[Guide] How to take full control of the i7-8750H (Advanced version)

IMON is not voltage or current.
There is no danger of breaking on these laptops.
These chips all come from the same silicon.
8086K / 8700K / 8600K, 8400, 8150, 8950HK, 8850H, 8750H ....just binned.

Putting 80W into a 8750H isn't going to do anything.
You just have to make sure you are drawing less than maximum power supply rating (Use a Kill-a-Watt) and chips are cooled properly.
9900K has 95W TDP for example. But I pour 230W into it and it loves it.
TDP is just to keep power draw in design limits since laptops tend to have poor cooling.
Exceeding 45W TDP is only going to be a problem on very low end motherboards, like with 2 phases that can only handle 20 amps each.

Video card TDP unlocking is a completely different story and FAR more complicated.

 

@hackness @Falkentyne As Uncleweeb said in the throttlestop guide, (before i find your tricks in the Bios, Slope, IMON... i had yellow and red ring in the Past, Limits tab) i had to lower the Long and Short Turbo Boost Power Max. I forgot these settings, after i did the bios trick, it was 75 for Long and 90 for Short on TS at 1st install, so basics according to my pc, I changed these to 45 and 75 long time ago from Uncleweeb advice.

With the differents pics i upload before, on TS settings and in game reference with after burner... Do you advice me to come back to the Long and Short Turbo Boost Power Max 75 and 90 ? Or with the IMON Offset -31999 and Slope 50, it is dangerous ?

Thx for all your advice and help guys.

 

Hey guys, quick question I have one of the single channel rtx models (gs65 8se) with Kingston ram (OEM 1*16. 19-19-19-43-61) and I am interested in adding another stick.

Option 1:

G.skill Ripjaws 19-19-19-43 $129.00

Option 2:

Crucial Ballistic SL 16-18-18 $150.00

Now I have OCed the RAM on the Kingston to 16-18-18-44 (I wanted to see if I can make timing tighter to match the Ballistic)

So would you recommend I just buy the Ripjaws or grab the Crucial?

I don't intend on ever matching the sticks. So I won't be buying another stick in the future.

Does OC setting in BIOS apply the OC to both RAM sticks, or do I have to do each individual RAM timing if mismatching RAM?


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I don't have any experience trying out other brand's RAM at OCing except Samsung, but from what I heard, for those who buy Ripjaws they usually just go for the 3200MHz model and not doing any OC, not sure about Ballistics though.

And yes, it is just one master setting for all RAM installed, so both RAM need to be able to support your setting, so usually it is recommended to have the same type of RAM all together.

 

Awesome. Yeah I am buying the 2666 versions since my stock ram is 2666.

Tbh the only reason I would be using OC options in BIOS is to match timings.

If I use the Ripjaws I won't have to do anything just pop it in and play.

If I use Ballistic I don't want to pay more for something faster only to have it down clock to match the slower Kingston OEM RAM.

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Yes the slowest RAM becomes the king. Your solution seems valid as far as I can tell, matching the timings.

 

Hi @hackness

If I don't use TS but I want maximum gaming performance what percentage should I set when plugged in? And should I uninstall TS if I don't use it? Or will it not affect these settings? (Chapter 4)

 

Maximum is 0%. If you are using the XTU to cover the UV part and wanting to use "Processor energy performance preference policy" to control the behavior of the EPP, you probably don't need to run TS unless you want different profile for different situation.

 

Hello hackness, thank you for this lovely tutorial.

I heard you are in taiwan, is there a way we can get clevo barebones there for a very good price ? shipping to europe ?

I don't have an option to contact you directly

best

 

Hello, there's one reseller called CJSCOPE.

However I believe they are using desktop CPU on their model

Mainly 8700 or 9700K,

Price is about the same as in the US where the US model would be using the 9750H or 8750H.

 

Would you guys agree that the best combo for managing CPU, GPU and FANS for MSI GS65 8SE would be:

MSI AfterBurner (GPU control) + MSI Silent Option (FAN control) + ThrottleStop (CPU Contro) ?

And, on a related (and quite necessary) note, is there such a thing as Silent Option for the I7-8750h (coffee lake)?

Thanks all

 

For GPU part, i can't answer you, cause i don't OC and undervolt my GPU, and don't use Dragon center.
For silent option, I find this version "Silent Option V1.0.1603.3101" (Skylake version ) witch works for my MSI GE73 8RF ( 8750H ).

You can download it here : https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=255972.0

 

Hello,

That combo is what a lot of people are using, however for the MSI Afterburner part, make sure the program is killed after the profile is loaded if you are running the NVIDIA drivers released nowadays, otherwise it'll keep the dGPU busy and not allowing it to shutdown as it should and Optimus becomes broken.

 

thanks

 

They are actually the same thing, by having the TDP directly set through the XTU or by adding a negative offset to the reported wattage and use ThrottleStop, both should be safe in this regard, because 8750H isn't drawing that much current and also it doesn't require that high in voltage like the desktop i9 that's pushing the voltage to nearly or more than the 1.5V zone at high clock rate.

 

how to stop this? After I set OC profile I just press (X)? Is this what you mean or do I have to kill it in task manager to not keep dGPU busy etc....?

 

You can set a delayed taskkill using task scheduler for the msi afterburner on Log on (Not startup), maybe a 30~45 seconds delay.

 

A few questions:

1) I have heard that undervolting the CPU core without also undervolting the CPU cache by the same amount is futile. Is that true? Or does undervolting them separately also work?

2) How do you decide how much do undervolt each one (core, cache, iGPU) by? Here's how much I'm undervolting mine. It feels very strange that with -0.3V on the core and running stress tests I'm still not crashing, since the rough figures are -0.15V for the i7 8750H, so what gives? (BTW I don't know if you are indeed from Taiwan, but if so you'd be familiar with my laptop, the MSI GL73-8SDK).


3) I followed your instructions below. Because undervolting with TS (and using XTU simply for monitoring) I found that I was constantly hitting Power Limit Throttling before Thermal Throttling. Afterwards it was the other way round (so I guess the trick worked). What exactly is Power Limit Throttling? Because prior to using the trick, TDP got stuck on 45W. After using the trick TDP is stuck on 13W, which if you add the offset of 32V, is still 45W? So I'm a bit confused as to how to get over that TDP threshold...

4) The only chapter I've followed thus far is Chapter 4: Make the way the Speed Shift to work as it should be, since I don't really know what benefits the other chapters confer as far as undervolting goes. Would you mind explaining? Thanks!

 

Thanks for the headsup
Would this be why my gpu kept getting hot(ish) while idle, even on battery? (around 55C idle gpu vs 45c idle cpu)

This "hot(ish) gpu" made the laptop bezel hot to the touch as well, which might not be a problem at 55c for components but it is becoming bothersome for regular use

 

While on the subject, I've read that my Package C State Percent while idle should be over 70% on C7 C8 and C9 but I'm definitively not there whatsoever (as shown in the attached image)




Ive also read that this could be due to a driver problem, any clues on that one?

 

Yep if you are only adjusting the core you'll find that the reported voltage will stop lowering at some point, you can fire up TS Bench and lower the voltage offset in FIVR menu to see the actual situation.

As the core will stop lowering at some point, what matters more is the cache here, even though you are putting an offset of - 300mV on the core slider, probably only the 100mV of it will work and the rest of the 200mV might be not having any affect towards the CPU voltage, but on cache its a different story.

Usually we find out the maximum undervolt by slowly decreasing the voltage, 5mV a time, until BSOD or freeze, restart and set the offset to the last non-crashing or freezing undervolt value.

The quickest way to find out is to do burn in test and have it run on max multiplier, if after 28 seconds the multiplier doesn't drop, it means the IMON tweak is working.

Power Limit is what the maximum power that the CPU is allowed to run at, usually comes with a timer, for mobile it is usually 28 seconds, once your CPU has exceeded the power limit, eventually after 28 seconds the power limit kicks in to make sure it is running at 45W, this is the main reason we needed IMON tweak to trick the CPU.

chapter 1:Usually C state is locked and cannot be changed in Windows, this chapter is just to unlock it and allow you to make changes in Windows through ThrottleStop.

Chapter 2: Usually you cannot set the mutliplier in the Turbo limit menu lower than the base multiplier of the CPU you have in a laptop, this one allow you to do so and some people use this to lower the multiplier to extend the battery life.

Chapter 3: As you have noticed that Intel CPU nowadays does have a pattern, less core active the frequency will go higher, but to have the CPU perform in the original way that it is intended to run, you will need core parking feature, but this feature isn't good for gaming, if you do 24/7 gaming then this isn't good for you, because when core parking enabled, you will see stutter in the game.

Chapter 5: Some believe that sometimes the mouse movement stutter is caused by this, this feature is usually used by enterprises, normal uses doesn't really need this feature.

Chapter 6: This one is to further extend the battery life, by force shutting down the number of cores you want.

 

I've been running the RAM at 3467MHz @1.2V for 2 weeks now, seems stable.

RAM @1.2V is around 1~2C less than @1.25V on both the CPU and GPU on the GS65.

 

Stuck on splash screen after setting tighter timing on RAM.

Just got 2nd stick of 16gb. Successfully OCed and stable. Tried to tightening timing I booted and BSoD

Tried power down and powering on while holding down power button for 60 seconds (AC plugged in)

Tried CMOS reset while unplugged (inserted pin in CMOS reset button)

Tried removing new stick of RAM

Tried removing CMOS and battery and booting.

I know this last timing worked on my OEM stick.

Not sure what else to try or perhaps I didn't follow reset steps correctly.

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You mean it is stuck on MSI Logo and unable to progress further no matter what you do?

Can you try removing the cmos battery and leave it for 1 full hour and see if anything changes?

 

Trying that now


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Fingers crossed.

 

Maybe this helps someone.

Steps I did that caused it.

Precursor: installed RAM and new SSD.
Booted and reformatted the SSD all good.
Decided to OC new RAM and use timings of OEM RAM.
OEM RAM timing were incompatible with new RAM timings/OC
Found stable RAM timings that allowed both unmatched sticks to run 19 20 20 49 at 3100MHz 1.25V
Used and tested for a few hours.

Issues:

I decided to tightening timings
18 20 20 48 @ 1.25V

Booted successfully into windows, got a intel program error and something else (a net framework update was pushed by WU prior to reboot and tightening timing) however as soon as I tried to test timings BSOD and rebooted.

Stuck on MSI LOGO unable to enter BIOS. ::This lasted for about 45 min to an hour, all the while I tried to troubleshoot::

Steps to troubleshoot.

1. Held down 60s rebooted and did the 3 reboot loops as customary, did not go past splash screen.

2. Tried 5s reset - same thing

3. Pressed EC Reset button - no progress still got the same 3 reboot MSI logo and then stuck on logo

4. Removed CMOS battery, disconnected laptop battery and removed AC for maybe 5 min - nothing

5. Removed new RAM hoping failed timing would at least allow OEM RAM to boot since this timing worked on OEM RAM - nothing

6. Swapped the OEM RAM into the other empty slot. - nothing

7. Removed new SSD, New RAM and left CMOS Battery and laptop battery unplugged (all together this was 25 minutes where cmos battery was unplugged.)

8. Laptop is now stock, all upgrades removed, CMOS and battery plugged back in and AC connected and FINALLY booted into BIOS. Date is reset.

9. LOAD OPTIMISED DEFAULT SETTINGS BEFORE PROCEEDING!!

>>>>>This maybe irrelevant but will post what I did next. <<<<<

10. Booted back into Windows just to see if I could. Then shutdown.

11.Reinstalled all upgrades back in and booted back into BIOS and LOADED OPTIMISED DEFAULT SETTINGS.

12. Rebooted back into windows, checked HWINFO to see if upgrades were detected and timings were still back to default.

11. Rebooted into BIOS, redid BIOS Tweaks (IMON Slope, Loadline Calibrations, PEG0 ASPM, SGX, CFG Lock, etc. + LAST STABLE RAM TIMING).

12. Successfully booted back into windows, double checked HWINFO and ran TM5 to test memory OC: Passed

 

Glad it worked.

So with the CMOS Battery Unplug for 25 min it resets.

Does your AC / DC Loadline still stick after performing the above?

 

Resets all of it


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Sigh, placed all the part back in and now same issue.

Will remove new NVMe drive
@hackness you are still required to Load Optimised defaults. Or in any case it's good practice. This fixed my error


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I see, looks like you have found the way to do full reset.

Still a bit of a hassle but at least is a way to cure settings related to UV too further in the BIOS and caused the laptop unable to boot.

I'll update the front page and link your post later on.

 

Oh it's still required to load Optimal Settings?

So you have activated Fail Safe mode?

Is it the same even with the RAM on stock timing and frequency?

 

1. Front page's Warning part updated, thanks @xLima
2. Linked RAM overclocking post to Front page.

 

Unsure about fail safe mode, I may give this another go and see what changes were done. I was more in a panicked state and didn't have the foresight to dig through every option to see if all settings get reverted (SGX, IMON SLOPE, PEG0 ASPM, ETC), I was more worried the wife would wake up in 3 hours and be unable to work cause I bricked my laptop which she is borrowing for her job currently. Was sweating bullets at 2:30AM.

Maybe when the 1650X arrives I will try this reset again and report back .

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I bought an AX1650 and my GS75 does not recognize it in the bios, it does not work. If you get it, I'm very interested in it. What model of laptop do you have?

 

MSI gs65 8se

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Are you also unable to install the driver in Windows?

It is alright,

As long it gets reset, it means we can do undervolting in the BIOS and if the laptop fails to boot we can still use this method.

It's a bit of a hassle though.

 

You can not install a driver to a device that does not exist ... if the bios does not see it, it does not appear in Windows either.

 

Case is different in some laptop, like Clevo's P170EM, if you install a 970M, BIOS can't see it too, but in Windows the driver can be installed and used normally. Have you tried it?

 

Yes, when I boot on Windows, there was no wifi network card.

 

Will install in about 12 hours. And report back.

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Thanks

 

That's a bummer.

Hopefully MSI is aware of this problem.

 

Sorry Pepillo. Was plug and play for me. Sorry I had to connect to ethernet to download driver.

I did this.

Open laptop
Unplugged CMOS and Battery
Swapped WiFi card
Plugged everything and back in closed up
Loader BIOS
Optimised defaults
Boot windows
Connect to ethernet because no WiFi
Item was ? In device manager
Installed from Killer Website.
Profit.

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Good news. In the bios do you see the card?
When you say "Unplugged CMOS and Battery", how you unplug CMOS?
What I did not try is to unplug CMOS and battery with load optimzed. I'll try it, thanks.

 

Guess I should get one and see if it works on the GS65 2018.

 

I searched and couldn't not find in bios. I search just the main page (did not unlock bios).

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When you say "Unplugged CMOS and Battery", how you unplug CMOS?

 

There is a little intertwined cable black and red attached to a black circular object (battery). Unplug that from mobo

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Thanks again, I see that to remove that CMOS cable you have to dismantle the motherboard:



Did you test without having to do the Clear CMOS if it worked? I say this because someone said that sometimes even if you do not see the bios you can install it on Windows, and the truth, I'm not sure if I tried that or as soon as I saw that I did not have Internet and I did not recognize the bios I did not look any more . And if you say that the bios does not see the card, perhaps it is not necessary anyway.