TONGFANG GK5CN5Z / GK5CN6Z / GK5CQ7Z / GK5CP0Z

I just got off the phone with OP tech support on my broken front LED bar (about a 5 minute wait). They did not offer to fix it but instead told me to return it. I told them I wanted to keep the laptop but again they did not offer a way to fix it. I wonder what would have happened if I was outside the return window? Anyhow, my new one arrives tomorrow.

 

Is an earlier windows 10 subversion a requirement for beating the 35W problem?

I received the 15+ last night and did the following:
1. Updated to latest OP bios EC GC
2. Updated windows
3. Only single channel

What I can’t believe is, at this stock form, it’s converting photos in Lightroom slower than my 6700HQ laptop. I was expecting not full performance but this is way too low

I’ll provide screen shots when I get the chance

 

Try uninstalling GC and upping the power in XTU and see if that helps.

 

I am not trying to bash on this laptop, I am trying to figure out if I got a possible defective unit due

Even in stock form I get very bad current limit throttke

 

hodge, in regards to the rtx 2000 series mobile SKUs, there are 3 potential benefits:

* they are upping the number of cuda cores by 1 notch. As per the desktop SKUs. So for example: a 1070mq --> then becomes the 2060. And so on.

* Tensor cores can be used for DLSS, in those games which support the new feature. And DLSS is a less demanding feature than ray tracing. The DLSS feature reduces the burden of anti-aliasing on the CUDA cores. Permitting higher performance and frame rates for the same TDP. This is a significant advantage once it's available. But only for those games which support DLSS.

* Performance of games which are properly programmed to use modern async apis is better. That is to say: games which are built for either dx12 or vulkan from the ground up. Examples: Doom (vulkan), Wolfenstein 2 (vulkan), Gears of War 4 (dx12). Turing inherents these async improvements from the volta architecture (the $3000 titan-V card). Which came out after pascal.

However some people are not even gaming on these laptops. In which case none of that matters.

 

I ran some cinebench tests and they show the same result as prime 95 26.6 regarding the GC software:

1. With GC software installed on high performance mode single channel ram - 860
2. Without gaming center installed single channel ram - 1260
3. My desktop Ryzen 2700x for reference - 1800

If you need CPU performance, the GC software is going to hold you back.

 

I am getting 1200+ Cinebench with GC installed. (although dual channel RAMl) I think there are just so many versions right now and so many other variables it's hard to pin the blame. Find what works for you now and stick with it I guess.

The front LED not working has got to be a software issue.

 

Which versions are you running on the bios and GC?

 

Ok I have tried about three different versions. I got that score with OP Gaming Center v.1.2.2.8 as well as the other versions if I remember correctly.

 

A thing to note is that temperature issues or fan noises aren't going to be resolved by the RTX 2000 series mobile SKUs since it is the processor that is the one that generates heat here

 

Thanks. So it looks like the Gaming Center is the culprit on the single/dual channel ram issue for the CPU.

 

Ok, I have my OP 17. I am updating windows and replacing the GC.

I know this is going to sound stupid, but does anyone have a basic how-to on what to run to test to make sure everything is optimized?

I am looking for something like this. And can update as people provide input:
1 - Update WIndows to the latest version (Currently 1809)

2 - Download and update the GC here:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/jcotrkc3uvzhvqh/GamingCenter_1.2.2.8_ESI.zip?dl=0

3 - Update the BIOS. I emailed support to get the latest for the 17.

4 - Download Throttlestop to undervolt,
Here is a video from @B0B :
What settings are you guys using?

5 - What benchmarks to run ?

Other driver locations and useful links:
https://www.opowered.com/laptops/ <--Support Emails and Phone Numbers
https://www.mysn.de/driver/1_XMG/XMG_NEO_15_XNE15M18/Driver/

 

When I asked about if we can change hardware, they didn't respond to my question regarding if opening the laptop voids the warranty.

Also something that is worry-some about these laptops, The warranty from walmart says it's 2 years but in the manual it says it's 1 years but it also has this very worrying clause.

So this seems that they do not want to deal with class actions due to faulty products / bad warranty. It seems that you need to opt-out of the arbitration to be able to be apart of any future class actions but as the opt out period is only 30 days I would only assume that the number of people perusing a class action would be small.

The fact that this company includes warranty stickers and will not respond to my requests if removing the sticker voids warranty is not a good sign, as warranty stickers are not legal under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act.

Edit: Quick update since they have not included any of the warranty information in the box nor have made us sign any agreements their arbitration opt out won't stand up in court.

https://www.reuters.com/article/leg...sung-appeal-in-warranty-dispute-idUSKCN1C71QF

So we got that going for us which is nice.

 

I have a video that is perfect for you. As soon as the dual channel kit arrives I can finish it up.

 

I want to try that OEMsev utility and see if it resolves my almost constant current limit throttling issue, but the download link requires a decryption key? please help?

 

Looking forward to it. Once my new machine arrives tomorrow I will start testing again. It will be nice to get everything sorted out as this laptop has the potential to be a really nice machine for a number of users - gamers, developers, etc.

 

Agreed, I would really like someone to post an out-of-the-box step-by-step fix for this machine, in the meantime I ordered a stick of RAM i think will be compatible, and plan on weathering this one out until January's end of return window date.

 

Check here;
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...ongfang-gk5cn6z.815943/page-101#post-10802356
Download the attached OEM.zip file.

 

For those looking to remove the warranty sticker, put some isopropyl alcohol on the sticker and let it sit for a min. It will be much easier to get off with the razor blade. Then stick it on a backing for stickers/stamps. If you need to send the laptop in, put all the original hardware back in and put the sticker back on.

 

Sure but we shouldn't have to do this in the first place, it's straight up illegal for them to enforce voiding the warranty for a sticker.

 

Can someone clarify this:

From my googling it appears that for Walmart.com orders we will recieve an email with our Master Key for those software offers in a day or two after pickup. Is that correct?

 

I received one a couple days after picking mine up.

 

I agree but with a little effort it might save you some time in dealing with OP should they decide to try to enforce it.

 

Unfortunately my Master Key didn't work. So I contacted Intel. Crickets...

 

Any *nix users get the keyboard backlight working yet? Doesn't work even with the latest 4.19.x series kernel (which fixed the i2c touchpad). It's kind of annoying because if you suspend/sleep the laptop, the keyboard backlight will stay on, so I had to disable it in the BIOS, which also keeps it disabled in Windows (I have a dual boot setup).

 

I too am one that received a double refund totalling $300 except on the gtx1050 version, so it cost me about $425 all in. I broke the warranty sticker because at that price, it's a consumable for me anyway. I put my own 950pro 512gb in it and it is a lot more responsive. They put a cheapo Phison drive in for the 128gb, so I suspect the 256gb isn't much better. If you're going to do the RAM (as it sounds like many are going to do), I suggest doing the NVMe as well.

 

Hi there! I have been following this forum and specifically this thread for some time now and felt the need to finally register. I would like to give my input, not only about this laptop, but about the i7 8750h CPU itself. I´m a sub and long time Bob fan; his videos are really helpful and I love his methodology.

What I want to say here is that no one can expect the i7 8750h to sustain its 3,9ghz max turbo clock across all cores all the time. That´s almost impossible, because it needs way more than 45w to do that! I see many people with unrealistic expectations about this!

So far I´ve only seen 2 models/brands that can sustain close to the turbo speed on any application:

1- Asus GL504
2- MSI GE Raider after advanced bios tweaking

The Asus GL504 can keep it around 3,6ghz most of the time, and the MSI GE can actually deliver up to 70w juice (!) to keep it at steady 3,6/3,7 in any situation providing you have adequate cooling. Specifically re-pasting, undervolting etc.

I´ve said several times that imo the best hassle free CPU you can get on laptops right now is the amazing i5 8300h. Yes we know it "only" has 8 threads, 4 cores, and 8750h has 12 threads 6 cores. But the 8300h is not only really easy to cool, but also it doesn´t need as much power to sustain its 3,9ghz. I´ve seen many brands, from Lenovo Y530 models, HP Omens, MSI (even some GF ones with bad cooling), having 0 issues keeping 8300h at 3,9ghz on ANY situation. And this is a plus.

Sometimes the 8300h ends up offering better performance than the 8750h, wich you need to accept that it will DOWNCLOCK, no other way around. Anyone claiming that he can keep the 8750h at 3,9ghz all the time on any application is either lying or didn´t really use software that really pushes the CPU.

In gaming, for example, the 8300h @ 3,9ghz will run circles around 8750h @ 3,5ghz/3,6ghz, depending on the game, resolution and GPU usade.

Let´s imagine this scenario:

- High Refresh Gaming external monitor - 144hz/240hz - GTX 1060 - Low Setttings + 80% res scale 1080p.

By doing this you are reliefing the pressure on the GPU so you can get higher framerates for the monitor. CPU is important here. I´m talking about games like Overwatch, Quake Champions, Dirty Bomb, Black Ops 4 or Counter Strike. Test the 8300h @ 3,9ghz vs 8750h @ 3,5ghz. Surprise surprise. The 8300h will deliver higher framerate! Because it has 400mhz more (and this is excluding the fact 8750h drops a lot to 3,2ghz/3,3ghz). Those 400mhz/500mhz more only account for like 15% performance difference at best, right? But when you have 120fps that´s already 15fps to 18fps difference, wich means a lot! 120 vs 135/138 ! And the 0,1% Low FPS also suffer a lot from lower clock speeds.

Now I understand i7 8750h runs circles around 8300h on some applications, even with 3,3ghz clocks. Rendering, converting, encoding! The question you need to ask yourself is: you really need 12 threads for your daily work? Yes? Then sure, grab i7 8750h. If you don´t need it and you mainly care about gaming or non heavily threaded apps, 8300h is the best CPU for most scenarios. Battlefield V stresses threads a lot and 8300h might get 80% to 95% usage on that game, but I still doubt you will get higher fps with the i7 8750h at 3,4ghz/3,5ghz, as I´m yet to see a laptop that can sustain 3,9ghz on Battlefield with that CPU. It simply won´t happen.

This is just my 2 cents on the subject. Please don´t be disapointed when you see your 8750h clocking itself down, it will happen with 99% of the models! It has nothing to do with this Tongfang model, or any other band. This is suppose to happen!

Best you can do is grab a 1500€ (in my country) MSI GE Raider, unlock the advanced bios and provide 70w so you can sustain 3,6ghz most of the time. Otherwise get ready to see heavy downclocks.

Remember that the i5 8300h is not too far from an i7 7700/7700k desktop CPU, wich was still the best gaming CPU in the world 1 year ago. Then Intel released 8700k.

i5 8300h with undervolt + 2x8gb fast sticks -> 2666mhz CL16/18. Your best bet for gaming on a laptop right now. Problems free, cool, quiet, 3,9ghz on ANY situation, and very good performance.

 

As a gamer first the 8300h would be my choice I’ve the 8750h every time.

I love to tinker with the 12 thread chip for the challenge but you’re right about the expectations and wattage pulled from these.

 

Hi Bob! Is a honor to talk with you, big fan of your channel I think a video comparing 8300h vs 8750h in gaming would be very very good for a lot of people Think about it, when you have some time.

Yes I loved to watch the 8750h challenge on your channel. The 35w limit was not suppose to happen at all, but then I see people still worried about the CPU dropping to 3,4ghz on Battlefield V and that will happen on almost any laptop lol. Unrealistic expectations! Even the 6 core Desktop Intel chips TDP is fake! That has been proven by Tech power up and hardware unboxed several times. Now of course the i7 8750h doesn´t need 45w only for 3,9ghz, it needs way more

 

I’ve seen it pull 90 on the m15 during Stephens stream and the y730 hit 79w lol. It’s no joke.

The clocks really become important when scaling settings back to take advantage of these 144hz displays.

Most are still on the 60hz mindset. Referring to the gaming laptop consumer as a whole and not NBR folk exclusively.

 

Received mine today, and I'm thoroughly impressed. Build quality is great, keyboard is good, and my display is flawless with regards to backlight bleed. This is definitely a keeper. I plan to wrap it in a carbon fiber vinyl to cover up that logo.

Small question though. Can you not choose white as an LED color in the Gaming Center?

 

The closest I come to white LED keys is to choose lightest yellow, like all the way down on the yellow color stripe.

 

Thanks. That's close enough. Strange oversight to not have a pure white option.

 

Ok so I've had the OP 15+ Laptop for a few days now and I've been doing some tests to see if I'm having any throttling issues others have mentioned and I don't think that I am but perhaps I'm misunderstanding some things. I'm still relatively new to undervolting and doing all these little tweaks to maximize performance but from looking at the specs for the i7 and testing I've done this past week my laptop seems to be performing as I would expect for the CPU and GPU. I generally followed the tutorials provided by Bob on YouTube with some slight modifications:

I am running the latest Windows 10 v1809
Latest OP Bios N1.05, EC 1.35.09
OP Control Center 1.2.2.8
Fan Mode = Gaming
Control Center Performance Mode = Equilibrium
Stock 1x16GB single-channel RAM
No CPU re-paste or anything (I have not opened the Laptop at all).
Plugged in via HDMI to an external 4K 60Hz monitor (both internal and external displays active in extended mode)

In ThrottleStop I undervolted the CPU core and cache by -0.135V and System Agent, Intel GPU, and iGPU Unslice all by -0.080V. I left BD PROCHOT, C1E, and Speed Step enabled as they were on by default. I did not set Speed Shift - EPP at all and left it unchecked. SIDE NOTE: I think Speed Shift might not be enabled by default on this laptop since when I open the TPL window in ThrottleStop Speed Shift is not checked (nor is Enable Speed Shift when ThrottleStop starts) and I do not have the little green STT text next to the Speed Shift EPP setting in the main window. Comparing to my HP Spectre x360 (i7-8550U, MX150), that has both the green STT text and Speed Shift checked by default in the TPL window (and grayed out so it cannot be unchecked). From my research it looks like this means the OP laptop does not have Speed Shift turned on out of the box but I could be wrong.

When playing Battlefield V using the MSI Afterburner/RivaTuner Overlay I am seeing the CPU power limits that others mentioned where it is maxing around 35W but the frequency is running pretty stable around 3.9GHz if I set the frame rate limit to 60 to match my 4k monitor (game is running at 1080p). GPU is around 1.4 to 1.6GHz. CPU temps in the 80s. GPU temps in the 70s. GPU utilization is around 100% as well. If I set the max framerate to 200 instead I do see the frequency fluctuate a bit between 3GHz and 3.9GHz at 35W and I get about 80 to 100 FPS during gameplay.

Am I misunderstanding something or is my system running at full performance for the hardware despite only pulling 35W? Based on the specs I see for the i7 and the GTX 1060 even if I was pulling more watts the frequency can't really go any higher. Is the idea that other similar systems are able to just sit at 3.9GHz continuously while playing the game and get better FPS?

Also, has there been a consensus yet that the 17" version doesn't exhibit this throttling because it already has dual channel RAM installed stock?

EDIT: It looks like setting the OP Control Center Performance Mode to Game Mode allows the CPU to pull up to 45W instead of 35W. When I set it to Game Mode the CPU frequency stays much more stable around 3.9GHz in Battlefield V.

 

That depends a lot on the framerate you are getting! The more FPS the CPU has to handle, the more you will tax it and the more power it will use! So imagine a 1080p 60% res scale Low Settings scenario on your GTX 1060. That´s CPU bound right there and it won´t be able to sustain 3,9ghz for long. Also providing you are using single channel RAM, it means the CPU will not be able to deliver all the FPS it could; on a CPU bound situation the memory bandwidth makes a big difference (up to 100% in some games).

Now, at 60hz, the cpu could even be running at 2,8ghz. That´s cake for any modern CPU! Even the Pentium Gold G5400 desktop CPU can sustain 60fps on 90% of the titles.

The importance of high clocks comes when you are using high refresh rate monitors -> 144hz/240hz and you want the max framerate as possible, thus taxing the CPU and making it downclock. When a downlock from 3,9ghz to 3,3ghz occurs, it is assured that the framerate will take a big hit, specially the 0,1% Lows! Even the average fps can come from 150 to 100, easily, and that´s very noticeable!

Games like Battlefield, Black Ops 4 or Quake Champions are very sensitive to clock speeds, and this is why on the previous page I said the 8300h is the right CPU for high refresh gaming on a laptop, because it can keep the 3,9ghz clocks in any situation; no downclocks, and uses way less power wich makes it not reach power limit.

 

When it comes to Battlefield though, at least recent Battlefield titles like 1 and V, a somewhat lower clocked hexacore definitely outperforms a higher clocked quad-core due to the threaded nature of the engine.

 

On Battlefield 1 yes, I doubt that happens on Battlefield V tho, as even an i5 8400 desktop CPU (3,8ghz 6c/6t) beats an AMD Ryzen 2700x 8c/16t.

And the 8600k gets same performance as an 8700k or 9900k. Source 1 - Source 2

i7 6700k, 7700k, i5 8400, i5 8600k were not even good options for Battlefield 1 as they would stutter (6 threads or 8 threads). Doesn´t happen now on Battlefield V! As long as you have more than 4 threads, after that is all about clock speed to determine the fps number.

 

I'm talking about Intel vs. Intel though. Ryzen loses in BFV (and most games) for reasons other than core count. Most current games won't scale much past 6 fast Intel cores.

In that first video he was GPU-bound most of the time due to 1440p.

I can tell you for a fact that the 8600K does not stutter in BF1, I was just playing it earlier today. You can expect FPS to be above 100 at all times and frame times are solid. Fast, low latency dual channel (not sure about dual rank) RAM also makes a significant difference.

 

My upcoming video will be perfect for you

Hope to have it done today.

 

I'm so excited to get my laptop. Mine should arrive at Walmart today but I won't be able to get it until Saturday. I shipped it to MS walmart near my parents while I live in AL. My tax is 10% here! Their's is 7%. Did anyone else ship to store as well to save the $8? I don't know why folks are worried about that warrenty sticker. At least for these initial few days. The Walmart employees would not even know the difference and they give you a refund before they ship it back. Also if they give you a hard time just go to a different store!

Well looks like we got our first Ram from one of these for sale! Anyone here? It's already got 7 watchers! Now is the time to sell these to get your money back on your other brand dual channel kits. I'm sure everyone is looking to get that second channel. There is also another goldkey ram on ebay right now, but it's not the 2666 from one of these laptops. I sure hope someone doesn't buy that for this expecting it to work.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Goldkey-16...h=item28714fc7be:g:y-IAAOSwTxhcGpgM:rk:2:pf:0

Bob thank you for making that up and coming video on gamecenter! I know I am going to need it!

 

Mine was supposed to come today but now isn't coming until the 24th. :'(

Let us know your thoughts when you get it.

 

Not to reply to my own post, but just for those wondering, I don't anticipate this being fixed anytime soon and the sleep problem was rather annoying, so I enabled hibernation instead, following these steps: https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=273202 ... with swap on an NVMe drive, it's rather instant, so it works for now to really put this thing to sleep (and turn the keyboard backlight off).

 

So far my 15+ is 10 days old. I let it run all night most nights and gamed with an uncapped frame-rate a usual. I've had the bottom panel off nearly 10 times for various testing reasons and it also tests the durability of the attachment points (screws and such) as the average consumer will never remove theirs even half that much over the life of the machine.

Not sure what else I can do aside from time to test durability, but so far so good.

The video coming up covers a lot of different things but you will likely have to watch this a few times as there's a lot of commentary. Some of the things discussed you are experiencing now, some not, and some folks will be overall, more confused lol. That's the nature of finding the balance of the "right" amount of info.

Bottom line there is only one major solution and the rest is on the user to get their heads wrapped around a properly configured laptop with the understanding of the following:
A proper fresh ISO install
What Windows build your are on in respect to the GC installed (lots of weirdness dating many months back here with many variables)

RAM explanation and performance evidence paying to respect to benchmarks and a CPU intensive title is heavily included in the video. It'll be well over 10 minutes long, big surprise lol.

There is nothing wrong with the machine unless you have something not covered in regards to this discussion. Everyone here that has an "issue" that pertains to this discussion, I and many others have been able to replicate it on our devices, dating back before the OP brand was even on our radar.

PL limits not associated with the 35w are going to then be related to the 8750h in that it is a power hog capable of nearly double its 45w TDP. It's not a problem, it's not a feature, it's just the nature of the beast. That too also adds to the inconsistency between one machine to the next and is also mentioned in the video. Fun times ahead!

 

Yep....just listed mine...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/GOLDKEY-16GB-DDR4-PC2666-260-Pin-SODIMM-Laptop-RAM-Memory/132894564297

 

BAM! SOLD IN 15 MINUTES!!!

 

Thank you for the reply, you are awesome!

I suspect this file is capable of setting other things in the bios/firmware, do you have any insight to what other settings can be altered with this OEMSev utility?

 

do we know for sure that we can load other vendor's bios/ec to the OP 15+ and revert back in case need to return?

or, is there certain bios/ec that doesnt allow flashing to other vendor's bios/ec that I need to watch out for?

TIA

 

I’ve already done all of that. BIOS and EC flashed with other Vendors as well as everyone’s GC software.

 

Thank you BOAT, with your blessing, I will try the "better performance bios/ec combo" listed on the first page of this thread and see how that does

I have dual channel RAM and latest OP everything (bios/ec/GC), on windows 10 latest, no repaste, undervolt -150mv, and on Lightroom export the 15+ still lags behind my unlocked bios and undervolted MSI GP63, and stock not undervolted Lenovo Y7000

p.s. and for those curious, I tried OEMSev setting 180W and 210W power adapter profile, I cant say I see any difference in real world performance (but XTU showed different power/current throttling graph during Lightroom export test, but the overall time it takes to export is still the same between 180w and 210w profiles)

to put some numbers for comparison, my tweaked 15+ needs about 2:40sec to export 73 super large Nikon D850 photos, the tweaked GP63 takes 2:20sec, and the Lenovo about 2:10sec in its stock form!

not sure what Leonovo did to it but that Y7000 is stronk AF

still trying to decide which one to keep, and in terms of price:

Costco Y7000 - $950+$15 shipping + tax
GP63 - ebay $850 no tax
OP 15+ - $800 + tax

@B0B may I pick your brain on the price vs performance based on my numbers as which would you keep between these 3?

 

The y730 on the shipped bios was a beast, then they limited it with the next two bios updates.

A lot can happen in a flash

It’s up to you. I like this Tong Fang chassis. Easy to work on, beautiful display and an enthusiastic community where you can find some fun tweaks.

Seems to suit me just fine