How will Ampere scale on laptops?

Based on paper specs I don’t blame them. 4k 120hz and Ryzen are all strong selling points. I do agree it seems to be the most powerful all around laptop currently. Ryzen has made some very large strides in the mobile CPUs. I’m genuinely impress by what I’ve seen. Question is can we undervolt them? Regardless of how the manufacture makes they’re cooling systems there is always room to tweak it get the most out of it.

I’ll be curious see how this thing runs once members get it. If I didn’t have the x170 it may have been on my radar.

 

Does anyone know the TGP for the MSI GE76 Raider 10UH-274 17.3 (not the 10UH-231 model. The 10UH-274 shows a 3080 8gb on microcenter’s website. I know about the 150 TGP for the 10UH-231 at 150 watts. But curious about this model because it’s available now to purchase.

 

That’s a mistake on Micro Center website. Someone in my Discord bought one yesterday. It has 16GB VRAM and 150W+5W boost.

 

Yes I just got off the phone with Microcenter, they cracked open the outer box and checked for me. Thanks for the reply!

 

I was able to try out the new ASUS G733QS laptop which was equipped with Ryzen 7 5800H and RTX 3080 130W VGA. I will compare it with the Clevo X170SM-G which was using 10700K and RTX 2080 Super 200W VGA.

(Please note that my X170 was using the Clevo BIOS, I do not have access to Prema BIOS).

Screen
X170 is available with 240hz or 300Hz AUO panels, while the G733QS is equipped with a 300 Hz Sharp panel. Amongst the 3 panels, I would say that the best is the 300 Hz Sharp regarding color reproduction. Between the 2 AUO panels I liked both, but slightly I found the 240 Hz to have better colors.
The main issue with the Clevo X170 is that as I already explained months ago, all are defective because of a design flaw. Both the 240 Hz and 300 Hz panels showed inverse ghosting/overshoot during Fire Strike and gaming (Alan Wake, Gears of War, Metro 2033 Redux). My theory was that this is because Clevo factory enabled lcd panel overdrive and does not allow the user to disable it.
If you do not know what ivnerse ghosting is please watch this video for a detailed explanation:


The X170 displayed inverse ghosting if reffresh rate was set above 60 Hz. It is "acceptable" for esport games like Counter Strike because during the fast pased action you would notice it, however for lowly casual gamers like me this was clearly visible and annoying.

What about the G733QS with the Sharp panel? Well I installed all the latest drivers and run the same programs where I have clearly seen the ghosting on the X170. I was able to detect some level of inverse ghosting, however it was visible in much less instances and even where I was able to detect it, it was hard to see, I had to specifically look for it.
In short, with the X170 it was clearly visible, however with the G733QS it was only visible if you very closely looked for it.

I even run UFO test ( https://www.testufo.com/ghosting) to see if the G733 really has ghosting or I am only imagening it after the X170. Yes, even UFO test showed a very minimal inverse ghosting.
However here comes the best part...unlike Clevo, ASUS allows the user to disable LCD overdrive. So next I did the same tests with disabled lcd overdrive and as I expected, no more inverse ghosting, not in games and not even in the UFO test. This has proved my suspision of why I see ivnerse ghosting on the X170.

In short: all X170 laptops can be considered defective, because they show ghosting due to factory enabled overdrive. The G733QS has much less, barely visible inverse ghosting by default, however that can be fixed by disabling LCD overdrive in the Armoury Crate. Shame on Clevo for not allowing users to disable overdrive and forcing them to accept the ghosting.

I forgot to make screenshot of my Superposition test, however the G733QS is stable around 7330 points, while the X170 was around 6700 points.

VGA & CPU
The G733 is using a 130W RTX 3080 + 5800H (8core+16 thread) cpu while my X170 has 200W RTX 2080 Super paired with 10700K (8core+16 thread).
By defautl settings the CPU in the X170 can not break 25000 physics points and my 200W 2080S is not able to break 27000 graphics points in Fire Strike.

Look at the results of my G733QS:



Yes, without software tweaking the G733QS beat the X170 in both cpu and gpu score. The 130W 3080 can be a letdown and does not bring the huge jump it should, however we can consider it a 2080 Super Super

Chinese G733QS users have started to cross flash their 130W ASUS laptops with 150W MSI vBIOS. They got a huge performance increase, however no info about the temp increase.

G-Sync vs Freesync
Both laptops support Adaptive Sync with theer built in panels. X170 has G-Sync and the G733QS has Freesync. I do not know the VRR range of the X170, however my G733QS is equipped with a 300 Hz Sharp panel which supports Adaptive Sync in the 48-300 Hz range. This means that if the FPS moves between 48 and 300, then AMD Freesync wiill make the game look smoother by syncronizing the display to the game. Both G-Sync and Freesync works fine, however in some instances I found the G733QS to be smoother than the X170. This was most visible in benchmark software like Fire Strike. Right after I loaded up FS I noticed it to be less smooth and to have microstuttering on the X170, it was much smoother on the P775TM1-G. Same program was very smooth on the G733QS with Freesync, it was as smooth as on my desktop G-Sync monitor.
In short, in some instances Freesync on G733QS was smoother then G-Sync on the X170.

Audio
The X170 has excellent audio system, I love it! G733QS has very good audio too, however the X170 is slightly better.

Fan noise
Both laptops are very loud, however the sound of the fans in the G733QS are a bit more annoying then the sound of the fans in the X170.

Temps
X170 has visibly better cooling, with vapor chamber and much more heatpipes, however the components in the G733QS draw significantly less power and heat up less more. Due to the difference in the cooling system both laptops produce around the same cpu and gpu temps of aound 80C in games.

Power adapter and mobility
The ROG laptop weight less and it is easier to carry around. Not to mention that the X170 is using 2x 280W adapters and both are needed for gaming, so it is a pain to carry it around. The G733QS in the other hand draws less power and thus only need 1x 240W adapter, so it is much easier to carry around.

Overall the G733QS with laptop RTX 3080 130W beats the Clevo X170 with 2080 Super 200W vga and unlike the X170, the ASUS G733QS does not have ghosting on the screen.

I do not know if Prema added an option to disable overdrive in his modded BIOS (I would say no if I had to guess), so anyone looking for a new laptop, I would recommend skipping the X170 and buying the G733QS. As I said the performance increase is not huge, however the fact that it does not have inverse ghosting during gaming and the slightly smoother Freesync is a huge selling point for me over the X170.

 

you dont need to undervolt they have them in 0.5in thick laptops and they run full speed....amd ftw

 

I'd still like to undervolt and further optimise them if possible.

While undervolting isn't possible, you can change the tdp with ryzen controller. Not undervolting but it's at least something.

 

Yeah I’m not familiar with Ryzen at all so that’s very useful to know. I’ve been sticking with Intel because at the end of the day I like to tinker. If I can’t mess around with a machine a tweak it to run how I want it, then I don’t want it.

 

I heard it can get 13000 TSG and if so it puts it in 2080ti territory

 

Nope: https://benchmarks.ul.com/hardware/gpu/NVIDIA+GeForce+RTX+2080+Ti+review

 

FSG is NOT Timespy dude, here you go.

https://www.3dmark.com/search#advan...ck=&maxGpuMemClock=&minCpuClock=&maxCpuClock=

 

And he clearly meant Time Spy, not Fire Strike. 13000 Fire Strike Graphics like GTX 980/1060 level lol.

 

To truly win on performance this time around, you need an eGPU, and no AMD laptop truly supports it (the Asus Flow eGPU just uses a mobile chip). There is no Thunderbolt which is a broader issue. USB4 might help, otherwise OEMs need to come up with proprietary eGPU connectors and proper desktop card enclosures for it.

 

13000vs 14500 isnt that pretty close? I mean we are talking only a few frames

like if the mobile 3080 gets 30 the 2080ti would get 32fps and thats assuming the tsg score holds up in gaming, or is the gap bigger i cant find much info

ok so I found this

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2080 Ti Desktop Graphics Card - NotebookCheck.net Tech

a poorly performing 2080ti is equal to a Overclocked mobile 3080.

D33cent




and yes I meant TSG not FSG LOL

 

I have a gs63vr with thunderbolt as well as a yoga 920 with thunderbolt 3....so your saying I should buy a desktop gpu and use thunderbolt vs upgrading laptop...I thought the losses of thunderbolt were massive like at 1080p which ill be at unless I hook up to a 4k monitor/tv..egpu with a 2070 performs like a 1060..I did some research and it looks like it loses roughly 30 on internal display and at 4k or 1440p the loss is minimal..

 

Yeah, TB3 (or AGA for that matter) won't be great with an internal display at 1080p. IMHO if you have the desk space it's totally worth gettung an external monitor for the improved productivity, better gaming experience, and better eGPU performance.

 

im getting a 4k tv soon but I have my vr headset...its oled and pretty decent I get to play vr games and watch movies in what appears to be a theater so the wow factor is pretty high but it gets uncomfortable after an hour or so hence the 4k tv purchase, its sorta justified unless a vr headset comes out thats light enough to not cause discomfort

 

140 watt 3070 contained in 1 inch.

 

125W+15W dude.

 

Oh sorry I saw fsg and thought that's what you meant.

Here's your accurate numbers timespy graphics chart for mobile, just click on the desktop filter for all of them.

https://benchmarks.ul.com/compare/b...RE&reverseOrder=true&types=MOBILE&minRating=0

FSG:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Graphics-Cards-Benchmark-List.844.0.html?

 

Rep will be given..thanks alot for that video it was really informative and its looking like AMD wins the CPU round....Ive heard of those cpus in ultrabooks and its crazy like i9 performance in an ultra book god bless the competition..

 

does anyone know if the 3080 will be close to a 2080ti or is it still 2080 territory and is the upgrade worth it like what games need this?

 

Depends on... Many want or hope for 4K gaming I wonder how the most capped 3080 cards will perform vs the 150W cards in the link.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...m-owners-lounge.831618/page-424#post-11078276

See also RTX 3080 & 3070 laptop GPUs in the test: benchmarks computerbase.de

 

4k gaming on a 17-15in laptop seems like overkill.....i can see 1440p but 4k no...do you think we will see more oled 1440p displays.. like there is a science and they say humans cannot detect the difference from x given distance

 

Edited in link in post above. Btw. Many use their external 4K screen for gaming I'm sure they will be pleased pissed. At least if they went with the most castrated 3080 mobile cards.

 

It's less about wanting 4k as not wanting 1440p. Because media are all in 1080p/4k , it doesn't scale as nicely to 1440p whereas games fare much better when scaling a 1440p render resolution to 4k.

 

I love 2k for laptops in this screen size range. The desktop can be run native, to my eye the artifact issue in media is highly overblown, and the graphical power compliments the refresh and the number of pixels needing to get pushed. I'd say just the opposite, HD or 4K is a deal breaker for me: I'm not a competitive gamer and I find scaling icons and other crap on a 4k desktop to be a pain. My real gaming machine is a desktop, my laptop must both work and provide a gaming platform.

 

Just got my m17r4. All results are overclocked and stable.

i7/3080

https://www.3dmark.com/pr/881815
https://www.3dmark.com/fs/24923344
https://www.3dmark.com/spy/18355595

 

Firestrike's cpu bottleneck really kicking in hard this generation.

 

That Timespy score is not so bad.

 

It’s not bad at all when you consider the score from my previous machine, the 15R1 with 980M lol.
https://www.3dmark.com/spy/17869476

 

Worse than MSI GE76 though, which has faster RAM.

 

honestly i dont know why you guys need this i have a 1060 and game on high all games well 99 percent of them its not like there is a dozen good games requiring a 2080 or 3080..that is unless you game at over 60fps which is ridiculus, i saw a video and more than half could not see the difference.....so even if you could spot the difference it would be a tiny incredibly small difference

lastly and this is big....medium is the new ultra

 

Cope

 

lol..yeah true....its like you guys are willing to pay 4000 for 10 extra frames



far from 3080

and arguably the best game graphically available a playable 49fps

 

Agreed. 1060m is still a respectable card for moderate settings at FHD, so many new indie and old retro games that don't require all the latest horsepower anyways. That all being said there IS a noticeable difference in much higher fps/hz, not for +20fps imo. Full RT/DLSS is going to be amazing a couple gens from now but not all games will utilize it even then I bet. Just keep your current rig as long as possible then the next rig will be a super awesome upgrade. 3 years my target for laptops. My next desktop will be 4k/60 or more. Upgrading every gen is madness unless you're rich or have a business need for it.

 

Value is relative to wealth and desire.

 

This sum it up how bad gaming notebooks have become in 2021. A wimpy 13 inch Jokebook on top of the 3DM Firestrike leaderboard. Isn't it amusing bro @Mr. Fox https://www.3dmark.com/fs/24887943 And Lenovo is back in the warm/heat race.

 

Everybody is different, but the difference between 60 fps and 120 fps is massive for me. As for those people who could not tell the difference, that's kind of concerning. Have you ever looked at a 120 hz or 144 hz monitor yourself? I know a few people who were anti above 60 fps because they thought it was stupid, but immediately changed their minds when experiencing a high refresh rate monitor themselves. Not trying to start a debate here, I'm just curious.

As for medium being the new ultra, yeah that's pretty accurate. Newer games look good enough to the point where medium settings looks like the ultra settings of older games. Some still look really good even at low settings. I don't see a point on ultra settings in newer games (excluding texture quality) since they offer a minimal increase in graphical fidelity, but cost significanty more processing power to maintain your desired framerate.

Gaming at 60 fps on a low end GPU at 1080p in AAA titles is going to be a reality soon. This will enable a lot more people to get into PC gaming at a low cost.

 

Cliff note: There isn't really a right answer to the value question. Skip the rest as suits...

Value and cost are both subjective and relative; it's going in eyes open that matters. A lot of people here are just stating their views which is all good, I've my own and done the same. I don't mistake my opinions for being more than that though and no one should.

Years ago before every McBillionaire bought an exotic car collection I recall reading about a man with 70ish cars, at the time an astonishing number. The author put the cost into perspective regarding relative wealth versus the average American by pointing out it would have been equivalent to one of us normal people buying 70ish odd t-shirts. Cost is relative to wealth and value with it. Drop any three of us in the desert, let one get envenomed by a rattlesnake, let a fourth man drive by with the anti-venom at a low, low, price of 3k a pop: For the two that didn't get nipped that anti-venom doesn't have much value and they're not paying that 3k. For the third its well worth the investment. Going back to the other two maybe they buy in if it were 5 bucks just in case considering the cost versus value change. If one of the two was a billionaire maybe he would have bought in at 3k; a sum not even worth thinking about. This is cost and value versus need and wealth.

Then you've got desire: If this sort of thing really is your bag, baby, well it really is your bag and you'll be willing to pay.

All highly variable and relative, let's not try and jam one shoe on every foot.

 

Even 75hz is significantly better than 60hz, removes a lot of the jitter than is perceive-able at 60hz. I remember back in 2012 people were pretty against high refresh and I didnt understand why...

Im not sure if I can appreciate 300hz but if anyone wants to buy me one for testing I'll let you know

 

@Papusan @Mr. Fox you know whats worse than thin and lights? Thin and heavy laptops

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Razer...w-The-GeForce-RTX-30-Difference.519563.0.html

Now heavier than ever, last gen's blade pro 17 already tipped the scales at 2.7kg, this gen clocks in at almost 3kgs making it as heavy or heavier than thick medium sized gaming laptops like the GE76 (2.9kg vs 2.96kg) while running much hotter due to its thin a̶n̶d̶ ̶l̶i̶g̶h̶t̶ yet heavy design.

Worst of both worlds, only with Razer ™

 

Not sure what the editors have eaten. But they can't read specs sheet from Razer they themself have added in the review.


And Razer themself still avoid post TGP https://www.razer.com/gaming-laptops/Razer-Blade-Pro-17/RZ09-0368CE63-R3U1

 

They measure it themselves as any reviewer should rather than just blindly following the stated specs. Still, it's one site, we'll see what other reviews say.

 

Bro @Papusan, before the mining crunch, how were graphics cards from MSI, EVGA Gigabyte, etc. priced in relation to the FE direct from Nvidia? My recollection is that they were around the FE price if not cheaper. Given that MSRP of the 3090 FE is £1400, I am not sure £1800 for a Gigabyte 3090 card is an acceptable deal. I mean it's a 30% "Elon tweet premium"

 

The cheapest aib cards were the same price as FE with most being more expensive than FE cards. The Asus ROG strix was 1800 USD which was on the higher end back then with the more standard cards like the Gigabyte Gaming Oc and Msi Gaming X Trio coming in at 1650-1700 dollars

 

A turdbook is a turdbook. Feces comes in a wide variety of colors, smells and viscosities. As a founding member of the "Let's Ruin Laptops" society, Razer has always been repulsive. The Facebook zombie hoard loves their overpriced trash.

 

cars can fly if you want....most don't do you drive a turdcar




perfect logic and this is iq 144 level rebuttal

NOUN

1. a refutation or contradiction.
   synonyms:
   refutation · denial · disproving · counter-argument · countering · invalidation · negation · contradiction · counterstatement · surrejoinder · rebutter · surrebutter · replication · confutation · disproval
   • another term for rebutter.

 

Stupidity is the new normal and, to some, idiocy is cool. As we become desensitized and grow numb to it forgiveness follows. But, at the end of the day, the idiotic stupidity remains. Only bad people are daring enough to point and laugh when they identify the foolishness.

 

was just saying...there is alot of things we could have but reality is king and what we live with is whats offered not what could be... yes we could have mxm 3.0 and upgradable laptops but we really don't and thats the reality of the situation..I wish my laptops(2) could be upgraded but they cant and I have to live with that...both are under 4 lbs and under 0.7in and one has power to play all games at high 30fps....one has the versatility to be used as a tablet on the go for 17hours..


I think you took it out of centext,I was not attacking you, I respect you....but this has to end.....create a petition and I will be the first to sign it