AMD's Ryzen CPUs (Ryzen/TR/Epyc) & Vega/Polaris/Navi GPUs

64 Cores is an awesome count without a doubt. Not too many people will bring it to its knees.Just a alot of money to get there but now you finally can. I am sure one O/C and LN2 have their way, watch out.

 

Bitwit Kyle gets all excited about the thought of getting to build a ThreadRipper 3 3990x machine.

My 3990X dream PC might actually happen ($10,000 budget)
Jan 7, 2020
Bitwit
AMD just announced their Threadripper 3990X with 64 cores and 128 threads. With the launch less than a month away, I'm wasting no time planning my custom water cooled workstation with the beastly chip at its core...Assuming I can get one.


Marcus Loke 12 hours ago
"smells like an attempt to "encourage" AMD to send him an individual CPU instead of sharing it with Paul "

 

Hopefully they send out some samples to overclockers, like intel did with the 3175x

 

An xmg with AM4 socket, meaning either clevo or another similar ODM is making AMD laptops!

And one of them they couldn't talk about was super thick, like P570WM thick it seemed.

 

Need a Zen 2 desktop grade CPU such as 3700x (or at least 4800H - 45W) with 5700M GPU

 

Don't worry about the voltage / power limits - unless they come locked like Intel (yipe!), as AMD so far has unlocked power and voltage settings.

So a laptop version will be interesting to see how the makers treat the new mobile 4000 series AMD CPU's / APU's and mobile 5xxxm GPU's. It might take them a couple of revisions to figure out what is possible, and I hope they don't lock them down out of the gate due to no time to verify if unlocked is safe.

 

Desktop CPU in a DTR is not what AMD needs. Actual good mobile silicon is needed for the OEM's to start making some good retail machines.

 

Saw a different video talking about a 3900 non-X being possible in it. 12 cores in a laptop...

 

Yes, Clevo made one with 3900 (non X) and 1060ti.
They should really slap a 5600m and 5700m into those laptops though and provide future BIOS updates for Zen 3 along with good GPU driver support - which quite honestly is something most OEM's don't seem to do that well.

I don't mind a desktop CPU in a laptop.
In fact, I actually kinda prefer it (as it gives me desktop power in portable format - and I would rather avoid getting a desktop due to its lack of portability - and portability [even if comes with a thick unit] is always nice to have and still FAR more portable than a desktop)... but the OEM's need to ensure that the cooling is either on-par or very similar to the one found in Helios 500 (with 2700 and V56) and decent quality control - otherwise, they'll end up with a cooling and hw failure prone mess that Asus created with GL702ZC.

I agree that Acer needs a good mobile silicon, and they seem to have provided that with Zen 2 (aka 4800U and 4800H series)... but I also think their previous Zen 1 and Zen+ mobile releases were quite good as well... its just they didn't get a particularly great treatment from OEM's in regards to cooling, and even hw mismatching.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but its not AMD that will necessarily dictate the voltages and power limits on a laptop... the OEM's will.
That said, up until now, AMD did not allow voltage or frequency control on their U series (seeing how Ryzen Master wasn't working with it)... not sure what the case will be in regards to Zen 2 mobile parts like 4800U and 4800H. Both of those have configurable TDP, so, ideally, for 4800U to properly reach and maintain its boosts, the cooling will likely need to support about 25-35W (as 4800U can go up to 25W in TDP).

The only exceptions that I know of from Zen in regards to unlocked voltages and frequencies are GL702ZC and Helios 500 - probably because they used the full blown desktop versions.

Historically, we unfortunately saw that OEM's tend to be neglectful of AMD APU's... in the sense that they won't put adequate cooling in those units and usually limit them to 15W (despite the fact they can go up to 25W) which in turn limits their performance and creates problems with high temperatures (which in turn can again cause throttling).

I'm hoping things will change with Zen 2.
As for OEM's having to make various revisions until they 'get it right'... no real need because they know the TDP's for needed components and likely the estimates on how far the CPU's/APU's can draw under full load.
So it shouldn't be an issue for them to design proper cooling for these units.

 

Yup, that's why I said "...[it] will be interesting to see how the makers treat the new mobile 4000 series AMD CPU's / APU's and mobile 5xxxm GPU's"

Also, I'm mostly thinking of this from a desktop perspective for AMD, while you are thinking of the locked down power / voltage controls in AMD mobile - so far.

What I am hoping is AMD is using the Ryzen Master with the new mobile CPU / APU / GPU and allowing full control as in desktop - now that the performance envelope is reaching desktop levels - unlike "u" low power parts.

Maybe AMD will be motivated to get it right... it would boost their AMD mobile buy in from a lot more people.

 

What will boost an AMD buy in would be actual worthy products.

 

This will depend on OEM execution.
What good is having great AMD hw if OEM's don't match it with proper RAM and other quality components that would maximise performance but still lower the overall cost to the consumer without compromising on quality (which we know is more than doable)?

We all know OEM's can overcharge heavily on laptops... and I've seen how a mid-range laptop can easily cost up to £1000/$1000, even though a decade ago, it was possible to get a mid-range laptop with a suitable mid-range dGPU for £600/$600.

Prices of goods and services should technically go DOWN over time, not up (especially if you take into account technical efficiency).
But we know OEM's already produce laptops for proverbial pittance because the cost of production did in fact reduce dramatically... for THEM, and yet they charge many times as much to consumers for what it took them to make the thing.

A mid-range laptop these days should be really cheap... but we see this isn't the case (starting prices for mid-range systems are in the ballpark of $900/£900 if you are lucky - and that again depends on the configuration the OEM puts out in a given region).

However, we have been told that Zen 2 mobile will change this by resulting in much more affordable gaming laptops for example (and if the whispers of some prices are any indication, I'm thinking its possible we will see decent gaming laptops with Zen 2 that can be gotten for $600/£600 - $800/£800).

AMD definitely needs to give people control over Zen 2 mobile and APU's in Ryzen Master too.
But in laptops, this would be of limited use if we end up with locked bioses.
Sure, we could technically affect the voltages, but I'd rather OEM's implement quality cooling and quality control allowing APU's to reach and maintain their advertised speeds indefinitely without much/any noise and provide unlocked BIOS-es in the process (this whole notion of locking BIOS on the laptop is a bit absurd - most people won't touch them, and those who do generally know what they're doing).

 

All would be needed, adequate cooling and power delivery + unlocked CPU controls in the CPU firmware and the laptop firmware, as in the best Intel laptops.

I hope AMD realizes this jump is needed to really take the lead in laptops.

As much as Frank Azor is a focus for all the ill's suffered by AW owners, he at least started knowing the mixture of balances needed for maximum performance and control over the AW laptops, and I hope he see's AMD's laptops as another fresh start to do it right a second time.

It may be AMD still needs to grow through some smaller steps on the way to fully tunable and optimized builds - and it will take makers with the same goals putting in their efforts as well, that may take time to follow through for all makes / models.

Even a "low end" 4x00H + 5700M should provide enough portable power, if not give their desktop counterparts competition, at least it will give Intel laptops competition.

I'm hoping for a 17.3" AMD H/M laptop, and that it will come out soon, my eye's prefer the larger size for long use.

 

A 4800H + 5700M would essentially surpass Ryzen 2700x and Vega 56 configuration.
The 4800H might be on par with desktop 3600 cpu-wise and 5700 (after all, the 5700M apparently has identical specs with main difference being in slightly lower clocks - so the mobile GPU should be only 5-10% behind desktop 5700 - and as a result, same as or slightly better than Vega 64/1080 performance (at much lower power draw of course).

Given the clock differential between 4800H and desktop 3600 (4.2 vs 4.4Ghz for single core turbo, and 2.9 vs 3.6GhZ on base clocks - which is expected to increase by 200MhZ for all core boost on both CPU's - assuming the 4800H works the same), they would perform roughly on par with each other in multithreaded tasks due to 4800H having 2 extra cores and 4 more threads, but with 3600 having a slight advantage in single core due to 200MhZ higher boost.
Overall, they would be more or less comparable cpu-performance-wise.

The 'advantage' of 4800H is that it has a pretty good iGP which can extend battery life when the dGPU is not in use.

The higher end laptops could then use 3700X and 3900 (non-X) with 5700 (in a similar configuration as Acer Helios 500 did with 2700 and V56).

I wouldn't be opposed to seeing how a 4800U + 5600M performs, but its possible they might also pair it with 5500M instead.

Anyway, with 100 laptop designs coming based on Zen 2, AMD seems to be having a nice path into the mobile market, and hopefully, the OEM's will do them justice this time around.

 

Below MSPR, not having x399 was a mistake!

 

AMD Ryzen 4000 processors for laptops may be nearly as fast as desktop CPUs
https://www.techradar.com/news/amd-...laptops-may-be-nearly-as-fast-as-desktop-cpus

Interesting if accurate, and it does support my earlier post on 4800H being comparable to 3600 (non X) and only about 20% less powerful than 3700x (if the PhysX score is any indication).

However, something doesn't sit right.
Those 3d Mark Physics scores for 3600 and 3700x are nowhere near accurate.
3700x would score about 23728 in Physics score... whereas 3600 would score 19062 - but the difference is still 19.6% (or 20% if you want to round it up).

The percentage differences would still apply if 4800H scores the same or slightly better than 3600 - which would make sense given its lower clocks (which were established - were they not?). So I don't understand how is 4800H scoring 'higher' than 3600 and bringing it only within 15% of 3700x (nice if it does, but sounds a bit strange if you ask me).

Plus if the % differential is the same, then 4800U being only 33% slower than 3700X... that would mean the 4800U is roughly comparable to Ryzen 2600... which is definitely not bad for 15-25W TDP chip (again, I think allowing 4800U to stretch all the way to 25W would be better - whether its a standalone APU or has a dGPU to accomany it).

EDIT:
The 4000 series APU's seem to be of a more monolithic design as stated here:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/1532...-apus-7nm-8core-on-both-15w-and-45w-coming-q1

"AMD said that this decoupling of the infinity fabric and memory support, especially with both CPU and GPU accessing it, was made substantially easier due to the APU being a monolithic solution (with that in mind, it’s likely that AMD might not be going down the chiplet APU route any time soon). "

This was done to improve power efficiency of mobile products and result in lower idle power draw most likely.
But I was also thinking if that the monolithic approach could possibly contribute to better performance on the CPU vs say 3600 given the latency elimination?

 

AMD interview with Lisa Su @ CES 2020...

[CES 2020 Behind the Scenes Interviews] Ryzen 4000 EXPLAINED By AMD - Smart Shift, Performance, MORE!

[CES 2020 AMD] Is 64 cores too many cores?!? w/ Steve from Gamers Nexus

[At CES 2020] Now Intel's In REAL Trouble! Ryzen 4000 Series Notebook CPUs Are Here

All here:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...ts-video-articles.831509/page-6#post-10984693

----------------------------

AMD Does Not Believe Its Mobility Processors Require PCIe 4.0 Right Now
By Usman Pirzada, 4 hours ago
https://wccftech.com/amd-does-not-believe-its-mobility-processors-require-pcie-4-0-right-now/

So this move by AMD makes sense, a little disappointing as PCIE 4.0 for SSD's would make a good selling point differentiator against Intel laptops, but then again the PCIE 4.0 chipset has higher power and cooling requirements and the PCIE 4.0 SSD's do get hotter under load as well - and PCIE 4.0 SSD's come with large heatsinks that wouldn't fit in a slim laptop form; Gen 4 SSD's would be difficult to cool adequately to avoid thermally throttling speed.

Cheaper parts, cooler running, allows for a less expensive motherboard build, all good things for going with PCIE 3.0 for this first round of laptop's so AMD did good - hopefully the price performance will reflect the needs of most people and move that market share needle for AMD laptops vs Intel.

Then again, I also hope AMD figures out the PCIE 4.0 product bus lanes to work well on PCIE 3.0 and PCIE 4.0 in future products. Reduced lanes on PCIE 4.0 works fine, but those same reduced lanes on PCIE 3.0 motherboards loses a bit of performance that even a 9900K can't compensate.

PCIe 3.0 could be crippling AMD's RX 5500 XT performance
By Sayan Sen · Dec 19, 2019 06:24 EST
https://www.neowin.net/news/pcie-30-could-be-crippling-amds-rx-5500-xt-performance/

"AMD introduced PCIe 4.0 with the Ryzen 3000 series CPUs and Navi-based RX 5700 series GPUs. The new standard doubles the throughput over last gen. Testing, however, showed that there was very little difference between PCIe 3.0 and 4.0 graphics performance on the x16-capable RX 5700 XT.

The recently launched budget-oriented RX 5500 XT, though, is limited to 8 lanes only, and as PCGH has found, it may be crippling the performance of the card on a PCIe 3.0 platform possibly due to saturation of the available bandwidth."
...see graph on website...

The solution right now is to use new x570 motherboards with PCIE 4.0. There are some nice cheap entry level motherboards like the Asus x570-P ($150) that can provide a good base for a long term build and an upgrade path all the way through the 3950x.

The CES 2020 announced MSI Tomahawk x570 ($189) also looks promising:
https://www.anandtech.com/show/15362/ces-2020-msi-announces-x570-tomahawk-wifi-189-

 

Some ThreadRipper 128GB 4x32GB memory testing...

OLOy: 128gb Threadripper 3960X 3970X Memory Tested
Jan 16, 2020
Level1Techs
https://openbenchmarking.org/result/2...

 

Radeon 5600 XT review:



While they kind of botched the launch, the results are pretty good overall. It renders the RTX 2060 Super a non-starter, but unfortunately it's likely going to cannibalize the non-XT Radeon 5700. The 5600 XT will probably do very well in the OEM/SI space as you can pair it with a Ryzen 5 3600 to create an excellent 1080p gaming rig that you can sell relatively cheaply.

 

Excellent!

 

I think that AMD probably should have released the 5600XT at about $250 price point for the OC version... and $225 for the non-OC version to better combat NV GPU's in that price segment (not sure if NV would be willing to drop prices that low though).

Obviously, the 5500XT should have also been priced accordingly lower.

 

There's various AMD content in the CES 2020 thread, here's one I posted that has good info on the new AMD 7nm Ryzen 4000 mobile CPU's with laptop integration examples:

AMD discusses the world's first 7nm mobile CPU
Jan 7, 2020
PCWorld
Gordon chats with AMD's Senior Director of Product Management David McAfee about the launch of Ryzen 4000 mobile CPUs, why more cores matter in a laptop, and power efficiency.
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...ts-video-articles.831509/page-6#post-10984942

 

Nvidia only recently reduced their prices to be competitive and are still not - and AMD is better going out higher and then reducing the price than low-balling the market and leaving $ on the table. These cost $ to build and the vendors need to make their fair share too.

 

2060 KO all day long. Better drivers by miles. AMD is having HUGE driver issues with their Navi cards. Head over to r/AMD and r/Nvidia and you see plenty of users that are reporting crashing, black screens, poor performance, throttling clocks, etc. AMD took this card and essentially removed all overclocking headroom just to match up with Nvidia's new $300 2060 card which still has plenty of overclocking headroom left. The driver issues are the biggest factor though. It's not like it's a new launch, it's been like 6 months and they are still having issues. Steve touches on the driver issues in this video. HWU never touches on this, hasn't done a single video on the topic, yet reddit is flooded with issues that Steve touches on here.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/erum1f/after_a_very_disappointing_experience_with_the/

 

Looks like the majority of 570 and 580 users don't seem to have any issues.
Similar goes for various desktops using 5700 XT.
It might be that certain configurations are causing these problems on some AMD GPU's such as the latest Navi.

On my previous Helios 500 with Ryzen 2700 and vega 56 laptop, everything was working fine with desktop drivers until Navi started coming out.
The drivers since then have consistently caused a static noise problem on the display whenever I brought the system out of sleep mode (which required a restart)... aside from that, I haven't experienced forced crashes, restarts, blue screens, or any other problems some other people seem be describing on Reddit. Games and software worked fine, and everything (apart from the static noise appearing coming out of sleep mode) was stable - this was of course with desktop drivers.
And rolling back onto earlier most stable drivers (19.5.2) solved that static noise problem too (but of course, my GPU couldn't use any of the newest features like RIS, etc.).

I had to return that laptop sadly due to a completely unrelated issues (failed BIOS update which corrupted the mobo and of course, the repair team couldn't fix the problem, nor replace the mobo in less than a month).

Its possible people have modded their GPU's to the point that's causing some problems, or they might have configurations that might be causing them more issues than with others.

I won't deny the fact that AMD needs to address these issues, but in fairness, if you google Nvidia rtx 2060 driver crashes (or for that matter rtx 2070 driver crashes), you'll find similar problems for people popping up on Reddit, etc.

 

Yup, there are lots of people without any problems. HU being one of them, I saw their Q&A and they stated it simply, they've tested all of the Navi cards in a bunch of different systems and the only time they have problems is when they forget to DDU the existing Nvidia drivers - they don't co-exist well apparently - just like it's always been.

HU just isn't seeing any problems with the Navi cards or drivers.

So, DDU your old AMD / Intel drivers in Safe Mode, then install fresh new AMD Radeon Adrenaline drivers, and run stock for a while to make sure your new card is stable - then start playing around with tuning.

The 2060 KO card at $300 was a short run, and other 2060 cards @ $349.99++ are $50 or more expensive than the 2060 KO, which is a total of $70 more for a 2060 than a $279.99 5600XT. And, the 1660ti costs the same or more than the 5600XT but the 1660ti is much slower than the 5600XT.

When to buy the AMD GPU:
5600XT vs 1660ti
5700 vs 2060
5700XT vs 2070/2070 Super

The 5700XT "murders" the 1660ti, see below... Detective PC (Kyle) is on the case...

Here's Bitwit / Paul's take on the release, followed by their reviews, watch the intro and jump to 4:41 for 5600XT:

Post-review discussion of the RX 5600 XT - Awesome Hardware #0214
Streamed live 23 hours ago
Bitwit 1.7M subscribers


RX 5600 XT Review & Benchmarks vs RTX 2060 KO + GTX 1660 Ti!
Jan 21, 2020
Paul's Hardware 1.15M subscribers
RX 5600 XT Review & Benchmarks vs RTX 2060 KO + GTX 1660 Ti! AMD Radeon's newest GPU is 7nm Navi based and starts at $280


Kyle is on the case, the RX 5600 XT's murder of the GTX 1660ti!

Call 911! The RX 5600 XT just murdered the GTX 1660 Ti
Jan 21, 2020
Bitwit
This looks like a job for...Detective PC the PC detective.


More Bang for Your Buck (if AMD hits that price) - AMD Radeon RX 5600 XT Review
Jan 21, 2020
Techtesters
AMD's BIOS shenanigans aside, this will be a great buy if that $280/€300 MSRP holds true...


So many people don't know about DDU to remove old Nvidia / AMD drivers, so tell your friends having AMD / Nvidia driver problems to download DDU, boot into safe mode and run DDU to remove their old Nvidia / AMD drivers before installing their new AMD Radeon GPU (or Nvidia GPU) so they have a smoother experience getting to know and tune their new GPU.

It’s time to upgrade your GPU - RX 5600 XT
Jan 22, 2020
Linus Tech Tips
The latest Steam Hardware Survey shows most people are still using a GPU from 3 years ago! Now that there's some more competition, maybe now is finally the right time to upgrade.


Display Driver Uninstaller Download version 18.0.2.1
https://www.guru3d.com/files-details/display-driver-uninstaller-download.html

 

This means they really should have removed any OC branding from the cards. Just call all XT Editions. But this will probably not increase the value and boost sales.

 

The real competition price vs price is the 1660ti, the fact that the 5600XT also competes with the next GPU up that is $70 more is amazing - and all AMD had to do was allow another 10w-10w more power headroom.

And, AMD's GPU's and CPU's automatically give everyone the best performance without requiring manual overclocking

My 3700x does fine with AMD's auto-tuning, being old school I get another 15% performance in benchmarks @ 4343mhz all core and near 20% when I play at 4505mhz all core, but no one needs to do that to enjoy their new AMD CPU / GPU.

In this age of AI Knowledge-based auto-tuning hardware, manual OC'ing is soon becoming old-timer "Boomer" fun.

 

Ok. Maybe AMD will put out a new vBios for Radeon RX 5700 as well so it won't cannibalize the sales of the latter. Or as you say, automatically give everyone the best performance without requiring manual overclocking Will they AMD do that? Or will they cook themself to death?

 

Noctua has another cool chromax.black cooler for AM4, a low profile NH-L9a-AM4 chromax.black this time:
https://noctua.at/en/nh-l9a-am4-chromax-black





Looking forward to the NH-D15 chromax.black on the 3950x
https://noctua.at/en/products/cpu-cooler-retail/nh-d15-chromax-black


Noctua FINALLY Has All Black Coolers! - Chromax Black

Why you shouldn't water cool your PC

Noctua's CPU Coolers - A Serious Case of AIO Regret?

Custom Waterloop vs Noctua NH-D15 AIR COOLING FTW?!

 

New AMD Wraith Prism CPU Cooler tomshardware.com | Jan 22, 2019

 

As I originally responded these look bogus, and sure enough AMD has come out and confirmed that they are fakes:

AMDeepfakes? AMD Confirms 6-Pipe Wraith Prism Coolers Are Counterfeit
By Zhiye Liu 13 hours ago
For a knockoff, the six-heat pipe Wraith Prism sure looks real.
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/counterfeit-amd-wraith-prism-coolers-are-entering-the-market

"...Cooler Master makes the Wraith Prism coolers for AMD, so we've also reached out to the manufacturer to see if it can shed some light on the counterfeit cooler. In the meantime, here's AMD's official statement on the matter:

"AMD is pleased to offer market-leading premium Wraith Cooler thermal solutions for Socket AM4 and AMD Ryzen processors. Our current solutions, the details of which can be found at AMD Wraith cooling solutions, use four heat pipes and AMD has no plans at this time to introduce a new AMD Wraith Prism cooler with additional heat pipes.

"It has come to our attention that third-party coolers using six heat pipes that are designed to look like an official AMD Wraith Prism solution, including the illegitimate use of AMD branding, are now entering the market. Please be aware that those solutions are not genuine AMD products and have not been tested and validated by AMD to meet our build quality and performance requirements.

"We are actively investigating the source of these products and will take necessary actions to enforce our rights to ensure users receive genuine AMD products. If you have any questions about the origin of a cooler, please verify the solution here .""

Wraith PRISM Vs. 360MM AIO Water Cooler for 3700X & 3900X
Jul 8, 2019
Tech YES City
If you are in the market for a new Ryzen 7 3700X or a Ryzen 9 3900X, whcih both come included with a Wraith Prism Cooler, then do you even need to go out and spend the extra money on say... something like a 360MM AIO Liquid Cooler? Well today we test Deepcool's New 360MM Castle which is their best in the series for Cooling (and surprisingly does a good job on cooling).


Overclocking with a stock air cooler?? Is it even possible?
Apr 24, 2018
JayzTwoCents
When AMD released the Wraith cooler it was widely accepted as a decent stock cooler... what about AMD's new Prism cooler found bundled with the 2700x??

 

Yeah, they squeeze out the last drop, and how reliable will it be within the cards life span? Do a Dell to stop chances for increased RMA numbers? I'ts probably cheaper for AMD to subsidize their partners with real 14 Gbps chips out of the box.

MSI Says not all Radeon RX 5600 XT GPUs Can Hit 14 Gbps Memory Speed techpowerup.com | Today,
Just before the launch of AMD's latest Radeon RX 5600 XT graphics cards, AMD released a vBIOS update that boosts the GPU clock speed by a few percent margins and increases the GDDR6 memory speed from 12 Gbps to 14 Gbps, which is almost a 17% performance increase in memory bandwidth. However, despite the release of these new firmware updates, AMD's add-in-board partners like ASUS and MSI have been cautious about applying the new vBIOS to the existing cards. A YouTube show called the MSI Insider, which is hosted by MSI employees, explains the situation. Due to the GDDR6 memory, which was originally meant as a 12 Gbps chip, when applying the new firmware update to the card can lead to RMA issues with customers.

While some cards are capable of hitting 14 Gbps speeds with the GDDR6 chips, others are not as they were not certified to work at that frequency. Silicon lottery (not the company) of the memory chips plays a big role as the quality of the onboard DRAM will have a large impact on the ability to overclock to new frequencies. That's why MSI released an RX 5600 XT GAMING Z variant with 14 Gbps vBIOS already applied out of the box. ASUS also joined the party and launched the ASUS ROG STRIX TOP graphics card, which is the only 14 Gbps enabled cards in ASUS'es whole lineup. By launching GPU SKUs with 14 Gbps speeds out of the box, manufacturers can guarantee these speeds and not depend on silicon lottery which may cause them a few RMA troubles down the road.

 

Yeah, that doesn't sound right, and it doesn't make sense. It sounds more like FUD.

The MSI 5600XT Gaming X product page has a note about the firmware update:
https://www.msi.com/Graphics-card/Radeon-RX-5600-XT-GAMING-X

" Due to a recent vBIOS update, we recommend upgrading your RX 5600 XT using MSI’s Dragon Center Software to unlock additional performance.
Please follow these step-by-step instructions or contact MSI support if you run into any issues."

Downloading and reading the update instructions there is no mention or any reference to 12gbps => 14gbps memory OC, or any warnings about such an OC.

One of the steps does ask you to check the GPU frequency after the firmware update.

Update bios Step 6
Double check GPU clock is 1615MHz with GPU Z or others software.


I would expect that if the firmware was also OC'ing the memory the instructions would also have a step in the instructions on how to check that as well.

The specifications page does say the memory is 12gbps DDR6, so if someone out there gets a nice new 5600XT, please check your memory speed before and after applying the vbios firmware update and please let us know what you see:
https://www.msi.com/Graphics-card/Radeon-RX-5600-XT-GAMING-X/Specification

The clock boost + power limit increase should provide the advertised average ~10% improvement.

So yeah, it looks like FUDsters at work taking a go at AMD, trying to make a big deal over nothing, again.

 

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/not-all-amd-rx-5600-xt-14-gbps.

 

It makes perfect sense given AMD provided its board partners a set of specifications then at the 11th hour, 59th minute, and 59th second before launch decided to change it.

Yes. FUD. Coming from MSI's product marketing manager and marketing director. The people whose job it is to ensure a company's goods are portrayed in the best possible light so people will buy them.

 

RX 5900 XT Specs LEAK - Double Performance + Ray Tracing?!

 

AMD has responded and confirmed the supposedly new AMD coolers are Fakes, and I updated my original response:

AMDeepfakes? AMD Confirms 6-Pipe Wraith Prism Coolers Are Counterfeit
By Zhiye Liu 13 hours ago
For a knockoff, the six-heat pipe Wraith Prism sure looks real.
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/counterfeit-amd-wraith-prism-coolers-are-entering-the-market

"...AMD has confirmed that the Wraith Prism cooler with six heat pipes that recently showed up on XFastest is a knockoff. At the current time, the chipmaker has no plans to release a revised version of the Wraith Prism."

An update...do the same as I did above check out the card's product page, download the new Vbios Firmware / instructions, and make sure the card with updated firmware and specifications give's you what you want before buying. See these videos for variations on the 5600xt by make / model, and make sure you are getting a card that performs and costs the way you want and expect before buying it:

News Corner | Not All RX 5600 XTs Get GDDR6 VBIOS Boost, AMD Stuffs Up Launch
Jan 24, 2020
Hardware Unboxed
News Topics:
00:00 - Lingering Radeon RX 5600 XT Launch Issues
06:55 - EVGA RTX 2060 KO Hides TU104
08:48 - AMD Improves Wraith Prism Box Cooler
[Update - AMD says they are Fake Coolers and are not by AMD ]
09:56 - Intel to Introduce ATX12VO Power Supply Spec
11:24 - Various Intel Rumors


AMD Radeon RX 5600 XT: A Good GPU Today, But What About Tomorrow?
Jan 24, 2020
Digital Foundry
Yes, there''s been the whole 'bait and switch' BIOS update situation but is the question we need to be answering more fundamental? With next-gen console features not in first-gen Navi, is it time to consider future-proofing in your GPU purchase? Should you consider the price-cut RTX 2060 or maybe the best strategy of all is just to wait a little while in what is a big transition period for gaming?


IDK about doing this, but I know a lot of people have done this with various AMD GPU's, so be careful, YMMV, no warranty expressed or implied.

How to Flash your RX 5700 into a 5700 XT - FREE Performance! (with benchmarks vs 5600 XT / 5700 XT)
Jan 23, 2020
Tech YES City
If you have an RX 5700, then it's most likely that there is the same tier model above it in an RX 5700 XT form, and if so you will be able to force flash that into an "RX 5700 XT" (using atiflash which I will show you how to fully do in today's how to/ tutorial). This will grant you performance somewhere in between that of a regular 5700 and a 5700 XT (though more on the side of the 5700 XT). So in order to do this we need a few small apps and some command prompt commands .

 

Very interesting details, looking forward to the rest of his many video's on this subject...

How AMD Radeon Sabotages Itself & Its Partners: Development Timelines & Failures
Jan 26, 2020
In this video, we're talking about AMD's VBIOS change for the RX 5600 XT and how it has more deeply impacted its supply chain than we previously discussed. We're using this opportunity to recap the manufacturing supply chain and product development timelines, alongside some memory overclocking concerns (e.g. going from 12Gbps to 14Gbps and the impact that has on production). AMD's Radeon division keeps sabotaging itself and its partners, and to help illustrate how the VBIOS change does that, we've recapped the manufacturing process.


IDK why Steve doesn't just make a positive effort instead of playing the drama queen on this. It's not helpful.

The reason AMD did this firmware update after the fact is because Nvidia drastically dropped the price of some of their 2060's, down $50+ after the configurations had been set, and that torpedoed AMD's 5600XT release.

Fortunately AMD had left OC headroom in this release so they had another alternative other than also dropping their prices to match Nvidia's drop. Is it a PIA to deal with this, yes of course, and it will vary depending on the vendor.

AMD could have dropped the price of the 5600XT but it wouldn't have been the right decision, as AMD had plenty of OC room left in the 5600XT and was "hotter" than it's performance slot between the 5500XT and 5700, so the best choice was to enable the performance reserved for OC for everyone.

This is one of those great examples of why AMD needs to continue to release their CPU's and GPU's at full performance - don't withhold any performance from users leaving OC potential. Sorry, OC sport enthusiasts

I hope Gamers Nexus is going to have Steve go through 5600XT's make by make and model by model and test the vendor downloadable firmware update + VRAM OC as recommended by the vendor, and then put out episodes building a chart of all the options for potential owners with price / performance.

 

Yeah, you all should blame AMD for this one Give out halfbaked will turn back on you if the competitors have a better value out already (performance). If they can’t lower prices then increase performance Before release!

 

AMD were between a rock and a hard place, and the best decision is the one they made, but it's going to take work to manage it, and buyers will have some research to do to get what they want at the price they want it.

The Nvidia 2060 price was changed after the AMD 5600XT was all ready to go, you do know that right?

Nvidia did what they always try to do, screw up AMD releases, and this time is one of Nvidia's better psyops, causing the physical re-work needed in China to switch to the new specifications for new cards ready to ship.

But, you won't blame Nvidia even though Nvidia clearly is the cause of AMD's dilemma, because you always look for something to cry about AMD.

Also, did you note, Steve says the 5600xt has the highest sell rate through his channel affiliations - so at least real people that want and need the card are figuring out what to do.

Hopefully Steve will cry it out soon and start doing helpful content to all those people that bought their 5600xt's through his channel, and all those that still want to buy a 5600xt. It's really not that hard.

 

(All right, more like 4-1/2 hours later, but the point stands.)

 

This is something that was posted by a notebookcheck poster a few days ago, noting how OEM's (such as Lenovo) sabotage AMD laptops in regards to cooling (at least when it comes to APU's:

It certainly illustrates how long standing AMD OEM 'partners' can gimp modern Ryzen laptops with previous iterations of Zen (1 and+).

This certainly gets me quite irked about general OEM behaviour.
Either they choose to pair the APU with single-channel RAM, slow components, lower quality hw in general, lower capacity batteries, but charge same or higher vs a comparable Intel system is just plain absurd.

I was under the impression that Intel bribery was supposed to be over. How are the OEM's getting away with this nonsense to this day?

Designing 'thin and light' systems with 15-28W TDP APU's is not exactly a problem if you modify the cooling to accommodate such a design in the first place.

One notable mention in a high performance laptop (aka desktop replacement) would be the GL702ZC which suffers from too high noise and a clear indication that Asus cut corners in regards to cooling despite having a massive 17 inch chassis to work with.

This IS the 21st century... so why aren't most empty spaces inside a laptop part of a cooling assembly which lower the ambient temperature? Its not like its impossible to 'stretch' the cooling assembly to accommodate that.

Also, OEM's should be VERY clear which TDP parts are inside which units, and HOW are they configured.
In many cases, even a 15W TDP constrained APU isn't really performing as it should (never-mind the fact we almost never see any APU's that go up to the rated 25-28W TDP).

 

Timmy Joe set's out to recommend the 1070ti over the 5600xt, surprise twist...

TL;DW, get the 5600xt, flash BIOS update, OC, enjoy.

The 5600xt worth buying over a cheaper 8GB used GPU?
Jan 29, 2020
Timmy Joe PC Tech
Can the new AMD Radeon 5600xt be the better buy over used cards like the GTX 1070ti? Gigabyte sent over their 5600xt gaming OC 6GB card for review and I was surprised at how good a value the 5600xt really is!


Another happy Navi Upgrader, happy *after* he used DDU to clean out old drivers in Safe mode:

Received my 5700DD Ultra yesterday. went from ultra blackscreening to perfectly working in 15mins
submitted an hour ago by koriwi
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/ew3xwr/received_my_5700dd_ultra_yesterday_went_from/

"Hi guys,

i destroyed my 1070 with some AIO watercooling experiments (successful in the end) and got an almost new xfx5700dd ultra for 265€. So far so good.
Popped it in my (soon to be replaced) rig with 6700k and MSI Z170 Pro Carbon. Started the superposition benchmark to stress my new GPU and BOOM!
The screen was more black than displaying superposition. And some weird horizontal artifacts, too.

So i restarted windows 10 into safemode after downloading DDU. Removed all nvidia drivers and removed all old AMD drivers which were automatically installed after installing the 5700.
Restarted and immediately went into the bios. Set PCIe speed of slot 0 from auto to GEN3. Saved, rebooted into windows and installed newest drivers from AMDs website.

Now i started superposition again and everything was perfect.

In the beginning i was afraid to go for this card because of all the negative experiences people had and posted about. But if I'm stupid enough to crack a 1070 while jerry rigging my Liquid Freezer 2 280 to it, I'm also stupid enough to just go for it (jk). I have to admit i was a bit afraid when wittnessing the ominous black screen issues myself. But i wanted to give it a shot and try to fix it if i experience these issues myself. I just did the standard procedure and everything went fine

Trivia:
WQHD 144Hz (no freesync capability) screen connected with DP."

kaisersolo 11 points 53 minutes ago
"This guy gets its. Good Troubleshooting!"

How to FIX ALL RX 5700 / RX 5700XT Problems! | Easy Guide
Jan 17, 2020
Ancient Gameplays
Hello people! I did something close to this before, but since SO MANY PEOPLE have been asking me what to do and complaining that their RX 5700/XT Cards weren't working properly, i decided to do a small video tutorial on HOW to fix all these problems, what least the most common ones ofc. Let me know what your experiences in the comment section!


HOW TO Adrenalin 2020 | AMD Radeon 2020 Drivers EXPLAINED (20.01.4) RX 5700XT
Premiered Jan 12, 2020
Ancient Gameplays
Hello people! TODAY, after SEVERAL request from my viewers, i am finally DOING a video about "How to Adrenalin 2020". This is mostly a video about "this does that" and not a benchmark video. Hope you enjoy it Let me know what you think, in the comment section. Hope you enjoy the video. Comment with your thoughts about it. Don't forget to hit like, subscribe and share the video if you can.


How to Overclock / Undervolt AMD RX 5700 XT | Easy Guide Tutorial (AMD Wattman)
Premiered Dec 5, 2019
Hello people! Finally bringing you one of the awaited videos about RX 5700 XT! How to Overclock and Undervolt RX 5700 XT! This is a pretty simple "tutorial" that i hope helps someone. In case you have some doubts, simply leave them in the comment section Hope you enjoy the video. Comment with your thoughts about it. Don't forget to hit like, subscribe and share the video if you can.

Spoiler: Profile Settings...

Download my 20.01.4 (Adrenalin 2020) Settings here: https://link-to.net/13644/RX5700XTSaf...
Download my 20.01.3 (Adrenalin 2020) Settings here: https://up-to-down.net/13644/RX5700XT...
Download my 20.01.2 (Adrenalin 2020) Settings here: https://link-to.net/13644/RX5700XTSaf...
Download my 20.01.1 (Adrenalin 2020) Settings here: https://link-to.net/13644/RX5700XTSaf...
Download my 19.12.2 (Adrenalin 2020) Settings here: https://link-to.net/13644/RX5700XT19122
Download my 19.12.1 Settings here: https://link-to.net/13644/RX5700XT19121

 

New AMD certification suggests the “Nvidia Killer” Big Navi GPU release date is close

https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/big-navi-release-date

Very interesting.
It seems historically that after a new certification appears for an AMD gpu, the actual GPU becomes available for purchase about a month later.

We also know AMD is planning a refresh of existing Navi lineup... but there's some confusion in how its worded:

AMD Confirms Radeon Refresh With RDNA 2-Based Navi 7nm+ GPUs Landing In 2020
https://hothardware.com/news/amd-confirms-radeon-navi-refresh-gpus-2020

"So, in 2019, we launched our new architecture in GPUs, it’s the RDNA architecture and that was the Navi based products. You should expect that those will be refreshed in 2020 and will have next generation RDNA architecture that will be part of our 2020 lineup..."

If I'm reading that accurately, the 'refresh' of existing Navi line could mean that it will actually sport the RDNA 2 uArch... or it just means existing RDNA 1 uArch on 7nm+ process... which wouldn't be much... unless it came with a big price cut (and of course RDNA 2 high end parts).

Wouldn't it be better for AMD to just focus all their attention on RDNA 2 and scale it appropriately?
The 'refresh' would certainly be better if it had RDNA 2... which (if you ask me) makes more sense rather than rehashing older uArch.
I mean, if you have a new uArch that's basically 'complete', just make a whole new GPU line with it.
Refreshes of older uArch's on new processes (however minor) should probably be reserved if your new uArch isn't ready for release... but for AMD, they usually release higher end GPU's and then 'modify' them to cut our CU's or reduce clocks to create cheaper versions for mid and low range, so this shouldn't be much of a problem.

 

Yeat, again not much for the notebooks.


Opinion | AMD confirms disappointing Radeon RX 5700M and RX 5600M specifications notebookcheck.net | Feb 3, 2020

AMD informed the world at CES 2020 that the Radeon RX 5700M and RX 5600M would be arriving in laptops in 1H 2020, but offered nothing in the way of other details about its flagship laptop GPUs. Now, the company has confirmed that both will feature 2,304 stream processors, 36 compute units and GDDR6 VRAM. There is a caveat with the latter though, and it could hand an advantage to NVIDIA. In short, AMD could have blown it with the Radeon RX 5700M and RX 5600M before they even come to market.

 

These are AMD's first laptop GPU's in a long time, and comparing the 5700M spec's they are very close to the RX5700 specs:
https://www.amd.com/en/products/specifications/compare/graphics/9016,8466

The whole line up of mobile GPU's would then start at the desktop 5700 as the top end, and fill out the mid-range with the rest of the sku's:
https://www.amd.com/en/products/specifications/compare/graphics/9016,9031,8911,8976

To me it looks exactly like I would expect.

Why would you - or anyone - expect the mobile GPU's to outperform the desktop GPU's of the same generation?

 

3990x, it's here...

Red Digital Cinema gets 64-core Performance with the AMD Ryzen™ Threadripper™ 3990X
Feb 7, 2020
AMD
Red Digital Cinema, creators of Red Camera, implement the massive performance of the AMD Ryzen™ Threadripper™ 3990X into their 8K editing workflow to game-changing results.
Discover more: https://www.amd.com/en/products/ryzen...


AMD Threadripper 3990X Review: Intel’s 18-cores, Crushed by AMD’s 64-cores
Feb 7, 2020
Hardware Unboxed


It's hard to watch, but I can't look away - Threadripper 3990X
Feb 7, 2020
Linus Tech Tips
With 64 cores and 128 threads, Threadripper has finally dethroned even Intel’s biggest configurations at a price far lower, to boot. Could it be too good to be true?


AMD Threadripper Launch -- Build & Initial Benchmarks
Streamed live 2 hours ago
Level1Techs
The 3990X is launching!! Thanks to microcenter for letting me run benchmarks on their build!


AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X w/ THERMOSIPHON IceGiant Prototype
Feb 7, 2020
KitGuruTech
It's another incredible launch for AMD today - We have no idea how Intel are going to answer this - they are now so far behind!
Read our full review here: http://bit.ly/2w13Q5T

Spoiler: Index

Today Luke takes a look at the new, incredibly powerful AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X 64 core / 128 thread processor. It's a complete monster - and proved challenging to overclock. We managed to get hold of the new IceGiant ProSiphon Elite Prototype to overclock the processor and we recorded power draw of up to 900 watts when we let it work its magic with untapped BIOS settings. It was quite a tough task the cool, but the ProSiphon Elite was up to the task.

00:16 The AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X!
00:40 Processor details and overview
02:50 Test System Details
04:38 CPU clock performance details
05:29 Overclocking 64 cores is challenging !
06:27 IceGiant ProSiphon Elite Cooler Prototype Teaser for later !
06:45 Some (amazing) performance results
11:10 Why would you need this processor and what are the potential issues?
15:20 Power Consumption results
16:47 Power Consumption performance per watt
17:45 Wraith Ripper Temperatures
18:51 IceGiant ProSiphon Elite Prototype Cooler
21:10 ProSiphon Elite Performance results (wow!)
24:46 AMD 3990X - how good is it and do you really need it?
28:32 Threadripper 3000 and TRX40 platform lead the way - here is why.
29:54 Scaling discussion and adoption
31:21 Business uses
32:41 KitGuru’s closing thoughts

And, a new contender for the Noctua D15...works great on Ryzen, but there isn't a model for ThreadRipper's...

Part 1: NOCTUA in trouble? - Leo tests the NEW Zalman CNPS20X / CNPS17X!
KitGuruTech
Today Leo takes a look at two new coolers from Zalman - a company we haven't heard much from in quite some time. Do Noctua need to be worried in 2020? Leo finds out all the gory details !
Full review with more details here: https://www.kitguru.net/components/le...


Part 2: Noctua NH-D15 v Zalman CNPS20X - NEW SAMPLE tested!
Feb 5, 2020
KitGuruTech
Our review a few days ago has caused a lot of debate. So much so that we felt we should go back and get more details and further information from some retests. We got another Noctua D15 sample on our test bench and reran a lot of tests. Thanks to Noctua for being such a great group of guys to work with!

 

The 3990x broke a few records today:

SurfaceDockGuy 8 hours ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/commen..._pushes_amd_ryzen_threadripper_3990xs/fgttyxy

Looks like the overclocker is getting 5.5GHz on ONE core with 60 cores parked at 600Mhz: https://valid.x86.fr/30db6z

But wow what a Cinebench score: [39518]
https://hwbot.org/submission/4347415_splave_cinebench___r20_ryzen_threadripper_3990x_39518_marks

AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X's 64 Cores Overclocked to 5.5 GHz in World Record
When having 64 cores simply isn't enough.
By Zhiye Liu 12 hours ago
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-ryzen-threadripper-3990x-overclock-record

"Today, we dropped our AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X review while overclockers dropped a number of world records around the chip. A professional overclocker known as TSAIK overclocked all 64 cores to a clock speed of 5,548.71 MHz using liquid nitrogen (LN2).

Careful selection of the proper hardware is key to setting world records, of course. TSAIK paired his Threadripper 3990X with MSI's Creator TRX40 motherboard and a single stick of DDR4 RAM clocked at 1,866 MHz with 13-13-13-31 CL timings.

GPUPI for CPU - 1B, Geekbench 3 multi-core and Cinebench R20 benchmarks with his chip overclocked to 5,475.43 MHz, 5,375 MHz and 5,305.88 MHz, respectively. Unlike TSAIK, Splave went with the ASRock TRX40 Taichi motherboard.

Meanwhile, safedisk now has the highest scores for wPrime 1024m and Cinebench R15. His Threadripper 3990X was clocked at 5,125 MHz for the first benchmark and 5,225 MHz for the latter.

Given the processor's more than generous core and thread counts, the Threadripper 3990X will likely become a new favorite toy for extreme overclockers."

Overclocker Pushes AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X's 64 Cores to 5.5 GHz in World Record
Posted by u/black_fang_XIII 11 hours ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/f0dqw1/overclocker_pushes_amd_ryzen_threadripper_3990xs/

The $6,747 base price is cheaper than the MacPro entry level model:

System76 'Thelio Major' Ubuntu Linux desktop gets jaw-dropping 64-core AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X option
By Brian Fagioli, Published 2 hours ago
https://betanews.com/2020/02/07/system76-thelio-major-amd-3990x/
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/f0lf42/system76_thelio_major_ubuntu_linux_desktop_gets/

"...So, how much does a Thelio Major with Threadripper 3990X cost?

The starting price with that chip is actually quite reasonable at $6,747. If that price seems astronomically high to you, then the computer likely isn't meant for you. Don't take that statement as an insult -- most people don't need a 64-core processor.

Those that do need such a beast can absolutely understand spending such money on a tool that can get work done. If you decide to max-out the specifications during the configuration process, you can easily exceed $15,000!

Ready to buy your own 64-core Linux super computer? You can configure and purchase a Thelio Major with AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X here."

" A final thought. The AMD TR 3990X is amusingly priced at $3990. It’s a great marketing idea, and gets people talking. I’m proud to say that this price was my idea – AMD originally had it for something different. I don’t often influence change in the industry in such an obvious way, but this one was fun."
https://www.anandtech.com/show/15483/amd-threadripper-3990x-review/6

True story: the $3990 price tag on the 3990X is @IanCutress's doing. https://t.co/7CpuwubS6L
— Ryan Smith (@RyanSmithAT) January 6, 2020

link
I found this article a bit baffling, frankly. I did not understand the "out of chaos" titling at all...

But anyway--it should be obvious what AMD is doing here--people running desktops for gaming running Win10 home or Pro are *not* the people the CPU is aimed at--the CPU is aimed at Prosumers who would rather not spend $20k for Intel's inferior solutions but would rather spend $4k for a faster cpu solution and save a cool $16k in the bargain and come out with something appreciably faster.

Yes, people are going to run this with Enterprise--duh...

You aren't going to spend money on a 128t cpu and then run it with a 64t OS--don't even know why Win10 and Win10 Pro were mentioned at all--other than to state they shouldn't be used with the CPU--which would take but a single sentence.

Then there the handful of benchmarks used here--how many threads do each of these benchmarks support at maximum? Article didn't say--so that was sort of a strike out, etc.

I think Anandtech needs to come back and do this review properly--as it stands, this one makes it seem like the only "chaos" involved is the obvious confusion in the minds of the Anandtech reviewers.... (No offense)

Simply put: if Intel couldn't sell $20k cpu systems Intel wouldn't make them--so obviously, there's a market for 128t cpus--again, duh.

You can do much better than Intel at a fraction of the cost--and there's your market! No chaos at all.

Also: this CPU is very new--there remain the usual AGESA bios improvements that need to be made in the upcoming months, etc. That fact should have garnered at least a sentence, don't you think?

In the past I've seen much better reviews than this--especially for the world's first and only 128t single CPU!"

AMD's 3990x is beyond the ability of almost all of the reviewers we rely on for our "gaming" laptop and desktop reviews.

With the 3990x AMD has pushed the consumer market beyond it's ability to comprehend and make use of it, which is great, I'm excited to see what consumer software and applications follow these large core count resources into the market in the next 5 to 10 years.

 

Well at least we know now why AMD let the rumor go about the WRX80 as then maybe 512 GB ram would be supported or better.