The new SSD Thread (Benchmarks, Brands, News and Advice)

you could be right... i guess it kinda depends on how you take it... either way i probably would go with G2 between the two just beacause intel is done with the G1...

I'm just curious how they would stack up against one another in Snow Leopard. That's kinda what i was thinking about with my post...

 

That's what I'm wondering as well (I am using G2 under Snow Leopard), and I haven't found any articles testing SSDs with Mac OS X. I would assume that even though Apple has only 10% market share, the SSD usage "might" be higher in Apple computers (percentage wise). Please let me know if you see anything regarding this. Thanks!

 

tenderidol,

maybe an 'old' article - with no OS/X 'tweaks', but the most thorough one I've found for the Apple;

http://macperformanceguide.com/Reviews-SSD.html

While I agree with most things the writer 'assumes' for his tests, there are a couple of things to 'watch out', or 'take into account';

1) All the mechanical hard drives are short stroked to 74.4GB (to match the capacity of the 80GB Intel) - although this gives us a more accurate performance comparison, nobody would ever use their (mechanical) drives like this and give up, up to 425GB of HD space! Would they?

2) He assumes that for random read/write 32GB is sufficient (instead of doing a random r/w across the whole (74.4) capacity of the drives). His error is in not taking into account the fact that as the SSD drive gets used, eventually, All the data access will be random r/w (because of the wear-leveling algorithm).

3) I think he either didn't see/know, but the significance of the read speeds is definitely downplayed (compared to the write speed results). To his credit though, he still scores the Intel SSD as around 50% increase over the fastest HD (Seagate 7200.3) - when used with applications that benefit from it (not all do).

A personal observation; when I first read this article (before I dove head over heels into SSD research-land) all I could see was the Intel X25-M through rose coloured glasses. Today, as I skimmed it again, I see not only the Intel's weaknesses, but also the reviewers bias/omissions too.

So, this was a Gen1 product review...

Can't hardly wait for a G3 320GB+ Intel drive to be announced...

 

I believe the 320GB is still going to be G2(.5?) unless you really are looking forward to the 320GB G3 of which i have never got wind of, and am sorry.

 

One of my previous post:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showpost.php?p=5354997&postcount=8653

And the Intel drive is 80GB gen1. I think I don't have to mention again what Samsung drives I have.
Machine specs is in sig. OS is Vista Ultimate x64.

 

Won myself a 30GB OCZ Agility last night. Going to use it in my parents PC and use their current HDD for storage (pictures, music, documents).

First time I ever won anything. So I'm just plain happy.

 

NICE! now u gotta tell us how....

 

http://forums.tweaktown.com/f31/weekly-giveaway-ocz-agility-series-sata-ii-2-5-inch-30gb-ssd-34941/

My alias name is under SolidBladez.

 

zephir, Thanks.

So the 10GB+ files you're transferring, are they just a few bigger files or many, many smaller files?

Also, is my assumption wrong that the six programs you use most don't really fully exploit an SSD's natural (current) superiority (fast reads) - excluding the file transfers which of course favour faster sequential writes that the Samsungs have over the Intel? (Sorry, just not that familiar with Matlab and Labview software).

If my assumption above is right, then our scenario's do not mesh well and my experience with a Samsung will not reflect what you are seeing.

Thanks for taking the time to help me understand.

Edit: My assumption above is based on Matlab and Labview essentially depending on a HD like the Developer Software build test in http://macperformanceguide.com/Reviews-SSD.html (they don't benefit at all). Is this correct on my part?

 

ScifiMike12,

Please drop by whenever you want to upgrade our computer to SSD awesomeness.

- your parents!

Seriously, Congrats!

 

The 10GB is with files of size about 200MB to 300MB each, with an additional few document folders (with files of size 100KB each roughly)
The kind of programs I write with Matlab and Labview is pretty intensive, with multiple steps for inputting the data in and outputting the data, thus relies pretty heavily on the disc's IOPS rating. The kind of data tables being read and written to has typical size of a few KB, so I'll say that it is the perfect measure parameter of the drive's performance in small file read and write.
Plus if you account in the frequent autosave session functionality of Word and Excel, and the functionality of Thunderbird to check and fetch email every 5 minuts, you get huge stress on the harddrive.

 

OK, I just got a replacement samsung SSD from DELL, and the firmware is VBM94D1Q which I have no idea if this is the new firmware having GC or supporting TRIM. Does any1 have information about this VBM94D1Q firmware?

 

CrystalDiskInfo should let You know does it supports TRIM or not.

 

Yes.

I bearly have it on batery, most of the time i have it pluged, so its hard for me to say, also i upgraded the CPU aswell, so even if i had info would probably be inaccurate about the baterylife, that said, i do think i get around 10mins more, but this is subjective.

The drive is 55% full atm.

 

My 128GB Samsung drive has the same firmware, manufactured in July 2009. I think your drive and mine has GC, since the letter is one after the firmware with GC.

 

I checked CDI, it show no TRIM....

 

I am still searching for tweaks to avoid "unnecessary" writing to the SSD. Well, some of the stuff is not really unnecessary, but can be avoided with few tricks.... Along this line, I would like to know whether I can use an external HD for Adobe Photoshop CS4 scratch disk. The external is a 320GB 2.5" Seagate connected via Firewire 800. I dont use Photoshop much, but when I do, 95% of the time I am in the office and the dock for the HD is next to me; so, it wont be too much trouble to drop in the external to be used as a scratch disk - if that's possible.

Thanks!

 

thank you tomy

 

Samsung drives don't have TRIM yet. The most you can hope for is getting a drive that features background garbage collection. Apparently with Samsung drives you have to send them to samsung to get the firmware (with TRIM) installed on your drive since there is no way for the end-user to do it.

 

according to Corsair, they say the end-user is able to get firmware updated, as long as Samsung release the firmware, and Corsair will post download link.

 

I have heard from multiple sources recently that Samsung will release user-flashable fw on or after Win 7's release.

 

i just fully copied entire hard drive , and right now my seq reading is 214, but writing is only 48mb/s... dang....

 

Intel and Samsung SSDs don't support TRIM yet. The best you can get right now is garbage collection.

 

Garbage collection happens when the drive finally gets a chance to stay idle. Wait a few days, and the write speed should restore.

 

totally idle? so I have to put my laptop there for entire day without touching it? turn off every application? or we just log out?

 

The process is very similar to Windows defragmentation. It doesn't do it all at once, but little by little, at every chance it gets at staying idle. You don't have to worry about doing any special other than how you use your computer normally.

 

I will see, but at least, my win7 is still fast...lol

 

i have a new toshiba r600 with an original HDD 160gb. when i replace this hdd with new ssd sata mtron mobi 3500 64gb, it cannot boot when i install windows xp and cannot install windows 7 . i have change AHCI to IDE in bios. but it cannot boot with new ssd with windows xp although i can install it and format it during install windows xp. in windows 7 installing , i cannot creat new partition and windows say you cannot install with this partition .

but when i use ssd sandisk 2.5 32gb series 5000, i can install and use any OS.

i have the same problems with this member of toshiba forum : here
http://forums.computers.toshiba-euro...40086&tstart=0
http://forums.computers.toshiba-euro...40086&tstart=0

Do you have any idea, pls help ! thanks

 

my first gen slc has so called garbage collection, so, every other second gen drive MUST have it also
but I would not called it that way, and I think it's nothing near to defragmentation as zephir stated

very earlier before I posted some benchs and degradation tests where you can clearly see how performance of drive is reduced by intensive IOmetre testing, and, if I leave my laptop untouched for about 15 min, sammy restores itself to factory state performance...
great stuff !!!!
also, drive is able to restore itself even if I power my lap and enter BIOS setup, so, there is no OS intervention needed, also, when drive is in process of restoration, user can't actually notice it, since there is no hdd led activity, or increased CPU usage activity under task manager
so, I think it is something similar to self maintenance, and it must be something very simple since it can be done so freakin fast

and no, sammys don't have trim stuff, but, I think they will not have it at all since this "self maintenance" or "garbage collection" stuff works pretty darn well

 

Just curious - are there any users here who've had a Sammy or Intel (gen 1) for more than a couple months and can report back on degradation [if any]? I think a lot of people are wondering about this issue. We read articles and updates like newer firmware and background garbage collection are taking care of degradation on the drives, but it's really the test of time I'm interested in here.

Much appreciated.

 

I don't feel GC really works,
I put my laptop on overnight to check if GC really works,
after the testing, the writting is toooo slow!!

--------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 2.2 (C) 2007-2008 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : http://crystalmark.info/
--------------------------------------------------

Sequential Read : 211.549 MB/s
Sequential Write : 69.998 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 169.572 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 49.157 MB/s
Random Read 4KB : 16.604 MB/s
Random Write 4KB : 8.902 MB/s

Test Size : 500 MB
Date : 2009/10/10 9:40:44

 

Hello, I have 128GB Sammy nearly a year and subjectively I don't feel much difference from beginning...I feel like over some time it got even quicker

But anyway...from that time I didn't really check about new SSDs and I would like to try to get back to the game...as I thought with upgrading to Win7 it would be nice to upgrade for new generation of SSD as well.

Can you pls help me, before I'll try to read this thread backwards few hundred pages...what's the latest best?

I'm looking for some nice 2.5 SSD 128-256GB, price until ~570$, with minimum heat, minimum power consumption and maximum speed

 

Doesn't Dell still have the 256GB Samsung Gen 2 for $480? That's probably your best bet.

 

Either the PM800 or if you can afford it the 160GB x25-m G2.

 

Thank you both for replies. So it's still between Samsung and Intel. Well I'm fully satisfied with Samsung and I heard many scary stories about Intel...but maybe they're already just past...and Intel's TRIM support in combination with Win7 seems tempting...will probably have to read a bunch of reviews.

 

Please post these scary stories about Intel.

 

Throughout the thread there have been "horror" stories from just about every SSD out there. The ones that I can recall on the spot for Intel have been massive slow downs after being filled or used for a while (especially with G1s) and the 8MB bug. Most of the problems with SSDs (by Intel and other companies) have been experienced only by a minority of users, so on average I don't think it should be a major concern for prospective buyers. It is only good to know of these issues to be aware of that 1% chance where you do have a problem with your purchased SSD.

 

Yep, that's what I read. The thing is, that I've never read anything like that about Samsung drives. On the other hand, I'm not a Samsung fan and I'll be happy to try something new. I like the possibility of installing new fw for Intel drives...so I'll probably go for it.

 

I'm not saying that it works like defragmentation. I'm saying that it behaves like defragmentation (in that you don't need to manually do it). There's a difference
Also, I'm not really sure if it does GC independently of the OS or not, since there's really no way to prove that's the case.

 

Have been using my Samsung SLC for two years now. Still feel as fast as day one.
Have been using my Samsung MLC gen 2 for exactly three months now. Still feel as fast as day one.

 

Negative... I run both the Samsung SLC 64G and the Samsung MLC 256G daily....no degradation or slowing whatsoever.....and I run alot of multimedia along with productivity software...

 

here is mine after 9 months:

--------------------------------------------------
CrystalDiskMark 2.2 (C) 2007-2008 hiyohiyo
Crystal Dew World : http://crystalmark.info/
--------------------------------------------------

Sequential Read : 94.779 MB/s
Sequential Write : 83.445 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 91.950 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 73.387 MB/s
Random Read 4KB : 17.363 MB/s
Random Write 4KB : 5.890 MB/s

Test Size : 100 MB
Date : 2009/10/11 3:46:58

how was writing at the beginning of using ?
also, do you feel it is slow ?

well, defragmentation needs to be started by OS itself, and it needs to be scheduled or initiated by user
just kidding
I see your point

GC definitely works OS independently since my drive managed to restore itself while I've left my laptop in BIOS setup menu after IOmetre degradation setup testing

 

Sounds reasonable. I think you may be right.

 

The 160GB Intel drives are getting pretty ridiculous mark-ups on Newegg. I guess because they're in high demand and short supply? I was hoping to buy one by the end of the month and put it in my new laptop, but I may have to wait. The OEM drive is marked up over $100, and it looks like the retail version is approaching $200. I know there are other online stores to buy them from, but still, what a bummer.

 

I think that You won't get TRIM if You send SSD to Samsung for upgrading FW. When they release FW with TRIM (same day or after Win 7 is released) they will release "flasher" to end users, so we'll be able to get TRIM on are own.

 

Today I find out that partitions aren't aligned anymore, probably because I was playing with Acronis Disk Director, so I "tested" is there really big difference among aligned and unaligned partitions.

Results for unaligned:
Sequential Read : 122.892 MB/s
Sequential Write : 115.084 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 107.015 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 65.927 MB/s
Random Read 4KB : 13.237 MB/s
Random Write 4KB : 5.975 MB/s

Results for aligned:
Sequential Read : 123.471 MB/s
Sequential Write : 113.045 MB/s
Random Read 512KB : 107.192 MB/s
Random Write 512KB : 79.164 MB/s
Random Read 4KB : 13.397 MB/s
Random Write 4KB : 8.046 MB/s

Tested SSD is Super Talent MasterDrive SX 64 GB (same as Samsung PB22-J, 2ng generation MLC) on SATA-I (Dell D620), 50 % filled, booted from other drive.

There is no significant difference in sequential and 512 KB reads and writes, but random 4 KB writes are 33 % faster and are fastest I ever had, even on SATA-II they were slower.

 

anybody can help me pls!

 

Does anyone know the model of the 256GB ssd in the Dell Adamo Desire model?

 

Its the Samsung drive... thats pretty much all Dell uses for 256GB capacity SSD's

 

GC and TRIM probably won't work as well on Samsung drives in real world apps because the random write speeds(which are affected most by GC and TRIM) are already low.

There isn't much to fall to if you aren't high up already.