Brace yourself: NEW MAXWELL CARDS INCOMING!

GT72 certainly got some feature I want if I go 17".

- Mechanical keyboard. I miss Steelseries keyboard over this mushy Alienware 18 keyboard.
- Excellent sound system, now with 3 amplifiers. The speakers got a 15W amplifier lol. Headphone jack also got amplifier.
- Probably the best cooling system out there (?). Its the only system Ive seen that can get that 880M down to mid 70s while still being pretty quiet. GT70 had an enormous fan. GT72 got two of them. Maybe Asus is there with them, verdict is still in the air because NBC havent reviewed it yet.

 

Cheers n=1, I read your advice a little late. I ran ComboFix thinking it would give me some options to check in terms of what I wanted cleaned and/or removed. Running ComboFix didn't give me any options though - it just ran it's script & proceeded to delete stuff all on it's own! Killer Net Manager for my Wireless card doesn't start up automatically now on system start up. Haven't noticed any other problems, but it didn't fix the Java Update pop up. In fact, as I suspected, I've confirmed the 'attack' is enclosed within the ads on this website. I know this because I installed Adblocker for Google Chrome, and I'm not getting that Java Update pop up anymore. My system is not infected - this website is, and other websites too it seems from my googling - mostly forums! So, if anyone else is having this problem, just install an AdBlocker until the problem is fixed. (I don't like running an AdBlocker though, because the whole internet is funded by advertisments, and I don't want to deny them that.)

 

I'm running the vB4 Default Style skin instead of the New NBR Style so I don't see the ads, not to mention it makes browsing the forum much smoother without all the Flash videos constantly playing and not only annoying the hell out of me, but causing CPU/GPU load so my fans spin up and freezing/crashing Pepper Flash in Chrome more often than not. The default design of this site is simply awful. And you're absolutely right, a lot of websites seem to have been infected lately with these malware-infested ads. One example would be DSOGaming. My AV goes absolutely nuts when I browse there due to all the fake Java pop-up tabs and downloads it keeps initiating. I'll stay away from these infected sites for now since I literally can't browse 30 seconds before getting redirected.

 

You *DO* realize that the HWMonitor picture in that thread was after a single 3DMark 11 run on max fans, right?

If that's the benchmark we're going for, my SLI machine is cooler by a long shot.

Spoiler

Even on auto fans, its still great

Spoiler

I don't see why this is so hard to understand. MSI's fans are nothing special, they look like the fans that Delta manufactures which Dell and Clevo both use in various models.

Everyone buys into the fan hype when everyone gets their fans from Delta, AVC, T&T, etc. OEM fans are OEM fans, there is absolutely nothing special about them. Its all a marketing gimmick.

Again, under load for an extended period, things will change very quickly.

 

The biggest joke is the MSI GT72's purported "mechanical" keyboard. :laugh:

 

Sorry about that , I personally never had a issue with combofix , did you try to reinstalling the driver and software for killer card ?

 

The biggest joke to me is the extortionate pricing.

 

I think the biggest reason for the price is that they want to get rid of the GT70s

 

I think they're just trying to capitalize on the quad SSDs and the 24/32GB of RAM. I can't blame them for that but its just shameful for them to advertise their cooling system as something special when its the same damn fans everyone else uses. All they did was add a second one. We've hit the most we can expect from the fans, thermal paste, and heat pipes. The biggest gains to be made are up to AMD, nVidia, and Intel to figure out with their die shrinks and "efficiency".

 

Lol never underestimate aerodynamics , also who knows the "next next" gen laptops might have liquid cooling

 

Liquid cooling would reverse the portable trend that seems to be coming back.

I wouldn't object to liquid cooling as long as the radiator wasn't loud - my H100i irritates me with its random clicking/grinding noises it will start making out of nowhere which is why I hardly use my desktop.

 

They could try to fit it in my using radiator across long instead of the part with the most cross sectional area would be interesting to see how it is, also liquid means you wouldn't be able to take it on the plane except in luggage (-_-) TSA

 

LOL maybe I'm just dumb, but you mean thermodynamics not aerodynamics, right?

 

Well, GT72 has unique pipe design. 2 CPU pipes go to left fan and 1 to the right fan. MSI always experimented with pipe combinations like CoolerBoost 2.0 which actually is a pipe bridge between GPU and CPU. As to fans, yeah. They are average.

 

If I go to Notebookcheck`s review of P377SM and use their sound measurements just running a 8970M which should output less heat than GTX 880M, and apply the temperatures you got:

Turbo fan on GT72:
44dB- 68C

Turbo fan on P377SM:
54dB - 66C

Autofan GT72:
Below 30dB - 78C

Autofan P377SM-A
47dB - 73C

Massive difference. This is the best case scenario for your machine. The cooling fans will probably be more noisy on your machine because the 880M runs hotter.
Clevo machines are notorious for high fan noise. I`d pick GT72 anyday of the week. Or Alienware. Or Asus.

I agree that gaming will be different, but I`d wager that they will show about the same difference there as well.

 

Well its both but they intertwine allot but increasing the flow would depend on aerodynamic properties of the fan and also on any backflow in heat transfer tubes section lol a lot of complexity.

I don't get clevo since upgradablity might not be an option

 

GT70 had only one fan but it could move 25CFM. Other brands are usually around 10-15CFM which is why MSI only used to stick to 1 fan.

But two of those fans, no wonder the GT72 runs pretty cool and quiet at the same time. I think Asus G-series could only give it competition here, since they use two massive fans as well. Like super massive

You mean the bios support? Yeah its a bit tricky. They got Prema to help them though. But I can understand its not very nice if they have to rely on a third party

 

Where are you getting the decibel reading from? Because the videos I've seen show the MSI pushing the EXACT SAME decibel reading at the back of the machine where I tested mine with max fans. Gentech and XOTIC both have readings in their videos and the MSI is way over 44dB, more like 58-60!

Fans have the same temperature curve no matter the graphics card in the P377SM-A so the fans run at the same speeds at the same temperatures.

I'm not debating that on auto, the MSI is quieter. On turbo though, they're both obnoxiously loud. MSI just has its fan profiles to prefer silence over cooling performance.

Its also impossible to get a reading on the GPU fan in this machine because the CPU fan screeches up a storm whenever a load of any kind is placed on it. The CPU fan is ridiculous. :|

 

Im getting my decibel data from Gentech`s GT72 video where they put the decibel measurement meter 15cm away from the notebook. Notebookcheck does the same with P377SM, thats why I mentioned them.
Nobody is crouching behind the notebook near the fan vents and putting their ear next to them dude. Not sure why you are even bringing that up

GTX 880M might be louder because NBC review shows 47dB during simple 3D benchies while it shoots up to 54dB on full speed during artificial stress test. So obviously there are more steps beyond benchmarks which the 880M might hit which the 8970M doesnt if you have the fan on auto. That was my point.

Clevo builds great machines too, no doubt about it. But I do not care for their cooling system. Im happy with my AW18 machine, it doesnt get loud or hot (but I`m just rocking weak 770Ms anyway)
But enough of this discussion. This is a Maxwell thread.

 

Fans on max right over the keyboard: 54dB, 6 inches away from the keyboard: 48dB

And you're the one who derailed the thread in the first place, you don't get to dictate who jumps on and continues the off-topic derail just because you don't like what people have to say.

I'm kind of surprised by the sound results though. I'll admit I thought it would surely be higher because the Clevo fans have a nasty high pitched whine to them. I'm not a fan of the fan noise of this machine either but MSI and Alienware aren't just magically superior. I'll drop it now.

As for Maxwell, still waiting... -_-

 

Who's on top? 880M is a joke. And after the failure of my slave and having to have one replacement already I'm not really too interested in flashing the modded vbios and having even more heat to deal with.

I want the 980M to be everything everyone hopes it will be and for Prema to make a modded bios to support it so I can dump these cards.

Hell I'm so irritated that I'm considering AMD for my next card and I hate AMD.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 on Tapatalk

 

You should have known that 880M was squeezing out whatever little was left of the Kepler jar. It doesnt take a genious to understand that Nvidia is playing on a fine line with that card. Not defending Nvidia though since customers shouldnt have to suffer, but its business as usual for them milking whatever is possible. Funny how long it takes to get their fix out that they said they may have found.

Many are considering M295X, me included. With perhaps excellent scaling over SLI, it will be even more tempting.
So thats the worst case scenario if 980M wouldnt come in October. But it will. If M295X ends up way ahead of 880M, I might jump ship anyway. Especially with the current price.
Alienware charge $275 more per 880M over M290X. Not exactly cheap.

 

Considering that when I got this machine I hadn't been keeping up on the tech at all, I had no idea the 880M was such a dud until after I ordered it. I was one of the first with the 880M SLI machines and I wasn't expecting to have the money for a new machine when it happened. I got screwed. Had I ordered the 9570, I'd have had 780M cards and been totally satisfied with them but all the other machines were 880M in May.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 on Tapatalk

 

It's got nothing to do with your Internet connection unless you're on dial-up or really slow DSL. The lag is due to New NBR Style loading up all these video ads and other Flash elements, which pegs the CPU and even spins up the fans audibly for me. The intermittent background audio also drives me absolutely bonkers.

It's a good idea to be using AdBlock or the default vB4 style ATM anyway as some of the ads embedded here have been compromised with malware that's been making the rounds recently: http://forum.notebookreview.com/sit...ents/759716-psa-malware-infested-ads-nbr.html

More OT: Comcast stinks, but it's not like we have much choice in the Bay Area. Where I live, Comcast is the lesser of two evils, the other choice being AT&T DSL, which is slow and unreliable. Internet infrastructure in the Bay, or indeed in the entire US, still leaves much to be desired. Can't wait for Google Fiber.

 

Cleared out a few pages of off topic posts. Nothing too bad. I would not have a problem with a few off topic posts, particularly in a waiting thread like this, as long as it doesn't deteriorate into complete nonsensical "let's see how crazy we can get here".

I DID leave octiceps' latest post because it contains an important warning about that Malware ad. Admin is working on it, but we don't have anything to report yet. Please click the link in octiceps' post and discuss it in the thread he created.

Now please carry on about Maxwell

 

no it really doesn't, the 5 heat pipe setup has been there for years in workstations and so does the pipe bridge. the main point of the bridge to make CPU utilize both fans, which helps to reduce noise levels under normal usage. gt 72 really is just msi's attempt to catch up last year's cooling standard, it's nothing unexpected.

the problem with cooling nowaday is that as intel and nvidia are shrinking down TDP and power, it will become more and more of an overkill for all these massive cooling setup.

take a look at g750jz's cooling for example, the fans are thickers than a quarter. while it makes sense since haswell is so hot, for broadwell I would say even the MX series can be handled very easily, not to mention maxwell is also shrinking the heat down

 

Thanks Dannemand for cleaning up the thread.

I have no problem with some off topic posts either, especially in threads like this where leaks are far apart and few. But its a difference between a couple of them every now and then and 3-4 pages filled with CPU discussions The thread kinda lose its purpose then.

 

I think the words 'cooling' and 'overkill' in laptops are a rare combination - if anything laptops need better cooling systems, not worse - Intel & Maxwell will just design the chips to fit inside existing cooling systems (to utilise their full potential).

 

Spoiler

if you look at g750jz's cooling setup and compare that to its specs, I think you'll get the definition of overkill when you put that with maxwell and broadwell. that said, if maxwell and broadwell can run as cool as they are claimed to be, there indeed will be some overkills in cooling

 

Having some headroom in the cooling system is a good thing anyway, allows for a certain amount of dust collection, people don't always clean out the dust from their laptops very often (or at all in some cases). Also good for overclocking too! I like those beefy cooling systems as long as it doesn't compromise the design or function of the laptop. (Looks like a good combo for modified vBIOS and Maxwell overclocking!)

 

what I'm saying, yes for OCers it's fantasic, with an unlocked BIOS we can literally do w.e. the hell we want. but for the other 80% who doesn't even know what OC is, these are a bit of an overkill especially if you consider the size/form factor. take razer for example. if the 980m can be about as hot as the 870m, then that means we potentially could get a flagship performance in the size of an ultrabook. it all comes down to size and weight

 

I wonder what Maxwell chip the Alienware Alpha got. Its releasing in November and features a "custom made" Maxwell.

GM204? Is that why they are waiting and refuse to give out specs? For $550 I highly doubt it though. Unless its a GTX 860.

 

I thought it was just a custom superclocked 750ti

 

If the 980M is a 100W TDP chip then the end result will be the same. More efficient just means they can squeeze out more performance in the same TDP envelope, but if they choose to keep the same TDP then the heat output will be identical. 860M vs 765M is a perfect example of this -- more performance, same (or slightly more) heat for 860M.

Also, the slave GPU fan in the Clevo SLI laptops is probably 1.5 quarters thick.

 

Me too but nobody really knows. GM107 makes most sense regarding the price, but why wait til November until it ships?

I`m actually very interested in the GTX 970M. Might be ideal if I want to keep the heat down to 770M level. But there is one thing I didnt do with 680M which I regret, is to downvolt the 680M and see what heat reduction I would have ended up with. Might be interesting to go that route with 980M

 

Downvolted 680m was actually pretty good. Mine ran upwards of 80C max even with furmark unlocked when downvolted and on stock cooling fan profile, no turbo fan. I was a bit alarmed at how hot 780m got compared to that, but since it runs at higher voltage and clocks it is understandable hahaha.

I just wish 980m could come out now, I want to see the performance increase. GT72 is so tempting with 980m....

 

I can't imagine paying $3000+ for a gaming laptop with a soldered CPU though, that's just such a terrible decison on MSI's part.

 

Everything non upgradeable seems like a bad decision at the time. While it sucks it is non upgradeable, I honestly don't have a problem with it because at least it is a capable CPU. If it were a low end core i3 maybe I would scratch my head until it bled.

 

Ahem, Razer, ahem.

 

But they have an excuse 'cause their laptops are literally half the thickness and weight.

 

Different market segment though, catering to the "thin and light" crowd.

The GT72 is supposed to compete with other 17.3" single GPU laptops. I suppose MSI could point to G750 and say it's even worse, but why focus on the lowest denominator? I thought Alienware was overpriced until I came across the G750. I once priced out an equally spec'd Clevo laptop and the G750 cost $500 more!

 

Thats amazing man.
How hot would 680M run while using normal voltage in Furmark? I assume the 680M had no throttling and such while downvolted?
I`m so gonna experiment with that when I get my new notebook. Can`t see why not. But Im thinking it takes quite a bit of work to monitor different applications just to be sure it isnt having problems on that voltage.

Also interested in downvolting the CPU as well, but I have no experience with that. Cant be that hard right?
GT72 absolutely got my attention for 980M for sure. Especially how I see it handle the 880M.

 

Stock 680m would reach throttling temps within half a minute lol But I think I tested it with 850mhz core clock. Stock 680m as it came had a failsafe lock so furmark ran as hot as 68 C but it was core clock limited.

Downvolting CPU is not hard with Intel XTU, the hard part is figuring out what to downvolt and for how much. The good thing is that these CPUs can handle overclock and downvolt, so you get an extra 200mhz+ and lower temps! I downvolted dynamic CPU voltage offset to -50mv and Processor Cache Voltage Offset to -50mv. You can check with -5mv increments and test stability.

 

Just because everyone has gone off-topic:
How does undervolting affect performance?? Is there a decrease in performance or the voltage is just there to power the chip few mV up downs don't matter.
I am new to these things and went through the undervolting and overclocking stuff to control heat and hence throttling in the Ghost pro.That was my first time understanding these things.
So is it just that we undervolt chips to lower the temps and sacrifice a bit of performance to avoid throttling and avoid that almost half the MHz auto-switching in order to get smooth performance? or did I miss something whilst understanding these stuff.

 

It depends on the chip. MX and XM benefit more from undervolting than the others because they are designed to use as much power as you can give them so they'll increase their clocks as long as they are within their TDP limits. On my 4940MX, undervolting by -85 actually gave me a 200MHz increase on all four cores without having to increase the TDP. Temperatures stayed the same.

 

MQ chips do the same thing when undervolted -- you will also see a speed increase because it's not hitting the TDP wall that it used to with default voltage. The difference is MX chips will aggresively turbo until they they hit the TDP wall again with the new, lower voltage, so while speeds increase temps also stay the same.

MQ chips turbo until their predefined limits, so there's a net reduction in heat outpt (-80mV roughly translate to 5-8W), hence lower temps.

I was thinking the same thing, the 970M will be a very interesting card. It should have about 20% more performance than 780M but run much cooler (75W card?), and cost less too. Might be an option for those who don't mind sacrificing some performance for much better thermals.

 

980m yet? waited 3 years for the upgrade.. waiting half year more lol

 

Slightly off topic... But are there any plans for all in ones to include any of these new GPUs?

I'm in the market for a new laptop... But I really want something with a high res screen. But I don't have the space for a desktop or even small desktop with cables everywhere...

 

I don't know of any all-in-one PC's with higher than 1080p let alone a dedicated GPU. iMac is the only one that I'm aware of.

 

Bro don't know about new gpus but you can currently get 860m, 870m and 880m versions of MSI all in one pcs....
All of them come with Full HD glossy/matte displays.... So I reckon they gonna release newer versions with the 900m series in the future....