Brace yourself: NEW MAXWELL CARDS INCOMING!

The desktop and mobile audience are separate beasts with the exception of a few of us. Don't think there was ever a fear that mobile is or has a potential to cannibalize market share from desktop audience. You've got either your dedicated mobile users or your desktop users. They would have to do something pretty drastic both cost/performance wise to cause a shift in audience.

Edit: Bah, Cloud and Robbo you beat me to it.

 

980M is supposedly coming a month before the desktop 880, nVidia loses all desktop card sales for the month of October and most of November because they can't keep up with demand... Sounds like a dumb move to me. I know I certainly would not buy a desktop card if there is a mobile chip that is close to the top tier desktop offering, I would hold off until the new desktop part landed.

Either way, I'm not buying the performance rumors anyway but I definitely don't buy that nVidia would be stupid enough to release the mobile part first. The only way they would do that is if Tonga proves to be enough competition to warrant it which isn't likely either.

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No they are all launching in the same month Ethrem, in October. All of them using GM204, second generation Maxwell. It will probably be a big announcement coming, with both GTX 800 GPUs and 900M GPUs listed at Geforce.com.
Nvidia to release three GeForce GTX 800 graphics cards this October | KitGuru
http://videocardz.com/51098/nvidia-release-geforce-980m-based-maxwell-gm204-october

Remember the benchmark posted many pages ago, where the GTX 880 scored 30% more than GTX 780 Ti? I dont think a mobile GTX 980M performing more or less like a GTX 780 will change their minds
We have two non confirmed benchmarks, one from GTX 880 and one from GTX 980M. I think its wise to be sceptical about them.

I atleast think the GTX 980M one seems very plausible. Will see if I can find more in the coming month

 

I wish the rumors would all at least agree with each other... That's why I don't follow rumors.
If nVidia releases the 980M with such a big performance boost, I guess they will get me on the hook for two plus an 880 for the desktop.

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Just guessing that will run ya close to $2,000... you must have a nice wallet.

 

Temporarily. It's money I have to spend by December so these releases will be timely if they pan out.

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But 860M Maxwell is clocked much higher (1029 core/5000 vram) than the 765M (850 core/4000 vram). Clock for clock it would be maybe around 25-30% more efficient. We should get someone with an 860M Maxwell to run 3DMark11 at 765M speeds, that would give us a pretty good idea of how much more efficient Maxwell is.

So the way I see it is, if 980M really wants to have 2x 780M performance, then it will pretty much have to be superclocked, and will once again be pushing the limits of Maxwell silicon. Even with Maxwell's efficiency it will run like a hot potato.

 

Same clocks is probably not best comparison. Same TDP and/or power draw is a better comparison. In any case here's a few quick benches, will do more later:

GPU @ 850 / vRAM @ 4000
860m (Power) / 765m (Power)

3DMark 11 P: 4262 (79) / 4354 (103) = -2% (-23%)
3DMark 11 P Graphics: 3927 / 4143

3DMark Fire Strike: 3024 (82) / 2353 (116) = +28% (-29%)
3DMark Fire Strike Graphics: 3187 / 2499


1080P
Bioshock (ultra no DDOF): 44 (89) / 28 (119) = +57% (-25%)

Tomb Raider (Ultra): 63 (99) / 32 (107) = +100% (-8%)

Sleeping Dogs (Extreme): 17 (90) / 14 (106) = +21% (-15%)

edit: added 3DMark Fire Strike. Just odd how 3DMark11 performs worse at 720p with 860m, but 1080p is significantly better. Then again, 3Dmark11 was 720p, and the games were 1080p. Results vary wildly though just with those few benchmarks. I'll double check settings because vs stock 860m Bioshock was 45fps, Tomb Raider 47fps, Sleeping Dogs 22 fps.

I'll try to do a full comparison compared with the 765m results here: http://forum.notebookreview.com/sag...r-np7330-clevo-w230st-review.html#post9296919

 

And most people will choose the desktop, because dollar for dollar the mobile machine will cost as much as an SLI desktop configuration.

 

I've had a feeling that Maxwell had a shot at getting close to GTX 780, but this sort of brought me to another question.

Q: Can mobile CPUs [non-MX] really handle two of these cards?

It would seem to me that they wouldn't do well, especially in the long run.


As for me, I think I'm set for a 4810MQ/980m/16GB. Something approaching the power of a desktop GTX 780 should last me another 4 years, considering all the console ports ..maybe the life of the PS4/XB1 [...2020?].

I'd love to wait for the die-shrinks, but sensing what I'd get from what is coming up, I don't think I have to.

 

I would wait for confirmed info at this point tbh, which should be soon if an October release is true.

 

Everything has to come into the light at some point , be it 2 month or 6 months. But let it be known , once the light is upon it , we shall bask in its brilliance or be witness to its utter demise

 

Well in the meantime Iam side stepping to a 680m I am done waiting (doesn't cost me a penny ) by the time it can't play 1080p I will ready for a new laptop...

 

Yeah with all the console ports, we will see a stagnation of graphics innovation. It honestly wouldn't surprise me to see Microsoft and Sony launch a new console in 2016 to make up for the epic failure that the current ones are.

Who knows, maybe we will see the console start to die off and move back to PC gaming. There are very few benefits of a console over a real computer with the way things stand now. It wasn't like that previously.

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Just don't buy an Alienware from the Japanese store.. have you seen those prices?

 

That's good, 680M will give you a nice boost over your 7970M, especially if you flash the TechInferno vBIOS & overvolt & overclock (assuming you have the cooling capacity in that M15x). You'll end up with greater than 780M/880M stock performance if things go well.

 

That would be a tough sell. Less than three years for a console would be a death sentence. Only way it would work is if it had 100% backwards compatibility and/or offer current owners a cheap upgrade to the new console. But if they keep using standard PC parts they may be able to get away with a new release every 3 years and maintain backwards compatibility.

If the Steam Box takes hold, then we may see PC desktops make a surge though. Since Steam Box is Linux but it can stream PC games, then users can use whatever hardware they see fit, and stream their Windows games.

 

Slv7 already flashed by prior user

 

That's not gonna happen. PS4 is doing well and the XB1 is doing better since dropping Kinnect. They're both here to stay.

I for one don't mind consoles holding back PC a bit, it makes PC gaming more cost effective.

 

I do feel PS and XBx are here to stay, for now. Until Steam (or other new ventures yet to establish) takes up a dramatic form we cannot predict any big shift to PC gaming. Entertainment vs cost ratio is certainly higher for PC and, its only a matter of time for people to innovate - ie. how to get PC's into the living rooms (Steam!). Once that is done and the market picks up, people will play all mods in their living rooms, causing consoles (and their exclusives, huh don't know how gaming standards got here in 20 yrs) to vanish.

It's simple, universal gaming format (PC - hence no exclusives) + upgradability + modibility + portability (hoping gaming laptops in the future) + living room enthusiasts = nailed it!

 

I thought 680m was only marginally faster than 7970m?

On topic, it'll be nice to finally see some confirmed benches.

 

It depends, at least on the desktop side, neutered Kepler GK104 outclasses Pitcairn by a fair margin but I'm not sure for the mobile side.

 

Supposing that I have to buy something until December, do you guys think that gtx 870m is a good idea, or should I definitely wait?

 

That just means that Maxwell is better at reaching higher clocks without sacrificing thermals.
The most crucial point with mobile GPUs is TDP like HTWingNut mentioned. If they can keep that down, who cares about the clocks and core count.

Say GTX 980M got 2304 Maxwell cores (2560 cores is a full GM204):
2304 Maxwell cores * 1.35 (performance increase per core over Kepler cores) = 3110 Kepler cores.
Say these run at the same clock as GTX 780M: 850MHz
3110(980M)/1536(780M) = 2

It doesnt have to be super clocked to beat 780M by 2x

I`d stay the hell away from the 870M...

 

Yes, but it overclocks better, especially if you flash a modified vBIOS - I mentioned that in my post, but you decided to chop that bit off when you quoted me! ;-)

 

uow, why? Isn't 870m good enough?

 

Because something alot better is coming over the horizon

 

Colour me interested... Can we expect October launch too?

 

Like Killer explains, something better is about to come.

Look at the first page of this thread.
Potential GPUs to replace GTX 870M:

NVIDIA_DEV.13D7 = "NVIDIA N16E-GX"
NVIDIA_DEV.1619 = "NVIDIA N16E-GX-B"
NVIDIA_DEV.13FA = "NVIDIA N16E-Q1"
NVIDIA_DEV.13F9 = "NVIDIA N16E-Q3"
NVIDIA_DEV.13F8 = "NVIDIA N16E-Q5"

But by all means, go buy the 870M if you want something today and don`t care about the upcoming GM204. GTX 870M isnt a bad card, just very old.

 

This is all a bit depressing for me to be honest. I just had my laptop stolen from my car, it happened very fast, sager 780m, 4700mq, 1tb evo ssd just gone.

So now I need to get a replacement because I used this laptop for work as well as play, but now I'm really on the fence. The 880m is reported to have issues and is nothing more than a re badged 780m and the 980m is coming as soon as October possibly, but still it seems so far when I need something right now....ugh.

 

Get an ipad in the meantime (probably not ideal for work I guess)

 

It needs to be able to run excel, access, photoshop, etc. I wish there was a decent tablet that didn't have a huge premium like the surface pro 3 that could handle heavy duty stuff.

And the thing is I'm on the go a lot. Hence the need for mobility.

 

Well that sucks I guess. I had a month downtime before I bought this Alienware, and used an ipad while waiting for the release. Worked out ok, was a little tired off it in the end. But you can get bluetooth keyboards etc that helps tremendously with writing etc. Of course doesnt help you if you do office work, unless Apple have something in the app market that let you work on excel etc.

I guess you can just accept the Sager now and upgrade the GPU when 980M is released. Not ideal I guess, because other features like HM97 chipset with PCIe speeds for SSDs are just about to come as well...I know I want that.

 

The current laptops from sager aren't HM97? I kinda figured those chipsets came with the haswell refresh, which has been out for sometime now.

 

I havent seen a single notebook with HM97yet. Not sure whats holding them back, but desktop got their 9 series chipset a while back, that supports all the way up to 2GB/s instead of the 600MB/s barrier current HM87 chipsets are locked down with.

Hopefully the notebooks with 900M GPUs from Nvidia got that covered.

 

I am also quite confident that 900m GPUs will carry now the HDMI 2.0 standard. 4K at 60fps on my tv finally!

 

More news that pans out for GTX 980M in October.

GTX 880 will be released in September!
Exclusive: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 880 to be released in September | VideoCardz.com

 

Another reason to wait lol. I don't know, maybe I'll get the Clevo W670SJQ with an 850m, 4700mq and 16gb of ram as a way to hold me off instead of going all out. I was really considering SLI with my next laptop before this last one got stolen recently. I have another spare SSD I can throw in it too.

 

Epic Failure? They are selling low-medium end hardware at price of high end hardware, remember that xbox 360 was i think the same price or less that PS4 is now, but 360 was high end when it came out, when PS4 is a low end CPU with a "old" mid end GPU

That the next consoles will be also x86 is highly probable, these ones are x86 to reduce developent cost (of the games) and that costs are only going to grow, so i don´t think that we will se "normal" consoles again

 

Could you buy a cheap very portable & slim laptop with a half decent processor & sh*tty graphics card (or no graphics card), which has great battery life too, to tide you over until you buy a gaming laptop. Then you can use both of your new laptops and switch between them depending on when you want extreme mobility or gaming.

 

Fair enough, but that's going to be one MASSIVE die to fit that many cores on the same process. (780M only has 1536 cores for reference, so we're talking about a 50% increase)

Also just so I get this out of the way: I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but (even just for my own sake) I don't want to hype 980M too much and then be sorely disappointed in the end, which is why I'm being skeptical about 980M = 2x780M on 28nm process.

 

I forgot to say earlier that GTX 980M ships in October in MSI GT72 and Asus G760, but it could launch along with GTX 880 in September

Pay attention to the thread man. We have already seen the GM204. It is 50% bigger lol

Read the Videcardz link above. Desktop GM204 should be above GTX 780 and even 780 Ti. GTX 860M is only 10% below GTX 750 Ti.
All the more reason why GTX 980M should score like the rumored X4500.

But believing the worst increase the odds pleasantly surprised. Thats one strategy too I suppose..

 

They are selling low-medium end hardware and low medium end prices... You can build a PC with similar specs at similar prices withou OSs or accesories etc. Xbox360 and PS3 launched with high end architecture over a super chastrated cut down design, with half rops, half memory bus width resulting in very memory bandwidth starved GPUS. Their desktop counterparts and even next year's offerings completely trashed the X360 and PS3.

Luckily, the jump was big enough, and people forget that the desktop scene was already being stagnated due to last gen's consoles. PC ports and multiplatforms were very limited, and the pc advantages were only resolution, texture sizes or simple things like that. We also had horrid ports hahaha.

This time around, the overall game should have much higher standards and design decisions, so we might see a better increase in image quality when using our gaming computers compared to consoles.

Not only that, but depending on the design they go with, porting and backwards compatibility will be much more easy to do. Personally I think next consoles will become a service, rather than new hardware.

 

Well, you wrote 680m is a boost over 7970m especially if you flash, overclock etc implying its better even without it, and thats what I questioned.

 

Oh dear, semantics! ;-) Don't you just hate the English language! But, it looks like we both understand where the 680M & 7970M lie in performance anyway - (close at stock, wider when overclocked with modded vBIOS).

 

Yes, the ROPs were cut down, and also the bandwith but what is most important (shaders), weren´t, what is more, Xbox 360 had the first GPU with unified shaders,

 

Yes, and it then became the footprint for future X1900 series. But what I mean, those changes made are literally are what they used to do back then for lower end versions of the powerful GPUs. I am not saying PS3 and Xbox360 were not powerful, but the cuts they got made them significantly weaker, specially for "future proofing".

Xbox360 had a lot of help from the extra ram though, for free AA.

 

I wasnt trying to pick on your grammar, I genuinely wanted to know if I got the numbers wrong.

Anyways, lets leave the 680m and consoles and get this back on the rails

 

Even with the cutdown they were pretty powerful for their time, not as powerful as the top end, but no that far, like if today PS4/One would have a 280x or 290 maybe, instead we have a 250x and a 265, and the lastest one performs like a 260x in games instead because of the CPU bottleneck

 

cloud are you sure they didn't quote you again this time?