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    Why should I get this X220? Plus some other questions..

    Discussion in 'Lenovo' started by WAYNENUMM, Apr 30, 2011.

  1. Epsilon748

    Epsilon748 Notebook Evangelist

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    Just so you guys know, I've seen this misinformation spouted a lot with the new processors- just because your CPU doesn't support Vt-d DOES NOT mean it cannot do Virtualization.

    For a quick overview, Vt-x is the CPU feature that allows virtualization, pretty much all modern CPU's support it now. Vt-d is also known as PCI passthrough. It's a more advanced feature that allows for direct memory mapping, better video acceleration (by exposing the video card to the VM), etc. Essentially, Vt-d allows for better resource management for mulit-vm machines.

    You can easily run VM's on say, the 2410 or 2310. Heck, I've seen people run VM's on Intel Atom based netbooks in a pinch (by god it was slow, but it worked)

    virtualization - Advantages of TXT/VT-d in new Intel CPUs - Super User

    Intel xeon virtualization feature - vt-d /directed io - Chipset feature? - Server Fault

    Basically, for home use, Vt-d does almost nothing in performance benefits. You can run VMware or Virtualbox fine without it as long as you've got the resources.
     
  2. stackPointer2.0

    stackPointer2.0 Notebook Consultant

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    Indeed you don't have to have vt-d to do virtualization, but the obvious benefit of vt-d is the reduced overhead in I/O operations by allowing direct hardware access to the virtualized OS instead of going through the host OS. For the casual user who doesn't rely heavily on using a virtual OS, indeed the 2410 is more than enough (heck my T8100 Core 2 Duo can even run a virtual OS decently), but for someone who uses this for work and makes heavy use of it, I'd say vt-d is certainly worth it. Its not a terribly expensive upgrade to the 2520m considering you also get a 300Mhz bump in the max turbo frequency and 100 Mhz increase in GPU memory clocks.
     
  3. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    I can't believe I said "Dell" dude above - what an insult lol! Anyway, after a bit more grovelling with the Lenovo dude, he'll give it to me for $1128.72 which I think works out to a 17.25% discount. How some people are getting suped-up X220's for under 1K is a mystery to me, but it probably has to do with us Canadians getting gouged as usual. But compared to the $1250 MBP 13", I'm feeling like I am getting a better and more durable machine for less.

    So, I think I'm pretty happy with the price and will be pulling the trigger :)

    For the umpteenth time, thank you all for your help. If this thread continues on as it has been with interesting info, I won't complain.

    Cheers,
    Wayne
     
  4. afhstingray

    afhstingray Notebook Prophet

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    from my experience, the reps have the power to give up to a 15% ish discount, so 17.25 is probably stretching him (he probably used the recent coupon as justification). more than that he has to get approval from his manager, and he'll have to justify it. usually if u order several systems they use this as justification. however, they also can give freebies like a mouse etc usually. you might be able to push for a discounted/free USB dvdrw drive, they're giving that away for free in malaysia with the X220
     
  5. maticomp

    maticomp Notebook Consultant

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    You are right. It is worth mentioning however, that VirtualBox (perhaps the most popular free virtualization software) does not support VT-d and won't in the near future. The advantages of VT-d are available mostly for VMware* users.


    * just to simplify things, I know the topic has more depth in it than I provided here


    M.
     
  6. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    Thanks. It sounds like I'm getting about as much of a discount as I can. So now I just need to hear back from him so that I can seal the deal! And stop reading the "just got my X220 and the display is bleeding light and the fan is out of control" posts LOL!

    Wayne
     
  7. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    Good to know! Thanks.
     
  8. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    I think that I will do that. The Lenovo 4GB was costing me $66.20 over the 2GB, and the Newegg 8GB will cost me $85.98 inclusive of shipping. No brainer really. And the Lenovo 8GB would have cost me $132.40. Again, the Newegg 8GB is a no brainer.

    I just have to verify that this is the proper memory (from what I understand, 2x4GB is better than 1x8GB):

    G.SKILL 8GB (2 x 4GB) 204-Pin DDR3 SO-DIMM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Laptop Memory Model F3-10600CL9D-8GBSQ
    Newegg.ca - G.SKILL 8GB (2 x 4GB) 204-Pin DDR3 SO-DIMM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Laptop Memory Model F3-10600CL9D-8GBSQ

    I might as well get an external dvd drive from them as well. This one looks like it will do the trick for me for quite a reasonable price ($36.99):
    SAMSUNG 8X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 5X DVD-RAM 8X DVD-ROM 24X CD-R 16X CD-RW 24X CD-ROM USB 2.0 External CD/DVD Drive Model SE-S084F/RSBS
    Newegg.ca - SAMSUNG 8X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 5X DVD-RAM 8X DVD-ROM 24X CD-R 16X CD-RW 24X CD-ROM USB 2.0 External CD/DVD Drive Model SE-S084F/RSBS

    The 320GB 7200 is costing me an extra $57.93 at Lenovo, so I think I will leave that one (and save myself the trouble of re-installing the OS etc - which might be something I should force myself to do, but I don't really want to do it if I don't have to).

    Thank you for your suggestions!

    Wayne
     
  9. stackPointer2.0

    stackPointer2.0 Notebook Consultant

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    I actually ordered that exact same G.skill 8GB kit (and many others on this forum have as well). It should work just fine.


    If lenovo is charging you just $57.93 for a 320GB 7200rpm and you don't want to bother with reinstalling the OS, that should be just fine, it's a fairly decent price.

    Hope you enjoy your new system :D
     
  10. stackPointer2.0

    stackPointer2.0 Notebook Consultant

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    Yeah, good point. Lets hope virtual box adds vt-d support soon.
     
  11. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    Perfect! I am about to order it up :)

    I told my sales rep that I wanted to change my config from 4GB to 2GB. He obliged, but could not oblige with the 17.25% discount and had to change it to a 15% discount. I guess they really do count on memory upgrades to increase their margins!

    The X220/2GB + 15% discount + 4GB newegg memory is $7 more than the X220/4GB + 17.25% discount. But considering I really want 8GB, the X220/2GB + 15% discount + 8GB newegg memory is $82.73 less than the X220/8GB + 17.25% discount. So I'm happy about that.

    Thanks stackPointer2.0! And thanks for your help.

    Now that the system has been ordered, I am REALLY happy! Icing on the cake is the Dell U2311H IPS display (that I got on sale for $100 off) that's on it's way. :D

    Cheers,

    Wayne
     
  12. ferganer80

    ferganer80 Notebook Consultant

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    Are you, guys, referring to LENOVOVIP as the 15% discount? I think it's dead. Does anyone have a new comparable promo code?
     
  13. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    I had looked into the visa perks website/coupon, but quite a few people had suggested that I speak with a Lenovo sales rep so that's what I did. I explained that I had been looking at a Sony Vaio and a Samsung, but apart from the price of the X220, the X220 was what I was hoping to get. In the end he gave me a 15% discount. I think he said that was the equivalent of the student discount. Hope this helps.

    Wayne
     
  14. mellospace

    mellospace Notebook Geek

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    I dont know about Canada prices, but by going through the Barnes & Noble EPP site, you will get the student discount plus an extra 10% off by using code "BESTSELLER". I got the configuration below for USD $890 + tax. I believe the coupon still available until May 8. It's the same as this deal here on slickdeals with a different config and just that the 10% off code has changed to "BESTSELLER". At the moment, they are offering the 4gb upgrade for free.

    Intel Core i5-2520M Processor (2.5GHz, 3MB L3, 1333MHz FSB)
    Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 English
    12.5" Premium HD (1366x768) LED Backlit Display, Mobile Broadband Ready, 2x2 Antenna
    Total memory 4 GB PC3-10600 DDR3 SDRAM 1333MHz SODIMM Memory (2 DIMM)
    Keyboard US English
    Fingerprint Reader
    720p HD Camera
    320 GB Hard Disk Drive, 7200rpm
    Battery ThinkPad Battery 29+ (6 cell)
    Power cord Country Pack North America with Line cord & 65W AC adapter
    Bluetooth 3.0
    Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 (2x2 AGN)
    Integrated Mobile Broadband - Upgradable
    Language Pack US English
     
  15. mikoal

    mikoal Notebook Enthusiast

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    hey guys just got a quick question, ive seen a lot of people saying that IPS is the main reason or a very imporant reason to get this machien, or if you are getting this machine that IPS is pretty much a must..

    im still new to laptops and was wondering if it really is a necessity?
    i mean what if you dont really care about clear view at angles or dont want people beside you seeing what you type.

    What are the pros and cons for the IPS? Is 150 worth it?
    Is it stupid not to get it? etc.
    thx
     
  16. ZaZ

    ZaZ Super Model Super Moderator

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    Food and water are the only real necessities. I'm sure there's a lot of corporate buyers who won't opt for the IPS display because they prefer a lower price. Here in the US it's only a $50 upgrade. I'm thinking the upgrade rate is pretty high. The biggest benefit of IPS is the wide viewing angles. If you've ever used a notebook and shifted your position a bit, then had the colors invert some, you'd know what I mean. IPS are also much more vivid and color consistent/accurate than TN panels. I guess to some degree it will depend on your needs. If it's just just office and internet, then perhaps it's not worth it if the budget is tight. Anything where color, consistency and angles are important like photo editing or videos, IPS will clearly be superior. Plus it just looks a heck of a lot better. If you plan to keep this for a while, it's a no-brainer if you ask me.
     
  17. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    My X220 was ordered on May 4, shipped on May 10, and is somewhere in transit across Canada right now. Hoping to get it soon!

    I will be using my X220 as a desktop replacement (hooked up to a monitor), but I also want to be able to quickly grab it when I want to go mobile (or when I want to do some browsing on my lap while watching the Canucks win the Stanley Cup :). So, I realized that I probably should have also gotten an Ultrabase dock (and related discount).

    The ultrabase is $219 CN on the lenovo.ca website. Wow. I am not sure what the shipping charges would be (having trouble finding that info). I contacted my Lenovo sales rep to see if he would give me a discount on it, but I was denied.

    I did find it though at directdial.com for $177 + $18 shipping = $196:
    0A33932 - Canada : Lenovo Thinkpad Ultrabase Series 3 - Product Details
    $177

    Still pricey, but I couldn't find it for anything less than that anywhere. So even though they are out of stock until the start of June, I ordered one.

    If anyone has any thoughts about where to find it for less, or any thoughts about the Ultrabase in general, I'm all ears.

    Thanks!

    Wayne

    I received my X220 beast 1 week ago (May 20). I happily received the over priced utrabase3 a few days ago as well.

    I've got to say I am very happy with the X220. Having based my buying decision on what I read on the internet only (I never had seen a Thinkpad in person before), I am happy to report that everything I read was right on, and the X220 is awesome. I am very happy that I ended up getting this (over the MBP 13" or Sony Vaio SB).

    These are the things I love about the X220:

    - The size is just about perfect. For mobility, it rocks. On my lap, it rocks. The weight is great. The build quality is awesome. Love it.

    - Screen. This IPS screen simply rocks. 'nuff said. And the resolution has turned out to be a non-issue for me.

    - Keyboard. Really quite awesome. The texture of the keys rocks. The layout of the keys rocks. I am enjoying typing this in as we speak! :) Although I would probably prefer for the keyboard to be backlit, I don't mind the keyboard light at all. I also found that you can swap the function key with the control key. Perfect.

    - Trackpoint. Very cool. I am using it exclusively now. It is incredibly handy to be able to keep the hands on the keyboard and work the mouse. I never really enjoyed using laptops before, but with the X220, I enjoy using it as much (maybe more) in laptop mode as in desktop mode. I found that putting the trackpoint into smooth scrolling mode allowed for the middle button to be used (for opening links, or for pasting), but I can't handle smooth scrolling, so I am still looking for a quick "paste" solution (I am using firefox, so there should be an addon or something out there). Minor niggle!

    - Performance. Rocks. Very fast (especially with the 8GB of memory). I was looking forward to an msata SSD drive down the road, but I am not really sure that need it.

    - Lack of problems. I don't seem to have the IPS screen bleed syndrome, or the fan loudness syndrome, or overheating syndrome. or any other problems. Yeah.

    - Battery life. Awesome (especially when the screen brightness is decreased).

    - Utrabase3. I totally love being able to simply unclick the X220 from the ultrabase and take it mobile, then click it back in when I want to use it as my desktop. It is overpriced, but well worth it (for me).

    So in summary, I love this X220! :) There, I got it off of my chest, and I feel better LOL!

    Cheers,

    Wayne
     
  18. ThinkRob

    ThinkRob Notebook Deity

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    I would be willing to bet that most X220 recipients are like you in this regard.

    I'm also willing to bet that you are unlike most in that you've posted here to point this out. :D
     
  19. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    Just feeling and sharing the love ThinkRob. Somebody has to do it LOL!

    Seriously, when I was doing my initial research, the X220 kept popping up. I tried to ignore it (because it was more expensive). But then I read the raving reviews. I already knew that I wanted an excellent screen. And I started to realize that an excellent keyboard, and maybe even that mysterious trackpoint would be something to covet. Hmm, and maybe having a laptop that was very durable might be a bonus too. Then I found this website, and when I started this thread and got such great input from people who seemed to know what they were talking about (and further positive input about the X220), it made it very easy for me to feel confident in the purchase even though I had never seen a Thinkpad before.

    And, as it turns out, the X220 is awesome :D I'm one happy camper.
     
  20. david1274

    david1274 Notebook Evangelist

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    Agree with that about the Lenovo forum here. It's one of the better ones. Probably to do with the fact that members here are a bit more mature (in age and attitude) than some of the other manufacturer specific forums. Or so it seems :)
     
  21. SuperRoach

    SuperRoach Notebook Guru

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    Excellent information in this thread :)

    I read earlier that WAYNENUMM was looking to use his as a desktop replacement, and I guess I'm going to do similar - I would like to do all my development work on it. Of course that means plug into a nice big screen when I have the option to.

    To save needing to unplug it and into the laptop, then out and back into the desktop each time I want to use it (meaning I'd only bother a few times), what alternatives are there? I could imagine some kind of switch or something as long as it was fairly painless. It's a Screen with a DVI and Vga input if that helps, at 1680 x 1050.
     
  22. gauden44

    gauden44 Notebook Consultant

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    Check out some of the dock's that Lenovo offers, like the Ultrabase or the Mini Dock Series 3. They're super convenient and are one reason that business laptops are so great!
     
  23. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    I ended up getting the Ultrabase 3.

    As an additional Christmas present to myself, I got a Dell U2311H 23" IPS display off of the dell.ca site when they had it on sale for $100 off. So I'm feeling quite stoked having the awesome IPS display on the X220, as well as the very nice U2311H IPS display. I quickly came to realize though that I needed the Ultrabase so that I didn't have to plug and unplug cables into the X220. I ended up getting it at directdial.ca for $177 + $18 shipping, which was $24 less than the $219 that lenovo.ca was wanting for it. As I said a few posts above:

     
  24. lineS of flight

    lineS of flight Notebook Virtuoso

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    The ultrabase does not work with the X220 does it?
     
  25. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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  26. lineS of flight

    lineS of flight Notebook Virtuoso

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    Thanks. Then it is pointless for me to buy it because I am certain I will be getting a new machine next year - probably a refresh version of the X220. Kinda of sucks though since I will be stuck plugging and unplugging cables. Unfortunately, eBay is also not an option for me at the moment.
     
  27. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    It is quite possible that an X220 refresh, assuming it's the same size, would use the same Utrabase3. So maybe there's a chance for you!

    Yes, I received my X220 a few days before receiving the Utrabase3. For those few days, I basically couldn't be bothered with the unplugging routine, so I wasn't grabbing it for around the house. Once I got the Ultrabase3, it set my X220 free :)

    Thank goodness though that I was in "temporary spending spree mode", because my usual stingy self would have obsessed for a long time about getting the Ultrabase3 (due to the price).
     
  28. gauden44

    gauden44 Notebook Consultant

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    You can get the Lenovo Mini Dock Series 3. It's compatible with the X220 and what appears to be all of the recent T-series models, meaning it should be more future proof.
     
  29. lineS of flight

    lineS of flight Notebook Virtuoso

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    Hmmm....thanks I did not know that...so what is the difference ebtween the Ultrabase and the Mini Dock Series 3?

    Edit:

    I don't think the X201 is compatible with the Mini Dock Series 3. See here.
     
  30. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    I found this "Docking Option for the new X220" page:
    Docking Option for the new X220 - Lenovo Community

    D'oh - I didn't even know about the Mini Dock when I got my Ultrabase. Or the ThinkPad Port Replicator Series 3.

    The ThinkPad Port Replicator Series 3 is $159CN versus the $219CN for the Ultrabase3. It is the same thing except (a) way less expensive; (b) a bit bigger; (c) it is compatible with other models and (d) it does not include a slot for the optical drive (which I am not using anyways). D'oh again - I would have gotten the replicator instead had I done my proper homework. Hopefully this will help someone else not make the same mistake!

    As far as the Mini Docks are concerned, I am not really sure yet what their purpose is (over the Replicator). I guess they have more usb ports and also include a power adaptor (and probably some other things that I don't need).
     
  31. gauden44

    gauden44 Notebook Consultant

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    The Mini Docks have digital video-out, while the Replicator does not.

    I ended up going with the Mini Dock Plus for the eSata port. :)
     
  32. lineS of flight

    lineS of flight Notebook Virtuoso

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    But the port replicator works adequately with external monitors (not intended for games, but for work and an occasional movie) - right?

    Btw the Port Replicator that we are all referring to is this one correct?
     
  33. thepiratebay

    thepiratebay Notebook Enthusiast

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    Could anyone tell me the difference between these options:
    1. 12.5" HD (1366x768) LED Backlit Display, Mobile Broadband Ready, 2x2 Antenna
    [$0.00]
    2. 12.5" HD (1366x768) LED Backlit Display, Mobile Broadband Ready, 3x3 Antenna
    [add $45.00]
    3. 12.5" Premium HD (1366x768) LED Backlit Display, Mobile Broadband Ready, 2x2 Antenna
    [add $45.00]
    4. 12.5" Premium HD (1366x768) LED Backlit Display, Mobile Broadband Ready, 3x3 Antenna
     
  34. vinuneuro

    vinuneuro Notebook Virtuoso

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    Don't get 1 and 2. They are the standard TN screen.

    3 and 4 are the IPS screen. Fantastic screen.

    2x2 vs. 3x3 depends on which wifi you get. Intel 6300 is 3x3, but you can't spec it with the camera if you go for this.
     
  35. khtse

    khtse Notebook Consultant

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  36. edit1754

    edit1754 Notebook Prophet

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    Premium. Only select one of the options that say "Premium" because that's the IPS screen. It's so much better than the regular stock screen, and for just $45 it's a waste to buy the X220 without the IPS screen.
     
  37. Avila1

    Avila1 Notebook Enthusiast

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    is bluetooth of any use?
     
  38. khtse

    khtse Notebook Consultant

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    YES!

    It makes transferring files from/to your phones much easier, unless you like using USB cable more. Plus there are many apps on iOS/Android that allows you to turn your phone into a remote for you laptop. Most of these apps support both bluetooth and wifi, but wifi would require them to be connected to the same network, which is not always possible if you are not at your home. I find it very useful using my phone to control my presentation slides through bluetooth.
     
  39. alexo

    alexo Notebook Enthusiast

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    I beg to differ.

    Apparently, the "premium" screen is the cheapest e-IPS panel that Lenovo could find and exhibits image retention after some 15 minutes.
     
  40. ZaZ

    ZaZ Super Model Super Moderator

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    Did you expect the best screen ever for $50? The important part is it's big step up from the standard screen and most notebook screens available right now. That's worth $50. Here's Lenovo's official response to the ghosting issue.
     
  41. alexo

    alexo Notebook Enthusiast

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    No, I expect a usable screen, and I am willing to pay a premium for it (otherwise, I'd go for a cheaper brand).

    Read some of the replies in the thread I posted. You trade better viewing angles for image retention and a lot of customers don't consider it a good trade-off.

    And here's my response to that drivel, including quotes from both customers and representatives contradicting the release. Scroll up and down to see other responses too.

    You can decide for yourself who to believe, just keep in mind that I have absolutely no financial interest in the matter, I am just trying to find me an ultraportable wit ha good blend of performance, long battery life and good screen.
     
  42. ZaZ

    ZaZ Super Model Super Moderator

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    How would you define your screen as unusable? All I can tell is my X220 LCD and the couple others I've seen looked pretty good to me. I have noticed no ghosting/image retention. You may be willing to pay a premium, but where are you going to buy it? I think you're free to go back to the TN screens offered other ultraportables if you're inclined.
     
  43. ekam

    ekam Notebook Consultant

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    Can you swap the Fn & Ctrl key??? I heard you can do this in the BIOS on newer thinkpads.
     
  44. erik

    erik modifier

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    have you seen the X220 IPS display in person?   judging from your posts it sounds like you've not yet owned or used an X220.   campaigning on others' opinions rather than first-hand experience can be a very flawed approach.

    my X220 shows slight image persistence if i truly force the scenario.   otherwise i use it without issue for CAD and DCC work while mobile and can't complain about it beyond its known limitations (6-bit color depth, 1366x768 resolution, etc.).   the X220 is still by far the best X-series i've owned so far and i've owned literally all of them at one point or another.

    that's not to say others don't have the issue or aren't bothered by it.   but, i tend to think many of these complaints become unnecessarily exacerbated by the internet "pile-on" effect.


    yes, it's an option in the BIOS.
     
  45. lead_org

    lead_org Purveyor of Truth

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    firstly, there are not many manufacturers that produce e-IPS or IPS LCD for that matter. Secondly, IPS image retention did plague a lot of more expensive S-IPS LCD too that were used in many different Dell desktop ultrasharp LCD, not everyone knew they had a problem until others told them about it. Finally, the early generation iMac 27 inch also suffered from image retention problems, so i guess it is not as uncommon as it seems or as bad you make it out to be. Obviously, some people will be more sensitive to such things then others, and this problem may crop up more frequently when you use the laptop with certain applications.

    For those people whom really have a problem with such things, then there is always the 30 days product return windows. But for an extra 50 dollars on top of the TN LCD, i think the IPS is a good buy for what it is.
     
  46. alexo

    alexo Notebook Enthusiast

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    I have two Dell Ultrasharps at home, 2005fpw and 2209wa.
    No IR whatsoever after hours of continual usage.
     
  47. erik

    erik modifier

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    so that's a 'no' on you having any first-hand experience with an X220?
     
  48. WAYNENUMM

    WAYNENUMM Notebook Guru

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    +1 on that. Maybe I haven't looked closely enough, but I haven't noticed any ghosting (and I've been using my X220 extensively for the last month).

    Also, we were outdoors browsing on the internet with my brother's non-IPS reflective screen laptop and had to give up on it. Not only were the reflections overwhelming, but the angle of viewability meant that really only one person could effectively see the screen. I then brought out my X220 and solved the reflection/viewing angle problem (my brother won't be buying another laptop without a screen as good as the X220's :)
     
  49. alexo

    alexo Notebook Enthusiast

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    Looking at the context, I thought it was clear that I was replying to lead_org.
    Contrary to your opinion, not everything is about you.

    But since you asked so nicely, I will address your question:

    1) I don't have a 1st-hand experience with the x220. I do have 2nd-hand experience, namely: seeing images of the image retention taken by people whose integrity I trust.

    2) What does it matter whether I have 1st hand experience or just serve as a mouthpiece to other people that do?
    Do you contest that this phenomenon is real? Are all those people that report it on Lenovo's forum (as well as here) liars?
    Do you contest that Lenovo acknowledges the issue and claims that it is normal?
    There's a post on the Lenovo forum by the admin "Mark_Lenovo" (a Lenovo employee) that states that some people notice IR after as little as 10 minutes.

    But you'd rather attack the messenger, right?

    BTW, took me all of 15 seconds to find this.
     
  50. erik

    erik modifier

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    re-read my post above.   i've already stated that my own X220 will show this phenomenon if forced.

    that's the only question i was seeking an answer.
     
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