The Ultimate AMD Trinity Notebook List

As iamflang already mentioned, Kaveri is based on Steamroller.
However, Steamroller is supposed to be a 'Bulldozer done right'... an extra decoder (if I'm not mistaken) on each core (which would turn existing 'half-cores' into 'full/proper cores'), IPC enhancements ranging in about 45% (this was a conservative estimate from AMD - and I think this might have been in relation to Bulldozer, so from Piledriver, that would be about 30% IPC improvement - which would effectively be the same amount Intel did going from Nehalem to Haswell - about 20% rise was in SB, followed by about 3-5% on IVB, and finally another rough 5-10% from IVB to Haswell [this being more along the lines of 5% for real world situations and not benchmarks]), another 10% improvements on scheduling, and other modifications.

All in all, we cannot just estimate 30% improvements in single-threaded tasks for Kaveri, especially because we don't know what the overall impact on single-threaded and multi-threaded performance from all the stated 'improvements' will be.
I'm thinking that Kaveri might be able to finally match Intel in those tasks on the CPU front and quite possibly surpass Intel's Haswell offering - although, I'm not sure on the Iris Pro 5200 (but that one is more along the lines of a dedicated gpu slapped onto a CPU with an eDRAM chip - brute force approach that won't necessarily go into Intel's favor since consoles now sport AMD hardware and will probably be made with HSA in mind - which unlike OpenCL is far easier to code for).

AMD's Kaveri igp might not be on the level of Iris Pro, but it probably will get far closer with a much cheaper implementation and of course will have other things going for it.

I'm a bit anxious to see how Kaveri performs. I sincerely hope AMD delivers and even surpasses on their promises (which were over the past couple of years been on the mark).

 

Steamroller is an iteration/revision of HSA. Bulldozer was the first, Piledriver the second, and both of these were on 32nm. Steamroller is on 28nm, but with additional revisions, so it should me more of a jump than Llano to Trinity/Richland.

Long story short, Guagamela was referencing the Module/Core architecture, as opposed to the named iteration 'Bulldozer'.

Guagamela, While I think you're right for the short term, I don't think they NEED to chase down Intel down in the single thread benchmark anymore, at least not where mass market consumers are concerned. What is the typical consumer of this segment of devices going to do that's going to have more than a 2-5 second difference based on processor alone, let alone isn't going to be influenced by the surrounding components?

 

You understood what I meant. Piledriver is a refinement of Bulldozer, Steamroller will be a refinement of Piledriver. But the base architecture remains the same.
However, I disagree that AMD doesn't need to chase Intel. They need to do itbecause many of the software available today still is highly dependent on single thread performance.
Then there's also the issue, that although AMD is developing products that are tailored for mobile devices (notebooks, hybrids and tablets) the fact is that OEMs don't use their chips in the devices that would suit them best. Therefore, AMD still needs to compete in single thread performance and maintain a foothold on the dwindling desktop market where this architecture shows a lot of shortcomings compared with Intel's offerings.
I do believe we will see great improvements from AMD in terms of power consumption and IPC improvements but I am not expecting the world because in the last years AMD has underdelivered.

 

The base architecture will undergo changes (its not a minor refinement such as Piledriver was over Bulldozer). Steamroller will not have (at least per AMD statements) same 'shortcomings' that basically made Bulldozer and Piledriver seem like they had half-cores and underperforming single-threaded performance (compared to Intel).
AMD made it very clear they made changes to the existing architecture for Steamroller.

With AMD's inclusion of HSA into Steamroller/Kaveri and their hardware being in PS4 and XBox One, this will effectively change in the next 6 to 12 months. Multi-threaded performance will be much more important with single-threaded performance not really mattering that much.
But as I stated above... I do think Steamroller/Kavery will bring AMD sufficiently in line with Intel in single-threaded performance to present a viable alternative for programs that are heavily dependent on single-threaded performance.

I agree that AMD's products are suited much more for more mobile devices - while OEM's basically decide to put their hardware into ill-matching products that can also be overpriced and have a very pool build quality.

AMD's 'predictions' over the past few years were fairly accurate for their products performance (Piledriver, Trinity and Richland).
And while it is good not to have grandiose expectations... going by what AMD stated on Kaveri/Steamroller and IF those turn out to be correct, then they should be able to match Intel in single-threaded performance, and when the industry transitions more towards AMD based hardware in terms of games (from consoles) and multithreading in general that takes advantage of HSA (which seems to be adopted by developers), then I think AMD might experience a long-term boost of even larger proportions.

 

Trinity was actually worse than Llano, not an improvement, so no kidding AMD did not "catch up" in STP. Steamroller's new hardware, in a very similar architecture to Bulldozer/Piledriver will bring about 30% performance over Piledriver at the same clock rate, and expect them to be clocked higher too. That is 30% improvement in STP, which is a really nice leap, although no reason to really overcome Intel's STP. Steamroller will be more than adequate, while probably bringing their multi-threaded performance well over the top of Intel.

And the GPU performance increases in the low end parts is already like 75%, and they crammed more chipset pieces into it and at a lower power consumption. So the GPU on Kaveri, which has more space and more TDP headroom will probably be a 200% improvement over Richland.

 

Hey, I do hope so. But I think Deks is somking something funny if he thinks that AMD will be able to match Intel's single thread performance.
In no way in hell will AMD be able to give a leap to catch up to Intel Core i7's. I hope they manage to catch up to i5's considering multi thread performance as well. But then Haswell brought some quite epic improvements in efficiency (just look at the Macbook Air and that Sony Vaio tablet).

 

At a higher clock rate than the Intel parts, the AMD Steamroller STP could match that of Ivy Bridge parts. With certain STP benchmarks, AMD is approximately 30% behind Ivy Bridge parts. Now when you go to other specific benchmarks that Intel wrote new instructions for and got software developers to secretly optimize for, then Intel has other processing leads. So it is possible, 30% is a huge jump when 10% is typical. Steamroller is AMD meeting expected performance. Now Intel may have better performance per watt, but as long as AMD only has to compete on battery life and actually have similar performance, then they are much more viable. And then, then their superior iGPU becomes the major selling point, where they actually can offer superior performance. Without the CPU horsepower, AMD has not been able to capitalize on their GPU lead. Kaveri is something that actually has the potential to penetrate a lot of the higher end notebooks that come standard without discrete GPUs. If a 35W Kaveri puts a 28W Haswell Iris Pro to shame in raw performance, do you think the companies will ignore it?

 

Maybe we'll get access to Richland's configurable TDP? What if we could up that to say 45W and gave the APU more room to breath? Atom_Ant do you have any input on this with your Richland ES APU?

AMD Introduces Richland, the 2013 Elite Performance Processors for Notebooks

http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-launches-Kabini-Temash-and-Richland-APUs-for-notebooks-and-tablets.93181.0.html

 

For the record, I don't smoke. ;-)
As for what I wrote... I was using AMD's own estimates on what they provided about Steamroller in terms of architectural changes and said that if it pans out, it could approach/match Intel in single-threaded performance (which is seemingly relevant for the moment and also on its way out).
Granted, AMD's clock speed will likely be higher than Intel, but Kaveri/Steamroller will also be made on 28nm that uses a (supposedly) more efficient use of the die (densely packed) compared to Intel, and their cores were designed to operate on higher frequencies - so I think it will be possible for AMD to match Intel in large part and provide a more than viable alternative with Steamroller.
Power consumption could also experience an improvement what with all the architectural changes and the die shrink.

However, for the moment, until AMD releases more information and we actually see how Kaveri/Steamroller performs, we cannot make any final conclusions (which is why the above are estimates on how Kaveri/Steamroller might perform).

 

I'll remain skeptical. Intel has advantages not only in architecture but also on using FinFet and being in a 22nm node.
I don't believe that AMD will be able to catch up to the top of Intel line. I believe that maybe they can reach i5 performance level, with better GPUs (as usual). Performance per watt remains to be seen as well.

 

Actually, it might be possible AMD could reach mid class of i7 quad cores (probably not the extreme versions), because Steamroller won't have 'mini-cores', but rather 'proper' full-fledged cores that should be fully utilized for single-threaded tasks (something which Piledriver revision did NOT address).
Remember, AMD did architectural changes for exactly this reason. Intel will retain advantage in higher clocked extreme versions most likely, but also keep in mind that the most Intel did with Haswell was 5-10% (mostly 5% in real situations) for the CPU on clock per clock.
Here... you can examine what they say for Steamroller here:
AMD: We Are On Track With Steamroller Micro-Architecture in 2013 - X-bit labs

So... there's reason to be cautiously optimistic.

 

Well, lets hope so. I'm a bit jaded right now.
And lets also hope that OEMs start using AMD chips for something more than crapbooks.

 

I was also responding optimistically (a current trend of mine) but we will have to see if AMD delivers. I am hopeful that the change to Steamroller will address AMD's single-threaded issues, and if it does Kaveri is likely to be a big win. I for one hope that AMD's chips make it into some more business model laptops and 1080 IPS screens. AMD's Trinity APU couldn't handle gaming at that res, so I'm all right with the 1600x900 res I have now but for my next laptop I will not buy less than 1080. And there were not many desirable options for AMD this time around if just that box was ticked...

 

I think you are not understanding. Having the same STP is not the same as matching their Instructions per Clock. Thus why AMD would need to run the core at a higher frequency to get the same STP. Its not that hard to believe AMD would catch up, they have not always been behind. The goals of the AMD architecture were mainly for multi-threaded performance, to beat Intel's hyperthread advantage. AMD threw an extra integer unit at each core instead of Intel's method. It was just marketing on AMD to call them Quad core or eight core or whatever. I dont think Intel "architecture" is necessarily better, it was implemented more efficiently, and Intel has always had a manufacturing advantage while not always having a performance lead.

 

Hi all, thought I'd drop back into this thread with a question. Does anyone know (Adam_Ant?) if the Richland 5750m is a drop in replacement for the 4600m? My laptop (Samsung NP355V5C) hasn't received a Richland upgrade as of yet so there is no BIOS which explicitly supports the 5750m...

 

one more chip on fleabay BIN for $210.

 

Does anyone know if PSCheck is compatible with Richland APUs?

 

Yes it is, but PSCheck currently only works in Windows 7, not 8.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/msi/692264-offical-msi-gx60-owners-lounge-210.html#post9246255

 

If the PSCheck works with Kaveri APU...

That means I could either have a better battery life (or a higher clocked GPU), or driver support for some of the hardware that's unlikely to get Windows 7 drivers.

 

Mehh, more APUs with unlocked multipliers and no PScheck please... Terrible program, cause more problems than goods.

 

Can't you use AMD overdrive for modifying settings and overclocking?

I tried it on my laptop and it seems to have lots of options and settings; I only tried changing the gpu clocks, but they got locked afterwards and I ended up uninstalling to let the clocks adjust based on load.

Sent from my SGH-I717D using Tapatalk 4 Beta

 

If AMD overdrive would not crash at startup, would be great for overclocking unlocked APUs. Hopefully fix is coming soon. Otherwise it is not too useful for those who has the retail (locked) APU.
!! Other than that I recommend you to try the new MSI Afterburner beta, with turning off some power saver features seems giving me some real boost at the GPU side. I'll have to test further...!!

 

Atom Ant, did your Richland work with a Trinity BIOS, or did you check? I'm considering getting an A10 5750m to replace my 4600m but my model hasn't had a Richland makeover yet (prob never) so no supporting BIOS...

 

The HP bios what I am using did not mentioned any Richland support and it is working. For further help I'll install an older bios to see if Richland still working in it... But you have to wait until my new laptop arrives, because before I do not want mess this system up, in case if older bios would not work...

 

Don't go out of your way, it was just curiosity. There doesn't seem to be many 5750m chips about at the moment. If I can snag one for <£100 GBP, I'll give it a go and sell my 4600m.

My 4600m is constantly banging up against it's thermal limit when playing taxing games. Others report they can force 2.7GHz on all cores - I can but it quickly throttles in the likes of BF3, so it's JUST on the edge of playable Haven't tried repasting it yet though

 

Samsung ATIV 9 Lite
13.3"
AMD A6-5200 (Kabini)
4gb RAM
Up to 256gb SSD
8.5 Hrs battery
1366x768 ( eugh!)

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7093/...he-ativ-book-9-lite-ativ-one-5-style-hands-on
http://www.theverge.com/2013/6/20/4449124/samsung-ativ-book-lite-notebook
http://www.engadget.com/2013/06/20/samsung-ativ-book-9-plus-and-ativ-book-9-lite-hands-on/

480 euros?

I think it's the first high quality ultrathin I've seen.

 

If the resolution isn't at least 1600x900, then it's a no deal.

I have a 2009 era low-end 13" business laptop that has a 1080p screen. Seriously Samsung?

 

I think 1440x900 would of been a better compromise.

 

Junk screen, and the processor is Samsung-branded. After those three links you offered, I've skimmed four articles on that machine - one said it's a Samsung-branded processor, two didn't mention it, and Anand says it's Kabini but implies that Samsung said nothing of the sort. From what I've seen so far, I'm about 50-50 that it's either Kabini (but mysteriously rebranded by Samsung) or something developed in-house by Samsung. Don't they have lower model numbers (ATIV Book 4, maybe) for their inferior machines? Why would they use their top-end premium nomenclature for a budget machine? I'm kind've lost here. Either way, 1366x768 and single-channel RAM (speculation, but it's almost certain)...

The drought continues.

 

I like that 9 Lite's style (does remind me of the Galaxy devices which i like), its size and weight (3.2lbs). I think it would fit well in my backpack, especially when I'm on my bike (sits very flat not bulky). The Kabini SoC should be plenty of compute performance for my uses and the 1366x768 res does not bother me too much at 13.3" display. This is going to come down to the cost. I have a feeling its going to be priced similar ,if not more, than last years ULV Trinity Series 5. I'd rather get a hard drive model and upgrade to an SSD of my choice. I hope the 4 GB RAM is upgradeable to 8 or 16 GB of my choice.

From what I've read HP's Kabini DM1 is going to be starting at $400, probably more like $450-475 with the fastest quad core though.

@Fat Dragon
My best guess, Its probably an Engineering Sample Kabini SoC. It does say "specs subject to change without notice." Also no "Intel" sticker. We already know about the A6 and its 1.0GHz clock that Turbos up to 1.4GHz under the right conditions. I'd be surprised if it was anything else.

 

Are you playing on IGP or you have a discrete GPU near the APU? If you are playing on IGP do not use PSCheck, it messes up everything. Try the latest beta MSI afterburner, disable ulps without powerplay support and seems it fixed my GPU throttling issues. I get good FPS with A10-5750M all long as I playing games, instead only for one minute and than throttling, throttling...

 

What if you undervolted the CPU and modified the cooling system to accept additional thermal loads?

 

Bestbuy has some new, nice and thin AMD laptops, if you guys are still interested;

 

I have a 7670m in there too, which is in use. When gaming, as soon as the temp hits 90c+ (yes, 90) gameplay gets all jittery and the FPS falls off a cliff. The 7670m stays sub 80c even at full load. I "THINK" the dGPU passes the frame buffer through the iGPU and this has something to do with it... I've used PScheck to undervolt, which helps a lot, but the program is so unstable and buggy it isn't worth the hassle most of the time! I'm near sure some better paste would help a little, a 5750m even more!

 

It seems odd that AMD does not offer a higher wattage mobile part, while even Intel's latest Haswell is offering a 47W part with its "Iris Pro" graphics that they think could make it into things like a 13" MacBook with the ability to overdrive it up to 55W, because they think if you get rid of the 60W GPUs or whatever that the CPU with IGP should be able to offload more heat. Meanwhile thin notebooks with 30W processors still get hot even without dGPUs.

Not sure how that is going to work out, but I would still like to see a higher TDP mobile AMD part for the larger notebooks, or this customizeable TDP we have heard about with Richland.

The 35W AMD Opteron Berlin is said to have 700GLOPS of total compute, with 2 Steamroller module (4-core) and 512 steam processor GCN GPU. It has dual channel DDR3-1866 with ECC. Aside from the ECC, I suspect that is the mobile Kaveri. Unless they do something cool and actually use GDDR5 in the mobile parts which would drive its GPU performance up considerably. At 35W, it nearly matches the compute capability of the Trinity 100W part. Destroying that of the normal HD 4600 graphics of the 28W up to 65W Haswell mobile parts. Amazingly Intel's mobile processors go up to 65W. I cannot wait to see how badly AMD's 65W Kaveri desktop APUs beat down Intel's 65W Haswell Iris Pro offerings. Because the desktop Haswell variant has the same graphics as the top end mobile parts already tested. Now if only AMD would release a 45W mobile Kaveri variant that would directly compete with Intel's 47W mobile Haswell with Iris Pro.

 

In order for Kaveri to match Iris Pro, AMD needs to get a lot more memory bandwidth somehow. Intel's custom eDRAM is a very sweet solution. It's lower power than GDDR5 and it's more flexible (doesn't force a special GDDR5 main memory setup on you). Intel definitely has them in a bind. One can only hope AMD knew Iris Pro was coming and has some kind of answer that's not "make it cheaper so we can still sell it".

Plus AMD needs to address these ridiculous throttling issues.

 

I believe AMD may have shot down the GDDR5 memory system for the standard Kaveri.

 

I don't think AMD shot down GDDR5 necessarily, nor do I think there was an official word from AMD on that front.

I seem to recall one of the posters on another forum who commented on Kaveri/Steamroller stated that GDDR5 will have to be included in Kaveri/Steamroller because of HSA and shared memory interface (that without GDDR5, the direct transfer of data between CPU and iGP wouldn't be doable otherwise).
Its just that GDDR5 won't see its full potential on currently used sockets, but rather on new sockets that will be released with Kaveri/Steamroller.

 

5 months until launch!

 

Hm... Interesting:

[mygaming] AMD Temash gives glimpse of gaming future in Acer Aspire V5 sub-notebook

 

200K views, nice! Thanks everyone for showing interest in this thread and the AMD-based technology in general that doesn't always get the attention it deserves. I'd say my goal has been accomplished here but itd be cool to know that someone from AMD heard all of our rants and raves.

On another note...

Vizio’s 11.6 inch, Windows 8 tablet with an AMD chip is now available for $600

 

Nice, but why a Z-60? That makes no sense. Hopefully they are just trying to exhaust chip stock and will switch over to Temash soon. I'd say that's worth no more than $500 with the Z-60 in there, and only 5 hours battery life? The screen must account for a large portion of the power consumption.

Put a Temash CPU, 128GB SSD, and 4GB system RAM and I'll buy for $600.

 

Some of these companies may have long quality assurance processes, so anything takes a long time to be released. Vizio is not a big mobile player so its a new thing for them.

 

Do we have a thread for Kabini notebooks already? The Samsung Ativ Book 9 Lite will come with an unnamed Kabini APU.
It's a premium looking 13,3'' ultrathin with an SSD (although the display is 1366x768 resolution).

 

only saw one - the A6-temash 11.5 unit. appears to be the one that was reviewed Review AMD A6-1450 APU "Temash" - NotebookCheck.net Reviews

not encouraging for the small form factor crowd [me...]

So, in old news - I had wanted to pickup a A10-4600m unit and waited like the vulture forEVER, then as Murphy would have it, finally decided to grab a cheap A8-4500m unit off ebay, and sure enough, one of my snipes cooked off right after I bought the A8 so I end up with a Gateway [acer] 15.6" A8 unit AND a DV6 A10 unit.
Interestingly, they were effectively the same price though the DV6 had 6gb vs 4 for the other.

around $250 each, delivered to the doorstep.

Once I got windows 8 the way I wanted it, the A8 unit performs well. not too hot, ok battery life for such an unbearably huge monster of a lapfull...
Its hard to imagine a worse display. it made me feel good about my lowly thinkpad x120e display which looks awesome in side/side comparo.
the Acer/Gateway display, whatever it is... one has to position the screen spot-on PERFECT, and don't move your head or you'll lose quality...

dv6 hasn't arrived yet.

for $250, that should be some dirt cheap $/frame budget game thrills....

its hard to believe that people still carry these things around with them. 5lbs and that huge mechanical bulk just seems obscene.
I put my Thinkpad, my iPad MINI, and my Galaxy Note 1 side by side with the Gateway monster to take a group shot.... All of the devices have similar resolution.... All of them are "720p" displays. The Note 1 has a spectacular display in my view, old as it is... the Mini IPS looks great and has more bright-headroom. [i had a nexus 7... nice display, but device is, on the whole, not on par with the mini..sorry] Actually, the mini and the note both look great to me and pretty 'rightsized' for the rez

so, my chance to wave a proper goodbye to the Trinity line :hi2::hi2: . I will probably replace my htpc with the dv6

 

Actually what Atom Ant showed in the picture there is this HP ENVY TouchSmart Sleekbook TouchScreen 15.6" Laptop 8GB Memory 1TB Hard Drive m6-k012dx - Best Buy. It is the new replacement to the Envy m6 line, you can actually tell it from the sku number. So a 0.9'' thick touch screen laptop with a 25W A10 Richland APU, saddly though 1366 X 768 screen and 3 cell battery keep it from being perfect.
Also I wouldn't touch a Gateway laptop with a 3 meter stick.

 

No, unfortunately no sign at all of configurable TDP, I've checked every possible place. Hope AMD will realize how much better is an unlocked APU and they'll do a real black edition for consumers.

 

If the TDP is configurable by the manufacturer, who's up to the task of modding a BIOS from 35W to 45W?


EDIT: This is interesting: http://anandtech.com/show/7106/amds-a105750m-review-part-1-the-apu-and-radeon-hd-8650g-performance/4

 

If I knew how to mod BIOSes, id give it a try. Also, it would be cool to have a program like Llano's FusionTweaker and K10Stat. Again, this is out of my spectrum but maybe someone more knowledgable can help us out. I'd donate some cash to that.

Richland A10s are now starting to slowly drop in price. Still too rich for my blood, but at least its dropping.


Sent from my SPH-M580 using Tapatalk 2

 

:hi2: It looks like us HP ProBook 6475b owners have official support for Richland A10-5750Ms and more:

HP Graphics Drivers

HP BIOS