HP Envy 17 - coming to the US in May 2010

if we say yes would you stop asking?

 

sounds GREAT. really looking forward to the next 2 weeks. I'll happily give HP my money if they have what I need. If the Envy really does have switchable graphics...the game is over. If it has 3D...game is over. lol

but....

...uh oh. Kshinn won't like the bad news there.

 

I really do wish they would be more specific. Is it a hardware issue or is windows just inherently more clunky when it comes to touch gestures?

What windows laptop do they consider best in class for multi touch gestures, what is the comparison?

 

The multi-touch works great for me, I just had to tweak the settings in the synaptics control panel. I enabled the "Momentum" setting. Several of my co-workers have 2009 or 2010 model MBPs and the Mac glass touchpad is simply a bit more elegant, user-friendly and great for working with images, similar to multi-touch on the iPhone. One thing that could be a huge improvement is when I pinch to zoom or use 2-finger scrolling the little cursor pops up to show evidence that the gesture is activated, but this is completely redundant and unnecessary since you will of course see the effect of your zoom or scroll on the screen and the little scrolling image cursor looks very old-school Windows 95-ish. Microsoft should allow users to simply remove that graphic. Perhaps there is some cursor setting that I am not aware of to replace it with some other .bmp file.

But the Envy touchpad is large and once you get accustomed to it it's much better than any previous Windows laptop I've worked with. Also I downloaded the Scrybe gesture application which enables more complex gestures. ( Scrybe )

 

it's more robust and better implemented in OSX. go to an apple store and play with it for 20 minutes. it'll all become clear.

(and that's not an exaggeration. 20 minutes and I was genuinely impressed. It's a core feature, where on our laptops...it's more of an add-on. with fewer features)

Obviously, I'm not surprised in the least that the trackpad on these new Envy's--while better than previous Envy's--is still considerably far behind the MBP. It's not a knock...nobody's is touching their solution. It's just how it is for now. But as long as the Envy trackpad doesn't cause problems (some things about it I found very irritating), it should be just fine.

considering the business day is almost over, I assume we won't get anymore news nuggets. oh well.

 

It's just that their description of the trackpad, especially considering the feedback on the last trackpad gives the impression they are trying to torpedo the machine. When comparing it to other WINDOWS machines, they described it as "passable"

To me, on a scale of A-F, "Passable" is a C grade. Implying that compared to other WINDOWS notebooks it is merely average.


What they need to do to compare the hardware is compare mbp touch controls in windows. If it is still vastly superior then we know the software and hardware for the touchpad is just light years beyond. If it is much more comparable, then it tells us that windows itself is simply not as fluid with its touch control interfaces.


Their description provided none of this insight.

Sometimes I want to know the source of a failing or strength of a system. For example, safety.

macs are safer on the internet than pcs.

why?

If the reason is that windows is inherently less secure that is a VERY big difference from a case where

Windows is attacked more often


If the latter is true, then each platform could be equally secure, but windows would STILL perform worse due to being attacked far more often and targeted by exploits.


All the difference in the world, but I could not fault windows for being a bigger target and therefore being logistically more likely to have security issues.


(sorry, bit ranty, just hate it when people compare apples to oranges, and make confused comparisons that muddy the details)

 

yep but..if you run in windows mode you don't get all the same functionality. most of it--yes..but things like 4 finger swipe are not supported yet in boot camp.

it's still pretty good tho

 

i dont understand all the fuss over trackpads. I always use an external mouse. Trackpads are just lame whether its a macbook pro an hp a dell an asus all trackpads are completely crap compared to a mouse.

 

Thank you! I'm glad I'm not the only one here who actually prefers to have the trackpad disabled despite its quality/functionality.

 

I hear you. I'm sure the trackpad is servicable. Some may deny it, but the older Envy laptops had trackpads that would behave funky in certain situations. In ways that irritate me to this day. I would have preferred a normal trackpad with physical left and right click buttons to the solution they put on Gen 1 and 2 Envy's.

I would have graded the Gen 1 and Gen 2 envy trackpad as a C+ on a scale of only trackpads that run on Windows. I would have graded my Vaio AW as an B+ (perfect operation, buttons easy to press and smooth, but the individual buttons had a very loud click sound when pressing them, and there were no multitouch features). But when compared to mult-touch trackpads on a Mac running OSX...well...you realize how useful they've made their trackpad. I can certainly live without OSX's cool multi-touch interface (I've gotten along just fine without it for the last 20+ years)...but damn...when you have it (or have used it for a 20 minutes or so), you realize how behind Windows touch pad gesturing implementation is.

indeed. It's an OS issue more than anything else. but no matter what the reason, the lack of features and smooth implementation is a reality of our experience. the only question is whether or not you're willing to live with or without it.

Like I said, I'm fine without it...but I' love to have it, would it have been an option.

Maybe on Windows 8.

yea...you haven't used the MBP trackpad much. it's so good, Apple released a mouse that featured it's multi-touch features.

a mouse is still preferable for many things...but the Apple trackpad and "crap" don't belong in the same sentence, nor do trackpads from other manufacturers deserve to be paired with Apples (though again, that's more Windows fault than the trackpads themselves).

 

It's an OS issue rather than an HP issue, and I think you know that.

In Windows 7, the MBP's touchpad isn't any more smooth than the Envy's in terms of operation. The glass does feel nicer (less friction), but imo as someone who uses a MBP and Envy all the time (both in Windows), there isn't enough of a difference to matter.

If I were grading touchpads in Windows, I'd give the MBP a A, the Envy a B+/A-, the Alienware M17x a C-, the ASUS EEE 900a a B (even though their touchpad is super small, it somehow has smoother scrolling and operation in windows than a MBP and Envy. I have no idea why this is), with the average Windows computer being in the C range.

Every Windows touchpad, including the MBP's, is lightyears behind a MBP in OS X. Everyone knows that, but let's try compare apples to apples, shall we?

 

a mouse isnt preferable for many things its preferable for everything on earth. The only time a mouse isnt preferable is if you are sitting somewhere that doesnt have a table like a train or airplane or something. Thats like maybe 1% of my usage. I have used MBP's glass touchpad and I still find it very uncomfortable compared to a mouse and it takes me much longer to do simple things that the mouse would take .3 seconds to do.

btw i highly reccomend the steelseries ikari laser mouse. hardware adjustable dpi, 1000hz ultrapolling, super comfortable right hand style ergonomics. I've used a lot of mice from razers to logitechs to microsoft and the steelseries ikari is the most comfortable mouse ever in my hand

 

for you.

speak for yourself. opinion != fact.

preference != truth.

I've been designing on laptops for about a decade now and unless I'm doing something that requires absolute precision (ie cleaning up an image by hand in Photoshop) creating 3D content (few trackpads have a middle-click option) or am gaming, I'm apathetic totally when it comes to whether I have a mouse or a trackpad. In fact, I've owned my Logitech MX Revolution mouse for 1.5 years now and often times forget I even have it.

Then again, I've never bought a laptop that had a mediocre trackpad. I've used some bad ones before while fixing friends computers and wanted to punch babies...the kinds of laptops that some of you guys clearly have (ie. past Envy owners, some dv owners, recent-gen mini owners). I've also tried out the vaunted G73 Asus and found the trackpad buttons to require too much pressing to click easily. FAIL. So yea, some are genuinely horrible experiences...and I can see that influencing people's opinion on trackpads in general. By contrast, my old Dell E1705 trackpad was stupendous. My Sony Vaio AW trackpad was fantastic and big. My Toshiba 17" before them was fantastic.

I would never and will never buy a mediocre touchpad.

So it seems we've simply had different experiences and are used to different things. I can switch on the fly and do precision work with either (though I can do it a little faster with my excellent mice) but I never care that the mouse isn't around when it's unavailable. My experiences give me the ability to have no preference at all.

the gestures on the MBP would probably make me prefer the touchpad in all but the times when I absolutely have to use the mouse or when I know it would save me some time on a part of a project.

but YMMV.

 

I agree, besides the build quality, the touchpad on a MBP is the most amazing feature to me, I've used my friends' macbooks, they are just A-M-A-Z-I-N-G, honestly I don't want to use a external mouse when I m using their trackpads, it is smooth and functional, unless you want to play games.

 

The Envy 17 Service Manual is up on the HP site.

Manuals for HP Envy 17t-1000 CTO Notebook PC - HP Customer Care (United States - English)

No mention of 3D that i could find anywhere. Some interesting bits:

Quad core: 720, 740, 820, 840
Dual Core: 430, 450, 520, 540 (no 620)
Chipset: HM55
Graphics: 5850
FHD Antiglare Display: LED, 16.8 million colors, 72% gamut, 200:1 contrast, 300 nits
RAM: max 8GB (user accessible) 1333 mhz quad core/1066 duo core
HDD: supports 2.5" 12.5mm and 9.5mm customer accessible (no dual SSD option)
Optical: BluRay ROM option
Wireless: Centrino 6200
Adapters: 120W and 65W slim travel
Battery: 9 Cell (93wh) or 6 cell (62whr)
Vents: 7 (!) on bottom (means no slice but glowing testes)
Weight: 8.18 lbs (!)

 

840 Quad core???? What is this?

620 is not an option because of bad availability from Intel. Nothing stopping you from upgrading on your own, unlike Apple products.

200:1 better be a typo on the display. I've my eye on these. Somthing that caught my eye was the "wide view angle" displays. If true, we may be seeing the only PVA and/or IPS displays on laptops in the industry. Except for a custom swapped x200 with AFFS display. THis combined with the possibilty of 120Hz display (not just nice for gaming!) and I'm watching. For the time being I am not inclinded to trade this Envy 15 which is actually lighter then the 14 with dual drives (2x1.8) which is looks like the Envy 14 cant do... Better graphics, too.

 

zomg! 8.18lbs weight! That's heavier than my 5 yr old 17 inch dell inspiron 9300 and and that thing is a tank. I don't know about this one. No wonder the guy in the video grunted when he was picking it up. It wasn't because he was old...

That being said, i really don't care how heavy it is as long as it's under 9 lbs, as I think i'm a pretty strong guy. For me it's the battery life, not the weight that will determine how portable it is.

 

I think the 8.18 lbs, is with the extended battery.

 

that poor guy is on disability leave at hp. work injury

 

a couple of thoughts:

• looks great.
• lack of 3D mentioning is a little disappointing...but it was more icing than anything else. if the display isn't a 120Hz display, perhaps it will work if you have a 120Hz external monitor? because the GPU is certainly capable in and of itself...so long as it has a 120Hz-capable display to connect to.
• 72% of the Adobe RGB gamut...hmmm...is that pretty average for laptops? I ask because display quality is important to me...and my past Vaio AW displayed a whopping 137% of the Adobe RGB gamut. I knew my old laptop was "special" when it came to matte displays...but this means it produced literally 100% more of a color range? You guys can understand why I've had such a hard time finding a replacement. lol.
• BD option is nice, though I used it very rarely on my Vaio AW. It was much more convenient to just convert movies to .MKV and store them.
• I see I was right on the HDD size. It *does* incorporate 12.5mm, 1TB drives to hit 2TB. There's nothing special about the 2TB claim (as people were trying to suggest to me earlier) and they don't have special or unique HDDs. they're using 12.5mm drives that have been on the market for months. Difference is that most laptops can't hold 12.5mm in the first place. Just a note for those considering this: my Vaio AW came with 12.5mm drives too. When you're ready to take them out (say to upgrade size or rpm speed with new drives), you'll have a helluva time finding enclosures to throw your old 12.5mm's in. Virturally no enclosures are available in the US market because these drives are rarely bought in the consumer market. I had to import one from the UK. Just something to keep in mind.
• lack of normal slice battery is disappointing in the sense that I'm not a big fan of having a big battery jutting down/out the back. Oh well. Wait and see.
• use of the HM55 chipset pretty much closes the case on hope for IGP switching, right? my understanding is that the HM55 isn't capable of that? And that they would have had to use the HM57 chipset in order to implement graphics switching? So I think we know why finding reports of battery life on this beast are impossible to find right now. lol
• 8+ lbs is heavy...but whatever. it's a desktop replacement. I'm more concerned about how heavy the PSU and "slice" will be, because short standard battery life will mean those 2 items (or at least one of them) will have to be factored in daily to my total weight. 8lbs is okay...but is the real-world travel weight 11lbs (laptop + slice/PSU)? or more? that's the real question. Meanwhile, that MacBook Pro is smiling and waving to me at 6.6lbs travel weight.
• whether it says it in the service manual or not, you will be able to run dual SSDs in the machine. The only thing that ability requires is 2 HDD slots, which this computer has. Not sure about RAID, though. then again, that's not really popular on laptops anyway.
• USB 3.0 is fantastic. if I did more transfers, that would make me buy the laptop all by itself.
• lack of i7 620m is surprising. but allows for a more obvious step up to quad core for the indecisive. where the advantage of quad core i7 720m is debatable, its advantage over i5 is pronounced.
• 200:1 contrast on that display? I agree with the other guy...if that's not a typo, this laptop is off my list completely. that's a bad joke and can't be true...though the low asking price makes me feel it just may be the case. it just won't do for my line of work. if I was typing papers and working spread sheets all day, it'd be different. but those stats scream low-quality. not looking good on paper...but maybe real-world performance will surprise.

all things considered, those in the 14"-15" market have a great laptop to look forward to. 17" looks good too, but there are a few features I'll be left wishing it had. and I look forward to seeing the display before deciding to buy or not buy.

If it won't work, my choices will be down to the 8740w + Dreamcolor 2 display (delayed until June at the earliest) or the infamous MacBook Pro.

sure about that? because Apple doesn't seem to be having trouble getting them. maybe they've bought them all up? surely people would have appreciated the option.

 

Actually I'm not sure about what you mean about *being right* about the HDD size. No one was trying to suggest anything special either, besides it's vast storage capacity. It supports 12.5 drives, which was quite obvious when HP stated 2 TB of storage. We also know the AW has 12.5 enclosures also. So I'm lost there But yes, you were *right*

And HM55 is a IGP enabled chipset, but considering lack of mention of the switchable graphics, it probably isn't there.

 

actually, in the earlier conversation:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/hp-...y-17-coming-us-may-2010-a-39.html#post6221033

http://forum.notebookreview.com/hp-...y-17-coming-us-may-2010-a-39.html#post6221063

http://forum.notebookreview.com/hp-...y-17-coming-us-may-2010-a-39.html#post6221210

http://forum.notebookreview.com/hp-...y-17-coming-us-may-2010-a-39.html#post6221351

...2 of those posters explicitly challenge me and my assertion and JurijTurnsek went as far as to suggest the Envy an Pavillion lines are the only laptops in the world even capable of using them. Read at the links above for yourself.

Neither of the posters in question was you. Is there a reason you felt like I was talking to you, specifically? I was talking to whoever earlier in the thread acted like they had never heard of 12.5mm HDDs in laptops and attacked what I deduced. My only point in that whole discourse was that there was absolutely nothing special about a 2TB claim, as any laptop that can hold 12.5mm HDDs can hold the exact same HDDs. I said so very clearly more than once. the fact remains: though a non-standard size for laptops today, the bottom line is that the only thing that makes this "special" is that HP may be the first manufacturer to ship a computer with a pair of 1TB HDDs from the factory. it's not something morally praiseworthy in and of itself, nor is it something others with space for 12.5mm HDDs can't do easily. I suppose that's why I found your initial excitement here somewhat surprising at the time. you've been around long enough to know that technically speaking, there's nothing "insane" about it. just a leveraging of the options available on the market since late 2009. My opinion would be different if it were the *only* laptop capable of this...but it's not.

but whatever. bottom line is Koshinn and I were correct in our presumption there. wasn't even something you should have felt compelled to once again challenge.

oh and okashira was wrong: the unibody MacBook Pro's *can* fit 12.5mm HDDs. confirmed at Macrumors.com. cheers.

 

Oh I didn't think you were targeting me, but thanks for linking to those posts, I never read them. I missed the couple of posts after mine on those pages. My bad. I wasn't attempting to challenge you, you were correct.

And no way, the new MBP's can fit 12.5? That's impossible. How did they do it? Cuz I don't think there is enough space in there.

 

cool beans. party on.

anyway, here's hoping the display is better than it appears to be on paper. that 200:1 contrast ratio worries me, but maybe it shouldn't?

 

Well there are laptops with similar contrasts levels, and they still have excellent screens, like the Sony CW. I tend to correlate number of nits to screen quality most of the time, though there are exceptions. But considering the impressiveness of the Envy 15 screen, which I think had like 200-250 nits (don't quote me on that), the 300 nit Envy 17 should really be a treat.

(Why am I anxious to see what laptop ajreynol will buy? Something is wrong with me...)

 

Wow, you take internet very seriously. Having said that, I admit I was wrong - still there are not many laptops that can fit 12.5mm discs and from examples that were presented, none of the are cheap (as in Pavilions).

Also, HP made a huge mistake, as far as I am concerned, with inclusion of the optical drive. Why not offer a small SSD for OS and two massive HDDs for storage? With 2TB, who needs Blu-ray? Who needs Blu-ray in any case? (just teasing, I know someone probably does, just not me)

 

it's all good, baby. let's hug it out. it wasn't something that time needed to be spent on anyway. some of us were right, some were wrong. keep the party going.

 

It's possible in the future that BR discs will replace DVDs entirely, like DVDs did with CDs. It's unlikely, because most programs don't even fill a single DVD, but there are other programs and games that use multiple DVDs. With the storage capacity of BR, size would not be a limitation for audio and texture quality in games, for example.

And with a 17" 1080p 3D monitor maybe 18" from your face, inclusion of a BR drive just makes sense.

 

personally, I don't see BD overtaking DVD. Well...not until we get faster transfer speeds across the board (standardized USB 3.0 or lightpeak) and cheap blank BD media.

and I totally agree about the 3D implementation. 3D as it is in 2010 is really only good for devices like computers and hand-held gaming systems. cost of buying multiple glasses makes it unreasonable for home theater use. but for computers, it's just fine. 3D would be a game-changing attribute if the monitor supports it. we'll see soon enough.

anal-retentive note: Blu-ray is referred to properly with the acronym, "BD" not "BR".

 

I don't think we will see cheap double layer BD media anytime soon. Single layer yes, the prices are already coming down, but there is a lot of pressure from the studios (who are members and contribute to the budget of the BDA) to keep those double layer prices up because it helps dissuade piracy if the cost of the blank media is comparable to the cost of buying a retail blu-ray movie. i believe the price point is artificially kept high because of this.

 

Just replying to red, in order.

• I think HP may be trying to keep this on the "down-low," apple style. This makes alot of since if you think about the fact this would be the first lappy with such a feature. Waiting to the last second to reveal it is a good strategy here.
• Color Gamut % is the LAST thing on my list when I am looking at specs to try and determine if a display may be a good one. (and I am suggesting you consider the same POV...) Anything better then ~65-70% and it really doesn't matter much compared to other specifications unless you have a VERY specific reason to need it.
• ...Huh? It was everyone who replied to you who explained that the 1TB hard drives are 12.5mm, that they not considered laptop hard disks and that the feature of the ENVY here is support for 12.5mm hard drives. You did not make any of these assertions. And everyone's point that 12.5mm hard disk support (especially two of them) is not common for a laptop. (so far I've heard of 3 mabye: huge a$$ alienware, a huge 18" Sony, MABYE a new MBP - a SINGLE 12.5mm drive.) So I think it still qualifies as a feature for the ENVY 17.
• Nope. HM55 will support the IGP and switching. Actually, I think it's the PM55 is the ONLY chipset for this platform that doesn't support switching. I think I made this point before, but this is because of the fact that when the PM55 was released, an IGP DID NOT EXIST when using the procs and this chipset. The only CPUs available were the i7 quad cores with no video on board. So it was not even an option for HP to offer switchable graphics on the Envy 15.
• Well, so can the Envy 15. I would like to see the Envy 17 support 4x SSD RAID (e.g. 4x 1.8" hard disk support) That would be a really good feature. Actually, with support for 12.5mm drives, there should be physcal room for EIGHT (8) 1.8" disks!!! (just think, 8x 320GB Intel G3 SSD's. Absurd and Sweet.) Would need a secondary controller to get all eight, though. The HM55 can only do 6 or so I think.

Just...wow. Not going to continue this.

I have to say that contrast really is important unless you do all your viewing in highly lit areas. In bright office lighting I'd say up to ~800:1 contrast is useful, in dark lighting (for movie viewing) I'd go all the way to ~3000:1 or so, perhaps even up to 10000:1 for maximum quality. 200:1 is just abysmal. My LCD TV (Samsung LNT5271f) can do actual measured ~2200:1 static contrast, and even with that I can see some gain for darker blacks. I'd like to see 10000:1 static contrast for maximum benefit. A good TN LCD display (TN = laptop) can do approx 1000:1, IPS - ~900:1, PVA - ~3000:1. Note i am talking about static contrast, dynamic contrast is pointless and useless. LED / CCFL backlighting has NO effect on static contrast (one is not better then the other) and local dimming LED displays can improve static contrast, they still SUCK - no where near the fidelity of the actual display (something like 512 local dimming zones, vs 2 million screen pixels) RGB LED also has no effect on these things... just serves to improve gamut and offers some advantage for color calibration, color temperature.

I have to agree on the optical drive inclusion. One of the reasons the Envy 15 is so great is the lack of optical. Just look at the Envy 14. It's heavier and thicker then the 15. yet it has weaker graphics and a smaller screen!

Use the damn space you gain with no optical to
1.) make the laptop smaller/thinner
2.) include a larger battery.
3.) improve cooling.

hasn't it already?? I mean, the market keeps growing at least. My personal collection is about 8% DVD and 92% HD-DVD/BD (about 75 disks)

 

Sorry, we were discussing BD replacing DVD for software use only, not movies. Of course BD is replacing DVDs in video and making very steady gains, but in terms of software (one of the main reasons you'd see a BD drive over a DVD drive in a computer), BD might eventually replace DVDs, but haven't yet. I remember in Win95 when it was so strange to think a game would need more than one CD to install and play... then Wing Commander IV came out with 6 CDs or a single DVD, and it all made sense. Imagine Metal Gear Solid 4 on DVDs... haha.
"Snake, you need to insert DVD 4 to continue."

 

I don't think so either. online distribution and flash memory will replace DVD's before BD's. Hence why I do not want an optical drive in my laptop.

 

well in that case, BD will never go mainstream on laptops and desktop computers.

by the industries preference.

online distribution sucks. US networks can't support it (infrastructure just isn't there), and the quality of digital distro releases is a fraction of what it is like on original BD's.

it's like comparing 160kbps MP3 files to the original CD/FLAC. it's "okay"...maybe even acceptable for most. But everyone who cares about quality knows the quality that comes with an 8GB-10GB digitally-distributed 1080p movie will pale in comparison to its 50GB big brother on a BD.

and even then, the US is at least 5-7 years away from being able to stream 8GB-10GB movies over the internet. digital distro is alright in principle, but we're far away from it being reasonable in practice.

 

BD is one of the primary reasons that the PS3 is the only un-piratable* system.

It's one of the reasons I think software might move to BD and that the industry might push for it; to reduce piracy. If the cost of a BD-R is as much as the software itself, why pirate it?

Of course, you could just download it off the internet........ but there's probably something you could do to make that harder.

*Besides PS Store downloaded games.

 

The Envy 15 manages dual SSD by jamming two 1.8 drives into one 2.5 slot. I do find it curious that dual SSD apparently won't be a config option on the 17 as it is on the 15. But this is something that could easily change by the time the machine is officially released on the 19th.

 

^ true. we'll see!

I don't really feel up to responding to the rest, so I'll address this one: I'm not a gamer. I don't buy these computers as toys. I use them to get work done, and my trade focuses on print design and development, graphic design and development, web design and development. I've been building and configuring computers since the days of my Compaq 486DX/33 with Windows 3.1 & DOS + 8MB ram. I've been buying exclusively 17" laptops for the last decade or so.

for what I do these days, color accuracy is important. any old display *won't* do. I paid $2,700 for the 18.4" Vaio AW 290 in my sig almost exclusively because of how amazing the display was on a portable system. it was overpriced for the specs, but the display alone made it worth the price of admission. It covered above and beyond the Adobe RGB color spectrum and the difference was *always* obvious when sat next to other computer displays. Truth be told, if I didn't have so many repair problems, I'd still have it and still be bragging on it. that color gamut = jaw-dropping. awe-inspiring. nut-busting.

so yes, i need a good display with colors I can trust. my work rides on it to some degree. Whether the Envy's 200:1 contrast ratio and 72% RGB spectrum are good enough for my needs when I'm mobile or not will become clear in upcoming days as tests and benchmarks are completed.

To be sure, this will be a great computer for those who are mobile and demand power on the go. But for me, I need power on the go and a display whose color reproduction I can trust...and at this point, I prefer it all in a weight lighter than my past 17"+ machines (I can carry more weight, but why should I if I don't have to?). That's why the 8740w is on my short list (DreamColor + form factor). That's why the MBP17 is on my short list (high-quality matte + form factor). That's why this Envy has been on my short list for awhile now.

It will remain on my short list unless the battery life is putrid or the display is of less quality than I need. It's just that simple. Ever since the early days of this thread, I've been saying I need a great screen combined with good battery life and good enough power to run Adobe software, Visual Studio and Autodesk software. All 3 of my "finalists" will do that relatively well (give or take a little, depending). All 3 are competent machines. Price really isn't the issue, though if I can save money with the Envy and be satisfied, I sure as hell will. What's most important to me is that whichever computer I get needs to operate well for the next 3 years (no matter what, I'd not want any of these finalists in 2014, period) and meet my specific (and perhaps non-standard) needs after which, it will be re-sold.

I promise you, if I didn't need a good mobile display, I would have picked up an Acer TimelineX machine, an SSD and called it a day. But unlike for most, my needs are those that typically command a high price tag. I'm okay with that, as I make it all back with 1 project.

I appreciate your full response...but you see how much time and energy it takes me to just address your singular point here. I just don't have the energy to meaningfully address the rest.

was gonna say that. lol

and so long as files install on computers, there's no way to make that more difficult. but really, they shouldn't bother. piracy creates legions of future professionals who will buy and use their software. take Photoshop, for instance: how much has Adobe benefited from people pirating Photoshop over the years? It's created armies of employees who know how to use and purchase photoshop and other suites. if not for that, people would have found and used free software like GIMP and that would have become the standard, to Adobe's detriment.

but I digress. Back to Envy 17 talk.

 

I know a lot of people in the industry who believe Autodesk purposely leaks copies of Maya and 3dsMax on the internet. They're so expensive that the average user won't buy it, period, but they want people to learn how to use them so in the future, they can buy legitimate copies and make a living on it. Same with Adobe's Creative Suite.

Piracy isn't only used on professional software, it's arguably primarily used on games and other forms of entertainment media. But I honestly believe game piracy either does not reduce sales, or reduces sales by so little that it doesn't matter, for the most part. Most people who pirate games do it because they lack the financial means to legitimately purchase the game.

But anyway, back to the Envy17. After looking at its specs, I'm re-considering the ASUS G73JH... the main drawback of which is the lack of eSATA, expresscard, and USB 3.0. That means it's limited to USB 2.0 file transfer speeds.

 

Agreed on the software stuff, Koshinn. completely. it's a brilliant leveraging of that kind of thing, to be quite honest.

and yea...the G73 is a beast. I was looking very hard at that system. I had the exact same reservations. At those prices, though, I certainly understand being willing to go without. lol.

only reason I scratched it off my short list was because of the lack of firewire, which I needed for certain video streaming/recording functionality with some hardcore camera equipment.

I'm very interested in seeing what will happen with Intel and Lightpeak. Because even with a name like "USB", it would get stomped on if Intel supports a competing technology exclusively. it looks like a game-changer on paper. whenever they make that decision, all of us stressed out about getting or not getting USB3 for "futureproofing" will feel pretty dumb. (or justified if they go with USB3)

 

FYI I just profiled my E15 gen1 1080p display again, I got 277 nits and about 600:1 contrast. so it seems to hold up brightness pretty well over time -when I got it late Deceber it was not much brighter. Gamut is a close match to sRGB which is ideal for non-colormanaged use but a bit low for wide-gamut use.

Going beyond sRGB means you're stretching those 6 bits per channel awfully far though - most color pros would likely agree that a midrange external IPS screen is a better solution than even the top of the line DreamColor/Dell M6x00 display panels.

 

ACTUALLY.... i think pirating blu-ray is already possible. they were selling some in a place i went to and i was a bit skeptical at first.. yknow i thought they were just labeling dvds as blurays because thats what they used to do.... but they actually ARE blu-ray! they still cost like 12 bucks anyway with the exchange rate.

 

I archive my purchased BDs to a RAID 5 NAS using AnyDVDHD. Haven't tried to burn to a DL disk tho.

 

Yes, unless you buy a ridiculous quantity, blank BD-R DL media costs almost the same price as buying another copy of the retail packaged blu-ray.

 

Dell ships their studio 17 model with and optional 17" RGB-LED display?? Why can't HP put a decent 1080p display on this thing??? It almost perfect in every other regard- but the screen is where everything begins. When choosing a computer, I pick the screen first and work from there.

 

I noticed that but I have no interest in making copies.

The situation was the same when writeable DVDs first came out, but it seems the content owners are exerting greater control on the BD HW chain.

 

Discredit this post, contrast level is a good indicator after doing some research. The Sony CW has a higher contrast ration than 200:1,

 

are there any pictures or video that show what the envy 17 looks like from the bottom?

 

You can download the HP ENVY 17 - Maintenance and Service Guide. There are some schemes. Manuals for HP Envy 17t-1000 CTO Notebook PC - HP Customer Care (United States - English)
What about the battery time, since it hasn't got a slice?

I hope 3.7kg to be the weight with 2 HDD and the power adaptor

 

There is a diagram on pg 15 of the Service Manual

http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c02160120.pdf

 

(because scrolling through service manuals sucks)

I suppose it's fairly obvious given the volume of bottom ventilation that a standard slice is out of the question. here's hoping the "big butt" extended battery rocks.