AMD's Ryzen CPUs (Ryzen/TR/Epyc) & Vega/Polaris/Navi GPUs

For Intel HEDT, 4-10 core chips released in June, 12 core, I believe, was in August. AMD 10-16 cores are summer 2017, which means between June and August.

Now, because of the specific designs and feature sets, with gaming out of the picture (so no one can really fall back on to keep saying Intel is so much better), it will depend on the specialized workflows of the software and the nature of the workstation as to which will be best for which user. There is no clear winner, as heavily multithreaded applications that can fully utilize AMDs architecture will do better on its flagship, while those that need the slight speed boost and IPC will need Intel. This goes right back to our previous discussion.

When we move to Epyc and Xeon, the specialization is even more pronounced, especially with the extra PCIe support with AMD and the 8-channel memory.

I'm not saying there is a clear winner, but this is very exciting for choice!!!

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http://www.anandtech.com/show/11403/amd-unveils-the-radeon-vega-frontier-edition

Absolutely insane, now lets see how much it costs and the actual performance lol

 

I am sure after Epye's release, I'll be able to see its performance in person. Ryzen Threadripper does really interest me for my home computing.

It's going to be between Intel and AMD this summer and may the best platform as a whole win. I already have my case and PSU waiting. Whoever I choose will have my money and attention for the next three years at minimum.

Edit: If my company does offer Epye products, it likely won't be until two quarters from now.

 

Because of the winner in 2019, and my specific use case, I'm likely going AMD on an HEDT setup. The life span did it for me. But MB manufacturers still have to bring their support, or it means nothing. Same is true of software vendors. Without the ecosystem on which to build, doesn't matter if you have the raw materials to build an amazing structure. It would be like putting the Sydney Opera House in a toilet.

So come on motherboard manufacturers! Don't do like you did with Ryzen! Software companies are either working on it or coming around.

Edit: but, the Zen socket should be good for the long haul. Intel will switch sockets going to Ice/Tiger, so no loss if you go SL-X now, then Zen 2/3 later...

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AMD 2017 Financial Analyst Day Highlights

 

The video editor did a fantastic job.

I am totally hyped!

 

NCIX Tech Tips - Summary of AMD + Google IO 2017
RX Vega Frontier Edition, Ryzen Threadripper, Google I/O Day One Roundup

 

Intel denies story of license deal with AMD-Guru3d.com

 

That's a nice trick, create a financially damaging event against AMD made up completely from rumor, just when AMD is rolling over Intel in heavy armor, destroying Intel on the field of battle, nice one Intel

 

AMD Ryzen™ powers Evil Geniuses

 

What am I missing? How is Intel responsible for the rumor(s)? Speaking the truth about their involvement with AMD isn't a 'trick'; it should be commended.

As for AMD destroying Intel on the field of battle while rolling over Intel in heavy armour? Uhm... I haven't seen one Intel platform that has been traded in for an AMD one... yet.

 

Actually, in the low to mid mainstream category, you are wrong. For gaming and high-end mainstream, absolutely correct, with caveats, although they have done enough for Intel to drop process for competition. As for HEDT, server, APU, and laptop, not yet fighting, but coffee is going to really effect the laptop and APU fight more than AMD fans think. But, AMD will deal large blows in workstation AMD server market share.

But, to date, except in certain categories you ignore, you are correct.

Edit: also, game streamers are picking up on AMD, so, that is a caveat.

But, lots of hype on both sides.

Intel did the right thing here. A rumor supposedly confirming the deal was published. They had to make a public statement correcting it within a couple days or they would have violated securities laws. They did the right thing. Blame the rumor mill. If you can prove Intel started the rumor in the first place, then you might have a fraud case, as it affected another company's stock, but was not to affect their own stock price.

Edit 2: initial analysis down with no coffee and splitting headache.

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Intel to Further Bundle Optane memory With 200 motherboards-Guru3d.com

"It seems Intel is hurting in PC sales due to a 'weak demand'in the PC DiY market. Hence Intel is pushing its motherboard partners to bundle Optane memory, much like MSI recently did. Motherboard manufacturers aren't too happy about it though as the bundle increases price, and Optane really isn't in demand at all." Yeah, Intel pushing for sales Maybe AMD is one of the reasons for this?

 

It is because Optane has no benefit for the average consumer and the marketing on it sucks!

What they need to push is teaching gamers to set it up to replace an SSD. Buy a 2TB HDD, install all those 60GB games on it (32-40 games), then never have to uninstall a game for space, risk losing files, etc. But you don't see that in the consumer literature much to push to gamers. You get about as much as I wrote. If you don't make it easy, people will go with what they know.

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Ok, personally I've seen enough hype video's. I am ready to see the real meat and potato's.

Edit; Since there is little to no OEM ryzen systems about the only way to obtain one is OEM or custom build. I am sure this is eating into previous Intel only markets. I can see where Optane is exclusive to a platform trying to push it for the platforms sake but to be honest for most out there this enhancement does not warrant that platform over another.

 

I really wanted to Photoshop a picture with Epyc chip on one side, thread ripper on the other... Vega would be there somewhere... Horrible joke, back to business.

I definitely agree there is no reason to prefer on the basis of Optane. What they are really mad about is Intel wants to bundle to push Intel memory sales for the quarter, which had large growth last quarter, but motherboard manufacturers bet big on z270 and didn't expect Ryzen popularity, which hurts their inventory and price/marketing more. Or, at least, that is my hypothesis.

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The AMA is over, plenty to read, about 362 comments now

Answers:
https://www.reddit.com/user/gfxchiptweeter

AMA END:
Update [3:05 PM PST]: Hey /r/amd, we're ending the AMA here. Thanks to everyone who participated!

We are Radeon Technologies Group at AMD, and we’re here to answer your questions about Radeon Vega Frontier Edition! Raja joins May 18, 2 to 3 PM PST—it’s time to AMA.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/6bklro/we_are_radeon_technologies_group_at_amd_and_were/
"Hello, everyone!

Today, we’re talking Vega. We announced the Radeon Vega Frontier Edition on Tuesday, our graphics card to empower the new generation of pioneers and visionaries.

If you haven’t heard about the Radeon Vega Frontier Edition, it is our graphics card built on the new Vega architecture to propel data science and new technologies forward. Having spent years preparing to enable the next generation of data scientists, game developers, VR creators and product designers, we’re thrilled to unveil this card’s capabilities to you all."

 

We also got 3 wallpapers out of it.

http://rtg.re/frontier http://rtg.re/frontierAIO http://rtg.re/frontierBEFIRST

 

Asus ROG teases the world's first AMD Ryzen BGABOOK-Pcworld.com

 

Asus ROG teases the world's first AMD Ryzen laptop
"Something has awakened."
Brad Chacos Senior Editor, PCWorld | MAY 18, 2017 12:24 PM PT
http://www.pcworld.com/article/3197...teases-the-worlds-first-amd-ryzen-laptop.html

"Just days ago, AMD promised that Ryzen-powered laptops will hit the streets in the third quarter—sometime in July through September. But it looks like we won’t need to wait quite that long to get our first glimpse of a Ryzen notebook, going by an intriguing new teaser video on Asus’s Republic of Gamers YouTube page.

Spoiler: More details...

The video doesn’t spill many beans, but it doesn’t need to in order to get its point across. In it, a laptop sits in shadow in front of Ryzen’s circular orange logo. The ROG branding slowly fades in on the notebook’s lid, with the words “something has awakened” appearing at the bottom. The video’s brief description includes the #Computex2017 hashtag.

Asus will be revealing a Ryzen gaming laptop at Computex in two weeks, in other words (and as first spotted by Overclock3D).

So what? Well, this is the first-ever Ryzen laptop that we’re aware of, and because it’s the ROG brand, you can bet it won’t be a cheap ho-hum effort—Asus reserves ROG for high-quality gaming gear. But what we’re reallyinterested in is details about which processor family hums in the belly of this beast. AMD’s Ryzen-based “Raven Ridge” APUs will launch in notebooks in the third quarter, but they’re paired with Radeon Vega graphics cores. Radeon Vega isn’t out until late June, and the debut Radeon Vega Frontier Edition isn’t even targeted toward gamers. That suggests Vega graphics cards and mobile solutions may not be available for a few months yet.

If that winds up being the case, this ROG Ryzen laptop might use a more straightforward—and thus far unannounced—mobile variant of AMD’s standard Ryzen CPUs instead. It’s a long shot—AMD’s only previewed APUs thus far. Or maybe consumer Vega will launch right around the same time as the Frontier Edition. Or maybe this laptop will take a while to actually launch. Time will tell!

AMD says Ryzen laptops will provide a 50-percent boost in CPU performance, a 40-percent boost in GPU performance, and use 50 percent less power than the APUs it offers today.

Why this matters: Ryzen notebooks represent AMD’s return to high-performance mobile chips, but they’re far from the only hardware AMD has up its sleeve this summer. As detailed at the recent Financial Analyst Day, AMD’s got a hurricane of hardware planned, spanning CPUs and GPUs, from desktops to laptops to servers. While you’re waiting to hear more about this Ryzen’d ROG system, catch up on AMD’s big PC hardware plans, or read PCWorld’s Ryzen CPU explainer to learn what all the hub-bub’s about."

 

If they think it's going to get a pass because it has a Ryzen label on it, they can bite me. If it is BGA, then it's instantly disqualified as an unacceptable piece of garbage as far as I am concerned. No point in even looking at it for a few seconds... scratch it off the list and move on... nothing to see but filth. Don't care whether it runs well or not, because it doesn't matter. Trash is trash, whether it comes from Team Red or Blue is totally irrelevant. That this is an ASUS ROG turdbook merely exacerbates the disgust-factor.

 

You can blame the game for the BGA. AMD is trying to compete with Intel and thereby is doing so with the platform standards for them as well. I think it would have been nice to have a socketed platform instead of following Intel as it would have garnered more support from the enthusiast community.

 

Yeah, I would have hoped AMD would have used a little more intelligence. Just because Intel jumps off a cliff doesn't mean they should. Apparently, they lack the intelligence to figure that out. Sad... real sad.

 

Since present Ryzen cores have no media issues with heat transfer I suspect Mobile in BGA form will have little issues over what would have been socket. This, other than the non substituteable CPU issues, leads me to believe AMD should not have junk. This may be a wrong assessment but the way I would tend to lean. I am much more excited over AMD's mobile in BGA form than that of Intel's.

 

Uhm... no, I'm not wrong. I haven't seen one Intel platform swapped out for an AMD one yet...

High, low or mid mainstream category or not.

Just because something better comes out (even if right now it's just theoretically better); doesn't necessarily mean what you have is turned into garbage.

 

You state Optane has no benefit and then go on to state the benefit... sigh...

No manufacturer will publish what you typed (a very, very, very specific scenario) - their products are more general purpose than that.

I will be most interested in this notebook - after a full review is available to evaluate...

What will make or break this for me will be battery life. Time will (soon) tell...

 

Maybe Ryzen for notebooks will focus more heavily on graphics and battery life. Same ****y as Intel. Maybe push for lower TDP as well. And all ODM's can shrink the laptops further with even more gimped cooling. The main reason for going with welded on junk. Oh'well

Btw. More news
More on Ryzen Memory Support, Game Performance And Ryzen 3 Launch-Guru3d.com

 

Yes you are. When upgrading there were plenty that from Intel prior gens to Ryzen in desktop. Whether you saw it does not determine whether it happened. That is false logic. I never saw the civil war. So that must not have happened by your logic. Ignorance.

What I typed is very specific and benefits very few individuals is why. Plus, the cost of the large HDD+Optane must outweigh the inconvenience of reinstalling and cost. Most gamers don't need access to all of their games at once. Normal users don't need that at all. Outside of that, it is if you have one 4 lanes PCIe, you get a slightly faster speed, but the current offerings have much lower capacity than comparably priced NVMe drives, which are faster than Optane in raid striping. Finally, unless you need low Q-depth (most consumers wouldn't notice except in measures like boot, which is just a stupid way to measure an SSD worth), there isn't much value for the consumer.

I agree with @Mr. Fox here, give me the PGA Ryzen over the BGA crap. Hoping Clevo can help on that. But, considering Coffee is around the corner, if they don't give me the 8 core big boy, give me the 6-core coffee by Christmas and we'll call it good, if they stopped screwing with the mxm format in their machines.

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I expect you should forget 8 core big boy in the first round of laptops. It will be 6-core coffee!! AMD and some ODM will have more enough with pushing out Ryzen BGA chips!!

 

Ryzen 8-core 1700(X) or 1800X in laptops is a dream, one only Clevo could/is likely to fulfill, which isn't very likely.

But, AMD already dominates low-end and mid-grade laptops without discrete graphics. Those $300 cheapies. Now, companies are looking to increase their margin in this category by going ARM, which is why Ryzen being able to compete moving up the scale is so essential. With Vega there AMD BW-E IPC, so long as there isn't a large mobile premium, you could definitely see AMD growth in the laptop segment, even if we aren't interested in the offerings.

So, I do think these chips are good for its bottom line. I'm just indifferent on BGA.

Coffee desktop in a laptop before year end, with the highest IPC likely until around 10nm++ process for Intel side, that makes a bit of sense of I also build an AMD TR home server.

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Expect AMD this time will go after Intel's best offering for laptops. Not only low end and mid-grade laptops without discrete graphics. See Asus Rog in my previous post.

 

What you guys are forgetting is the collusion of Intel with the major manufacturers. It has happened before and it will happen again, probably even now. Even when AMD chips were competitive, major players like Dell and Acer and HP were not marketing AMD chips and would place them in bottom end machines and price them so they were far from competitive. Intel machines would get the shiny new displays, all the latest ports, in a slim metal body. AMD ULV chips would go in a 15" behemoth plastic and metal chassis with subpar screens and components.

AMD has to do what they can even if it means cutting costs by going BGA. I'm not a fan of BGA, but it's the reality we live in now, like it or not. Interchangeable parts in a laptop are going away, unfortunately. Even now RAM is even being soldered to the mainboards on many laptops. Heck, even batteries are near impossible to swap out any more, and that will limit the life of a laptop even though everything else runs just fine.

 

See my last words in previous post

 

I do agree. Just a matter of penetration. I'm wondering how far it will go and whether it will also make headway in business laptops, considering Lenovo's sales numbers (just talking that segment).

I do agree. But, in the past, Intel literally made illegal payments, colluded, AND left larger margins for the OEMs on the sale of the product. Considering how much Intel has been bilking OEMs on premium for mobile, plus the shrinking PC market, generally, they may be looking for new flash and good margins, which could help. But we'll really have to wait and see if they actually commit antitrust violations (which may happen considering the foxes are currently in charge of the hen houses; don't believe me, see the recent FCC moves on Net Neutrality).

 

BTW - Vulkan is merging so that now it is just OpenCL! Big news for AMD graphics card fans!
http://hexus.net/tech/news/software/105895-vulkan-opencl-will-merge-single-api/

 

Planned obsolescence, hopefully AMD will at least help ODMs who attempt to make a line of high end laptops that use socketed AMDs

 

If you mean a separate chip line, then unlikely. If you mean help with integration of desktop chip into a laptop, maybe, but with assurances it would be done WITHOUT putting them in a negative light. So, it depends on your meaning here.

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Your so called 'logic' is wack...

You cannot tell me what I have witnessed or not. Really, you can't. Sigh...

Low QD usage is where 99.9999% of the workstation workloads (i.e. single user workloads for the layman...) happen. EVERYONE cares about that. Because that is all they'll notice. sigh...

PGA, BGA, MXM? I don't give a dam about (and never have). All I care is that whatever is delivered works as promised. Everything above that is just gravy.

I don't really care how the tool is built. I just care for it to be built so that it performs better for me. Crying about the obsolescence of 5 1/4" floppies today is so 1990's...

And for the record: I understand that there are a few that can make the most of a system that is fully flexible to the user (i.e. Mr. Fox...), but there is just not enough $$$$$$$$$ to motivate more than a handful of companies to flood the market with their 'me too' designs and actually make a buck while they're at it.

 

No, I can't tell you what you've witnessed, but what you've witnessed does not mean it is a universal truth! You said no one has, then qualified with you haven't seen. To quote the movie Dr. STRANGE, "It's not about you."

As to SSDs, 512GB is a good spot, to 1TB. With the cost of Optane and changing work flows, plus setup optimization, many do not see it yet worth what Intel wants/is trying to shove down people's throats.

People here do care about component failure and lifespan, even if you don't.

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I understand that functionality has to come first, and I agree. But, it is unfortunate that you don't care how it is built because that's one of the reasons we have the plethora of trash. We will get nothing more than what we are willing to tolerate, and not a measure more. We have ourselves to blame collectively for allowing the ODMs and OEMs to profit from selling trash. If the people building them had any ethics to the way they do business they wouldn't sell BGA filth to anyone. They would leave that garbage for feces peddlers like Dell, Acer and Apple to sell to the bottom feeders of the world. Sadly, they don't. All they care about is how much junk they can sell en masse. All of the yuppies could buy the low-buck crap and the rest of us could have the good stuff, and those guided on principle would lose profit based on volume. The underlying issue is that those of us that know better and are willing draw a line in the sand and refuse to be part of their dung heap are outnumber by a very wide margin. We should have started educating them and building a culture of hate for BGA four or five years ago, and now we see the fallout from our complacency.

 

Do you know how to have a conversation?

I don't have to state a 'universal truth' every time I speak/type something. I expressed my point of view. Deal with it.

You, on the other hand, just keep piling up the pseudo facts to show how right YOU are (always). Yeah; it's not about you either.

An ~512GB SSD was a sweet spot about 4 years ago - today, anything (new) that you can buy in that range is garbage.

Intel isn't shoving anything down people's throats - they still have their free will to act on, right?

I care about total cost of ownership with the highest 24/7/365 performance possible over that lifespan. Most people don't think or buy like I do (until I can show them myself what they're actually missing...).

What gets me that aspect of highest 'compute' for the longest timeline at the lowest overall cost as outlined in the paragraph above is an Intel platform - the ones I have built to my spec's.

 

i meant the latter as a contrast to intel's refusal to help laptop ODMs with desktop cpus

 

Agreed 100% with all your points.

I don't buy anything that is unsuited for my purpose - that is just rewarding mediocrity.

 

Yet you push a drive that hasn't even pushed beyond that threshold to the public, calling nvme obsolete.

As to my ability to hold a conversation, ask the members of the forum, especially in the Clevo section. You pushing Intel in an AMD thread, literally marketing and cheerleading for them is why I have a problem with you. When you stopped, I stopped. Did you notice that? Then you went back to it. @Mr. Fox on my contributions.

Edit: or @Papusan, or @bloodhawk, or @triturbo, who already blocked you, etc.

Edit 2: your statement before in not caring so long as it works directly contradicts the later statement Mr. Fox made addressing your not caring if it was BGA. Duplicity!

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Had all of the high performance notebook enthusiasts banned together and become a force to be reckoned with, we would have as much or maybe even more pull than desktop PC enthusiasts. But, we all kept to ourselves in our digital Cub Scout and Brownie troops. Asus, MSI, Alienware, Clevo... we all had our precious pet cliques and the cancer slowly crept in. It started with Asus and MSI, then the filthbook toys began to surface from Razer and Aorus (Gigabyte) and Lenovo pretended to have something special, and all the while the bubblegum gamer kiddos ate it up in massive quantities. Cheap thrills were plentiful to be had and none of them really knew how to tell the difference between garbage and good. With dollar signs in their eyes, the sell-out decision makers on a mission to enrich the coffers of shareholders allowed that cancer to metastasize and it spread to Alienware, and now Clevo is the last gladiator standing. That really sucks, and it's our fault collectively. And, it is largely due to the folly of fanboism and brand loyalty. I accept my part of the blame here. I was a stupid Alienware fanboy and thought the sewage would never flow in my direction... silly me. Nobody should have cared about brand. It should have been about what's on the inside that mattered most, but most of the Facebook generation was too ignorant to know and we allowed them get that way... without firing a shot.

 

Hence why I'm with you decrying! But, I have to make a caveat in your list for the MSI white books supporting desktop CPUs and still having MXM, although I don't know how long it will last. We must give credit, because without it, they WILL stop, guaranteed. Even Clevo screwed us around on MXM, not to rehash old rants!!!

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The problem with BGA and laptops is from the chip makers. In order to have a non-BGA laptop you need to find a builder using desktop designated CPU's in the box. Intel started this and now it seems AMD is following suit.

Not everyone can afford the cost of these systems. That is let alone the size, battery drain, etc.. So in the end we have to either accept what is coming or do with what we have.

 

Fight, fight the dying of the light...

Edit: AMD has debts and needs market share and margin, together. Intel has ****ed us in many ways, like telling us mobile is more efficient! An underclocked desktop CPU runs cooler, pulls less watts, and still performs better than the crappy mobile lineup.

But, the thin and light craze (**** Apple), caused the problem of creating cooling for full bore desktop chips, because they wanted to mimic that and razr

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@Mr. Fox - imagine a panther-esque product with a full back, four fan, with vapor chamber, even if it has to be single GPU (but probably 18" dual GPU) supporting the new HEDT chips from either side. Granted, you'd still need to thicken it up like the panther, but...

Unfortunately, it didn't sell as well at the time. But with the market for desktop socket development and cost of the Phoenix line, I bet it would do better than the first time. (And now I have the foreigner song "Feels like the first time" in my head)

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I agree. The Tornado F5 is actually smaller than I like a notebook to be, but supporting it and making it desirable is mission critical. I have to set aside my preference for something larger and get behind it because it is one of our last hopes for a desirable future with notebooks. Lots of people like smaller, and it is living proof that small doesn't have to mean BGA trash.

It is also disturbing that MSI builds this, but puts their brand on the trashbooks. I have a hard time finding respect for that. The opposite should be true.

We must not accept it in an expensive package. It should be $500 or less or unacceptable. There will be no future worth participating in if we accept this trash in an overpriced package with a "high performance" label attached to fake us out.

Yup, rain falls on the just and the unjust. The weeds grow among the flowers when there is no gardener to kill them. Eventually, the weeds will choke out the flowers and everyone will admire the pretty weeds. In fact, that's kind of where we are now. It's so sad that AMD wimped out on us. That automatically casts them as losers in my mind. They are launching from the staring line in a position of weakness and apathy. They should be ashamed for offering Ryzen in a soldered lower-power package. I am guilty of expecting them to fail as well based on their checkered past. This is just the confirmation of it now with an AMD-powered Asus turdbook on the horizon, and more of that trash likely to follow. Boo! Boo!