nVidia 2015 mobile speculation thread

I doubt we'll see any new high-end Maxwell SKUs. I mean why bother releasing something better when you don't have to, thus preserving your precious margins? If anything I predict we'll see several more cut down variants, because hey, gotta put every single defective chip to good use amirite

 

I agree. Doesn't really seem plausible, especially with Pascal so close. Low-end mobile chips have always surfaced early.

 

Or a bunch of 9x5.

Maybe we'll see a refresh early 2016 on request from OEMs for new models and then Pascal second half of 2016.

 

There's already a 965m. Refresh should happen Q4 2015, so I guess we'll find out then.

 

Would it be worth it waiting to see if the next mobile graphics is closer to desktop parallel? Meaning waiting a couple of months or just better going 980m now and that'll be sufficient for high end gaming for a few years.

 

High-end notebook GPUs will never have full parity with their desktop equivalents. Notebooks don't provide the power and cooling that full speed desktop processors require. Yes, the next generation of notebook GPUs will be faster than the current generation but the desktop versions will be faster, too.

 

While notebook graphics will never have full parity with desktop graphics due to power and cooling requirements, they can get closer with each architecture that focuses on power efficiency. Such a focus reduces the power and cooling requirements for high-performance graphics, and allows notebook graphics to tighten the gap, in a similar way to how notebook processors are much closer to the capabilities of desktop processors now than they were a few years ago.

 

Well, no. Desktop and notebook graphics fabs aren't separate processes. A given fab run can produce ASICs that can and will be used across an entire line. ASICs binned for desktop processors benefit just as much from architectural improvements as ASICs binned for notebook processors. If a given architecture is 30% more power efficient than the previous generation then that 30% improvement applies to the desktop products, too. Given that desktops have fewer power and cooling constraints than notebooks, desktops can make greater use of those improvements. If anything, the gap widens with architectural improvements barring a manufacturer artificially crippling a product in a line to make other products in the line seem better.

 

Isn't power efficiency on a non-linear scale though? So the bigger desktop chips have less performance/watt than the mobile chips?

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Not at all. Performance per watt is useful for comparing two different product lines but it is not so useful for comparing products within a product line. You should read up on product binning if you want to learn more about why, for example, a GTX 980M isn't just an underclocked, undervolted GTX 980.

Edit: should be "not so much" rather than "not at all".

 

[double post; can a mod delete me? thanks.]

 

I don't agree necessarily. if nvidia has the full GM204 ready for mobile they would release it, and charge a huge premium for it because there's virtually no competitor to beat down the price.

 

why should they, if they can charge the huge premium for the 980M and charge it again later for the 985M, or whatever it'll be called?
Besides, there is not much development effort in activating another sector in the chip. If they'd want, they already had.

 

I have a feeling they will release the full chip too. They don't need to but they're ready to go. I'm inclined to believe they'll start locking down overclocking again on the new chips since it's a one horse race now.

 

Newest information from Asia:

An engineering sample of MSI`s upcoming flagship that will replace MSI GT72 have been teased by industry insiders.
Features Intel`s newest Mobile Skylake processor i7-6700HQ++, Nvidia`s upcoming GTX 990M and G-Sync.
Starting delivery from factory in late August.

Still no specific information about specs of GTX 990M but leaks should happen pretty soon. Stay tuned.

Here is Device manager dump (no GPU listed, sorry).

 

I picked the best time to break my laptop! All the money that could have been going to the glorious Skylake/Maxwell refresh going to a simple replacement unit instead. Arghhh! Stupid me. Stupid me. Stupid me.

I would wait until then if I could, but waiting that long (even if it's only a month and a half) is not an option when I'm currently laptop-less. I have important uni work to do.

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Lets hope its a GM200 just to rub it in even more

Nah, kidding. How did you break your laptop? And why didnt you just get a super cheap laptop while waiting for G-sync, Skylake and 990M and PCIe SSDs? Just sell it when September comes and buy that gaming beast?

Shoulda woulda coulda I guess

 

A botched display panel swap where I forgot to disconnect the battery prior to the procedure. A spark and the smell of burning and then one dead motherboard (presumably, as it won't turn on at all). I just hope that all the other components like my SSDs have survived the ordeal.

Ahhh if only. But I don't want certain family members knowing about the laptop breakage. I need to get an exact replicate to replace it with so that they never find out. The reasons are complicated.

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I hope there will be a few more mobile refresh cards and not only 1 new top tier card... however I guess at least 1 new top tier card is better than nothing.

 

Spies in laptop factory? lol

 

It'd be nice to see Maxwell 2.0 replacements for the 960M and 950M. That's the part of the lineup I feel really could benefit from a refresh!

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At the moment I've been window shopping 970M notebooks, so I'm wishing for a 975 or 970MX... but will just have to see what comes with the Skylake notebooks. Decided I'm not going to hold out any longer (outside any unexpected financial reasons) for the magic CPU/GPU moon alignment. Soon as these start appearing in the shops will pull the trigger.

 

Not sure where they got the sample. Its a MSI 1783, new model from the MSI GT72 which was 1781. New motherboard with new chipset and everything.
They can`t test it properly yet because they have problems with BIOS and vbios. Which makes me wonder what card the 990M really is...

We need to hang on a little longer. But I think more leaks are around the corner. Skylake laptops should be available to buy in September and Im guessing 990M along with it

Oh man, talk about being unlucky. Sucks for you man :/
I thought all wires in a notebook have plugs that separate the negative and the positive from shorting or even connecting to places it shouldnt?

Motherboard probably isnt cheap I guess? Judging from your signature it involves CPU soldered on it as well?

 

And GPU too. Hence why I'm just buying a whole new system. Might as well because the price is already going to be huge taking into account the cost of whatever repair service I would need too and the fact that I can't afford to go weeks without a notebook currently (it's approaching crunch time for my dissertation for my master's degree).

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Duuuuude, you are NOT buying a new notebook now with 980M and Haswell when I just told you 990M and Skylake and G-sync and extremely fast SSDs and Windows 10 and USB 3.1 and all the other goodness are two months away. I wont let you.

Man up, go face your family and say you screwed up if you must tell them.

Holy crap you are unlucky. I feel for you man. What an extremely expensive mistake that was. :/

This is exactly the danger with soldered stupid trend we are heading towards with notebooks. If this was 2013 you could have just gotten a motherboard or atleast salvaged the CPU and GPU and sold them.

 

I'm relying on my grandparents for financial support at the moment as a postgraduate student (which I'm really grateful for). I just happen to be pretty good at saving money and managing my bank account, but if they knew how much I have managed to save up over the years they would cut down what they're giving me considerably. That's why I must be so secretive about it. Edit: (they never explicitly ask about my bank balance so I'm not lying to them,- just want to make that clear)

I'm just praying that all of my SSDs are unharmed. If I lost them too, I think I'd implode with anguish.

I may still have enough to upgrade to the Skylake revolution and sell this replacement unit (as long as there's no further unforeseen disasters!) but then my savings will be completely exhausted so I better hope for a full time job soon!

Yeah I am definitely seeing the downside of soldered components now!

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Some owners of the new Aw models will also experience this nightmare after a while. Warranty does not last forever... About a year or two when the warranty has expired then come the questions about what they should do when the soldered processor or GPU fail. The question becomes so; Buy a new laptop or repair ? (buy new motherboard). It's no wonder many hate soldered hardware.

 

Remind me never to do any business deals with you...

http://www.quora.com/Is-a-lie-by-omission-really-lying (last paragraph)

 

Honestly all that hardware means very little if they all come soldered. And we pretty much know for a fact now that all Skylake mobile CPUs are going to be soldered. :/

My (very extreme) opinion: the only laptops worth buying at this point are the SLI and ZM laptops that use desktop CPUs from Clevo. I would honestly rather take a socketed Haswell over soldered Skylake any day.

 

there, fixed for you

 

lol touche, but pretty much what I intended to say

 

The display is directly connected to the power source and the GPU. So, if there's still power when connecting - poof goes everything on its way - power controlling chip on the MoBo, GPU core and most likely the display itself. The motherboard is repairable (I guess), anything else - new, or as you said, might as well be better to get a new system. Sorry for your loss.

 

Ah, it's directly connected to the battery? With that in mind it makes a bit more sense to me how this happened. I need a time machine right now.

Thanks. At least I know never to repeat the same mistake again. I will definitely remember to disconnect the battery from now on before I do anything with the display (and everything else attached to the mobo too).

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GM204 full chip. It's easy enough to do. Maybe cut the clocks 100MHz versus PC counterparts... But nVidia will not miss a chance to rebrand... Especially alongside Intel and their new darlings... Look at the history... There are always new rebrands or new architecture when Intel makes a chip release... Its collusion to drive sales... Outside of myself and two others, Maxwell runs so cool that GM204... Full GM204...with an underclock from the desktop (meaning scrap cores)... Its so possible that it's almost 95% probable at this point. Pascal is going to release with a whole new architecture... Let's face it... Maxwell is a refined Kepler... Pascal will be a huge jump... It makes sense for nVidia to selectively bin the scraps that can't make 980s into mobile chips. They would be dumb to pass up the opportunity to claim even higher performance than their current offerings when early reports show at least a 10% IPC increase over Haswell with Skylake (although the voltage is higher because FIVR is gone, its actually ironic and I see why they are bringing it back with Cannonlake)...

 

@Cakefish - You're in good company. I fried a laptop recently doing the same exact thing. I would like to say I always disconnect battery, but clearly I don't, and when I didn't, I fried a laptop too when attempting to replace an LCD. Thankfully it wasn't my primary unit and wasn't too expensive, but still it hurt.

And yes, it would be nice to have a 10 second time machine, to jump back 10 seconds knowing what you knew 10 seconds in the future. Once it happens though, it happens, there's no going back.

 

Yep. Same goes to MXM modules. So when those new GPUs come along, and if they are worthy of course be sure to remove any power source (adapter and battery) before digging into the internals.

 

I agree with Ethrem. The likelihood of full GM204 seems quite high to me considering history and the existence of the 780M/880M.

Oh man, so this must be more common than I thought? I had no idea replacing a display could be so risky! It looked so simple in your excellent video on the subject (not sarcasm, it is a great video and you clearly mention the battery - I just completely blanked over that bit in my excitement and rush to get the new display fitted). At least I am now all the wiser for it.

Duly noted!

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So Intel is removing FIVR for Skylake, but bringing it back with Cannonlake? Wot

 

I don't see why are all of you are so pessimistic about maxwell refresh. again, like I said before, if nvidia has the full GM204 ready for mobile, they will release it and charge a huge premium over it. a 980m costs like what? $750 ish? that's much cheaper than 780m iirc and nvidia can easily go up to $1000 with a full GM204. the 800 series exists because nvidia needs a gap before they can bring out maxwell 2.0, but this time they already have enough time for pascal in 2016 and they could easily finish 2015 with more maxwell.

yep, FIVR is gone for good with skylake and coming back for KABY lake which is the successor for skylake rather than cannonlake.
and btw kaby lake is still 14nm, and it's meant to be a gapping product.
http://hexus.net/tech/news/cpu/84524-intel-kaby-lake-skylake-successor-next-year-says-report/

 

Eurocom list GTX 980M 8GB MXM at $891 and GTX 970M 6GB MXM at $631. They list GTX 780M 4GB MXM at $809.

 

and iirc rj tech was selling 980ms at $750

 

RJ Tech's entire site is broken at the moment so I can't check their prices. The best price for a new 980M 8GB MXM card that I can find right now is $815 from HiDevolution; best price for a new 780M MXM is $696 from VGAStore. VGAStore has some lower-priced 780M cards but they're Dell-branded and probably won't work in non-Dell hardware.

Point is, 980M does not cost less than 780M barring special sales or price misprints.

My guess? If a full GM204 MXM card is real then it will be priced around $1500. Not because that's what it's worth. Because the cut-down GTX 980M costs roughly twice what a full GTX 980 costs (about $500) so a full GTX 980M would be at least three times the GTX 980. That's my conservative estimate. nVidia could give it a shiny name like "Titan M" and list it at around $2K, twice the price of a Titan X.

 

So apparently Kaby Lake won't have FIVR either, but its successor Ice Lake will. Yeah the names are all over the place now.
http://www.hardwareluxx.com/index.p...tage-regulator-for-skylake-and-kaby-lake.html

Personally I'm happy to see FIVR go away on desktop chips, since they do contribute a lot to the heat. But for mobile CPUs I can see the benefit of keeping them there if it allows undervolting.

 

Lol Intel really turned up the mess with the naming! Either way, my point is that they are bringing FIVR back.

RJTech was the cheapest, no idea why their site is down but it was indeed 750 for the 980M when I was pricing a replacement for my hot running ones.

 

Don't confuse USD with CAD. 750USD is nearly 1,000CAD. And, yeah 780M can cost a pretty penny. However, we sell them less then the 980M.
Eurocom, is in Canada. HiDevolution and RJTech are in the US. If you compare prices, well, we're the cheapest. But our GPU's come with higher quality capacitors, and ASIC quality starts at 98% and we only use Samsung VRAM/NAND. So you know you get the best, even if it didn't break your bank.

Over 100$ less. 780M are in high demand, always. They're the 2nd best sellers, single MXM graphics card wise this year, from what I have noticed.

 

I want to see a GPU-Z validation of this 98% ASIC score. Because I have among the highest recorded ASIC cards with one clocking in at 78. Clevo cards average much less than that. I find it hard to believe that you have a GM204 that was cut down into a mobile GPU with such a high ASIC score.

Also keep in mind that selling is only to be done in the marketplace, I have removed that part of your post.

 

FWIW, I'm pretty sure that all of the prices I listed are USD. The Amazon prices are definitely USD and they match up with Eurocom's prices after conversion from CAD to USD -- since Eurocom is the actual vendor. The other prices were found via Google Shopping searches. I'd be surprised if they weren't USD.

I think you missed the subtle jab at audiophools.

 

Quite possible but if I missed it, others could have too.

 

and skylake is unfortunately not as great as you think, 6700k barely wins over 4790k
http://news.mydrivers.com/1/438/438211_all.htm#2

I doubt jen tsun will charge that over $1000 because as you learn in economics, even when you have a monoply, it doesn't mean you can charge whatever you want. nvidia would have to find a price point that the market will accept and yet is still making loads of money, in which case over $1000 definitely won't do.

 

That link didn't want to load but looking at WCCFTech...
http://wccftech.com/wipintel-skylak...-leaked-tested-ecs-z170-claymore-motherboard/ it actually seems impressive considering that it's running 200MHz slower.

It will drop at 1k like the rest.