HP Spectre 13T-3000

Thanks - that was me - I'm going to have it delivered to my brother's workplace to play safe - so useful to know anyone can sign for it! I played with the i7/8G/256MB version in a shop today - feels nice totally overpriced in NZ @ NZ$3000 - but I'm confident I've made the right choice - trouble is I have to wait until late April to touch my baby :-(

 

My first one came in a plastic bag, but the replacement came in a neoprene sleeve. Maybe they ran out of plastic bags.

 

Oh, wow. Lucky on that neoprene sleeve. Speaking of sleeves, I am looking for a nice sleeve to accompany this system for my sister. (Everything is a gift!).

I should probably be shopping for ones made for the MBA's, since they'll be the closest fit, right? I want something with no zippers since those could always scratch the notebook.

 

So, I tried the Spectre in the leather sleeve, and the sleeve is quite a bit larger, about 1" of play in both directions. The foam (which is the same exact size as the laptop) seemed to fit better, but I think that's because the edges weren't tapered and has a higher coefficient of friction than the aluminum Spectre.

Here's a pic of the sleeve that came with it:


And a couple of the laptop in the leather sleeve:

 

Yeah, this Spectre is basically the same size as a MacBook Air. So any sleeves for it will fit this.

MacBook Air: 12.8" x 8.94" x 0.68"
Spectre 13t: 12.75" x 8.66" x 0.59"

Specs pulled from the HP and Apple sites. I've not physically compared the two since I don't have nor know anyone with a MacBook Air.

 

Has anyone been able to boot from a live Linux USB with this laptop. I've got a Fedora 20 live USB that I wanted to test, but can't seem to get it to boot, and I'm not sure if it's Fedora, UEFI, or SecureBoot. I hit Escape to get the menu, hit F9 for the boot menu, select my USB stick, the Fedora boot menu shows, and I select Fedora. The screen goes black, the LED on my USB flickers and flashes but nothing other than a black screen. I tried disabling SecureBoot in the BIOS, but even after saving the settings, it's still enabled. Is there some other trick to disabling SecureBoot? Any other tricks for bootig into Linux or from a USB drive?

Edit: I also tried changing from UEFI to BIOS, but that also is reset on boot. I think ultimately I do want BIOS boot for my USB stick, because I wanted to boot into MemTest, and that option doesn't exist in the UEFI boot menu for Fedora.

 

Thank you for the pictures! Those always help.
Wow, the dimensions are incredibly close. Also, the Spectre 13t is thinner? Wow?

Looks like sleeve hunting will be a breeze. I was originally planning on getting the HP leather sleeve but it's unfortunate that it's so expensive. I wish they had a good coupon for it.

 

So, I think I figured out why the secure boot and BIOS changes weren't taking effect. After you make the changes, on the next boot, a screen pops up that has you put in a confirmation code. If you hit escape on this screen, it'll cancel the changes. Since I had made the changes to boot from USB, I was hitting escape to pause the boot to get to the boot menu, and in doing so was canceling my BIOS changes.

After that, I was able to boot my USB in legacy mode to run MemTest86. Oddly, MemTest86 doesn't really work on this machine (at least not mine). It hangs. I tried running it from my Fedora 20 live USB, and several older ubuntu CDs I had laying around. All are version 4.20 of MemTest. I even got in my wayback machine and pulled out Hardy Heron, which has MemTest 1.70. That version just immediately rebooted. I was eventually able to get 4.20 to run by using the fail-safe mode. The only thing I can figure is when it hangs, it has several 0s next to chipset and processor, so I wonder if it hangs during detection of those items.

I figured since the RAM was soldered on, I'd want to run through several passes with MemTest while still in my return window.

 

I think I am going to be exchanging my second Spectre, everything is great on it except the part of the keyboard that connects to the bottom of the laptop is very loose and I can separate it very easily. For example, if I gently push up on the trim piece right below the track pad, the entire trim piece moves up very easily. Same thing kinda happens on the left side which also makes a clicking noise.

I am contemplating downgrading my screen from QHD to FHD for battery life, is that crazy? The FHD is still a pretty nice screen, right?

Thanks

 

That downgrade is not going to make enough of a difference for you to notice. Believe me, it's not worth it -- the battery life is more concerned with the processing power, not the resolution. It's an unnecessary downgrade, in my opinion. The QHD screen is stunning.

 

Here is a new one.

So HP has a MORE125 coupon for $125 off now. http://www.shopping.hp.com/en_US/home-office/-/search-SimpleOfferSearch?PageSize=15&SearchTerm=coupon

But it doesn't work with the Spectre 13 apparently. This is not in the fine print and the coupon is right next to the 13 on the website under the price where they flag their deals. The chat person told me it was a not applicable for the laptop and that the website will need to be changed. She gave me a take it or leave it offer to buy, but for the config I want it was just not quite to the discount percentage I was looking for.

 

Let me state this again: ask for a supervisor, plead your case and you will probably prevail. If you don't, hang up and repeat the process. The first line agent has no authority to extend a discout.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

 

Ditto. With all the QHD screens being sold there will be more and more content in higher resolution. Check out one on YouTube and you won't be thinking of changing that screen

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

 

So my third spectre (second replacement as I grew tired of the image retention and leaks) should come in on Wednesday (one day earlier than Fedex's estimate as usual). I have the i7/QHD/8GB/256GB/AC model (fully loaded), is it true that the FHD might result in better battery life? I did notice myself having to put the QHD at a higher brightness during school. I bought mine for a total of $1,220 (with a discount of 20% from Dec 31, and a discount I was given for the first ones shipping delays...yes I've been waiting that long for a proper computer now, its sad) So downgrading to the FHD will bring it below the Bill Me Later promotion i bought it with, so i may have to buy it with some thing else which is fine. Also apparently the FHD is marginally brighter, not to mention using photoshop at 1440p is a total joke, hopefully Microsoft pulls it together quickly because there are more and more Windows PCs with HiDPI displays. If the FHD truly does deliver higher battery life

I was also offered 3 year accidental damage warranty. Can anyone vouch for the accidental damage protection from HP? There are like 3 options for the warranty which makes it confusing for me to choose.

I plan on using the computer for the next 4 years at least, for computer science and design in college. I am VERY careful and protective of my electronics, I have yet to crack a phone screen which seems so easily done for most people. With that in mind I still wanted to be covered just incase of rain water damage, drops, bumps, spills etc and anything that can accidentally happen on campus or at home. Also I think the warranty covers up 3 incidents total which I think is plenty.

But if the panel is suffering from retention then I might consider going to FHD. Also do y'all think that the person that received a neoprene sleeve was an isolated incident? Would be really nice to not have to buy one and it had the branding. Just a random side note. I think the USA Network should use the spectre in Suits. I mean c'mon it would be freakin awesome if Harvey Specter had a Spectre.:thumbsup:

 

Mine came one day after the Fedex estimate.

The story I've always heard is that a lower res uses less battery for a couple reason. 1) And this would be very minor, that the GPU has less pixels to push. And 2) the support structure for each pixel blocks some of the light, and the more pixels, the more structure that's there to block light; therefore, to get the same light out, you need a brighter backlight. Makes sense, but I'm not an IPS display engineer.

As far as the Photoshop, that's purely an Adobe issue. MS provides the tools to implement HighDPI, but Adobe hasn't implemented them.

For what it's worth, I just bougth a new HP IPS monitor for my desktop. In the users manual, it states that image retention is inherent to IPS technology. I have a feeling all IPS could suffer from IR, just to what degree. I've not explicitly tested my FHD Spectre or my new monitor, but I've not seen any IR on either.

 

Good to know, then Adobe is making a pretty big mistake considering a hi-res screen is somewhat better for editing to see details without zooming in. I've seen an iMac with IR problems. I know its an IPS thing but I also know that it has been minimized over the years significantly, the last Specter got IR REALLY easily. Also if anyone has any thoughts on the sleeve thing and the warranty please let me know.

 

Good to know, then Adobe is making a pretty big mistake considering a hi-res screen is somewhat better for editing to see details without zooming in. I've seen an iMac with IR problems. I know its an IPS thing but I also know that it has been minimized over the years significantly, the last Specter got IR REALLY easily. Also if anyone has any thoughts on the sleeve thing and the warranty please let me know.

 

Besides changing the resolution prior to using remote desktop, how else can use remote desktop without the text becoming extremely small once logged in? My work LCDs resolution(s) is less than this laptop and it doesn't scale so text is extremely small. Only way I have been able to avoid this is by changing resolution on Spectre first and then launched remote desktop, but this is a little annoying.

Thanks

 

Remote Desktop on a High-DPI Screen

 

I've encountered an issue, most likely related to the 7260AC card or driver and Windows 8. It only intermittently picks up 5GHz wireless channels. Since my router is now much closer than it used to be I decided to turn off the 2.4GHz SSID and use the 5GHz only. The 13t-3000 picked it up and it worked fine until it went to sleep. Then it wouldn't work until I turned the router channel from "Auto" to a specific one. Again, it worked great until the laptop went to sleep and then it fails to locate it again (e.g. it only lists 2.4GHz networks). I was able to get it working again when I had both the 2.4GHz and 5GHz SSIDs enabled and broadcasting. I'll find out later if the 5GHz network disappears again. My research indicates that this is not uncommon on Windows 8, but it still affects the functionality of the Spectre as a whole. Has anyone encountered this and is there a fix or advice you can share? I'd rather use the 5GHz network with 40MHz channel width if possible.

 

I know that there are a good many people who want to buy this model but are not successful getting HP to honor the 20% discount (see one of my many posts on how to increase likelihood of success with this) and when I was at the Microsoft Store the other day I had a chance to see and play with an interesting alternate that is selling at steep discounts both at the MS Store and through HP with coupons. It's the HP Touchsmart 14. It comes in a variety of configurations, but there is a version sold at MS that has 8GB RAM, Core i5-4200U, HD 4400, and a 3200x1800 screen (yes, that's higher res than the Spectre 13t's and it looked quite impressive under bright flourescent store lights. The one main downside: the model at the MS store has a 500GB HDD with an SSD boot accelerator. My sense is that it is quite easy to remove the HDD and put in any 2.5" SSD and you can get good 25GB SATA III models starting at around $150. A bonus is that there are some versions of this model sold with a fairly high end nVidia d-gpu, for not much more money. It is a little confusing to go to HP.com and try to create a CTO one, however, as it doesn't seem that you can spec even a FHD screen, though there may be a different model designation that has the ultra high res screen. oh, saved the best for last: the price of the model I described above at the MS Store is presently $799! Even if you add $200 for replacing its HDD with an SSD you're looking at $999 for the same or better specs than the Spectre 13t. And, of course, the Touchsmart 14 has a 14" screen. It is a bit heavier and bulkier than the Spectre and, honestly, it doesn't have the awesome design and build quality of the Spectre, but that's a hard standard to live up to. Point is, if no discounts on Spectre 13 are in sight, you may be able to get a model that is equal to or better than the Spectre 13 (after substituting SSD) for under $1,000. If you can find a way to configure this on HP.com, you could get one with a nVidia 750 dgpu for under $1,200.

 

Engadget has reviewed the laptop.

HP Spectre 13 Ultrabook review: a good deal, but with trade-offs

I'd expect interest to go up.

 

Before you opt for a 3200x1800 res, check out the Yoga 2 Pro thread for problems associated with that res. A yellow color that looks green, a fix that decreases battery life and problems scaling so that text is readable.

Regards, Jim

 

Sometimes, they try to offer you a discount to your order total if you try to return the item. May be an option if you don't like the device.

 

That's the most critical review I've seen to date. The reviewer does like not the interaction with the touchpad, and reports that the feel of the keys left a great deal to be desired. Do any of the users in this thread share those sentiments?

They seem to directly conflict with some of the other favorable reviews, and I note that the Engadget round up of other commercial reviews is not up to date. For example, they use a September preview from Laptop Magazine instead of the more recent Editor's Choice full review. Given that they seem to take other reviews into account in the ultimate scoring, that is a significant omission, and seems rather unfair to this product.

 

While I don't have this laptop (yet) I've read a lot the reviews online. This is the most negative of them by far. I'd also like to hear some owner's stances on the keyboard and touch pad.

 

Keyboard seems fine to me, I like it and it feels fine while typing. Touchpad is not so bad but it takes some getting used to. I have not had any issues with my palm hitting and moving the curser, it seems to do a good job of distinguishing between your finger and palm. Right clicking takes some getting used to because of the size, I like the control zones but wonder if I would be fine with just the standard touchpad.

I like the laptop but I don't love it completely, I bought it when the 20% coupon was active and I got 5% CB from Discover and another 5% CB from going through shop Discover and I had $50 of extra CB on my discover card so in all I used about $150 in CB for this purchase. I am stuck with this commitment to buy an HP laptop because of the CB I received from this purchase, if I didn't have this constraint I would possibly consider another brand. With that being said, the other ones I would look at (Yoga 2 Pro, Sony and Samsung) are much more expensive and they have their own set of problems.

 

Sticky keys? He must have spilled his coke on the keyboard! I have no problems with the keyboard or the touch pad. Well, maybe some issues with the touch pad. Although I think my issues are with Windows 8. Stuff like getting a click when I didn't consciously click. Or highlighting text when I wasn't trying to highlight.

Jim

 

Good points, Jim. Actually, I thought Lenovo had pretty much remedied the yellow problems with new drivers - so HP could probably do so too? I can't say I really understand these ultra high res displays and scaling issues since there is no content made for them, but it would seem that 3200x1800 would be a direct scale from 1600x900 such that they could even pull a rMBP trick and generate images at a 1600x900 resolution, but with 4 pixels for every one in native 1600x900 for ultra, ultra sharp results. In any event, I was quite impressed by several of the HP notebooks I saw at the Microsoft store and which have been marketed in the always-successful "stealth" style, just as the Spectre 13 has been! One of the other really impressive pieces of kit was an Envy 17 with a gorgeous FHD screen, solid no-flex keyboard and quad core i7 Haswell silicon + nVidia gpu, all for $999 with an HDD, which you could swap for an excellent $175 256GB SSD and have an amazing DTR, for anyone who still uses them.

Well, if you don't like it I suppose you wouldn't want it for any price. On the other hand, I have advised people who do want it but really wish they could get the 20% discount to buy one, try it, and if you do love it, then call in a request for an RMA to return it, at which time they will send you to the "Resoultions" dept, who will do almost anything to keep you from returning it, taking $150 off the price is an almost certainty.

Agree 100% with your assessment. The product has been so universally well received and reviewed that I don't think this one, late in the game, sour one will matter much. I think the keyboard on this model is close to as good as any Ultrabook gets, and easily equal to the MBA. As for the trackpad, I find the "Control Zone" to be gimmicky, but you can get used to it and perhaps find it improves your efficiency, or you can disable it and have a nice wide trackpad. I had some problems getting completely comfortable with the trackpad, but after a fair bit of work adjusting the Synaptics settings I now find it to be the best Windows touchpad I've ever used and only the MBA - running only in OSX - can beat it. What kills me is how often "professional" reviewers will render judgments about the functionality of a feature when they know darn well that things like touchpads always need a good bit of fiddling with to get adjusted. I don't have any idea why they had issues with the keyboard, but at most I would say they got a bad sample.

See comment directly above; it should answer all of your questions. I have owned or demoed for several weeks every single one of about 7 top "premium" ultrabooks and this is my favorite without respect to price and is an absolute runaway favorite at its pricing, particularly with the 20% discount that has been on more than off and that I believe anyone can get by ordering by phone and talking to a supervisor in sales.

 

I have used 2-finger tap for right click, and that seems much easier than having to 1-finger click in the lower right corner.

What little I've used of it (it's my fiance's laptop), I really like the keyboard, but I have noticed I miss keys at times. But I'm also a keyboard nerd and have both a Unicomp buckling spring (with the floss mod) and a Cooler Master with Cherry Browns for gaming. I still use an old rubber dome at work; I'm trying to convince them to get me a Cherry Green (ideal) or a Cherry Blue, but I fear the wrath of my cube neighbors.

The biggest issue both my fiance and I have had is 2-finger scrolling. Sometimes it doesn't pick up both fingers, so the cursor goes shooting to the top of the screen. I have run Fedora 20 off of a live USB, and 2 finger scrolling worked very well, much better than on windows. So, that tells me it's a driver issue and not really hardware related.

Control zones could very well have been implemented with a standard touchpad. The main issue I have with the control zones is the inconsistent behavior. Example: I slide in on the right side to bring up the charms bar, I can then slide up/down to select a charm and just tap (not click) to activate a charm. On the left, if you slide in, you bring up the multitask list, but you actually have to click the pad to bring up the cursor, after which you can slide up/down to select an app or start button then a tap (not click) to activate. It's that click that shouldn't be necessary.

 

To each his own, I believe, but at the price you paid you can't touch this product with one by any other manufacturer. And having owned or extensively demoed the Yoga, Sony Pro 13 and Duo 13, Samsung Ativ 9, Asus UX301,Dell XPS13, Acer S7, hmm...feel like I'm missing one...I can categorically tell you that it is my opinion that this HP Spectre 13t is as good or better than all of those models in every meaningful respect - except the Asus, which is considerably more powerful, particularly in graphics (which I don't care about) but both Asus' quality control and customer service have become so bad and the price of the Ux301 - over $1,800 - pretty much takes it out of the running as far as I'm concerned. Second closest was the Dell XPS 13, but again that was $400 more for my configuration and it was at best equal to the Spectre, not materially better in any respect.

Are you, like many of us, just quick to get bored with your latest "toy," and looking for something new to get you excited, or do you just not like this computer so much now that you own it? For the net price you paid - sounds like around $850 for the top configuration - I don't see how anything else could be in the running, unless money is not an object.

 

That is the reason why I purchased it, no comparison in price to anything else and others also have their own issues to deal with. I am not tired of the Spectre, in fact I still love the form factor and look, just a little disappointed in the few minor issues and compared to a non-ultrabook laptop it is still kinda pricey. That is my dilemma, been thinking about getting a non-ultrabook laptop with a 14" display for a much cheaper price. When compared to other ultrabooks it is the best price, when compared to a laptop then it leans towards the expensive side and fully maxed out, including CB, I ended up paying $1,150 ish for the Spectre. I know comparing this to a laptop is not a fair comparison because of the size and weight differences, but if you put those aside and just compare specs then it seems a little on the expensive side.

 

You make a great point!
Yeah, from the research I have done, the Spectre 13t is honestly the most worth it in terms of price and can match nearly all of the specifications of those competitor Ultrabooks (for the most part) at a way cheaper price. The XPS 13, for example, can also go up to a i7 4500U, 8GB RAM, 256GB SSD, AC WiFI, but has a lower display resolution and I'm sure the all-metal body of the Spectre wins the quality game. The XPS 13 at that build is almost $1700 when the Spectre 13t is around $1400. Another example is the Samsung Ativ Book 9 Plus at almost $1800, and the Zenbook while it has better graphics is about $2000. Point is, yeah, the Spectre 13t's price is worth it for what it is.

 

Hello everyone,

I just wanted to thank everyone for their input on this machine. Two years ago I purchased an almost fully loaded Envy 17 3D laptop that developed almost like a cloudy effect around the outside edges of the screen. I barely ever used this laptop (got it for school, but then relized it was way to big) I contacted HP and they sent me a box as it was still within warranty. One week later, I was informed that the wait time for a screen would take months and they would rather just replace it with something else. They were very willing to give me any device I wanted as a replacement.

I have been wanting an ultrabook for a while, I feel I will use it much more as it much more portable.

After devoting two days of my life (there is a lot of information on this thread) I have decided that this should be a fantastic machine that should last me quite some time. I did get this model fully loaded.

I should have this machine in 2-3 weeks.

I also wanted to praise HP for their excellent customer care. I was forwarded to the Case Managers when they told me the screen was going to never come. They were more than willing to work with me, and even agreed to send me the SSD i installed myself and the 750 gig second drive it came with. (wanted it back to put in an enclosure for data backup). Customer service is par none, honestly. They even gave me a 2 year warranty on the new Spectre with 2 yr accidental damage.

To all the people that are hesitant to get one, I agree there are some issues with these machines, however, the majority of people you will find on a forum or online in general are only here because they are serious enthusiest or have a serious problem. 99.9% of people will never even begin to notice most of the problems discussed on this tread and chances are if you don't specifically look for them neither will you. Also, keep in mind, most people only post to these or rant online if they do have a problem. All the other thousands that have been sold, were sold from a retail store and people bring them home and enjoy their new machine and think it is the best thing they current own.

 

My understanding of the yellow color fix was something about power management which resulted in significant reduction in battery life.

Regards, Jim

 

The Y2P was on my radar, until I found out the yellow fix was a Windows only fix, and wouldn't work in Linux. It's quite possible that there could be a fix later on in the kernel, but I didn't want to chance it.

 

Also, it looks like the Intel Rapid Start is installed and working on our laptop from the factory. Closing the lid or putting it to sleep puts it in sleep mode. If we leave it for a while, the power LED isn't blinking and you have to hit the power button to wake it. It seems that by default, it's installed, setup, and enabled, but the install from HP doesn't have the GUI to manage it. Since it works like I'd expect and want, I'm ok with leaving it alone.

 

If you search for "Rapid Start" in this thread, you'll see where a while back Burd and I had some discussion and he helped me with getting the Intel version of Rapid Start working. It includes the notification icon and GUI so you can adjust when Rapid Start takes over for sleep. It also confirms when Rapid Start is operating correctly.

 

MORE125 coupon takes $125 off until 15 March - I tried it in the shopping car - seemed to work.

I really don't want to buy for another couple of weeks - so that I get most of the 21 day right of return once I collect the machine in the US. Is it possible to get it ordered and then ask them to delay shipping ofr a week or so?

 

My sister's Spectre 13t is supposed to be at my house later today! I'm so excited for her, I just had to share it with you guys.
I also bundled this notebook with a sleeve for her as well: PLEMO Neoprene Sleeve

 

Hmm you're right.... enough people must have inquired about why it didn't work earlier in the week. Not too bad of discount off the base models (12.5%). Better than a sharp stick in the eye for one similarly configured as the "Best Value" models.

 

The MORE125 code still didn't work for me.

 

Clear your cache or try another browser. I've had a preferred configuration saved on the site for a week or so too - maybe HP cookie tracking picks that up? I'm seeing this text on the main product page:

Limited time coupon savings on this PC*:
-$125 off a $799 configuration with code MORE125
*Coupon not combinable with instant rebates.

Don't know what '"instant rebates" are - would that affect you?

 

Oh... I got it to apply. I get a small discount due to the company that owns HP also owns my employer. I get "employee pricing". It's only about $40. This coupon is much better.

 

I'm going to buy it on the last day off the offer 15Mar - but that will mean that I need to get the rellies to un-box it and turn it on so I can confirm no major fail (battery ,screen) within the 21 days right of return period.

When you first turn it on is some sort of registration required? Or can that be deferred? Is it possible for the first user just to play around, use it a bit - connect to the internet - without having to reigster or similar (either with Windows or HP) ?

 

Hello All,

I want to extend my thanks to all the contributors on this thread. I've skimmed all the pages and have decided to buy the laptop for my wife (I'm sure I'll use it more!). It has been tremendously helpful reading and helped me decide which laptop to purchase. I've decided on the following:

Windows 8.1 64
4th generation Intel® Core™ i5-4200U Processor + Intel® HD Graphics(For 8 GB Memory)
Onboard 8GB DDR3 System Memory
Included 2 Year Warranty
13.3-inch diagonal Radiance Full HD Infinity LED-backlit Display (1920x1080) Touchscreen
256GB Flash Solid State Drive
No Additional Office Software
Free Upgrade to 1-yr McAfee LiveSafe service™
4 Cell Lithium Ion Battery
No Internal DVD or CD Drive
Backlit Keyboard
Webcam and Microphone
802.11 AC WLAN and Bluetooth® [2x2]

I really like a good deal some I'm going to be calling Customer Service to try and get the 20% off. I'm a good bargainer and I hope that it works. Thanks for the advice on the previous posts about calling CS.

Cheers, CK

 

Good luck!

 

Just wanted to say that my sister's Spectre 13t came in today and she LOVES it! She almost feels bad about having me get her such a nice notebook with great specs, but I told her to stop saying that and just enjoy the gift.

The notebook actually came with a neoprene sleeve and not the plastic wrap that a lot of others got! I think it might be because my sister's configuration was customized? Maybe that makes a difference instead of the premade models? Just throwing a though out there. Either way, I ordered her a good quality sleeve to accompany the new Spectre. I'm happy for her.

 

My original order was customized as well as the replacement I received but no sleeve with either of them. Maybe the third times a charm!?

 

Maybe, haha! Don't feel like you lost anything though, it's a very cheap sleeve and I wouldn't recommend using it as a real sleeve. It's definitely more premium than simply wrapping the device in plastic or something. The sleeve is more of a complimentary notion on HP's behalf than a functional item.