.

100W are simply not desirable for laptops, 75W is the way to go and it will probably remain like that for a while. For laptops it's all about performance per watt.

 

75W stock. More than 75W overclocked using AMD's Overdrive.

The utility seems to merge the ATI CCC overclocking tools with AMD OverDrive, which makes sense when you consider that both will be needed for overclocking Fusion APUs.

 

I was thinking that the technology could be used for other means. For instance, they could make only 3 cores for the entire mobile line-up and then use this technology to factory set (possibly by the manufacturer) the TDP of the cards depending on the laptop model and cooling capabilities. In a way, this could lead to the standardization of video cards for laptops and allow them to be sold by third parties.

 

Don't know if I'm late but I see ATI has 6000M Series listed on the Mobility Graphix Site:

AMD Radeon? Graphics for Notebooks

 

I'm back to looking around for a new laptop and I'm sure the 5870m will remain the top performance card for notebooks until roughly the 1st quarter of 2011, will we be seeing a successor to the 5870m sometime around end-Q1 2011?

 

Yes. This entire thread is one big answer.

 

You can now consult the specs for a part of the 6000M series ;

Here for the 6500. My guess is they're basically a rename of the 5600/5700, but the "6500" number is surprizing, because that leaves quite some room for higher GPUs !

 

The 6500M looks like an enhanced 5650M or similar to a 5730M, excempt that it now supports CrossFireX.

So now lower range Mobility cards can be run in a dual configuration.

Interesting.

 

We need some benches and TDP numbers before we can tell if they are a step forward or just a rebrand.

 

Almost assuredly rebrands of HD5400 and HD5600 since Caicos and Turks haven't been launched for desktops yet. As rebrands we could also expect to start seeing these models sooner than the rest, with possible notebooks using them being available for purchase by CES.

Like Botsu said the good news is this should mean new Seymour and Whistler GPUs will have greater than 80 and 400 SPU counts. (I don't expect they're VLIW4 like Cayaman. ) Mob. HD6800 (Granville) should also be a rebrand of Juniper/Broadway which is why I expect good things from Blackcomb.

@Blueneon: The Crossfire support on the HD6500 should come into play when pairing the discrete GPU with Llano's IGP.

 

Mobility 5800 becoming 6800, when it was 5700 in the first place?

Please, no.

Of all the possible rebrands, this one would actually upset me.

 

I know this isn't all that important, but who's happy to see that AMD finally shortened their ridiculously long name by dropping the "Mobility" in favor of an "M" at the end of the model number? It's about time...

Also, I wish there were a way to change my 5650 into a 6550M, since they'd be about the same thing. (Most likely. The fact that HP's dv6t-3000 AMD graphics driver mentions the 6550M strongly supports this, especially now that the specs are out.) Though, the fact that the memory clock is 900MHz would probably be an issue. :/

 

if the board are similar enought a vbios flah could do it

 

Either that, or irreparably damage the card. Not really worth it.

 

They will probably release the new 6000 series along with Sandy Bridges. Sometime, in January!

 

You're probably right. 6500 is a low number.

 

The only mentioned benefit from the 6000 series, thus far, is "eyefinity", which allows you to game on multiple monitors - I doubt any mobility users will care.

AMD Eyefinity Technology

 

I'd love it if it worked for virtual desktops.

 

You're wrong. There are a lot of mentioned improvements.

For mobile there are a number of big things coming.
1. 256 bit GDDR5. Also likely use the FASTEST GDDR5 available possible with highest bandwidth on the market.
2. Most efficient architecture on the market which should have even better overclocking that HD5870M. This new architecture while still 40nm is actually SMALLER than it's predecessor. AMD still managed to die shrink!
3. The improved Anisotropic Filtering algorithm for better quality image. This is a big deal for some, as there were some issues with bilinear/trilinear transition in the HD5xxx series.
4. UVD3, the next generation of video decoding.
5. Improved tessellation.
6. 32 ROPs. up from 16. This will improve help/boost tessellation and overall performance.
7. Between 50-100% increase in GPGPU power, up from 1.2/1.4 teraflops to about 2 teraflops.
8. Possible expect double precision floating point calculation which was not available in HD5870M probably due to not enough power.
9. CrossFire has been improved to about 100% scaling. HD6850/HD6870 mutli-GPU scaling is even better than Nvidia right now. This would be good news for Alienware users.
10. Native 3D Stereoscopic, 3D Gaming support for those who fall for that gimmick.
11. Native HDMI 1.4a for 3D BluRay.
12. You can expect the next gen, improved PowerPlay which will be good news for any laptop user.

And for anyone with HD5xxx and future HD6xxx, AMD announced they will be releasing a new method of video encoding. This new method will be as good if not exceed quality of Nvidia, while remaining as fast as the current method. At least that is what they are attempting, we shall see. Because frankly, x264.exe is much much much much better than both AMD and Nvidia encoding and the ONLY people who believe video encoding is faster on GPU is AMD and Nvidia. If you spend anytime reading doom9, doom10 or spend anytime on IRC where the x264 developers discuss, there is ample evidence to the contrary. x264 will remain on CPU with no plans for GPGPU. x264 quality and compression is just not comparable to AMD or Nvidia's hardware accelerated encoding, it's at an entirely different level.

And for ALL AMD users, expect in 2011, an NEW CATALYST CONTROL CENTER!!! They are changing it from the current completely to something that is easier to use!

 

Honestly, the 6000 series is just a normal step up that each generation is expected to bring. We already have 256-bit GDDR5 cards and if the newest generation highest end card isn't the fastest card available when compared to current offerings, something is obviously wrong.

Each of the other things are updates from the current offering (ie. HDMI version update) and for most users will just be marketing. Every successive generation will claim to have "revolutionary" breakthroughs that make it sound a million times better than the last generation but in the end, another newer generation after this one will be out within a year or less with the exact same claims.

 

256 Bit GDDR5 is not available already for mobile AMD users.

Regardless of how revolutionary the updates may be, these are still not available on the current system. However you want to phrase it and however you want to discount it, they are still updates, they are still improvements and they are still reasons why someone would want to upgrade.

And for the HD6xx it's not just about being more powerful, it is the most efficient on the market. And that is not necessarily always true for next gen, the GTX 480M is a great example of that.

 

While it's not available to AMD currently, the GTX 480M does have 256-bit GDDR5 and while it does consume significant power, this is more of an exception to the rule as it it was designed for fill the niche for the highest end GPU. The GF104 and upcoming GF110 are within the same levels of power consumption as compared to their HD 5xxx and HD 6xxx counterparts. I'm not saying that the HD 6xxx is a bad upgrade, far from it in fact. I'm just trying to say that most users will not appreciate all the benefits listed by AMD that will be used to promote the new line over the old one. If you are in need of a new laptop, I'd always recommend the newest generation GPU, but if you have/get a HD 5xxx series, it would still be sufficient.

 

The question had nothing to do with GTX 480M. Question was about what was new for HD6xxx. And this is about LAPTOPS not desktops. Plain and simple. Which is clearly indicated by the post I quoted...

 

I was just taking your statement in general.

"For mobile there are a number of big things coming.
1. 256 bit GDDR5. Also likely use the FASTEST GDDR5 available possible with highest bandwidth on the market."

You are correct that it is new for AMD but not for the mobile sector. The GTX 480 M already uses 256-bit GDDR5, so again, nothing new to the sector. Bandwidth numbers are pretty useless since they don't reflect true performance, sure they're helpful but only to a point. AMD always touts ridiculously high numbers for bandwidth.

The rest of what I stated is applicable to laptops. The GF104 is used in the GTX 460M and 470M. And the GTX 580M will use the GF110. Desktop models are easily comparable to notebook parts since they are based off the same chips. No need to bold your comments, I know we're talking about the new HD 6xxx series and I'm simply comparing it to the past HD 5xxx series along with it's direct competitors from nVidia.

 

No they're not. The GF104 (GTX 460) consumes almost as much as a Radeon 5870 at stock frequencies, probably more when clocked at 800mhz or so (which is almost becoming standard). The GF110 consumes almost as much as the GF100, which is needless to say a lot more than the 5870, and probably more than a Cayman (6970).

And the GTX 460M is derived from GF106 iirc, not GF104.

 

Well still wrong. The ram Nvidia uses is not the fastest GDDR5 (3.6 gb/s) available which is being used by the HD6xxx (5 gb/s). Memory bandwidth is a combination of both speed and bit. Just like the HD5870M @ 128 bit still has higher memory bandwidth than a GTX 460M @ 192 bit just because of the speed.

And the efficiency of Nvidia cannot compare to AMD. Even the HD5870M is more efficient power per watt than the GF104, GF106 or GF110.

The HD5870M is more powerful than a GTX 460M, yet the GTX 460M is nearly twice the size. And it consumes more power. And there is absolutely no indication that 580M will be based on GF110, GTX 580. Such a high end card is never comparable to notebook parts. A card that consumes 350 watts? That's more power than an entire SLI GTX 480M with desktop i7 Extreme! And reiterate again, this is not a thread about Nvidia... There is a thread right below for the GTX 580 discussion.

 

Hopefully much is improved with the upcoming cards. More and more people are using mobile today, therefore there is a growing demand for above average gpu's.

 

10 - 15% is the most, like every generation.

 

AMD has higher numbers for bandwidth because they have more experience with GDDR5 and their memory controller can reach higher clocks than Fermi's. It's how AMD can get more bandwidth out of a 256-bit bus than Nvidia gets out of a 384-bit bus.

Bandwidth does reflect on performance when it causes a bottleneck, which was a problem with desktop HD5770, and therefore likely would be a problem for a Blackcomb that should reach a similar performance level.

GTX 460M is GF106. GTX 470M is cut-down GF104.

If GTX 580M is cut-down GF110, then Nvidia will again be feeding mobile users bottom-of-the-scrap-pile chips that are less efficient than GF104.

Barts doesn't use the fastest GDDR5 modules available. Cayman does.

 

GTX 580M will not be GF110. A 300+ shader GF104 is all but a guarantee.

 

so are there any laptops due soonish with 6870 or 6850's in them that anyones spotted?

 

Wait for CES in january. And the thing to look forward to is the 6970 as the 6870 will probably end up being a rebrand of the 5870, according to AMD's road map.

 

Heh totally missed this on the AMD spec sheet for the new mobile cards.

Dynamic SG is AMD's version of Optimus.

 

Great news, now combine Sandy Bridge & a decent upper mid-range GPU and I'm in Heaven.

 

Well, this raises two questions:

a.) Does it work with Intel IGPs?
b.) Is there any chance of this functionality being brought to the HD 5000 series as well?

I really hope the answer to both of those is yes, especially if it means I can start using the official AMD drivers...

 

a) Yep, why bother otherwise
b) No idea, that'd be great for sure

 

To make AMD APU + AMD GPU systems more attractive, of course.

 

a) There's no reason why it couldn't be made to work with Intel's IGP. The tech behind it isn't all that complicated.

b) Depends on how AMD implemented it. From a post by Dave Baumann on the B3D forums it sounds like the improvements on these rebrands aren't much more than a VBIOS flash, in which case it might be possible to upgrade your old Mob. HD5000 cards to the new series.

 

The risk involved in VBIOS flashing would not be worth it, at least to me. :/ I just won't get my hopes up.

 

As long as you can blind flash back... it's all good.

 

That'd be why AMD is rebranding instead of offering existing owners the upgrade path.

 

Radeon HD 6900 series struggling to stay in 2010 for launch - www.nordichardware.com

Wonder how this translates to the mobile sector.

 

Well, since Cayman won't be used in notebooks, hopefully there won't be much of an effect. It is worrisome, though.