*HP HDX DRAGON Owners Lounge, Part 1*

I have a strange problem with the system icons on the taskbar - the volume, battery, and network. With each power-up, they could all be there (rarely), some be there, or none at all. When I right click on taskbar properties then go to notification tab, the icons showing on the taskbar have black letering with a checkmark in the box. The icons that are missing the lettering is not black and I can't put a checkmark in the box with the missing icons. After a restart, it changes. Any ideas on why my Dragon is playing musical icons?

 

( For you old timers around here, see if this rings a bell...)

I've had both the WUXGA and the WSXGA+, and personally, I feel the colors are much better on the WSXGA+. I never felt the colors on the WUXGA were "quite right". As such, my current Dragon has WSXGA and I'm happy with that.

 

Not quite sure what you are trying to say, but remember, in most desktop LCD's of recent vintage, 1680x1050 is the normal res for a 20 or 22" LCD. It's not until you reach 24" that the res went to 1920x1200. Therefore, for a 20" LCD, that's packin' a lot of pixels (sp. things are really small!)

 

Hey guys. I'm doing my preliminary shopping for the Dragon's upgrades and I wanted to know if anyone has the drive bay size for the hard drives. Looking at a WD 750GB or 1TB Drive. But these are bigger than the regular notebook HDD. I want to make sure they will fit before trying to purchase them.

Also, for anyone that is looking to upgrade the RAM for the Dragon, the price on the GSkill 4GB DIMMs have come down in price (129.99 for 667, 139.99 and free shipping for the 800) on newegg.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136414 - WD 750GB HDD

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231202 - G.SKILL 4GB SO-DIMM 667

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231292 - G.SKILL 4GB SO-DIMM 800 (yeah I know the Dragon will not run the 800 at the top speed, but if the shipping on the 667 is more than 10 bucks, then I will get the 800. Better to under pay for faster than to over pay for slower I always say lol.)

 

Oh snap..check out 37 minutes into the movie Fred Claus..I believe that would be an HDX Dragon...or is it...? EDIT: Nevermind, it's the Dell.. bah.

 

but this is still a notebook...

 

I dunno..something got corrupted possibly? I had graphical oddities for that reason till I full formatted the hard drive and reinstalled the OS. But maybe someone else has a less extreme solution.

 

...and I still don't get what differentiates a notebook LCD from a desktop LCD with regards to WUXGA vs. WSXGA+...

 

Did an HP Tech tell you that?

They both have a color range (xy) of 72% NTSC. But the LG has the slight edge in brightness being the panel with the higher watt backlights. LG (sxga+) panel is 7 watts. The other is 6 watts. That spec is even in the service manual.

To get 92% NTSC, you would need dual LED backlighting. Dragon has dual CCFL.
Or you would need a contrast ratio >2000:1. Dragon's is 200:1 for both panels. Another spec that is in the service manual.

The only real downside to the WUXGA is that if you also bought the HDX for gaming, the GPU is underpowered for that resolution. If the 280M GTX worked in the HDX, then it'd be all good. 3700M would add some umph but not enough to justify the risk and price over simply overclocking the 8800M.

 

Yep, for 16:10 20" screens, 1680 x 1050 was optimal DPI and the standard internationally. Notebooks were allowed to violate this ergonomic rule because one generally sits somewhat closer to a notebook screen and lean in due to the keyboard's location. But that's really for smaller notebooks.

1680 x 1050 was also your best bet for gaming since it is optimal for the 8800M GTS. It will give you much higher frame rates at native resolution than the 1920 x 1200.

But if one doesn't game much or doesn't play demanding games and uses the HDX close up, 1920 x 1200 is fine.

 

Found this solution on a forum that worked for a number of folk. Hope it works for you also...

CLEARING THE TRAY ICON HISTORY

> run 'regedit.exe'

> goto key 'HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Classes\Local Settings\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion \TrayNotify'

> delete keys 'IconStreams' & 'PastIconsStream'

> start task manager, go to processes and kill explorer.exe

> go to applications in the task manager, hit new task and type 'explorer.exe'

> explorer will now reboot and your icons should return.


Pictorial guide found here: http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windows-vista/clean-up-past-notification-icons-in-windows-vista/

 

Didn't yours have problems being calibrated or something being that it was bought used? Also I remember back when the NVIDIA drivers wacked the colors out because there were several peeps besides you saying they needed to mess with the color settings to get it to look right..including me. A few drivers after that the colors looked spot on from then on out. I wonder if anyone in the forum has a new or refurbished UXGA and SXGA HDX they can compare at the same time.

 

At the time, I was crucified by certain users for even suggesting that the WUXGA was inferior to the WSXGA+, since at the time, I had both and was able to compare side-by-side. Others with only the WUXGA could not even comprehend such a notion. Blasphemy, it was!

 

I'm keeping an eye out for the 1TB drive, but I believe it's 5400... I wonder how slow it will be with that much capacity.. 2.0 did you know if they would or wouldn't fit?

You may want to check on Ebay for cheaper yet still brand new ones. Lancorp has a brand new one I believe as well still. I could be wrong but from what I remember they said 800s would be slower because it's higher than what the HDX is set up for.

 

*Cough* Erik from Nordic *cough* I wonder when the X9000 peeps are going to be selling their HDXs... I haven't seen any in a while on Ebay or elsewhere. I was thinking I could get one with a warranty including the X9000 ctod, and use this one to do operations on with the screen, touch pad because of some scratches, and upgrading the CPU if not GPU..that way I could get a side by side comparison on the UXGA and SXGA screens. On another note.. you installed an X9000 in your HDX no?

 

Haha nah, I thought it was on a web review of the different panels, but I'll try to find where I saw that at.

EDIT: Here it is directly from Chimei, 5 paragraphs down, it says the WUXGA 20.1 screens have BETTER THAN 90% saturation:

http://www.cmo.com.tw/opencms/cmo/modules/news/MCNews/mcnews_0094.html?__locale=en

Do you have any examples of anything with dual LED backlighting? I wonder why they said the 20.1 WUXGA screens have 92%+ color saturation.

Was it Kindheart or someone else saying they were running Crysis on full settings via WUXGA with no problems. Also is it just me or is this guy saying Assassins Creed is more demanding than Crysis (little lower than middle way down on the first page)...

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/action/a...vert&om_clk=gssummary&tag=summary;read-review

because the game is more dependent on CPU processing or GPU? If the 3700 worked in the HDX did you say it couldn't be overclocked?

 

I'd like to see their calculation because it's not possible to do >~75% (xy) NTSC with 200 nits brightness. Desktop monitors that have that sort of color saturation are in the >=330 nits range. TV's in the 400+ nits range. But what's funny is that Chemei didn't list it as (xy) NTSC, so it's likely meaningless or incomplete info. Or I should say info that's only useful when comparing it to their other panels but not against an industry standard benchmark. Sort of like dynamic contrast ratio figures given that most manufacturers have their own way of figuring it.

Though on other parts of their website they do talk about the NTSC standard and that it is acheived with higher nits of brightness using LED backlight in 20.1" screens. Paragraph 6.

http://www.cmo.com.tw/opencms/cmo/modules/news/MCNews/mcnews_0004.html?__locale=en

And if you look at the specs of all their desktop monitors with high color saturation, you will see that the nits are all above 300 whether using LED or CCFL backlighting.

Whoever may have said it ( Not Kindheart BTW) was flat out lying. It's impossible. Even desktop 8800M GTXs couldn't do it well.

I have it and yes, it is more demanding than Crysis and Crysis Warhead. But depends on the driver you are using. The original HDX driver could barely play Crysis. These newer ones play nicely especially when overclocked.

No you likely wouldn't be able to overclock it because there's no thermal or electrical budget for doing so. The HDX's 8800M GTS is proprietary - that is to say made exclusively for the HDX with the HDX's electrical and thermal specifications (remember that it's a single motherboard designed to be used with two types of MXM cards.) The 3700M is about twice the design wattage and current usage. What's more the HDX's fans weren't designed for that TDP. That kind of heat would eventually affect the rest of the unit or at least the components in the vicinity of the card.

 

It'll be quick because it's all about density per platter more so that speed. A 320GB 5400 RPM HDD will be faster than a 120GB-180GB 7200 RPM HDD.

So it stands to reason that a 1TB HDD @ 5400RPM will be somewhat faster than a 500GB 7200RPM HDD. Provided that they have the same number of platters. Because it's all about density.

As for the size, won't fit the caddy. Likely won't fit the bay because the connector itself may be a 1mm or so too low for the 12.5mm height HDDs. This is one of those cases where one would have to brave it and experiment.

 

I have never owned nor played Crysis. I don't like this type of games. Please don't refer to someone if you are not sure; it doesn't add to your message but can only hurt, when others bounce back saying 'X' is a liar.

 

No worries. I didn't think it was you. Nor would anyone else really. You've only posted factual stuff. But every now and again we get folks making wild claims. But most importantly, they do so and rarely if ever come back after having done it. Or I should say when asked to back it up.

 

Reminds me of the guy that posted about his friend having upgraded the vid card on his HDX but never having proof. Think he took the card from an alienware. That was a mess.

 

Yea I wasn't sure, sorry I mentioned you man. I didn't know how to tactfully state that..like say "you" (Kindheart), not mention your name at all, or say Kindheart as I did. I know better. Sorry about that.

EDIT: I figured out how I scrambled that in my head.. I was arguing that Assassins Creed was more demanding than Crysis, and I believe you posted a thing about how you are able to handle Assassins Creed with no problems at 60fps unless my eyes deceive me (post #7657)..

"Thanks for the suggestion. I have just posted a message there. I am currently running Assassin's Creed at 60 fps+ at maximum settings/highest quality (WUXGA / X9000), so even if that gets halved it would still be playable at highest settings or at some other visually acceptable tweaked settings. There are also many other less demanding games, as well as 3D movies (NVIDIA has started a free gallery), which are not as demanding as real-time games. NVIDIA has recently announced that they are planning mobile GPU support in a future driver release".


which I guess 2.0 said was more so due to the drivers. I confused the more demanding Assassins Creed with Crysis. My bad.

 

Does anything this guy/these guys is/are saying apply you think?


http://www.hardforum.com/archive/index.php/t-1153458.html

My bad on mentioning him/you Kindheart, as I certainly was not certain on who exactly it was. I haven't slept in 3 days so I wasn't thinking very well in how to state that better. I'm going to sleep after this..

I was thinking some games are more GPU dependent, others seem to rely more on CPU processing so I didn't know if that factored in to what the reviewer said. I have it too and it plays just fine on WUXGA settings. I wonder how much better it can get with drivers. Also about overclocking, is it true that it can corrupt the BIOS as it warns while installing System Tools? If so, how does one fix that...flashing the newest BIOS over it? I can't seem to get it to go past the 610 recommended settings without the 3DMark failing.

Hmm ok. I guess putting the fans on manual control and setting them to go higher wouldn't help? Or maybe use really cold water balloons possibly?

 

I see. Thanks for explaining that. You think the build thickness will be a universal thing when Seagate and others come out with their own or will it just a Western Digital thing? I'm scared to know what the release pricing will be..though the 500GB 7200 drives weren't bad at release.

 

Sort of. But the point is, the HDX's WUXGA, like the SXGA+, does not do more than 72% (xy) NTSC. Not possible at 200 nits max brightness. If it were 300+ nits, then yes, it would be possible.

I have a SONY XBR TV that does 97% (xy) NTSC and the XBR in my living room that does 104% (xy) NTSC. Radical difference between them. Instantly noticeable. Difference between 72% and 92% would be super radical and would be a major selling point. HP would have plastered such information because it would have been a major feat for a notebook. Apple, IBM and Dell did when they offered them. In fact HP did with their business workstation notebook, IIRC.

Crysis is a different animal though. Same with COD series. FPS games tend to be more GPU dependent. Crysis sort of balances GPU/CPU but still is GPU dependent. Assasins creed is 3rd person perspective so there are certain calculations that do not have to be made as in first person shooters.

Not true for the HDX.

Every individual card has its vagaries. Some can clock higher, some lower. Between my 2 HDX's, each can clock differently and output slightly different scores at the same settings.

Nope, neither. And you can't make the fans go higher. Besides, would you like to hear the fans on high all the time? It'll get annoying quickly.

LOL @ cold water balloons.

 

Someone will come out with the 9.5mm height version sooner or later. Figure early 2010. It's inevitable. I haven't been keeping up with HDDs lately. I'm all about SSDs now. But HDDs, although slower, are still economical forms of storage. And when USB3.0 takes the lead (which is faster than eSATA), HDDs will continue to dominate for a while.

Imagine a plug and play USB 3.0 HDD enclosure with speeds faster than eSATA and all powered by the USB cable?

So keep you eye out for a USB 3.0 Expresscard that should be out early 2010.

 

No harm done. Thanks for your note. Also thanks to 2.0.
Yes, I like AC (and AC2 next month) for its historical charm and realistic rendering of old cities, but I still dislike the violence in it. With NVIDIA 3D Vision Discover on, AC runs at 20fps or so (1080p/X9000), which is 1/3 the original non-3D Vision performance. The stereoscopic effect is breathtaking but as I said game performance suffers ( at same max. settings unchanged, though still playable and can be of course improved by reducing settings/running at lower resolution doesn't help that much). Other games do not suffer any noticeable performance hit with 3D Vision. You need to try...

 

More breathtaking 3D Movies:
http://zalman.com/ENG/product/Product_Read.asp?Idx=346

and 3D Photopacks:
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3D_Vision_3D_Pictures.html

 

That is was. I gave him the benefit of the doubt but, well, you know the rest.

 

Yes I did, and I love it. Was working on it today, as a matter of fact. (I have many computers, but unlike kids, some don't always get my attention). I really do enjoy that X9000...gives it real spunk!

Good luck finding one with an X9000 in it, cto'd from HP...if there is one, you're going to pay a pretty penny. I lucked out in getting my X9000...I got a great deal on the chip!

 

The 1TBs are in the $220s right now, so until the competition comes out with adequete competition, they will be at that price for a while. The 750GBs are $149.99 at newegg. I am hoping that they are working to increase the capacity of the platters so the drives can have only 2 platters and not be as thick in the future. Yeah it's wishful thinking, but that's what my friends said when I told them just over a year ago that I was gonna get a 20" laptop

I wouldn't mind being the guinea pig and seeing if the 750GB or 1TB drives fit the HDX. If it works, great. It not, then I can just take the drive and throw it in my server. Prob will order it sometime in the next months or so. and of course i will post my findings and pics if I need to do something special to get it in the bay.

 

when this does come out, will putting one in an hdx make use of the full 3.0 speed, considering it's not natively 3.0?

 

Yes, but only through the ports on the expresscard.

 

Yes of course. so through the express card, there is greater than 3.0 Gbits/s (eSata) transfer rate? I thought most drives cannot saturate the 1.5Gbit/s rate, let alone the 3.0Gbit/s. Dare I think that USB 3.0 cannot reach it's 5.0Gb/s rate even less?

What about sata (III as it were) 6.0 Gb/s?

 

SSDs have already broken the 1.5Gbit/s transfer rate. Exceeding the 3.0 as a single drive is just around the corner. Mechanical drives will likely top out at SATA 3.0. But if you RAID them, they can break the 3.0Gbit/sec rate.

USB 3.0 would be abel to reach it's limit in the expresscard slot. But the question is what device would be able to approach that limit? Possibly a RAID enclosure with SSDs.

 

Doesn't this indicate they do use the same NTSC standards to define color saturation?

http://www.cmo.com.tw/opencms/cmo/technology/Display_Technologies/high_color_tech.html?__locale=en

From what I understand their WUXGA screen actually has 300 nits despite what the manual may say. This parts place lists it as such, but I'll try to post other sources as well:

http://www.hexparts.com/HP-Pavilion-HDX9000-201-Brightview-WUXGA-LCD-452302-001_p_31-802.html


Here's one more from our own forum. Iliketechnology posted his cto specs details in post #1667 and it lists the monitor as having 300 nits as well:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=169232&page=167

If one can play AC on high settings with UXGA and it's more demanding than Crysis, why can't one play Crysis at the same settings with the latest drivers? As you can tell I don't have Crysis yet. Also I believe the maximum power consumption of the 3700m is 75 watts according to Nvidia. The 8800m gts current consumption is 50 watts, but the site doesn't seem to indicate if this is average or maximum. Do you know which it is? The Dragon also has a much bigger chassis than the 8730, and much better cooling. If the 3700m doesn't melt the 8730's innards would it be a problem in the HDX in that case?

So I can overclock the crap out of my GPU and it will never corrupt the BIOS then? Speaking of corruption I think my OS is corrupted again. I can't wait to reinstall 64 bit to replace my Anytime Upgrade 32 bit! The 3D drivers won't recognize the OS as it is. I just need somewhere to store all these 1080i videos I recorded from my DVR first and all my hard drives are loaded to the max..

I see. I think I'm having problems with DX9 or the GPU or something.. the display drivers crash when I try to do some 3DMarks.. it crapped out when I got one QuickDock working via Component video out.. Now no QuickDocks will work via video or audio through the expansion port and HP is recommending using the newest BIOS flash to eliminate possible incompatibilities:/ I tried 5-6 different QuickDocks and only one worked with video no audio for just a week. I think the GPU may be purposely limiting itself somehow. I don't know what the deal is.

It might be annoying but I use earplugs. Can't think it would be any more annoying than the feint high pitched squeal that comes when you plug in headphones. Am I the only one who hears that?

It was the only liquid cooling system I thought might work

 

I'm trying to figure out the best possible investment for my video recording.. I DO like being able to record an On*Demand* movie in 1080i without having to buy a BluRay disc and BluRay burner I don't know if I should get a server (Which seems like the best option), a BluRay burner but Id have to buy BlurRay discs, and or more internal hard drives. I'll likely get all three at some point, but trying to figure out which would be best soon.

Can't you just like duct tape the morbidly obese drives in if it doesn't fit? Lol. Yea if you could let us know that would be sweet. Seems like the Western Digitals will be the first to go down in price when competition pops us since they came out first and all.

 

Just a quick note to say that I've had my HDX for one year today. Its the best laptop that I've ever owned or used. Aside from the keyboard issue, its been 100% reliable. I use it every day for work. Its been on about a dozen road trips. You can't beat the HDX as a portable desktop machine.

The only other machine that I would consider is a quad powered laptop with 2 video ports so that I could run 2 25" monitors at work.

I haven't made any changes to it thus far, but I'll probably do a processor and RAM upgrade at some point.

Is the x9000 still the fastest processor that can be used in an HDX ? Or have others come to market since that are faster ?

Thanks

 

Can it be RAIDed in the HDX?

 

"Can it be RAIDed in the HDX?"

With Linux it can... not that I am doing it.

 

Yea I know right? People must be very happy with it because they get very few listed. I think I'd be very happy with the X9000s performance. I push my HDX till it cries. I usually have 100+ tabs opened in Firefox, that uses many addons, IMs in the background, and video recording software going. Which X9000 chip did you get? ES?

 

Yes, via software raid, not hardware (which is preferable).

But if you get an external RAID array box you will have hardware raid.

 

I just did some testing with my Dragon... it will run 2 external displays !

Using Fedora F11 and the proprietary nVidia driver, reboot with 2 external monitors connected. (1 via the VGA port, the other via HDMI port.)

Log into a KDE session and go to Kickstart->System->nVidia Display Settings. It should show 3 display devices.

Disable the laptop display and enable the 2 external displays. Wala, they both work.

Can this be done in Windows too ?

The reason I am excited about this is because one can then run 2 23 or 25 inch 1920x1080 external displays which have much better ergonomics than using the laptop display. The laptop just becomes a pizza box sized processing machine. With Linux one can disable the lid switch and the Dragon lid doesn't even have to be kept open.

Time to go buy some monitors !

 

That's was I was referring to yesterday.

Yet, that is not the contract installed version in the HDX. Nor would it be the one you'd get if you bought the screen from HP. That's a replacement part which appears to be better spec'd than the original. What's more, it's double the watts of the original and is a different part number altogether. The WUXGA's part number is 452300-001. 452302 is the after market part number for the WUXGA that was never installed in the HDX. There may also be an error with the specs listed by these third party parts vendors which is common. If you look up the actual part number 452300-001, you will see errors in the specs with some of the 3rd party part vendors. Some list it as have 1 CCFL. It for sure has 2 of them. I've seen dimension sizes that are incorrect.

The other thing you have to beware of is that since it's a fungible part, while you may order the 452302, you may end up getting the 452300. But that's assuming the 452302 actually is 300 nits as oppossed to the original's 180 nits.

Last thing is, it may be possible that some HDX's have the 452302-001 screen as a last minute replacement due ot supply contraints or that HP may replace one's screen with it as opposed to the original screen. After all, it is fungible.

Those specs didn't come from HP.

The thing you have to understand about HP products is that much of what goes into an HP is proprietary. Meaning, they have things made to their specs which differ from the part maker's general specs for the part in question. For instance, the Gateway with the same 8800M GTS is faster than the one in the HDX because the HDX's is proprietary. USB controller, RICOH card reader, etc are also not to part maker's specs. Just opening up the HDX and looking at some of the IC chip codes/models and you can see that the HDX is truly a custom job.

Because of the way it and most FPS games are programmed. To much of a detailed discussion to get into. But it's a standard fact and why gamers always match GPU to resolution.

It's Max. but the HDX's 8800M is likely not 50watts, it's closer to 35 watts TDP. The 50 watt TDP is for standard 8800Ms. You can tell by looking at the difference in design of a standard 8800M versus the HDX's.

In any event, chassis size isn't as relevant as cooling design. Having actually had the cooling system of the 280M GTX which has the same TDP as the 3700M, it is clear that the HDX likely wouldn't handle it will - certainly not for overclocking. Dual heat pipes would be required. HDX only has one. Also overclocking requires current overhead. HDX's MXM specs are proprietary. They designed it so it outputs a certain amount of current, not more.

You can overclock it until you can't. Meaning, until either games crash, you get pixelation, or temps get out of hand.

Couldn't tell you what's up. But a BIOS update to latest wouldn't fix the issue.

Nope, haven't noticed that issue.

LOL.

I see a desktop and subsequent bliss in your future.

 

Long time no see.

Yes X9000 is the max.

 

You always mention you have tons of tabs open in Firefox...what is it, exactly, that you do that you have so many, and in fact, keep them all open simulataneously?

My X9000, btw, is not an ES, it's an SLAZ3, from here...keep in mind I got an extra $45 off using a bing.com cashback promo at the time!

You know, there is a really cheap HDX9494nr on ecost.com ($764) that has a supposed bad DVD drive...sounds like a good candidate for using as an upgrade machine with an X9000...you could have an awesome system for around $1200!

 

Hi Everyone,

I just wanted to say goodbye to everyone.

I have decided to move on and bought an HP IQ830UK we discussed some time ago.

I got it now and am happy with it. The CPU is not as good as in HDX but it is easily upgradeable to any of the T9xxx series and I am fishing in the internet to buy one some day.

I also upgraded RAM to 8GB and hopefully my problems with graphics editing stutters will go away.

It was great being a member of the HDX community, the best one.

 

It was great having you aboard. Thanks for the many contributions.

Best wishes going forward.

 

I am contemplating buying that one for either the spare parts or to fix the Blu-ray drive and sell it. It's a thought

 

Sorry to see you go. Take care and thanks for the input