*** MSI 16L13 (Eurocom Tornado F5)/EVOC 16L-G-1080 15.6" Owner's Lounge ***

Yeah, it's not good on a desktop or server either, unless that's what it's going to do all it's life - you need to gauge the tuning to the real life workload.

I've seen heat plates warp, heat sinks / fan's fail, paste run across a motherboard - imagine if that was Liquid Metal(!!), heat pipes or fasteners pop (usually while cooling down), and motherboards and power supplies fail.

So far only 1 CPU failed under load testing - when the heatsink fell off, but I burnt up more than 1 CPU OC'ing early on - it's a learning curve thing that costs $$$.

That's why I offer my experience in these things to help save you the embarrassment of having a client hear the heat pipe pop, or asking what the white stuff is running down the motherboard, or have them ask "will my computer work again"?

The tears, I hated the tears the most...

 

When I ran my overclock testing on my laptop I ran at 4Ghz all cores, but limited short & long power limits in the BIOS so as that it would always remain under thermal throttle point, so I could stress test in the 80 degree zones. I used Prime95 v26.6 (later versions produce more heat), and I run that for a few hours on all cores - it would load throttle a bit due to my BIOS power limits I had set. In addition also ran 2 or 3 threads only of Prime95 for a number of hours, just so that it would stick at 4Ghz the whole time, just to be sure that it was stable when the chip was at max frequency all the time. This was as stringent & as abusive as I could get with my laptop, I didn't want it to be thermally shutting down during testing. For my desktop I have been more abusive, most people take that approach when overclocking, if I wreck my CPU then that's my fault, but I'm sure it will be fine.

 

Yeah, hours is still too long, there's no need for it. It might be fun, but there's no need.

For example, if I need to run batch jobs on my laptop it's going to be at speeds well below my maximum OC and even below my daily OC, for both CPU and GPU.

Even the top end laptops with the best cooling and power need to be treated as if they are fragile for 24/7 usage - or even 2+ hours - that's going to saturate the laptop with heat, the whole thing is going to sustain a heat load beyond what it was designed to carry without external help - air-conditioner, fans, etc.

For a 4.2ghz benchmark OC, and a 4.0ghz daily OC, I run 3.5ghz on long jobs if I have cool ambient temps - which is about the only time I'd do long jobs, but if I was forced to run with high ambient temps I'd downclock even further, same for the GPU OC, reduce it.

I usually tune for temps in the 70's on long jobs. YMMV

 

They have been ordered and I expect them to arrive in the next week or so. We will let you know here...and also put them up on our website once they arrive.

 

Thank you! I emailed Bitspower earlier this morning to enquire about this and just received a reply back informing me they would send out a sample BP-OCCIHSI7-SL so I can help them with some performance comparison testing

 

Will you offer them as modded and ready for plug and play?
Speaking of those Dyson fans, can HIDevolution source them for us customers who would like to have them?

 

Played Mass Effect Andromeda for like 3 hours.
Played at 4K ultra on my TV with HDR looked amazing. Averaged 60FPS

Cpu stock clocks -110mv on core
GPU +135 core +300 memory

Avg temps
Cpu max 78 deg C
GPU max 62 deg C
Nvme ssd 89 deg C max (I saw lag in the game when this hit above 85.)
Overall i am very impressed. Fans were on auto also. I am however debating removing the nvme and just going to 2.5ssd now.

 

Nice temps, bro.

Try a couple of SanDisk X400 512GB M.2 SSD. That is what I have in the TF5. They do not get nearly as warm as NVMe, they perform great and you can find them for reasonable prices. I have a 2TB HDD in the 2.5 bay for data files.

 

You're a bit more careful with your hardware, that's fine. I run the overclock verification tests for longer to be certain, and then I never run them again to the same degree, just during the initial verification. I've never had hardware fail on me, well apart from my GPU in my current laptop in sig, but that served me well for nearly 4 yrs.

 

Nice temps! Really glad to hear you are enjoying the performance without throttling. I'm shocked your NVME got so hot though, what brand is it and did you put a thick piece of thermal pad underneath? I noticed Mr. Fox putting one on in his video, so perhaps it'll help with temps. Also, I recently ordered couple of these

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MY2NQ8S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1



I haven't tested it yet but I think it might help lower the temp as well. I'll let you know once it arrives!

 

I've just ordered the gelid xtreme gc thermal paste.
Once applied I'll let you know how temperatures will behave.

Thanks for the advice!

 

Are heat issues with the SSD typically related to the PC or the drive? I have a 960 evo that I did not notice running hot when it was in my Blade, however I also was not actively monitoring my SSD temperatures. If I end up going with a 16L3 laptop, or another brand, is a thermal pad under the drive or a heatsink type thing ontop of it recomended no matter what if it will fit, or is the temperature more related to the machine rather than the drive (I feel like it's the drive and not the machine since the MSI is fairly open and has pretty good cooling but it's worth asking about,)

 

The delta fans I've seen the best results with so far are really easy to buy direct from china for $12, from a USA importer for $16 or (worst case) directly from the Asus parts department for $20.

Unfortunately, even moving from a 4000RPM fan to a thicker, 5800RPM fan doesn't provide the huge gains in temps I was hoping for...at least not with the bottom cover on. When the cover is off, the faster fans show measurable improvement but with the cover on, they are starved for intake.

Thanks for this--I'm really looking forward to modding the bottom cover.

Thanks for the link. I have two Samsung NVMe drives in my F5 and during long writes they'll heat up to 73c before throttling. I attached some ramsinks using AS Alumina Adhesive and it only delays the inevitable...takes 6-7 minutes longer to get to throttling temp. It really needs some better airflow...

 

Have you done the bottom cover mod as well? I think you'll greatly benefit from it, unless you are awaiting for spare bottom cover like everyone else in here ^^

 

I'd like to make sure I can get another before breaking out the Dremel

 

That's great news, your public suggestions should more closely match your actual testing, as your first posts indicated it was fine to test at highest OC for hours at a time, and even you don't actually do that.

What happened to your GPU, how did it die?

 

I don't know how it died, I'm thinking it's the GPU, but I can't be 100% sure without transferring the GPU to another laptop, it might be the PCIe slot or something - at the moment (& for the future) it's running off Intel integrated graphics included on my 2920XM CPU. They were strange symptoms: it would post and just before the Windows sign in screen the screen would go black & hang. I tried reseating the GPU & blowing out the PCIe slot with compressed air: no change. It would boot to safe mode for a short time & then after a couple of minutes the display would do some weird flickering & then go black. I went back to an old Windows 7 image (from Windows 10) and even that would go black. I tried old Windows 10 images. I tried DDU to remove NVidia drivers & installing older NVidia drivers. Restoring previous Windows 10 images seemed to work ok until a cold boot, then black screen. Part of me thinks it could be something triggered by a Windows 10 update that's messed with some firmware or something - a bit like the corrupted EDID issues surrounding Alienware laptops which used EVGA Precision + Windows 10. Although, for a couple of years during my ownership of that 670MX GPU it would sometimes throw up a 5 beep & fail to post, and I'd have to do a seemingly random things to get it to post again, and it would be fine for months - at some point I think I partially concluded that whenever it threw those 5 beeps the solution seemed to be just leaving it turned off for a few hours. So, I think it's GPU failure, but I'm not 100% sure. Doesn't matter though, because I've got my desktop for gaming now, and the GPU in the laptop is almost obsolete, it's only a little bit faster than a stock GTX 660 desktop card (about 15% slower than a 780M, it's overclocked you see).

 

You should get this

 

Yeah, the "Black Screen" problems from Windows 10 + Nvidia drivers themselves are maddening.

It sounds like software still, if restoring older images makes it work again.

Sorry to hear about it, glad you aren't stuck on it anymore

 

The heat is generated from the NVMe drive, then it is up to the laptop to properly evacuate that heat. M.2 SSD heatsinks, or thermal pads, will help keep the SSD cooler as well.
.

 

I know someone from the UK who was interested in looking at this laptop with a GTX 1070 in it, what resellers are there for the UK that I can point him to? I believe Eurocom does but I am not familiar with others over there.

Thank you @Donald@HIDevolution I wasn't sure if these drives had a tendancy to overheat in any PC/Laptop they are in but I did not have issues in my old Razer Blade. Kind of surprised me that a bigger more open laptop like the MSI has issues with it.

 

(I thought it could be related to the Black Screen issues people have been having with Windows 10 & NVidia drivers, but I remember concluding that my symptoms were different, I can't see the screen using a flashlight for example. Older images didn't make it work again permanently, just for a short time & only sometimes. It was all very weird!)

 

Make sure you warm that stuff up before you use it! I found a large mug of very hot water and a zip bag did the trick.

 

As far as I know the only reseller in the UK was Cyberpower. Unfortunately, mine was one of the last ones they sold as they have now discontinued the Fangbook 4 Xtreme 1070. I did ask them if they could or were going to get any more but they decided not to and are going to stick with Clevo. I really don't think there is anyone else.

 

We will only offer the bottom service panel...then it will be up to each user to experiment.

If you email me with the exact model number of the fan, we will look into it.

 

Rather than "take sides" by replying to one specific post, I'm going to just say a single and heartfelt thanks to all who replied to my benchmark question. I've read all the posts carefully, and now I have a lot to think about. I don't know yet what I'll finally end up doing, but I deeply appreciate the discussion as input to my own thinking.

 

All depends where in the chassis the ssd's is located. NVMe drives need a lot of airflow circulation for cooling. Just see where those ssd's is located. Not easy task cooling the ssd's. But make a heatsink-spreader mod for your ssd's + use a cooler who push a lot air into the bottom grills. This will work.

 

Thanks for the tip!

 

Put me down for two please. You got my number or at the least, my e-mail. I am going to experiment with two types of mods.

 

We have already several requests for them, so it will be more efficient if I post here once we have them, along with the search words to use on our website (we can't post a link to our site here), and then you can just whip in and place your order.

 

Yeah I miss raid'ing some SSD's. I would do Raid 0 as I have network backups weekly. Might have to do that. Thanks.

 

Were you playing in a freezer? What were you using to monitor temps? Not saying you are wrong, but I find it hard to believe you got that low of a gpu temp in 4k unless you weren't using ultra/high presets and the gpu wasn't stressed. Even the title screen of ME4 causes mine to run at 99% gpu usage.

 

Note that he has an nVIDIA GeForce GTX 1070, not the 1080.

 

Be careful when drilling your bottom fan vent mod, you don't want holes in the kitchen table!




To counter the increase in m.2 NVMe temperature (because the fan vent holes do reduce the amount of air drawn over the m.2 area) I have carefully cut some plastic discs which fit snuggly into the recess of each of the holes I cut in the laptop base. If I am going to be taxing just the SSD I can pop in these plugs to restore airflow over it.

 

Interesting that your SSD temps changed. It had zero effect on mine. They were virtually indentical before and after.

 

Lol, I think it was around 66 deg F in my house around that time. Laptop was on a laptop cooler without the cooler actually on, and on too small of a table so about a quarter of the laptop was hanging over the table.
Using ultra/high presets. GPU was stressed, and also the title screen is always at 99% yes, but the actual game isn't. There are times when the GPU is at 99% but really depends on the world and if I am in combat or just driving the Nomad around.

I can screen shot it next time if you would like, but I really have no reason to lie.
Using HWMONITOR for temps.

I am using Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut and a delidded 6700K(undervolted with stock clocks).
Playing on a Samsung 65ks8000 with HDR enabled. 4k @60hz max.
My 1070 doesn't really overclock well but it has always stayed icy cool.

 

That could be something to do with hole size.

 

It is bit hard to tell the scale from the picture, but those circles look YUGE! Way bigger than the hole @Mr. Fox cut out for his bottom cover mod, which was just big enough to expose the fan intake.

EDIT: Do you happen to have a picture of the bottom cover while it is on the laptop? Would love to see how it turned out.

 

How much better is the average temps with the panel off vs the vents or versus without the new vents cut into the panels ?

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...6-owners-lounge.797128/page-523#post-10507042

 

Looks amazing!

 

With the holes in my mod the CPU and GPU temps were the same as with the panel removed. M.2 SSD temps were the same with modded cover as stock cover. I did not check the SSD temps with the cover removed, but I would expect them to be better with no bottom cover. But, they are good enough to not be a problem for me either way. Removing the thick thermal pad between the M.2 drives and motherboard improved my M.2 temps more than anything else, and that also made the palm rest stop getting hot. Adding the coolers after removing the thick thermal pads also improved the temps a bit more.

 

As so same as when Panel removed. See thats exactly what someone can do to see if it is worth it or not. Run the laptop without the panel - and see if that is the difference you need versus the cost of the work and such.

Thanks for the reply.

 

Owners can also improve the ssd temp with the Copper Foil mod for the bottom lid. Some NVMe ssd's will run hotter than some other.

 

Hey guys, so I have been holding off on getting this (or a laptop in general) laptop for a while now trying to make up my mind on what I really want and what I want to do. Right now I'm leaning towards committing to this finally if I can manage to sell my Alienware in my sig to hopefully cover most of the cost between the money I got from my Blade and the AW and not have to throw too much more down to get this.

I know PC components and tech are always moving and growing, but would it be a "bad" idea to buy a machine like this now? Will the newer coffee lake CPUs be using an entirely different socket and not be compatible with this machine to upgrade. Will they even be an upgrade or will it probably be something that's not worth it? I'm assuming a refresh of this with newer specs would probably be about a year away anyway, so if I need a laptop would I be better off just getting what's available now and then seeing what happens as new stuff gets closer and go from there?

 

"4K Optimised" setting looks & runs the best I think - it looks better than 1080p Extreme + higher frame rate.

EDIT: Ha, sorry, for some reason I'm replying to a really old post, don't know how that came up on my screen, ignore freely!

 

I felt the same when I first started looking through this thread, and wondered if I should hold out for the next gen. However, unless you truly need 6 core CPU for virtualization and what not, I don't think its necessary to hold out for something better. There is plenty of power under the hood and we are constantly working to make it better by modding/tweaking the system, so potential for growth is still there imo.

Do it!

 

Well Volta NVidia GPUs will probably be here by this time next year I would have thought too, but do you really want to wait.

 

No = \ I don't really want to lol. I waited a while and got the Blade after waiting a couple months for it to come out and I know I rushed into that decision. I know that if I get this laptop it will be significantly better than my desktop currently is anyway. I don't even make full use of the 6 cores on my desktop but I like knowing it's there lol. Part of me hopes there will be a bios update to support newer CPUs if I really wanted to upgrade to one but I probably won't need to. The Volta GPUs are one thing that interests me, and I've waited this long to get something and make a decision but I don't want to wait another year. Any chance of the Volta GPUs being MXM and being able to replaced in these machines....not that I would need something higher than a 1080 for a long time. I will probably end up just getting one of these now if I can sell my Alienware and get some extra money to cover it. If the P650HS-G had TB3 I would probably just cave and get a BGA turdbook but the power of this is so tempting even though its a little thicker and heavier than I wanted from an everyday laptop.

 

Oh boy, you said the forbidden words "Get a BGA". Prepare for a smackdown!

Joking aside, I'd like to hope we can upgrade to Volta in the future but no way to confirm for awhile.