The best Netbook for gaming.

It's all semantics really so it's no use bothering to bicker about it too much.

For me, playing Diablo 2 for 6 hours a day is still considered "gaming" even though Diablo 2 is an age-old game(and yet still has a very large player base); after all, Diablo 2 is a computer game in the proper sense just as Crysis is(or if you wanna stick with the minesweeper example). Btw, Diablo 2 runs on a netbook just splendidly.

Point is, it all depends on the person. A so-called "gaming netbook" might not play the latest and the greatest; I doubt anyone is arguing that. However, it can play certain games and for some, those few older/less intensive games are still considered "gaming" enough for them.

Remember the thread is entitled "best netbook for gaming" not "gaming netbook"; the title itself doesn't even assert that netbooks are gaming machines, but it's questioning the netbook most capable of running a given task i.e. gaming. In a sense, it's a comparative thing rather than an assertion. We're comparing netbooks amongst each other to determine which one is most capable of the action of playing computer games.

That's like saying a turtle is faster than a snail(random example and I'm not even sure which is actually faster ); that doesn't make the turtle a fast animal, but it still is the fastest animal in the given sample we're observing.

 

Well, this thread isn't a debate whether netbooks can game or not, it's to discuss best options for a netbook if you want to game. Phinagle summarized it best by basically saying that you want the most optimized components for the size of netbook/notebook. Atom and GMA 950 is NOT it. They can do much better.

Sure it's subjective, but going from being able to play games from 2001 and earlier with an Atom and GMA 950 to games from 2006 and ealier with the ION platform or HD3200 is a huge leap. No, you will never get a sub 12" notebook/netbook to be able to play all the latest games, but being able to play more recent and popular games is a boon to the genre.

 

What you CAN do and what is recommended are two different things.

If I owned a notebook, a desktop, and a smartphone AND a netbook I could not think of a single time when I would actually use the netbook at all let alone for gaming.

My laptop is small enough to go anywhere my desktop cannot.
I can play diablo2 and dragon age on my laptop when I am not in front of my desktop... why would anyone WANT to put up with the limitations of a netbook on purpose? A netbook is not all that much more portable than a notebook... is an extra 3lbs lighter really worth it for any barely-healthy-or-better person?

Let's say your laptop, desktop, and smartphone all somehow took a swim or something... ok... then having the "BEST IN CLASS" netbook you on may come in handy... then again you could have saved the money and gotten a good start on a laptop which while not a gaming laptop would CRUSH the netbook for any gaming tasks.

/shrug
Enjoy your spoiler on your minivan... it won't stop me from having a laugh at your expense or me recommending others NOT follow your example.

 

I dunno. I can easily take my netbook (minimum three hours even with gaming) with me, don't have to worry about my power cable and will fit inside my briefcase without noticing. My 15" I have to consciously pack up and find a power outlet. If I've got a half hour or hour to kill in between appointments, I can sneak in some time with freelancer, or a round of BF2.

Also, in my situation, I keep my netbook out in my kitchen for web access, but my more expensive notebook is in my den in my finished basement, where I barely can ever go with the kids around. So while they're playing or napping, I can sneak in a game of something or other on my netbook.

Not to mention if you ever fly on a plane, try opening your 15" notebook and use it. It's impossible. A netbook isn't a problem.

I can think of dozens of other situations too.

Bottom line is why should you settle for substandard components when you know it can do much better. Putting in an Atom and GMA 950 is like putting a 160HP 4-cylinder in a Camaro. Will it work? Yes. You know it can do much better though.

Again, if you don't care for gaming on a netbook, fine. Just leave it at that, but we're not debating whether you SHOULD. I think it's silly to have a big ol' 17" or 19" DTR for thousands of dollars but obviously there are those that find it worthwhile.

 

A shut-in who never leaves his house may think he has no reason to ever own a pair of pants....does that mean the whole world should go trouserless?


People have different needs, wants, and situations.

 

How small does it have to be? This is what i don't understand, why do people keep expecting for a laptop/netbook to be 8" yet still pack the power of a 15.4" and be able to play games without struggling, it's not going to happen.

 

What you're not understanding is that people aren't expecting an 8" to pack the power of a 15.4".

 

Exactly. I don't want a GTX260m and Core 2 Quad Q9300.

But I AM expecting an 11 or 12" to have a reasonable powerful dual-core CULV and dedicated GPU for under $600. It's definitely possible, but there's very few out there. Only one comes to mind really, is the Acer Ferrari One with the Athlon64 X2 1.2GHz and HD3200 GPU, and supposedly $500. Not the best combination, but a step in the right direction. An SU2300 and ION or 9300m would be a good mix. SU7300 would be better, but those chips tend to drive the price up too much.

 

Okay, so you jsut want a good balance for portability.

 

That is well said. Yes. Basically just a low power dual core and low power dedicated GPU. The technology already exists, it's just marrying them together. Only thing that sets me off with the Ferrari One is that awful bright red paint job. I may have to go to skinit.com and get something to cover that thing up if I do end up getting one. Ferrari One lacks HDMI, which many people are upset about but personally I won't use it.

 

There's also the MSI U230 which trades the XGP for a faster L335 Neo and an HDMI port. Due out in January in the U.S. and should sell for about the same as the current MSI U210.

What I'm betting is going to be better than a CULV + ION 2 though is when Neo gets it's die shrink sometime during Q2 2010. AMD could conceivably take over the market segment with a platform that pairs a Neo and an HD4200 chipset (or possibly even a new DX11 IGP) that matches Intel's CULV battery life, has better graphics performance when Intel's CULV isn't paired up with ION 2, and is less expensive than an Intel CULV machine when it is paired up with ION 2.

 

You need some work on your analogies.

The average person (or even computer user) doesn't need (or really even have a use for) a gaming netbook.

Pants are pretty useful... for everyone.
Even if its not about frostbite below the belt, I think you could find a recommended use for pants for everyone... even a shut-in.

You have convinced yourself you "need" your spoiler on your minivan as much as you need pants. I am still entertained.

 

Kernel Panic, what's the problem man?
He's laid out what he wants. If you think that's an unrealistic want then you can say "sorry buddy, I don't see that happening." as I do when people post a What Notebook Should I Buy? And expect to be paying $400 for a high end business class laptop.
But regardless of whether what he wants is feasible or not, regardless of whether or not the technology is there, or the demand is there, or the price is right... regardless, that is what he wants. Who are you to continually tell him that what he wants is wrong? I don't recall anyone claiming to "need" a netbook capable of minimal gaming.... but that is all anyone in this topic is looking for. Some people chose the Asus N10J, overclocked the CPU to 2.1GHz, and gamed away on the 9300M GS. Others, perhaps Phinagle are looking for just a little more power than that.

I don't think it gets much clearer than this:

 

Ah, but then you have to BRING the netbook despite all the things you cannot do with it on the off chance you won't be able to use your notebook.
And for the lesser games, your laptop in battery mode still has 10x the power of your netbook. Why bring an additional netbook when you can work, play, game and get everything done on a real laptop for a massive extra 3lbs of weight?

You could just as easily place the laptop somewhere closer too... itsnt like a 15" or 14" laptop is going to obstruct your view of the kids more than the netbook.

Funny, I bring the 15" everywhere... including on a plane. Maybe the planes you fly on only have seats 8" wide, but most are plenty large enough for even my gaming 15". Note, this also means I don't have to "game" with a tiny keyboard. Yes, at 15" its tighter than an 8", but i feel honestly sorry for you and your poor hands/wrists.

I am going to go out on a limb and say they are almost all more than doable with a 14" or 15" laptop that will bury any netbook that exists for gaming capability.

The arguement is that there is indeed a point at which mobility needs exclude the capability to game with any real return.
Scrunched over an 8" screen with a tiny keyboard and pointing device on the off chance that you can play a 10-yr-old game at 20fps seems like a waste of time as compared to a 15" screen and input devices which can play todays games at 40-60fps.

An 8" device isn't more mobile... its just smaller for the sake of being smaller.

 

I think maybe you have taken this all a little too seriously...

Someone someday will want a 1" minibook to say they have one and game on it despite causing themselves multiple hand/wrist disorders while using...
They will also claim its ultraportable and thus desireable. (and it will need to be waterproof because it will be washed multiple times in someone's pockets)
Is it wrong? Dunno... but its not recommended.

I'll have a giggle at that too.

 

Believe me, you're not the only one who at times laughs at what people on this forum are expecting to get. But if they've acknowledged that it's not a netbook that games well, it's only a netbook that games best, what more argument is there?

 

I just checked out that Ferrari One, had somehow missed that one.... that things awesome!! I want one now ha, dangit. And, honestly, I dig the red, course I love ferrari's and ducati's... Very nice looking machine, thanks for the heads up, will have to research it a bit, might have to replace my current Acer Aspire One... in red, ha, just not that shade!

Also, I think you're missing the point of this Kernal... I've got the 15" laptop that games, and it's great, love it and wouldn't do without it... but there's still room for a netbook for sure. I do construction, and run the netbook in the truck all the time. A smartphone is great, but even my Droid screen can't compare to looking up websites on a netbook screen. And, unlike lugging the 15" machine around and banging it up, getting it dirty, and having to find power and making sure the air vents are clear so it doesn't overheat, the netbook comfortably goes on my jobs on battery just fine, tucks out of the way nicely when needed, and dangit, when I have a few minutes to kill waiting on a sub or a client, I can dogfight in Jane's WW2 Fighters and have a ball... all on battery.

So, maybe for your missions it's pointless, but there is a niche use for these netbooks, and dangit, being a gamer at heart, I want the best one availble to game on. Will I play Dirt 2 on it? Nope, but a good slightly older version of Colin McRae or Microsoft Flight Sim goes a long way! Even while board sitting in a truck on a jobsite in the middle of nowhere without having to worry about power.

 

I think also that the point is, some people want a workhorse, powerhouse, whatever you want to call it, all the time so that they feel empowered because they could do anything on it. Some people require just a few things, and aren't smart enough to use the full features of a powerful 15.4", or don't need it. Me personally am the former, i like power wherever i go since where i live people always confront me with my T61p basically asking me to showcase it's gaming power, and i never like to let them down by saying it's just a little word processing notebook/computer. I don't mind carrying my laptop anywhere even with a 9 cell battery protruding out the back. Basically, i think this portability issue is sort of exagerated, how small notebooks/computers need to be nowadays with people. I will be a hard sell for a netbook. Netbooks are also technically harder against the environment because they typically are thrown out or stop working with what many netbook users i have seen do with their netbook, within a year or two. This is why i am against Lenovo developing a ThinkPad netbook, because on this issue i am conservative and i do not want that ThinkPad image to change. I don't want to get too serious with this i just can't wrap my head around netbooks and why they are now so popular and why the market is flooded with new models every couple months it seems.

 

I don't think the point of the thread is to question the utility of netbooks... They serve a purpose and they have their own market separate from notebooks, desktop replacements and ultraportables.

 

My analogies are spot on, you just keep missing the point....

...as evidenced by your analogies.


A more accurate analogy would be about an individual who sees they have a use for a minivan and instead of just going out and buying one with the basic four wheels, seats, an engine, and brakes going out and buying a minivan with AWD, good gas mileage, GPS, maybe some TVs in the headrests for the kids to watch movies on and of course an XBox.

 

No, no more console talk please.

 

??? Huh? I don't get what you mean AT ALL. What I'm saying is this netbook can fit in my current satchel without need for a power supply or another bag, period. Not hard to figure out. My 15" cannot, without getting a much bigger bag and again, having to lug around a power supply as well.

Again? I don't get your point. My point is I don't want my $1500 laptop around my kids to destroy. If they destroy my $350 netbook I won't be that upset, and fairly easily replaced, financially.

Maybe you fly business class, but I can't afford that. Any seat I've sat in (cattle class) you can't open your lid all the way up.

I never said an 8" laptop. I'm talking a 12". My Acer I have has a near full size keyboard, 1366x768 screen, 250GB HDD, 4GB RAM, just lacking an optical drive.

I don't know what your issue is. Using your logic, you'd be better off with a SFF PC instead of a notebook because you can play games at higher resolutions at higher framerates than your 15" laptop, can get any keyboard you want, and can interchange your components as needed, and has better expansion options than any laptop could, and costs less. I feel sorry for you scrunched over your 15" screen while I have a 24" monitor... The analogy makes no sense.

I owned an N10J. I got rid of it because of its limitations: anemic Atom CPU, small keyboard, and 1024x600 resolution. Otherwise it gamed fine, even for more modern games, believe it or not. The resolution typically held it back because many games required minimum 1024x768.

The Acer Ferrari One is a perfect example of a "gaming" netbook, and that's all I've been asking. CPU more powerful than an Atom and dual-core with a dedicated GPU.

I really detest people's attitudes like yours who think because it has no use to them, it has no use to anyone else, and it's stupid. That's a conceited and shallow viewpoint, and I am sorry you can't see beyond your narrow view of the world and your little respect for other people's opinions, desires, and intelligence.

Please, we get it. You think netbooks/subcompact notebooks are stupid to have for gaming. Your point was made like 20 times already. So don't go away angry... but just GO AWAY!

 

Fantasticly said HTwingnut, would quote, but would be too long ha.... not sure why there's been so much debate in a "best netbook for gaming" thread about why netbooks even exist... as mentioned, that was never the question.

I for one have got to find a Ferrari One!

 

Same here. I think they're supposed to be in the US January 2010, but I can't find any places with firm dates.

Here:

Review: http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Acer-Ferrari-One-200-Subnotebook.23155.0.html
(Not looking too great for gaming. Intel 4500MHD fared better than the HD3200 in many games).

and available at newegg soon apparently:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834115685

Dangit, still not a winner. I guess for gaming for now you're best to stick with an Atom CPU with dedicated GPU. The Eee 1201N is looking to be your best bet. It has dual core Atom 330, but ION graphics. So it will dog in CPU tasks, but will work decently for gaming. Unfortunately Source games are more CPU dependent, so they may not be very playable either.

 

Second part of Blogeee review is UP for 1201N:

Translated to English (google translate):
http://tinyurl.com/ybzyn2q

Original (French):
http://www.blogeee.net/2009/12/test-asus-eeepc-seashell-1201n-performances-et-autonomie/

For gaming:
width='560' height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/wdUaebbB27w&hl=en_US&fs=1&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/wdUaebbB27w&hl=en_US&fs=1&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width='560' height="340"></embed></object>

lilliputing gives a good summary:
http://www.liliputing.com/2009/12/roundup-of-asus-eee-pc-1201n-reviews-benchmarks-impressions.html

 

I'm not really in the mood for surfing through 50+ pages of posts to see if this has already been said, but I'd say an ideal gaming netbook/Thin&Light would be something with an CULV+ION 2(supposed to have double the shaders of the first so it would seem spec wise to be better than an ATI HD4330 or a Gforce G 105M, being that they have similar 3dMark 06 scores, and I'm aware that isn't indicative of real world performance)

Show me a notebook with a sub $700 price point with these, where do I send my money?

And I know the ION 2s aren't out yet, but in the next 6 months I hope because I need a notebook.

 

That video of the Eee 1201n there looks pretty promising...if I gamed on it at all, it would mostly be MW2 and Team Fortress 2.

 

When is ION 2 due out? I mean I only see a couple ION notebooks/netbooks out there.

edit: after doing some quick web research, every place states ION 2 chipsets should be shipping Q4 2009. Well, we're pretty darn near the end of Q4 2009 and no announcements of an ION 2 netbook. Good news, however is support for Pineview and Core 2 chips. So this means that we may finally get an Intel CULV and ION 2. If that is the case, I hope we see some good contenders from CES. This is what I've been waiting for. An SU7300 and ION 2 in a 12" would KICK BUTT!

 

The Asus Eee 1201N is not considered a Ion 2 product.
I think its similar to my ASRock Ion 330 in gaming preformance as long as i dont overclock the cpu.

But i heard Nvidia struggles with some kind of legal problem since Intel changed something in the new Arrendale cpus, so until that is fixed we wont see a Ion 2 sulution for that platform.

 

I was reading that Pineview support for ION 2 or just the ION would not fly because of the integrated GPU already on the CPU die. That Nvidia would have to do a dedicated solution and not ION, which is good and potentially bad. Better performance but what to say about battery life?

Personally, I like the 11" form factor, if I could find one which a switchable graphics under even $800, I think I could swing that.

Also, what's the time frame for the new hardware roll out that will be debuted at CES?

Edit: Scratch the thing about ION 2 for Pineview, sounds like the ION 2 will be dedicated while the ION will be integrated which would make the first work for Pineview. http://experts.thelink.co.uk/2009/12/08/nvidia-ion-2-getting-prepped-for-launch/

 

My translation says "BANNED!"

 

ION 2 will be a "discrete GPU like product" as opposed to a chipset and an IGP.

http://www.fudzilla.com/content/view/16892/1/

Won't launch until after CES.

http://www.fudzilla.com/content/view/16888/1/

 

Sounds awesome, but I don't like the comment that "it will cost more". I hope not THAT much more. ION notebooks, namely the 1201N costs $500 already. I can't see paying more than $600 for a notebook with an Atom CPU even if it is more powerful. That starts to creep up in the range of much more powerful 13" notebooks.

I am in no rush to get one yet, so it will be interesting to see how things pan out in the next few months.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if an ION 2 Atom netbook will cost as much the ASUS N10J did.

 

So the 1201N s the best option at this point, eh? I'm just a bit concerned about the CPU, but we'll see. I'm wondering when an Atom 2/ION 2 notebook will come out, though.

 

Yep, the 1210N seems to be "it" right now. Dual core Atom isn't all that it could be, but at the faster 1.6GHz clock speed (compared to 1.3GHz of some single core Atoms), it should go quite nicely with the nVidia ION.

 

Netbook Atoms are N270 and N280 at 1.60 and 1.66GHz respectively. Silverthorne chips (Z5xx series) run from 800MHz to 2GHz, but they're more for mobile devices, not for netbooks.

The one advantage I see with the 330 is well, of course dual core, but also support for 64-bit.

Details can be found here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Atom_microprocessors

I am looking forward to see what Pineview and ION 2 have to offer and when we might see some prospective notebooks with this combination. I guess wait for CES 2010 next month and see what, if any announcements, come out of it.

TBH, I think anyone that doesn't NEED a 1201N right now should wait a few months. ION 2 with anywhere from 32 to 40 shaders compared with existing ION's 16 is well worth the wait. Not to mention the Pineview Atom. Granted who knows if anyone will make a dual core version with ION 2 is yet to be seen. So either get dual core nettop Atom with ION (1201N) or single core Pineview Netbook Atom with ION 2.

 

Or get a CULV with ION 2...

 

Other options, like the HP dv3z with the Turion Neo x2 and Radeon 4330 graphics offer a much better experience and power for not that much more in price or size and weight.

 

If and when it happens. I hope it does. I guess just have to wait and see.

Hmm, let's compare:

1201N / DV3z with 4330

Cost: $500 / $1200
Dimensions: 11.65 x 8.19 x 1.31 in / 12.2 x 9.1 x 1.3
Weight: 3.2 lbs / 4.3 lbs

Dimensions aren't too different, but cost is exhorbitant, and especially if you can even find a dv3z with 4330 graphics. Weight is ok, but still 30% more than the 1201N.

I know you're getting more, but for the price difference, it's just out of the cost league.

 

MSI U230 looks like it has the full clocks for the HD3200 unlike the Acer Ferrari One which is downclocking the IGP to 380Mhz Core/266Mhz Memory according to Notebookcheck.com.

[ Source Funfunhan.com]

 

Ah, I didn't know the single core Atoms don't have 64-bit support.

And yeah, I'm aiming to get something cheap and ASAP, considering my laptop's been dead for around a month now, and the next semester of classes starts in January.

 

^^^ New Pinetrail Atom's do have 64 bit support.

Ion 2 to be offered as an pcie card upgrade to current Ion netbooks?

 

A neat idea but how would they cool the GPU...

Maybe as an external solution.

 

PCIe would be a great idea, but like Phinagle mentions, what about cooling? Granted the Atom CPU doesn't even use a heatsink. Depending on what they can manage, maybe only it will need a heatsink. or have a really thin HS/Fan combo on the chip that will package. Or add-on ION 2's may have reduced clock speeds to manage thermals. Whow knows. All speculation, but great idea. Anything will be better than that crap GMA 950 or GMA 500 whatever they call it that's integrated in the Pineview.

 

GMA 3150 actually.

 

Is that just a modded 3100 then, only coined 3150 because it's on the chip?

 

Well as you know, the higher the numbers, the better it is. Especially for intel graphics.

 

Based off 3100, not much better than GMA 950: Link

 

Acer Ferrari One has an external PCI-e 2.0 port, the ATI XGP port.