*** MSI 16L13 (Eurocom Tornado F5)/EVOC 16L-G-1080 15.6" Owner's Lounge ***

Yes lol


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Start with the easy solutions work your way back... have you checked all your power settings? What are your temps like?

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When it works temps hit 100c


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Wow! You are going to throttle to shut down at those temps.

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Are you manually maxing your fans?

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I have the fan button on .. is kinda crazy I got it today .. I might be sending t back .. in going to try to replace there thermal paste but not sure what the deal is .


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What silicon is hitting 100 C? Are you delidded? What are your specs? There seems to be more going on than just your TIMs.

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OK, I've tested it on the P870DM3. I have not tested it on the 1080 in the 16L13 yet, but will be doing so. Results will be posted here when I do. For those interested in seeing the results, see this post:

Showdown: Thermal Grizzy Kryonaut versus Phobya NanoGrease Extreme

 

that AUO B156ZAN02.1 is used in the lenovo p51 4k
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-ThinkPad-P51-Xeon-4K-Workstation-Review.229212.0.html

X-Rite i1Pro 2
Maximum: 330 cd/m² Average: 309.2 cd/m² Minimum: 3.8 cd/m²
Brightness Distribution: 89 %
Center on Battery: 313 cd/m²
Contrast: 881:1 (Black: 0.36 cd/m²)
ΔE Color 2.7 | - Ø
ΔE Greyscale 3 | - Ø
99.5% sRGB (Argyll) 87.6% AdobeRGB 1998 (Argyll)
Gamma: 2.27

http://www.panelook.com/B156ZAN02.1_AUO_15.6_LCM_parameter_30322.html

 

Yes, I opened the "best laptop monitor" of the same website and analysed all the 15.6 monitor available. It's a very good monitor which doesn't suffer of PWM flickering, too. The N02.3 version seems to be exatcly the same and has the correct brackets position for the Tornado F5. Once verified that the eDP connector is the same, it can be a big deal to make this laptop powerful both for gaming and digital stuff - graphic design - photography and so on.

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Hey guys maybe you can help me out and give some input. I'm looking for the smallest 4 pin PSU for just powering the F5 enough to do some programming and browsing, so no gpu related tasks really. How low of watts do you think we could get? Or does anyone know of a reasonably small PSU? I have the 330w for gaming and heavy gpu software, just looking for the smallest possible adapter to throw in my bag.

 

Eurocom sells the smaller 230w too, which seems to be the same of Clevos and has the same connector. What I don't understand is: what happens if you , for istance, overtake the maximum wattage output needed opening a game for mistake? Will the pc shuttle down immediately?

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Yeah but even still the 230w exceeds my needs by far and is still quite bulky. As for overtaking the maximum wattage, I believe.. But also am not positive...windows has some failsafe where if the PSU cannot meet the power requirements it steals power from the battery to make up the difference, thus draining the battery while still plugged in. This actually happens to some notebooks today that ship with underpowered PSU's

 

The 230W PSU should work. The Laptop will recognize the max power limit and throttle the GPU accordingly (at least that is what happens on Alienware systems).

Same warnings apply. You risk PSU overheat and fire if you max it out for extended period, so don't benchmark or big title game on it. Video, browser games, Adobe, and other low GPU tasks should be fine.

 

Try removing the bottom cover for testing. Run some games and benchmarks with the laptop on your cooling pad without the bottom cover and with max fans to see how the temps compare to with the cover in place.

 

Unfortunately the 230W and 330W are the only ones with the 4 pin. 180W and lower use single pin. You can try modding a 180W to 4 pin

As there is no iGPU in this system, the 180W may just be too low power to drive the Panel

 

Yeah, that's super idiotic and sucks. Windows doesn't do that. MSI came up with that (and perhaps Alienware and others followed) retarded scheme to deal with wimpy AC adapters instead of providing an adequate part for the job. Whenever corners are being cut to save a few bucks on production and maximize profits, the outcome is always going to suck. Notebooks that are properly engineered will always function identically with the battery totally removed and running off AC power alone. Reliance on the battery to assist the AC adapter to achieve bare minimum system requirements really blows, and leads to erratic behavior.

 

Well I mean I have found absurdly low Watt PSU's that have a 4 pin connector, we're talking like 100W - 150W haha. I unfortunately don't have a power meter on hand capable of telling me how many watt's i'm pulling during specific work times, so I may pick one up and and go from there.

Ahhh, so for once it's not windows at fault. Yeah I seem to remember Alienware having that issue not long ago, and a buddy of mine has a new ASUS ROG also doing the same..tis tis tis... unacceptable

 

@Mr. Fox
While we're on the subject of cancer firmwares, do you or anyone else know what the unlocked Bios variables:
PS Current Threshold1 (Default is 80)
PS Current Threshold2 (Default is 20)
PS Current Threshold3 (Default is 5)

actually do?
And if there's a way to adjust a value like this to prevent the EC firmware (I think it's the EC doing it) from allowing the system to steal power from the battery by changing variables like this (For those of us poor peasants with BGA trash and who are not blessed by the power of Premamods?

This line makes absolutely no sense whatsoever:

"
PS Current Threshold1
The PS Current Threshold1 is defined in 1/4A (Amperes) increments
and uses the BIOS mailbox command 0x3. A value of 400 equals
100A. Range is 0-512 which translates to 0-128A. Enter 0 for AUTO.
Default is 80 for 20A"


For example: Changing Imon Offset to a negative value - (25.276=25276) makes the CPU report that it's using less wattage than it actually is using.

Note: I changed PS Current Threshold1 to 400 and the system instantly rebooted at 4.5 ghz when I put a *4 thread* load on the CPU. Ahem...why the hell would it do that.....

One of you brave adventurous souls out there want to try changing PS Current Threshold1 down to like 30-40, and maybe 2 also (or half of your defaults) and see what happens?

Hell, try setting them to 0 for all three and see if thats the same as "default", as that' supposed to be "Auto".

 

HWinfo64 will tell you your CPU and GPU watts.

 

I am not sure what they do, or why they exist. There is no useful documentation with meaningful explanations that I can find anywhere on the subject (which is almost always the case with BIOS settings). I have been playing around with all of the BIOS settings, including those. I had everything except CPU voltage all maxed out to try to block the TDP throttling of the CPU, but also found the system shuts off as you did. Apparently, MSI cut some corners on the motherboard engineering and it is not up to the task of providing support beyond a certain threshold. I can max out those settings, and have done so, with my P870DM3 and it does not shut off. It also does not have the TDP throttling at 5.0GHz and greater like the 16L13.

 

@Mr. Fox
Found out something that might make maybe 10% more sense.

https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/forum/#!msg/chromium-os-reviews/kyyJs_xqNz8/hvJ7vdWGEwAJ

There it's called "Power state current cutoff"
Welp at least we know that "PS" means "Power state" and not "Power SUPPLY."

And PS3 Enable and PS4 Enable mean power state 3/4 enable"...

Wonder if that's related to Power Limit...I guess only the @Prema God would know...
Or maybe it's related to sleep states? But there's no "S5" I guess since S5=power off....my head hurts.

 

Every little bit of knowledge helps. Thanks for the link. It's sad that there is so little knowledge available for some of these things, and what little information from the manufacturer there is seems to be withheld by the very people that should be intelligent enough to know that sharing information about the products they sell is much safer than customers using trial and error to figure everything out on their own. But, I remind myself that we are dealing with self-centered imbeciles and the reality of the situation is they just don't give a rat's ass about end users.

 

Here's an Intel Confidential document about XTU.

ftp://ftp.ltec-service.ch/FTP/AXXIV/WORKSTATION/DRIVERS/SVELT/SP67A/W7/Intel/XTU6/XTU%206.0%20BIOS%20Interface%20Specification.pdf

 

Thanks. I added that to my Google Drive Intel XTU Archive. The folder is publicly accessible. Newer versions of XTU do not work correctly with some older Sandy Bridge systems (including the M18xR1 and M17xR3). It sucks that Intel does not make them available for download, so I've taken care of their incompetence.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0Bwdqi25LDwZyRUpZc1B0NW5fd2c

 

Has anyone else noticed recently that their GPU wont lock into max clocks during games? I'm monitoring using MSI afterburner and my clocks bounce between 1700 and 1900 despite me have the max set at 1911. My desktop GPU doesn't do this and my laptop used to not do this. This is on a fresh install as well just to make sure nothing funky was going on. It is super irritating. I do have it set to maximum performance as well.

 

Does it do it on the same drivers that it never used to, or have you downgraded to never GeFarts drivers? NVIDIA wants everyone to have the "Max-Q Experience" LOL. Especially so if you own something better.

When you say you have it set to maximum performance, you're referring to both the Performance Management mode in the GeFarts drivers, the Windows power plan, or both?

 

Yea I have used drivers from April and May, before the release of that MAXQ junk. Performance plan set in both nvidia control panel and in windows power plan, it didnt help at all. Its just really dumb. Before i could run my card stable 1900 mhz @ 900 mV to help with temps now it just bounces all over the place.

GPU Z reports perf cap reason is pwr despite the fact the card never goes over 925 mV.

 

I seemed to have fixed this by changing the bios to the one talon linked in February. Clocks aren't quite as high but voltage and clocks stay stable and games are smoother too.

 

i had same issue with the stock. it had higher max clocks but too much fluctuation. i had many black screens issue from tht too. the one talon posted is stable while the max clock a bit lower it remains stable throughout the game session.

 

Hey there guys,

I have been in contact with Eurocom-Europe, and they have offered a good price for their Tornado F5. I would like to know what everyone's thought on the spec/build they have given to me, I think its a great price)

15.6" IPS 1920x1080 (matte) Premium Quality w Gsync (not sure if its 60hz or 120hz)
Intel Core i7 7700k desktop 4.00-4.500ghz (upgradeable)
16gb ram 2133Mhz DDR4 Ram Memory (upgradeable)
Nivdia Gefore GTX 1080 8gb GDDR5X (upgradable)
250GB EVO 850 SSD + 1TB 7200 RPM HDD (upgradable)
Wifi AC Dual Band Intel 7265 + BT 4.0 (upgradable)
Windows 10 Pro
US Blacklit Keyboard En Antighost
x1 USB 3.1C, HDMI 2.0, 4 active LCDs
webcam 2.0 mpix FP Reader
Warranty 24 months EU Return to Depot for Companies

Total price 2.799 euros after discount (including shipping + vat)
(Thermal paste, backpack as well)

Main reason is to get a gaming laptop that will last me a long time and to upgrade parts in the future. What I have been reading on the forums is that at this price point or higher its better to get a laptop that you can upgrade the GPU/CPU rather then a laptop that you cannot. I haven't had a chance to read the posts here, but perhaps I can get a quicker reply then the thread I posted for this.

Cheers

 

Why did they give you a special price?

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Europe special promo and some discount sort of thing

 

When I ordered my machine with Eurocom 20% Coupon, they didn't apply the student discount neither thermal paste and backpack because "backpack promotion can't be added to 20% coupon" .

So I paid 2870€ for a similar machine with i7 6700k, 8 GB RAM, NVIDIA GTX 1080, QFHD IPS screen , Italian keyboard, NO Windows and NO SSD - HDD.

Probably they dropped down price listing?

Invia

 

Might be refurb I Dono anyways. Could you perhaps answer my question ?

 

Yes the lower mounting brackets are different. The way the F5 works the top brackets slide under a small plastic clamp and held in by compression. The bottom mounts are where the screws hold, without them the screen will shift up and down. If it shifts far enough down it will also go left and right. Also to make it fit you might have to cut off the side brackets but that I am unsure of as I am not in front of my laptop so I can't see the bezel clips and locks right now.

 

For detailed question about gaming you'd better wait MrFoxRox opinion. I'm dire that Is a machine that allows you some upgrade improvement , if you want to overclock you'd better to mod backlit opening 2 holes next to air fans.

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I found the 02.3 version that has the correct bracket placement, now i'm comparing eDP connectors to ensure that I'll not have troubles.

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Cool, glad it solved your issue. I noticed my voltage wouldn't increase over 900 mV but clocks stayed stable. I'll probably try a driver reinstall with the new bios and see if it helps. Now that you mention it i have had some black screens that seemed like it was a driver crash and restart.

 

Seems like a solid build. Do you know if your 7700k is delidded? That is going to be priority 1 in using this machine to its potential. Otherwise you are going to struggle with heat. If you have the money, pay for the Prema BIOS upgrade. Don't pass on that. Seriously. It's a terrific little beast. Stick around and share your experience once you've received your 16L.

One point to consider, the GTX 1080 is going to run most games at 1080p well above 60 fps. The 60 Hz Gsync screen isn't going to do much for you. Gsync will only work when you are pushing less than 60 fps on that screen. Screen tearing can be worse when you are running frame rates higher than your refresh rate. I would recommend either purchasing a faster screen or a higher resolution screen.

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Nvidia drivers haven't played well with our book. 378.92 is the latest driver I could use without having my screen black out. I've just upgraded the BIOS so it may be time to revisit updated drivers to test for compatibility. If all else fails, uninstall the driver and keep it below the mentioned driver.

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Just to put some of your expectations regarding upgrading components in the future into perspective - I think it relatively unlikely that you'll be able to upgrade your laptop to the next generation of GPUs, same is true for the CPU. RAM amount & drives you can upgrade. Please correct me if I'm wrong about this, for example if you owners have been told otherwise by the manufacturer on specific points like CPU & GPU upgrades for next generation hardware.

 

Worth noting that it provides replacability as well as upgradeability.

@leftsenseless, where can you buy the Prema Bios?

 

From Prema partners. I believe Eurocom is one. I know HID is, but you have to purchase the book through them and it's a service that comes with the purchase.

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not sure about the next gen GPUs but considering nvidia pushing Max-q hey might drop MXM who knows. but im pretty sure the next cpus are going to be same socket, will they work on existing chipset is not known but its likely they do?

 

for me thos black screens and crashes werent the drivers, it was with stock vbios. i had no crashes/blackscreens with the new vbios on same drivers.

 

That's what I've heard, but I didn't want to pass it on as solid info without having tested it myself. Thanks.

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I've been looking into this loosely recently when I heard leaks about the 6 core i7-8700K, it's gonna be on LGA1151 - same socket, but most people think it wont' be compatible with Z170 motherboard (which I have) for example, so thinking the same kind of restrictions will be in place for laptops that used desktop CPUs. I hope it'll be compatible, but I doubt it. (My Z170 motherboard is compatible with 6700K and 7700K, but later generations, I doubt it.)

 

Very special if Intel let us upgrade 3 gen processors on same socket. I can smell socket 1151 v2 long way who contain same amount of pins, but with changed pins layout. My best bet. Intel doesn't run charity.

 

With that configuration, you NEED the PremaMOD BIOS. Yes, you can get "unlocked" BIOS through Eurocom but you won't get the less restrictive vBIOS that ONLY PremaMOD BIOS Partners have. HIDevolution is your best bet but unfortunately, they won't be as cheap but you DO get what you pay for. Ask @Donald@HIDevolution for additional information on such an important/expensive purchase.