W230ST - The 13" We've been waiting for!?

For sure furmark stress system more and probably W230ST will be more noisy than in any game on heavy load.
During gaming fan is generating big amount of heat air, but it was predictable with so great components inside in this small 13.3" beast (i7-4700MQ & GTX 765M)
Trackpoint is very good, nice and very comfortable surface in touch. Click buttons are not loud, sound which they are generate is soft click, positive impression.
Overall this notebook is fantastic, of course there are:
pros like: noisy fan on heavy load, speakers might be better (Clevo should consider installing speakers like Harman Cardon like in Toshiba ,JBL from Dell XPS or DynAudio from MSI) is there any posibility to replace it ? Speakers are probably that same which used in P170EM/P150EM but without subwoofer.

 

Thank you for your quick review, I am really excited with this model . But is this normal to have CPU temp at 85+ degree ? I find that a bit high.

 

Yeah it's quite high under heavy load but tomorrow I will try repaste it again. I hope so this W230ST cooling system is good enough. Weird is that heatpipes are very long, there is long way till heat will be cooldown by fan. I'll test it more.

 

Finally a reachable BIOS chip position.

Can you please give us the exact measurements of the keyboard incl. hight (minus the 4 screw wholes)?

 

Thanks LightningPL. I'm planning on actually using dual mSATA RAID 0 with two Plextor 128GB SSD's. So hopefully I can confirm SATA III and how well it actually works.

 

If this rig is good as everybody says it is then would anybody object to me getting one?

 

Not sure if cooling has been addressed at all, I only see comments about fan noise. How are the temperatures while at idle?

 

See #1249 of this thread. There are some figures about temperature. I assume the max ones are under load and the min ones are idle temperature (correct me if I am wrong).

 

LightningPL,

Thanks for the great info. Can you also comment on the whether the touchpad has good palm rejection? I hate when I'm typing and then all of a sudden it goes somewhere else because my palms got close.
Thanks in Advance!

 

Now why can't they do the same on the P150EM.

 

Oh baby! The awesome updates are rollin in!!!

 

does anyone know if w230st will support dual core CPUs? gaming rarely requires the power of a quad core so trading off a little bit of multi-tasking prowess for less heat and longer battery life would suit me well.

 

I'm certain it will but most newer games absolutely makes use of a quad core, and a dual core won't give you much longer battery life since they consume about the same power at idle or low loads. Heat will be a little less, but not substantial.

 

Holy molly, that's great info. Actually the laptop has exceeded my expectations, so the only remaining factor will be price. I hope it won't be a killer.

I cannot wait til the end of summer though, I'm dying over here..

 

You can always preorder it now, it's possible in my local polish reseller XNOTE website: www.xnote.pl
Today I'm testing 2xmSATA 120GB SSD in RAID0 configuration instead of 1xSSD more info very soon.

 

So does any reseller in the US know that they'll be getting this model in? Is the mid-next month timeframe accurate as well?

 

Can you show the size comparison for the power brick?

 

Unfortunately not allowed to say any official release dates just yet. The moment we are I'm sure all the reseller sites will be putting them up.

 

Understood. The second all that info gets released, I'm totally on the bandwagon for a purchase.

 

as you wish:

 

funny how theres still an nda up in the us while private users are already playing around with the actual hardware in poland

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

The logic of companies, right?

I'm not sure if it's an actual NDA, just that we haven't been provided info on an official release date here on our sales team. That typically means we're being asked to hold back by Sager because we put stuff like that up right away. Since none of the other resellers are listing that date either though, that either means there isn't one just yet or they're asking it not be put up just yet for one reason or another.

 

I still don't get the intentional delay from one part of the world to another..

Keep us posted!

As for buying from Poland, I don't reckon shipping the laptop to US is possible through them, and even if it is it'll be very costy. I'd rather wait a bit ^^

 

You actually can ship from them (Poland) to the US but I would expect it to take several weeks to arrive.

 

LightningPL, could you possibly check in the Device Manager and see what brand track pad it has? I hope it has a Synaptic like the W350ST.

 

I don't need to check, it's Synaptics, same drivers like W350ST, P170SM, P150SM.

 

Hate to state the obvious, but it's ENTIRELY IDIOTIC as there's NOTHING to compete with it(in their lineup) ATM... kinda silly unless they're having cold feet about it and want outside "beta" testers... although I'd hazard that this is unlikely given that ASUS & MSI have similar notebook platforms OTOH presumably they also both(ASUS definitely) have more cash to absorb a whoops...

(I'm really being tempted to order one of these as well as even the 8250-S is still a bit large for some situations. I'd be even more tempted IF it were c. 11" ... as in SOLD.)

 

Poland is first world. Everwhere else 2nd/3rd world hehe

 

Australia will get them very soon as well, pretty sure they can ship to other places in the world as well.

EDIT: Shipping July 12 to Australia and the world. From $1349AUD.

 

It is sounding like Sager resellers will likely have them up for sale by July 15 in USA anyhow. They usually don't do "pre-orders", only post the configurators when the product is ready.

 

I believe it's done implicitly, as in having to wait additional time for a usual laptop that has just been released.

It doesn't matter anyway, they're free to take my money any day!

 

So no Thunderbolt on this laptop either?

 

So from the AUS pricing it seems like the w230st is going to start around 1200 dollars when Sager finally releases it. Right?

 

That's been my guess all along, but we won't know until it's officially posted.

 

https://www.aftershockpc.com/AFTERSHOCK XG15/
W350ST = Start from SGD1560

https://www.aftershockpc.com/AFTERSHOCK XG13/
W230ST (FullHD) = Start from SGD1679

Difference = SGD119

SGD119 = USD95 - USD100

XOTIC PC | Sager NP7352 (Clevo W350ST)
W350ST = USD999

Estimation :
If the differences is around USD100 or less.
W230ST = Start from USD 1099 or less.

 

Not how I price it but I did get same conclusion for price of. $1099

 

You can't use international currencies for determining cost of electronics. It's all based on volumes, market conditions, taxes, demand, etc.

 

I think you can if you have an existing comparative cost.

 

Possibly, but in any case I'll just wait until it's officially announced.

 

Hang on chaps, running between 45°c - 89°c - does anyone else have any concerns about this?

I am relatively new to gaming laptops, but I remember the concern over the w110er, which was 85°c+.

Will running at this temp damage the internals in the long run? I am looking to invest in a machine that I can rely on for around 3 years as a workstation (not for the latest game releases down the line), and ideally repurpose after that for something or other. Could anyone either put my mind at rest or give me some advice? I know the gpu and cpu can both run as high as 100°c, but is that healthy or is it a case of the light that burns brightest burns shortest?

 

It will be perfectly fine. 90C isn't desirable, but not unusual for a CPU. Many users with the W110ER 11.6" Clevo would run close to 90C frequently and been using the laptop for over a year now. Not to say I wouldn't want to try to reduce the temps a bit.

 

What are you doing to push such a high range of temps? Stress testing? Anyway, TJmax is 100c+ for a reason. Those temps are fine.

 

This is by far the #1 issue I have with my NP 8130.

 

Well it's 89°c max, but that's with the stock paste.
FYI, you can choose for your lappy to be delivered with ICD on both the CPU and GPU instead of the stock paste for a small price premium (~30USD). ICD's quite a good TMI IMO (well you can apply MX4/Gelid/etcetc. on your own as well ). It would help CPU and GPU temps. (MX4 on CPU-only already lowers the temps by 9°c)
And, we don't really know what's the ambient temps (try testing the laptop in 33°c and in direct sunlight , as well as inside an air-conditioned room. Quite a large diff with my MBA), or what's the laptop placed on (E.g. bed vs on a solid table) Lightning please enlighten us
These do influence temps!

And TBH, my MBA's CPU regularly runs at ~92°c on Civ 5 (ambient 30°c, glass table). (It runs 12°c lower in an AC'ed room, FYI)
Or when I'm using Code Saturne to do some CFD for hours.
Well, it's still running fine after >2.5 years at such high temps so at least for me, I'm not terribly concerned about the CPU temp reaching 89°c
If you still are, you could consider getting a cooling pad (e.g. Cooler Master U3), elevating the laptop's back (cheapest!) with something. Or get a 4702MQ with it, if it's an option. The 4702 is a tad slower, but rated for 10W less than the 4700.

Though, with the CPU further from the fan than the GPU does make me want to question anyone who tries to put a 4900MQ in it.....
(From LightningPL's post) ImageShack® - Online Photo and Video Hosting
The CPU heatpipe most probably physically touches the GPU heatpipe, and the GPU probably cools much better than the CPU. (temperature diff at CPU heatpipe is less hence lower heat transfer... blahblahblah)
And if you really want to game with a GPU OC, it's probably going to disable turbo on the CPU or perhaps might even throttle? (Someone confirm if possible thanks!)

 

Okay, quick (ED: Make that long) price comparison. Skip to the end for results and the estimated price (based on p170sm).
P170SM (equivs)
Specs = Base P170SM (on LPC) with dead pixel guarantee*. 1419USD (LPC)
Same specs on Aftershock (x17s): 2469SGD NOTE: YOU CANNOT COMPARE BASE SINCE THEY HAVE DIFFERENT BASE CONFIGS
e.g. x17s starts with 4gb ram, 500gb HDD, 765m, dead pixel gurantee

Equiv price on LPC: 1797.45 SGD (30/6, GMT+8)
Price difference: 671.55 SGD
Factors: GST (7%) --> Import Tax (on things >$400 in value), Shipping costs (not very cheap either), (being a builder like myth?)

I probably should bring in Myth's prices as well to make a better comparison on prices
1590.24 USD (2014.36 SGD) for equiv.... well, almost equiv.
Except for the differences written below (price equivalents given) and the Mythlogic Advantage ( https://www.mythlogic.com/mythlogic-difference.php)
of which: things like custom bios (for the black editions, not sure if w230st will get something like that) (See the most recent album: https://www.facebook.com/mythlogiccorp/photos_albums). Note: Aftershock also has it's own special schtuffs: https://www.aftershockpc.com/Main/About-Us/

*Something like this. Copypastaed from Myth since Myth makes it easier to do things like this thanks (All options that have none are deleted to save space_
Lucid Logix MVP Mobile Lucid Logix MVP 2.0 Mobile Increase your graphics performance, a $54.99 Value (Myth only. 69.66 SGD equiv)
Mobile Chassis MYTHLOGIC Nyx 1713-Black Chassis (Clevo P170SM)
Mobile Display 17.3" Full HD (1920x1080) Matte LED Backlit LCD
Dead Pixel Guarantee MYTH Pixel Perfect Guarantee
Monitor Calibration Free MYTH Professional Monitor Color Calibration (49USD on Xotic (LPC doesn't seem to have the option?), 35SGD (27.63USD) on Aftershock)
CPU Intel Core i7-4700MQ 2.4GHz, 6M L3 Cache, 22nm, DDR3L-1600MHz, Quad-Core Mobile Processor
Thermal Compound Free IC Diamond Thermal Compound (38 SGD (exactly 30USD) on Aftershock (comes with free repasting forever though), and free on LPC) ((both) For now. Traditionally, I do remember that ICD costs around 35USD as an upgrade (at least for the last two gens of Clevo/Sagers)
System Memory 8GB (2 x 4GB) , PC3-12800, 1600MHz SODIMM (Low Voltage) (Is Aftershock's and LPC's LV?)
Video Adapter NVIDIA 770M 3072MB GDDR5 DX11 Compliant Video Card
Optical Notebook Black 8X DVD+RW/CDRW Combo Drive
Hard Drive 1 750GB 7200 16MB Cache SATA Notebook Hard Drive
Keyboard Standard Backlit Keyboard - NON Chiclet
Network Card Onboard Gigabit (10/100/1000 Mbits/sec) LAN subsystem
Wireless Card Intel Centrino Advanced-AC 7260 2*2 802.11 ac/a/b/g/n + BT 4.0 350/867MB Total Bandwidth (Myth only! Other 2 are using the inbuilt card) (costs 54.99USD+9.99USD shipping on Ebay. The seller is from s'pore, though --> 69.66 SGD (for people in s'pore) or 82.31 SGD (for people in US)
Bluetooth Integrated Bluetooth 4.0 Only With Intel 2230/6235/7260 AND Killer 1202 Wireless
Operating System No OS, format drive only.
MYTHLOGIC Assurance MYTH Lifetime Assurance with Lifetime Labor + 1 Year Parts Warranty, 45 Day 2-Way Shipping Cont US
Phoenix Upgrade Plan Lifetime Phoenix Upgrade Plan (myth only)
FREE MYTHLOGIC T-Shirt Pick a size MYTHLOGIC Tribal T-Shirt - Medium (myth only)
MYTHLOGIC System Media + Mousepad MYTH Mousepad and System Media (myth only?? Kinda forgot if other suppliers do provide or not)

Price diff between LPC and Aftershock: 671.55 SGD + 38 SGD (ICD) (since it's free on LPC)
Price diff between Myth and Aftershock: 454.64 SGD + 69.66 SGD (wireless AC) + 69.66 SGD (Lucidlogix MVP 2.0's price according to Myth) + 38 SGD (ICD) + 35 SGD (calibration)
Price diff taking into account GST (7%): 293.12 SGD (2 d.p.) + 69.66 SGD*2 + 38 SGD + 35 SGD

As can be seen, the prices aren't really that similar. Meh.
But let's assume very wrongly, that the prices of all possible configurations and models (I don't have the time to compare all models and brainstorm all possible factors) are related by a constant factor.
Google gives me a 1.28(3s.f.) factor. (You know, this is actually very very good. I usually expect a higher ratio)
(1726/1.07) / ((2469/1.07)/(2014.36-69.66-38))) = 1332.91 SGD (aka Price (w230st) in SGD w/o GST / ((price of config above in SGD w/o GST) / (Price of Myth's config in SGD minus the value of them extras))
Again dumping currency conversion in Google gives 993 USD estimated price w/o tax WHAT... hmmmm... (note: if I do this calculation with LPC's price it'll be even lower :O)

I still expect it to be in the 1000-1100 USD range though. Kinda unsure if prices will change when w230st is released.
Things to factor in for price:
W230st: BL KB, IPS screen, additional 1x Msata/3.75G card, Weight (2kg vs 2.7kg of w350st) / Dimensions
W350st: Numpad on KB, 3 DDR3 mem banks, DVD drive (practically extra 2.5" bay), HDMI, eSATA

DISCLAIMER (always wanted to write one ): Calculations are subject to change in accordance to supply and demand, as well as fluctuations in currency valuation. I am in no way responsible for raising or lowering people's hopes prematurely. No offense is meant in any way to anyone, and this is a logical guess / hypothesis / whatever you want to call it.

 

Too many factors, you cannot just compare them like that. For example, many resellers tend to get their highest profit from upgrades while having minimum starting price, while others will go with the high starting price and somewhat lower priced upgrades... let alone the currency difference, taxes, etc etc.

 

Yep I kinda realised that but I do feel it's better to compare with less factors in the way, especially those that can be quantitatively determined. Which makes it less iffy of a logical guess

Thanks for your critique, I have realised I did not explain certain internal decisions for the sake of time (since I do have to get up early tomorrow). Here's my reasoning.
I did feel it's more reasonable to compare Myth and Aftershock since they are both Clevo builders (and have thorough burn ins etc. as well). However, Aftershock appears to use a pricing system with a lower starting price and pricier (mostly) upgrades as compared to Myth's more expensive base price. Yet, this is partially negated that there is a need for upgrades on both sides to reach the chosen base configuration that was used as a comparison. Hence, I do think it is rather reasonable to utilise such a comparison. Do note that this is not a guideline for pricing for sellers of the W230ST, it is merely a logical guess by an interested person who has already decided to get one in the near future. Speculation is after all, speculation and as the superfluity of speculation over the vast multitude of items of different kinds have shown, may very well not be reality.

 

i was wondering if there is a major performance difference between low powered i7-4702MQ and i7-4700MQ ? i wanted to know which one are you guys going for ?

 

I do remember there was a post about that somewhere around here....
http://forum.notebookreview.com/hardware-components-aftermarket-upgrades/721000-i7-4700mq-47-watt-vs-i7-4702mq-37-watt.html Here's a discussion
Intel Core i7 4700MQ Notebook Processor - NotebookCheck.net Tech Benchmarks of the i7 4700mq
Intel Core i7 4702MQ Notebook Processor - NotebookCheck.net Tech
Benchmarks of the i7-4702mq

I'll probably be going for the 4700mq, since I will probably need the 200mhz higher normal and boost clock rates for batch post-processing and some physics stuffs that do occur quite frequently (not to mention I do have a habit of having insane amounts of tabs).
I don't really see the point of the 4702mq (yet), unless I really see a noticeable dip in the power consumption on pretty much idle (i.e. taking notes normally in class).
But I guess, it depends. Do you want more mobility, or more power? How long will you be from a power socket? If, perhaps, you're like me, with a power socket usually within reach, the 4700mq is probably for you.
Though, I don't think the CPU power consumptions will really matter when gaming on the go

 

OK this is probably overboard on the specifics but:

I would be using it for CS6 - with multiple applications like Illustrator, Photoshop, InDesign, Bridge and Fireworks possibly simultaneously. And occasional gaming. There’s an extremely slim chance I may start video editing in the future but currently no plans for this.

It would be inside my desk cupboard about mid up on an open rack like shelf (maybe just two or 3 slats for the feet to rest on. Screen would be off and it would be plugged in to two high res monitors. The cupboard will have a large vent hole at the bottom and one at the top for air flow (with polyurethane dust filters). I live in the UK so room temp will probably be between 18 and 22°c? No AC.

When used on the move I will get a rubber foot or feet to raise the back as I have found this to be better than a cooling stand. Probably end up getting one though. I will never be using on my lap without one and definitely not a bed.

Thank you for the advice on the thermal gel. I will be ordering from Scan in the UK so will probably have to apply this myself...
As for the 4702 - I will probably stick with the 4700 and not upgrade to the 4800. I believe a powerful processor and 16GB RAM is important for what I want it for. So I keep telling myself.