*HP dv8 Owners Lounge*

All good procedures, Peter, particularly when taken with the backup of current data and drivers as you described.

I still view his principal problem to be the 'implant' to his boot sector. If Jeff (LoveLaptops) hasn't removed or uninstalled the program that installed this stuff, how do we know that Revo-Uninstaller won't reverse all the issues? Besides, if it won't, I doubt that the URLs you suggested will clean up the MBR. That's why I recommended he d/l the Hiren's BootCD as it contains both a startup environment and half a dozen utilities for recovering/repairing the MBR.

That seems a far simpler and quicker approach, IMHO.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

I agree, simpler is better.

There is an emotional temptation to do the full gamut and just get it over with... but then you have tons of reinstalls, configuration etc.

But sometimes emotionally, that stress is more welcome as it is controlled and understood rather than dealing with unknowns and continuing the stress of being lost as to the fix.

Whether fixing a car, or a computer... if you can get over the emotional temptation to scratch the whole thing, you have nothing to lose in learning a few tricks along the way.
Doing the first fix is very expensive and you learn nothing as to what the problem was for future reference to not do it again.

Its amazing how a screwed up MBR can trash things... its also amazing how fixing it brings back sanity!

 

While I agree totally that Acronis is great solution to prevent this type of disaster from becoming devastating, Peter, I prefer, assuming the user is capable of using it, to use Ghost as a simple alternative and, using Ghost 11.5 included on Hiren's BootCD, gives all the benefits at no cost (free!). Also, as you pointed out in our many repetitions of this discussion on this thread here, the users of Seagate or Maxtor drives in their Dv8, or for clone targets, the Seagate Disk Wizard is essentially the same Acronis product as your Acronis True Image Home but, again is free!
An ounce of prevention is DEFINITELY worth pounds of cure!

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Thank you so much for your feedback Peter. Comments in bold below.

I see. Well the recovery to factory is what HP recommends, but I will try these other steps first. Before I even try them, I will use Acronis to make an image of my current C drive now because, other than the boot problems, everything seems to be fully intact and working fine. If I do the Acronis now, and the various things you and others have recommended somehow make things worse, do you think I can transfer the Acronis image back from my external drive onto my C drive and be at least back to where I am now, in terms of function, or is there some risk that if I image the current drive with Acronis and put it back on the C drive, I may not get it in the exact status it was when I made the image?

Thanks so much. I also have a phone appt with the publisher of Bounceback later today, and hope it might solve the "mystery" for me. But your comments are most helpful and most appreciated, and I will try them and get back. Jeff

 

Start up repair sometimes needs to be run up to three times, ime, before concluding it won't work. It specifically is designed to fix start up issues which usually are boot related problems. It's worked for me several times in the past.

I have done a repair install several times in the past and it has fixed various problems for me.

Assuming Acronis is used correctly and you are able to successfully validate the backup image after it has been made (which is a .tbs file unless you make a clone using the clone wizard in "disk tools and utilities"), it should restore to exactly what you backed up, i.e., the current system state. (If you make a clone instead of a backup image, you don't have to validate it, you just need to check it out to be sure the expected partitions and files are where they should be.)

However, if Acronis detects certain problems, it may not even allow you to proceed to make a complete backup or clone. But it's certainly worth trying.

However, I still think you should also back up your essential data, while you can, in case things get worse from here and you end up having to rebuild your system from scratch.

Btw, a clone made with Acronis' clone wizard makes a clone very similar to the way Ghost does. While one can initiate the process either from an Acronis Rescue CD, which loads the program into ram in it's own pre Windows environment which I believe is Linux based (but not sure about that, it might also be Windows PE), or from within the Acronis program within Windows (in which case a reboot is required before the cloning process will actually start), in both cases, the clone is actually made from outside of the Windows OS environment from a separate OS environment that is loaded into ram. Iows, the clone is not actually made from a program active on the disk that is being cloned. That would not be possible as the target disk must be locked to be cloned.

 

For those who aren't familiar with Hiren's and WHY I recommend it FIRST for all PC problems, here's what another person wrote about it:

Hiren's BootCD (HBCD) is a completely free bootable CD that contains a load of useful tools you can make use of in a variety of situations like analyzing, recovering and fixing your computer even if the primary operating system can not be booted.

It is a great resource for anyone with computer problems who is having trouble accessing the internet to download programs in an attempt to fix it. It has a multitude of tools divided into a number of categories like partitioning tools, backup, recovery and BIOS/CMOS tools to name a few.

With some simple knowledge about what is contained on the CD, you can use it to repair many problems computer like hard drive failure, virus infections, partitioning, password recovery and data recovery.

We may call it as an emergency cd which every computer technician or home user must have.

We thank and appreciate Hiren for his great BootCD. This site is just a download place for Hiren's BootCD and is not related with Hiren. For developer's homepage please visit Hiren's Homepage under the links.

Partition Tools
If you need to make changes to the partitions on your computer, there are several applications that provides various levels of functionality for accomplishing this goal. You can both create and delete partitions from your computer, even while there are other partitions on the hard drive you are modifying. You can also resize partitions if needed, to change how much space is allocated to them.

Backup and Recovery
There are several backup and recovery tools on Hiren's BootCD. Backup tools like GetDataBack, HDD Scan, Partition Find and Mount, PhotoRec, Recuva, Undelete... let you copy data off of your hard drive and schedule automatic backups to ensure your data is saved to another location. You can also recover deleted data, whether that data was deleted intentionally or accidentally. There are also a few tools that will help you recover data from damaged or corrupted portions of your hard drive if you are unable to recover them through other methods.

Testing Tools
Hiren's BootCD provides a variety of tools for testing different aspects of your computer. If you suspect that your RAM is corrupted or that a piece of hardware on your machine is not functioning properly, there are several applications you can run to determine the problems. You can also perform hard drive tests to see whether your hard drive is physically damaged, and get a report on how much longer your hard drive is expected to work.

Password Tools
Password recovery and modification tools are also provided on Hiren's BootCD. You can change the administrator password on Windows machines, and there are utilities for saving passwords for your online accounts in an encrypted format. You can also encrypt your entire hard drive with Hiren's BootCD so that a password is required to read or write any data from or to your hard drive.



Changes from Hiren's BootCD 10.5 to 10.6:

+ Update Checker 1.037, + Speccy 1.02.156, + BootICE 0.78, + MyUninstaller 1.65, + SearchMyFiles 1.47, + Glary Registry Repair 3.3.0.852, + HDHacker 1.4, + Delete Doctor 2.2, + Write Protect USB Devices, + Protect a Drive from Autorun Virus, + SumatraPDF 1.1, + RegShot 1.8.2, + KeyTweak 2.3.0, + Bart's Stuff Test 5.1.4

- Partition Magic, - Drive Image 2002, - Easy Recovery

Opera Web Browser 9.27, SuperAntispyware 4.39.1002 (2606), SpywareBlaster 4.3 (2606), Malwarebytes Anti-Malware 1.46 (2606), Spybot - Search & Destroy 1.6.2 (2606), DriveImageXML 2.14, 7-Zip 9.15b, Total Commander 7.55, CCleaner 2.33.1184, MBRWizard 3.0.48, CurrPorts 1.81, Network Password Recovery 1.24, Defraggler 1.20.201, Bulk Rename Utility 2.7.1.2, RIPLinux 9.8, GParted Partition Editor 0.6.0b2, ProduKey 1.41, Process Explorer 12.04, DiskCryptor 0.9, Autoruns 10.01, PCI 32 Sniffer 1.4 (2606), SIW 2010.0428, UnknownDevices 1.4.20 (2606), Astra 5.46, HWiNFO 5.5.0, PCI and AGP info Tool (2606), ComboFix (2606), Dr.Web CureIt! Antivirus (2606)

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Updated to nvidia forceware 258.69 beta which allegedly contains numerous bug fixes, among other things. All good so far.

 

Glad it went well for you, Peter. Did you happen to note whether any of the stated bug fixes applicable to our nVidia GeForce GT 230M ?

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Did you post a note over on Drivers thread about this?

Regards,
- - Phil

 

In 85 on my first 286 system, my computer guru taught me to do backups as well as know all the files on my system. It's no longer possible to remember every file, but system restore can put them all back like it came in the box. Data backup always posed the problem of a file format that needed the backup program re-installed in order to restore the data. I decided long ago to just keep duplicate files on another hard drive. Better yet I just keep duplicate computer systems. Last week one was stolen and I pulled out the other without missing a hitch. Now waiting for the new system to arrive. Lastly a warranty with ADP takes care of most everything that could possibly happen. Customer support can do remote diagnosis, return pickup and in home repair. I figure why try to become computer repairman when all the bases are basically covered.

 

Because the person I posted that info for had not gotten Hiren's in the month or so since I first described it here on the NBR - I wanted others (who through ignorance or inaction may be headed for a similar situation as his) to know Hiren's includes all the free stuff you need to make perfect clones as you apparently do. Before getting a proper clone made, he already has a major problem with his Dv8 and I wanted others to know that, aside from procedures, etc., there is a one-stop source for free stuff to do the repairs, incremental backups, and image clones, that we Network Admins live by.

Net-net, I agree with you (agreeing with me <g>) that everyone should be doing image clones before making any changes to their PCs. As I posted, "an ounce of prevention (or backup) is worth a pound of cure (or repair)!

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Phil, I'm wondering when this new dv8 arrives to maybe take a different approach if possible. Can't quite recall the setup on this dv7, but wondering if it would work, after initial setup, to take off all the bloatware, install my software and then make the system repair and restore discs. Then again, I keep system images on an external HDD using the win7 software, never had to do a restore to date. The hurdles I've ran into with HP tech support was them wanting to do a system restore every time I called for troubleshooting.

 

You can do that, for sure, but after installing everything, it'll take more DVD-R disks (and more time, risk of failure, etc.) to make the restore disks. If I were you, I'd remove all the bloatware from the new system, install a freeware AV like aVast, and then make the restore disks.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Again, thank you much for the feedback. On your last sentence, what do you mean by "...the target disk must be locked to be cloned" ?

 

"ShadowProtect's rivals include the venerable Symantec's Norton Ghost 14.0, Acronis Backup & Recovery 10, and <!-- start ziffarticle //--> Paragon Hard Disk Manager 2010<!-- end ziffarticle //--> ($129.95 direct, Informal testing of recent and current versions of all these products showed no particular problems, but I've experienced problems with earlier versions of the Symantec and Acronis products, while I've never had problems with ShadowProtect Desktop. The excellent Paragon suite is the app I prefer for partitioning and other hard disk management. But, for drive-imaging, I prefer ShadowProtect's proven reliability; unlike the Paragon and Acronis products, it's focused entirely on drive-imaging. ShadowProtect's authors aren't distracted by the kind of feature bloat that tends to lead to problems in less-focused products."

That was from PC Magazine, current online issue. Any comments from those who support Ghost and Acronis? I really want to get this right - now and for future. If you read the rest of the review ShadowProtect Desktop 4.0 - Full Review - Reviews by PC Magazine you'll see more details as to why they like it so much, and more than the others. I know the price is steep, but I wonder if it isn't worth paying if one wants the most reliable and flexible backup/restore functionality.

 

The software locks the target disk in order to make the clone so you don't have to worry about it. I just mentioned it to highlight that whatever cloning software is used, it is not "running off of the target disk" (or words to that effect) while a clone is being made, whether it's Acronis or Ghost, etc.

I don't agree with much of what is written in PC Mag or CNET which I believe owns them (or more likely they are both owned by the same larger organization). Many, many years ago I thought they were pretty good but these days, imo, they are very advertiser driven in their reviews. I trust my own experiences and have been successfully cloning and backing up with various versions of Acronis for many years. Although it has many features I don't need or use, for my purposes, I see no reason to use anything else.

And while I'm on the subject, I'd like to take this opportunity to correct a factually inaccurate statement made by another poster here today who mistakenly said words to the effect that the trouble with backup software is that it has to be installed in order to use it restore a backup. That is totally incorrect. One can restore to a completely empty or blank drive using nothing more than an Acronis bootable rescue disk (which is supposed to be burned ahead of time from within the program long before one ever needs to use it). Once that rescue CD or flash drive is in one's possession, it is a simple matter to boot from it and use it to restore a previously made backup located on an external drive to a new or totally empty drive (i.e., one with no OS or programs, including any backup programs, installed on it). That is what is meant by the phrase "bare metal recovery" which is what backup and recovery programs like Acronis, Macrium Reflect and Paragon, to name a few, enable one to do.

 

I've searched the lounge and came up blank on the TV tuner that is offered on the DV8t. Nor can I find much about it's features and connections. The Laptop comes with 1GB Nvidia GeForce GT 230M / HP Integrated HDTV Tuner with Media Remote Control.

Anybody out there using one? My question would involve connections. What type of input cable goes into the laptop? Aside from receiveing TV signals, I'd like to know if I can hookup an analog TV VCR and feed AV from my VHS tapes into the computer and record it to the hard drive? And what video format does the computer capture?

 

It comes with a hybrid antenna and an adapter that accepts coaxial cable. The composite video breakout cable is not included with the built in tuners.

 

Thank you for your help. Additionally I would like to play out of and old TV/VCR with RCA jacks into the HP tuner. Would you know of a cable that will accomodate that connection. Not having my system yet, I don;t know what input is on the side of the laptop.

 

The input looks like this:



There is no composite breakout cable included (what you would use for your vcr/tv setup). The easiest choice would be to get an external tuner via usb or express card. I have a different HP express card tuner from a dv6000 (which includes that cable) that I use for capturing video and it works perfectly on the dv8t fwiw. There are a ton of different makes/brands available though.

Another option (not really convenient imo) would be to use an RF Modulator hooked into the female coaxial adapter included with the integrated tv tuner. Something like this:

Amazon.com: Belkin RF Modulator ( F8V3063 ): Electronics

I'm not even sure that software included on the dv8t would support this (Quickplay of WMC). You may need video capturing software, idk...

 

Jeff, when you boot up with a Hiren's disk, for example, to use Ghost to clone a HHD, the source disk and target disk are locked so no
files are open when the cloning is taking place. When any program tries to clone the source drive and it was used to boot up, lots of temp files and open files occur. The program must then shut down and reboot using a "stub" to conduct the cloning after the files are locked. See?

Regards,
- - Phil

 

I've already told you, Jeff, that Ghost, not mentioned in the reference to problems in the article, is solely for doing clones and that's why I've used it for 20 years. Never a problem plus it comes on the free Hiren's disk. You can pay more to buy something else but you won't get simpler or better.

I already posted some other comments on this issue but you didn't reply ... I won't repeat them again here.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Certainly true, Peter. I can only add that Ghost has been doing the same thing since before any of the others existed. I've used it for 20 years without a problem and it comes on the free Hiren's disk.

The only reason I can understand for going with anything else is to use the wide variety of other features they offer beyond simple cloning of hard drives. If those features are compelling for anyone, they can use the other free program, Seagate Disc Wizard by Acronis, if they want to have features beyond simple cloning and have Seagate or Maxtor hard drives in the system. Beyond that, like Peter, I'd endorse Acronis True Image Home edition if I wanted all those extra features enough to pay for them.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Yes, I've seen examples on youtube of express cards with combo coaxial and RCA leads. I was hoping for a direct connection from RCA to integrated tuner input. Then I'll have to see what comes in the box and what happens when the signal plays into the computer. And of course what software HP includes to make TV on the computer happen.

I'm seeing a variety of software costing a yearly fee for unlimited usage of up to 3000 channels and the companies offer continuous updating to make sure all channels are active.

And lastly, I'll need to find out if the TV video can be recorded and waht file formats end up on the hard drive. Ultimately I intend to record clips that can be retrieved as files into the video editing Corel Videostudio software.

Thank You so much for the help,

Frank

 

That direct connection rca/coaxial is included with the express card setup HP offers, but strangely not the integrated. What comes in the box is 1 antenna that connects directly to the laptop for OTA HD. You also get the female coaxial adapter which your cable connection plugs into, and finally 1 larger media center remote control (separate from the compact remote that slides into the laptop express card slot).

The connection to the laptop itself is a proprietary connector. It can receive analog cable, clear QAM and ATSC. Clear QAM is HDTV over cable. ATSC is HDTV over the antenna. They cannot be used at the same time: you either connect to cable (using the coaxial connector) or to the ATSC antenna.

The software that HP includes is called Quickplay. Works fairly well. Obviously you can just use Windows Media Center that is built into Windows 7.

You don't need to spend any additional money to watch tv. Am I misunderstanding? You hook up your actual cable (coaxial) from your cable co./satellite provider.... or use the included antenna to pickup FREE HD channels(ATSC)

You can record using Windows Media Center. The file format that ends up on your hdd is .wtv

I don't know what file formats your Corel Videostudio supports, but most likely you'll need to convert it to some other format before it will accept it. There are freeware tools on the web to do this...

Hope this helps

 

Came across an interesting comparison review between Ghost and Acronis (both older versions) here: Review: Acronis True Image vs Symantec Ghost

 

Phil:

I just got a new replacement dv8t. This time, I got dv8t-1200 instead of dv8t-1100 which I had before. I ran Everest Report for dv8t-1100 previously and also ran it for dv8t-1200 and was curious what is different between these two and found glaring omissions and surprises:

CPU:
dv8t-1100: QuadCore Intel Core i7 720QM, 2333 MHz (18 x 130)
dv8t-1200: QuadCore Intel Core i7 720QM, 2750 MHz (21 x 131)

Memory:
dv8t-1100: 4 GB DDR3-1333 DDR3 SDRAM (8-8-8-22 @ 609 MHz) (7-7-7-20 @ 533 MHz) (6-6-6-17 @ 457 MHz)
dv8t-1200: 4 GB DDR3-1333 DDR3 SDRAM (8-8-8-22 @ 609 MHz) (7-7-7-20 @ 533 MHz) (6-6-6-17 @ 457 MHz) (5-5-5-14 @ 380 MHz)

HDD:
dv8t-1100: TOSHIBA MK5056GSY (500 GB, 7200 RPM, SATA-II)
dv8t-1200: Seagate ST9320423AS (320 GB, 7200 RPM, SATA-II)

Network Adapter:
dv8t-1100: Realtek PCIe GBE Family Controller
dv8t-1200: <NONE> ?

USB Device:
dv8t-1100: HP Integrated Module with Bluetooth 2.1 Wireless Technology
dv8t-1200: <NONE>?

CPU Speed:
dv8t-1100:
CPU Clock 2676.4 MHz (overclock: 67%)
CPU Multiplier 20x
CPU FSB 133.8 MHz (original: 133 MHz)
QPI Clock 2141.1 MHz
Memory Bus 669.1 MHz
DRAM:FSB Ratio 5:1

dv8t-1200:
CPU Clock 2729.7 MHz (overclock: 67%)
CPU Multiplier 20x
CPU FSB 130.0 MHz (original: 133 MHz)
QPI Clock 2079.8 MHz
Memory Bus 649.1 MHz
DRAM:FSB Ratio 5:1

Battery Properties:
dv8t-1100:
Wear Level 22 % (What does this mean?)

dv8t-1200:
Wear Level 4 % (What does this mean?)

PCI Express Controller:
dv8t-1100:
PCI-E 2.0 x1 port #1 In Use @ x1 (Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6200 AGN)
PCI-E 2.0 x1 port #2 In Use @ x1 (Realtek RTL8168D/8111D PCI-E Gigabit Ethernet Adapter)
PCI-E 2.0 x1 port #5 In Use @ x1 (JMicron JMB380 PCI-E 1394a OHCI FireWire Controller and Memory Card Host Controller, JMicron JMB382 PCI-E Memory Card Host Controller)
PCI-E 2.0 x1 port #8 Empty

dv8t-1200:
PCI-E 2.0 x1 port #1 In Use @ x1 (Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6200 AGN)
PCI-E 2.0 x1 port #2 In Use @ x1 <EMPTY>?
PCI-E 2.0 x1 port #5 In Use @ x1 (JMicron JMB380 PCI-E 1394a OHCI FireWire Controller and Memory Card Host Controller, JMicron JMB382 PCI-E Memory Card Host Controller)
PCI-E 2.0 x1 port #8 Empty

Now, the good ones first (I think):
dv8t-1200 has better specs on the CPU and RAM front and also Battery wear is 4%. For a brand new laptop, isn't the wear percentage should be 0%?

Now, for the bad ones:
I know for sure I ordered Intel 6200N w/ Bluetooth for my new dv8t-1200 and I'm seeing that Everest reports "NONE". Same with Ethernet card. dv8t-1100 says "Realtek Gigabit Ethernet" but for dv8t-1200, it says "EMPTY". Am I missing something here?

Can somebody comment on the CPU and Memory wrt dv8t-1200?. Last time, I got a Toshiba 500GB HDD (single bay). This time, it is Seagate 320GB (dual). How reliable are Seagate drives? Also, I would like to get some feedback here before I call HP customer service and file a complaint.

Please help.

 

Interesting - I feel bad for the fellow who tried to used Ghost as an installable backup program like ATIH. I never have used it that way (as I have explained here ad nauseum) and only use it in the simple form as it comes on the free Hiren's BootCD.

As you know from my prior posts, I really like the installable Acronis' Seagate Disc Wizard when I want the extra features, etc., etc.

Both Acronis' Seagate Disc Wizard and Hiren's BootCD are free. My only issue with Acronis' TIH is its complexity (that I don't want or need) and its cost. Ghost 11.5 has neither of those

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Congrats! Sounds like everything is better than your previous one.

Peter is the expert advocate of Everest Ultimate (though I recently bought it so I could understand the things he quotes from it <g>) so he is better prepared to comment on the items you described.

I can, however, answer the one question you asked regarding the "wear level on the battery" (also reported by "Battery Bar") is the approximate amount of capacity lost since manufacture. I wouldn't be concerned about that as it declines fastest when new, when discharged fully, and when fully charged - and it's likely it's seen all three conditions recently. Mine has dropped only to 15% in the 8 months I've owned it but I WORK hard to avoid the degradation that occurs in normal use.

The higher CPU frequency is nominal and should be in the ranges of both old and new figures under mixed operating conditions.

I like both Toshiba and the Seagate Momentus drives. Though smaller, I see nothing there to be concerned about and smaller drives distribute failure risks and can be cloned more quickly. As far as that goes, PLUS you can go to the Seagate site and download free Seagate Disc Wizard by Acronis and have all its advantages for incremental backups as well as full image clones from boot CD!

I would compare it to the info in the "Device Mangler" before I become concerned. Peter probably will offer comments later on what he thinks Everest Ultimate is doing - whether it is missing something or what.

Don't have any idea what your issue is here?!

Regards,
- - Phil

 

If you plug an ethernet network cable into the ethernet jack, Everest will probably pick up the presence of the Ethernet on your new machine. It probably just has been turned off by windows power savings policies and that's why Everest is not seeing it. Plugging in a cable, even if it is not connected to anything should wake it up enough that Everest will be able to pick it up and report on it.

I don't really know about the other stuff. Some of the differences could possibly also be due to using different versions of Everest, if you have been updating it to the latest beta versions which. btw, come out and are made available for download about every week or two. Everest frequently updates and changes the way it reports about various hardware or adds ability to detect new or different things.

Don't know why it's not picking up the bluetooth, assuming you have it. Maybe you need to update or install new drivers or possibly just turn it on. . .

 

This is what I figured you'd attribute it to, Peter, but it is more authoritative coming from you. Also, I hope you noticed how favorably my comments on Acronis were

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Thanks Peter. This has got to be the most thorough review I have ever seen for a product! Sounds like Acronis is a safer bet, and I'm all about safety here.

BTW, my good news for today is that I have restored my boot function, thanks to your links to the relevant MS site pages. I still believe my D partition is corrupted from the mirroring program I used, and I haven't figured out how to replace it, nor from which source to get it: the recovery disks I just received in the mail from HP, the clone I made with Bounceback, apparently quite successfully, on the external drive - it actually "kidnapped" the boot sector MBR because it has a default mode of making the image drive the new boot drive, and they don't even warn you of it before you do the imaging. There is a simple toggle to toggle it off but the main screen of Bounceback warns in red letters that anything on the target drive will be erased, but no warning that your ability to boot from your internal drive will be "hijacked" if you don't toggle it off! (I told them I thought that was bass-ackwards and the tech I spoke to was hard pressed to disagree.) Here's the real kicker: the Bounceback program automatically restores the boot sector and the recovery manager if you uninstall it (hats off to you Phil, on that call), however, in restoring my computer to before the installation of Bounceback, it tucked it away somewhere that is not accessible to uninstall/Revo! Seems like I would have to re-restore it to a later date, after Bounceback was installed, to remove it. Neither Windows nor Revo can find it on my C drive at present, yet it is surely still there, as a restore will not take away files, just present the system to you as it was at the time you select, and apparently hides at least program files, but not data files. Anyone know if hazards exist when un-restoring back to the later date?

If I am correct in the above analysis, it's an amazing catch 22. Though there are other ways to get things working properly, the simplest would be to uninstall it, even it's mfr says so, but I can't find it to uninstall it!

Thanks again for your help. Jeff

 

I didn't really notice but that doesn't matter.

With the version of Ghost that you use, can you schedule compressed full/incremental backup images to be made automatically on a schedule you set w/o user intervention? This for me is an essential feature of back up/recovery software, as is the ability to make true clones, which I know, of course, Ghost does.

Although I like to regularly make fresh clones about once a month or so and keep a few handy at all times, I also like to have scheduled backups made daily automatically w/o user intervention because about a month or more of this kind of daily backups can be stored on a single or couple of external hard drives, unlike clones, each of which takes up an entire hard drive for a single cloned "backup." What I like about Acronis is that it is a single program that does both the cloning and the automatic compressed back up images for me. And I find it a snap to use for cloning (probably because I have been using it so long and I am very familiar with it just as you are wrt Ghost ). The scheduling part of the program could still use some improvement, imo.

Plus it securely erases hard drives. Plus I like the Acronis start up recovery feature, (or whatever it's currently being called) that once turned on enables the user to simply press F11 at start up before windows boots and just boot right into Acronis' recovery environment without even needing the rescue media (assuming the hard drive is still physically OK). All together, it's a pretty compelling package to me. I use the program so often and for so many very important things that it's worth it to me to pay to use the latest (and presumably most reliable) version and it can occasionally be found on sale for around $20 something.

The last time I tried to use Ghost, back in the early 90's I think, I found it rather arcane and confusing. For me Acronis is much easier and clearer. But each to their own. Everyone has their own particular favorite apps to do various things and that's fine. One of the things I like about the Windows OS (as compared to Apple) is that the platform is much more open and there are so many more and greater variety of third party apps available to choose from.

 

Different strokes for different folks.

Peter, I'm surprised at your question given all I've written to Jeff about how I use Hiren's version of Ghost. To recap:

Hiren's BootCD is a wonderfully "Swiss Army knife" collection of over 100 great utilities. It is simple, free, and downloadable as an iso file with a self-contained utility to write it to a blank CD. After writing to a CD, the CD is bootable to a choice of several alternative OS envirionments - I find an XP environment most comfortable to use but booting to DOS and Linux are other options. Among the 100-plus utilities is Ghost 11.5.1 which I use for SIMPLE, quick, and reliable cloning operations. I do it every Friday night (or Saturday morning if I'm out "on the town"Friday) and rotate my clone operation to one of 3 drives inserted in my NexStar Hard Drive Dock which is connected using one of three altenative cables - Firewire 800 for Apple, eSATA for my Dv8, and USB2 for everyone else who doesn't have the one of the first two ports.

Since the cloning takes less than 1/2 hour using eSATA, I schedule starting it before dinner on Friday or before breakfast Saturday and, when I finish my meal. my week's backup chores are done!

Note:if I am out of town without the Dv8, and it is not used during any week, no backups are done. I will however perform the same backup task on whatever laptop I take out of town with me.

In ADDITION, I make a clone before any software installation and/or driver update since I can't predict when I'll find an update I determine I need or a new software or software update I'm wanting to install immediately (after the full image backup completes).

After every 50-60 clone operations (or about once a year for readers in Yorba Linda), I buy three new 500 gb HDDs and feed them into the schedule to replace one of the old HDDs each week.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

The difference is that once the original schedule is programmed, I don't have to schedule or do anything further. It all happens automatically whether I'm there or not and I can continue to use my computer normally to watch movies or write posts or whatever while it's making my backups. And again, I can fit many many separate daily backups on one external drive.

As you say, different strokes. . . .

This is not directed to anyone in particular but I just wanted to mention for the benefit of all that there is another excellent collection of free troubleshooting tools available (from Microsoft, no less). It's the recently updated "SysinternalsSuite" which can be downloaded from http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb842062.aspx It has some very useful tools in there.

 

Yes, I could do things that way if I wanted to. In fact I don't know why you didn't respond to my post here which acknowledged the benefit (that you pointed out to me yourself) that Seagate Disc Wizard by Acronis is free for users of Seagate and Maxtor drives.

I PREFER to make it easier for those who read this forum to learn an easy way to get started making useful backups they can understand and use - and to do it with a free Hiren's BootCD that is useful for lots of other things, too.

While you don't comment on my way of doing this, except to say yours is automatic and takes up less space, I point out that most people will benefit MORE from something simpler to start with! I've done it the way you advocate and find it leads to more problems and most new users find it too easy to make mistakes, etc.

More on this in my next post to Jeff.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

I am REALLY glad you got that resolved in some fashion.

While I would be happy to debate the demerits of the article on the comparison of ATIH to Ghost with you privately in email, it seems unnecessary to do it here as it was basically comparing apples to oranges IMO.

I consider Ghost the simple clone-maker and no one I've ever known (or that took my advice on using the free Hiren's BootCD) ever had any problems getting Ghost to clone drives successfully. When Symantec took it in the direction of additional features to compete with complex, bloated feature-sets like those of BackUp Exec and ATIH, they screwed up what had been a really good utility!

As I told you here previously, I don't recommend it to anyone as a "do everything" program and feel most everyone will learn good "safe computing" practices using it as I advised you to do. After most users learn basic 3-step backup practices I preach about (see response to Peter prior to this post), some will move on, after establishing a sound system of backup cloning, to try out the complex "do everything" programs like ATIH (which is amongst the best of them I freely acknowledge to Peter) after they "have a clue of what and why they are doing things".

Most people are overwhelmed by complexity of ATIH and similar programs and find they have no useful backup sometimes when the first time arises that they REALLY need it. I believe most will make out better doing simple "clones" at the outset with a SIMPLE program they can easily learn to use correctly "on the first try" before they "play" at learning or even mastering the complex options available in ATIH.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

I really don't want to go on and on beating a dead horse but I'll just say one last thing and then I'll shut up about this. When one installs Acronis TIH 2010 (the current retail version), it puts a shortcut on your desktop that is called one click backup. It literally backs up your entire system with one click. I don't know what could be simpler than that.

 

We'll see

I think we both consider this forum to be largely about solving Dv8 users problems while educating them so they learn something in that process. My emphasis is on the educational part and not just clicking on backup and having NO idea what they're doing. Using the free Hiren's BootCD to make a clone is just as simple, the user just boots up on the CD, clicks Ghost, clone-drive-to-drive, and knows that nothing has been installed on their SOURCE drive and that the result is a copy of their SOURCE drive - not some file somewhere for some later, unclear, purpose. Hence no hassles and no risk of screwups (like Jeff has been dealing with after using a complex product before he fully understood how and what it does)!

Let's just agree that you like advocating purchase of a complex product that takes hours or days to understand what its features mean (and do) and I like advocating a free approach that produces a known result, easily understood (clone of original drive) and used by anyone before they move on to more complex products.

I still wish you'd acknowledge that I've been touting the free version of Seagate Disc Wizard by Acronis you recommended to me for use with my Seagate and Maxtor drives. You seem to be UNUSUALLY silent about that today, Peter.

I hope we're done with this for now.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

I'm not an authority on cloning software, but I do remember way back before Symantec acquired Ghost, the Ghost cloning software was the best of the best.....
Computer techs used it as their "secret" way of getting systems up and running again without hours of troubleshooting.

I consider Ghost the leader and all others copycats.

While its true you can take someones strong foundation and improve and build upon it, I'm among the group that "trust" Ghost regardless of how easy or whether its one click or two clicks or three.

Its absolutely amazing what all happens when you clone a hardrive.
Formatting, partitioning "all complex processes" are combined with every sector if information, titles, configurations, along with checks and balances to ensure the hardrive integrity can be trusted before the cloning is done.... all things that are done on the fly and we now take for granted.

I don't want any funkiness or mistakes being done and I will stick with Ghost.
No one wants to "think" all is well just to have future issues because deeply imbedded files never made the switch quite right.

Making programs bigger is not better when it comes to margins for error and opportunities for conflicts and crashes....
seems the more information that written into a program, the bigger the haystack to lose a needle in.

While I too have utilized system restore, and see it as a powerful tool, I don't recommend it for serious issues beyond basic configuration screwups.
Its totally different than importing a clone backup.

 

Wow, I never saw this thread "dark" for two straight days. That "cloning" debate must have worn everyone down, lol.

 

More likely out BBQ-ing on the holiday weekend. BTW, you have email and PM if you want to respond.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

2 days? Now it's been 7 days! LOL!

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Its easy to get distracted and not come back once something else has grabbed attention.
Also.. much of the power of a thread like this is the social strength of the interaction.... while passionate dialogue is fun and welcome, once it crossed the line of disrespect and fighting... no one likes that.

Thats why we all come here is the learn and share. We all have different levels of expertise and see from different angles and value systems.

We just have to stir the pot a little and add a little seasoning.

 

Big week for Lovelaptops. Let's send positive thoughts his way.

 

Yeah, I know ... I've sent him private messages. Hope he's recovering well.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Been months since that occurred, Alan. My referrence was to the last few days over the 4th of July when most of us were busy with other stuff and, in the East at least, the heat has been oppressive!

Yes, there are usually several valid viewpoints being expressed and, particularly, when the issue is preferences in contrast to technical issues. Always interesting though.

Regards,
- - Phil

 

Wow! I just saw this and seriously came close to crying! That was incredibly nice of you, man with a number instead of a name You really warmed my heart. Surgery is Friday and can't come a day too soon.

If you aren't proof positive that people can have differences on this thread and wind up friends, I don't know what is.

Thank you my friend, and you too Phil, and all the well wishers.

Once I get home from the hospital and am back online, maybe someone can help me get my dv8 booting up and restoring it's recovery partition too

You are the greatest. Thanks, from the heart!

 

All the best for the surgery on Friday (Saturday where I am!) - I'm sure it will go well for you. Let's hope the recovery doesn't take too long, but at least you'll have as much time as you want to play around with our favorite toy!

Best wishes from New Zealand (paradise Down Under),
Richard

 

I discovered the answer to the problem I was having with hibernation - some of you may recall I was having an issue where, when the machine resumed from hibernation, the cursor kept jumping back to the beginning of the password entry field. Some of you suggested 'sleep' instead, which I tried. Sleep caused a different issue, in that both the Password entry box AND Fingerprint Reader disappeared and I was left with the Win 7 background and no way of logging on, aside from a forced shutdown of the machine.

I recall seeing something about this somewhere (couldn't remember if someone had this same issue on this forum way back at the beginning, or if it was on the HP forum), but after some research (read: Googling!), I found it was an issue with the Digital Persona software.

The software has a power save mode that turns off the fingerprint reader, unfortunately it doesn't turn it back on after hibernation (causing the flickering screen and jumping to the beginning of the password entry box) or after re-emerging from sleep (causing both logon options to disappear).

The solution was to go into the Properties in Digital Persona, go to the Advanced tab, then turn off the power save option. Voila - problem solved (and fully tested by placing machine in both hibernation and sleep around 20 times today ).

I'm sure some of you were probably aware of the issue and the fix, but I thought I would post my experience FWIW.

Cheers,
Richard