*** Official Clevo x7200 and Sager NP7280 owners lounge ***

The Raid5 Saga:

Starting to be “cautiously optimistic” , things have been running quite well, no HD errors, and as a side benefit of looking at the event logs, I have tracked down and fixed some other issues . I think I am going to say if we have no issues by Friday this week, we can conclude that the XT’s don’t play nice in a Raid5 situation. If that is the case, I am not sure how Sager will proceed on this one…but in my mind that will be pretty definitive proof that the XT’s were the issue.

 

More succinctly we can say they didn't work in your setup/configuration on the x7200. No one from Seagate has come on record to say, "Sorry, RAID 5 won't work with Momentus XTs."

• It could be that the ICH10 controller is having problems with the XTs in RAID 5.
• It could be by not loading the drivers using F6 from OS install was the problem.
• Perhaps something happened while upgrading from Intel Matrix to Intel RST.

I'm not going to tear down my configuration to find out, but I would think some of the resellers may want to pick up this mantle, as it could really bogs down their support - allowing a configuration which is going to result in an unhappy customer, possibly returning the x7200. Think at how angry you were when this all started.

In any case, it has seemed to work out in your case, and here's to hoping things stay well.

 

MALIBAL, Aikimox, mythlogic, or any Clevo reseller.

Can you comment on getting the Style Note BIOS for the x7200? I still haven't heard anything from Clevo support. What is the latest version from Clevo? Is there a download-able flash utility of the x7200 BIOS.

I think I've found how to make a backup, but would prefer the "official" BIOS from Clevo instead.

 

You might check the below thread in the link below...

http://forum.notebookreview.com/sager-clevo/416916-clevo-bios-thread.html#post5300982

_

 

I donno.....I will take issue with a few points here:

if not doing a F6 load was the issue, I would still have issues with these drives

if something happened when going from matrix to RST I would still be having issues with these drives.

I will give you maby its that specific chipset and the XT's, but really the only thing that changed right now is the drives and all SEEMS well, granted I am going to let it go longer before I claim victory, but its looking more and more like the XT's are not good in a raid5 setup.

And TBH, I dont expect Seagate to come out and say that their drives are a issue in a raid5 config, especially on just my experiance, BUT Xotic has taken notice and they are persuing this with Sager....

Also of note, both Sager and Xotic have seen issues with the XT's in raid5.......granted not many because not many people run those drives in a Raid5 setup

 

babyhemi,
Thanks! Sorry I forgot you in the list for resellers.

One question... This thread looks like it contains a BIOS for the NP7280, not the plain Clevo BIOS. I was hoping there was a plain Clevo version with fixes not tailored to any changes Sager had requested. Is there such a thing as a "Clevo Style Note" BIOS?

 

Also, that list of BIOS's has a older BIOS listed for the 7280.....the one Sager has listed is newer

 

Possibly. But I'm pretty sure a system restore may have re-distributed the image across the new drives, thus creating a new layout for the RAID array. I don't know if that would have lost/fixed any problems with the data layout.

That might depend on the reputation of the company. I wouldn't think Seagate would want a PR black-eye. Perhaps by remaining quiet, they can create some kind of "plausible deniability" there is a defect with the drives and RAID 5. Regardless, I've never found covering up data or misleading / lying to the customer to be a good company strategy. Just own up to it, so people have the data and can plan accordingly.

It's good to know Sager is on it. I've used them for over 6+ years, and found them to be reputable. If Sager *does* find an issue, it would be great if they made the info public for the good of the general consumer.

 

Sager lists "05cs/ecflash7". The thread lists "V 1.00.05." Are these not both version 5 of the BIOS? Are they the same BIOS?

Would still feel safer if one of the Clevo resellers (not Sager, but just plain Clevo) could give me an update on the latest BIOS version and a download if it is available.

 

Yea they are the same, my bad.......I was looking at release dates and not what the files were.

 

One last possibility on the Momentus XT drives...

Perhaps the drives you had either one way or another were defective. Been reading the feedback at Seagate and Newegg. Seems like people are having significant problems with even single drives, and then their replacements.

Just one more possibility. Looks like replacing them with the "Scorps" was the best move.

 

My first post on this site.

I hate to admit it, but I have read 95% of the pages in this thread. I am finally ready to pull the trigger. I have a few questions for the current owners though.

Background: I travel a lot for work. A few muti-day trips a month at least. My work is simply word processing, and maybe watching a video clip or two or putting together a powerpoint. I am, however, an avid gamer. I have a vaio AW150 with a 9600m GT in it. I am in need of an upgrade! Skyrim and the new Total War have put the itch under my skin. I will be going from home outlet to hotel outlet, so battery life is not an issue.

So, for current owners:
1. Have the heat issues for some of the processors been resolved? I plan on getting the 990x to future proof it as much as possible.
2. Did the SLI Power supply fix work for dual gpu cards? Any shutdown problems since?
3. So, dual 485, or dual 6970? The performance difference seems minimal, and the 6970s are quite a bit cheaper. I will admit, it has been some time since I have had an ATI (I guess AMD now) card. Their old reputation is that they often had driver issues. Are the AMD cards well supported now, and do the 6970s perform well in this laptop?
4. Does anyone have any idea when SB desktop procs will be offered (perhaps by mid-summer)? If it is in the relative short term, I might get an 8170 now, and save this beast for later.
5. Does anyone have Morrowind will running on their 7200?
6. What is the delay between ordering and delivery now?

Thanks in advance.

 

So, i would like to know, what are your BIOS versions? Mine is 1.00.08. But i still don't know what are the changes with this one.

 

BIOS Revision: 1.00.04
KBC/EC Firmware Revision: 1.00.02

 

I would not expect any sandy bridge stuff in an x7200 successor until Ivy Bridge

The LGA1155 parts that are out now are mainstream stuff and not a suitable candidate for the desktop cpu toting clevo monsters like we have seen in the past.

 

Well my x7200 is 6 months old, I have to say it runs like a dream, never had problems with overheating or the PSU shutting off. Never had problems full stop. Only negative is its bulky when travelling, but hey its the power of a desktop.

 

1. Not sure about others, but I still have very high idle/load temps (64/95c) and at times throttling in some apps. I've pretty much given up on Xotic and Sager at this point since they keep telling me these are safe temps. As a last ditch effort, I'll be getting a 970 to try in hopes the temps reduce a bit.
2. I'm not sure what the power supply fix is you're referring to (other than getting two PSUs), but I would recommend getting any extra PSU with converter if you're going SLI and plan on OC-ing. On mine, a single PSU trips with my 950 at 3.4ghz and 485s at 650 core/1650 mem.
3. If I was buying now, I'd definitely get dual 6970s. While 485s will be a bit faster and have physx, they're not worth the extra $400 by any means. I have a grudge against AMD/ATI mobility products from a horrible driver support experience on an Asus w90vp so probably wouldn't ever buy one again, but it seems like they've cleaned up their act recently.
4. If you're referring to a SB "refresh" on the x7200, just speculation, but consensus seems it won't happen until Q3/Q4 this year at the earliest.
5. I have Morrowind running with practially every major mod known to man and it runs like butter.
6. Can't answer that... maybe a reseller could chime in?

 

well i remember in clevo bios thread there are x7200 style note bios 04/02 05/03

but sager one is
1.01.05
1.00.03

and the latest style note i have is
1.00.05
1.00.03

bcz im getting upgrade to 485m sli hope the old bios will read the card properly,otherwise have to flash to sager one and xuck with that cycling fan noise.............

 

If you are ordering one of these machines with a video card other than the 460M, (470M, 485M, or AMD 6970), then it should by the end of next week ship to you, that is if you order now or tomorrow.

If you are ordering this with the 460M, it may take a week more.
_

 

1) I also have the 990 and no heat issues at all. Idles at 50ish

2) I have the dual power supply and have never tripped off while running both

3) I have dual 485M's, opinion varries wether its worth the extra 400$ for them, the 6970 wasnt avaliable when I got mine, but TBH I probbaly would again.

4) No clue

5) Not I

6) I dont know TBH, call a reseller or two and ask

 

1. Is this just for gaming? Then the 990x is a total waste of money. Spend it on an SSD. Any 3.0Ghz CPU will not be bottlenecking.

2. It worked.

3. The dual 6970M is the only logical option.

4. Clevo has made no statements, on the SB refresh being on the table.

5. 10fps average @ 720p

 

Surely, you jest.

Thanks for the replies everyone. I appreciate it. Will probably buy one tomorrow...

Though a question on the 990x - I know it will be overkill now, but I am trying to future-proof. I would like to get at least 3 years out of the thing. Hopefully there will be some games finally support 6 cores in the next few years...

If I had my druthers, I would get a quad-core SB proc, but that option doesnt seem to be in the cards soon. Admittedly, I am not up to speed on all of the new procs, but the 990x seems to be the best insurance since it the the last best of that generation. Is there some other reason that it will still be overkill in 3-4 years?

I hate to admit it, but I still have a QX6700 in my desktop - sure it cost me 1k when it came out, but its OC to ~3.2ish and has lasted me just fine for 4 years (though SandyBridge is going to finally make me upgrade).

 

There no such as future-proofing, when it comes to CPUs and gaming. By the time 6 core CPUs receive industry wide support, your GPUs will be running games on low-medium settings at best, and it won't matter anyway. I'm not kidding.

Look at it this way. How many games, today, need a 3.2 Ghz Quad-Core to run effectively? Yeah, exactly. Even the i7-960 is future-proof for at least the next two years. You'll be able to pick up an extremely cheap i7-990x, by the time they matter for gaming.

If Intel isn't making more than one ultra-expensive, hexacore CPU per generation, gaming developers will never care about fully leveraging that power.

 

1. Power cord is too short, the part from the brick to the PC, so you can't add an extension (If I knew, beforehand it would have been a show stopper).
2. Sound volume is too low.
3. I thought the (very annoying) fan cycling was normal, would be nice to fix it. (and to shut the blue lights off.)
4. I love the rest...

 

1) The 990 isnt a waste, depends on what you want...

2) Agree

3) Not true...again depends on what you want.

 

We're talking about gaming performance. In what way is the 990x not a waste?

 

maximum gaming




LOveryL

 

OK, what game is the top 3 imags from ?

 

Don't know what your expectations were on this. The x7200's power cord that came with my unit from Clevo is about 46" (~117cm) from transformer to laptop unit.

FWIW, this is within 1.5 cm of the power cord of the machine I replaced, a Sager NP 9260 (Clevo D900C).

 

wwoods - Started this thread on notebook review.

Don't know if you give a rat's hind-end anymore, but some interesting feedback on other possible factors on factors for XT and RAID5.

Someone raised a good point, if AAM or other power saving features were used on one of the drives, perhaps it did not report in for participation during some query by RST. Then the RST drivers reported the drive as degraded.

Just a thought.

 

I don't think software developers would necessarily have to program specifically to take advantage of six core CPUs, they could just start designing software to automatically scale itself across multi core CPUs. With very powerful multi core CPUs becoming more and more prevalent, is it really such a stretch to imagine that software developers might want to take advantage of that with their future products? Look at Crysis, how long ago was that game made, and it still crushes most computers at its maximum settings. Crysis 2 will be out soon, and if they intend to hold their title as makers of the most hardware demanding software, they will have to have support for high end multiple core CPUs. I remember all my tech savvy friends way back in the day mocking the idea that anybody would need a 32mb video card, or 8mb of ram. What are you gonna do with that, work for nasa designing spacecraft?? You're wasting your money. Surprisingly, the software developers of the time found a way to utilize all that raw power. The software developers of today will do likewise.

 

Apparently this is extremely difficult and complicated to do....thus all the hard coded multi core optimizations

 

I tend to agree. May not be needed now, but it doesnt hurt to have the extra overhead for the future. If I get GPU bottlenecks in the future, I will buy new GPUs.

One last question. I read about a benchmark thread for these computers. It is somewhere on this site, but I will be damned if I can find it. Can someone provide a link? I would like a dual GPU comparision between the 485s and 6970s. Strangely, there is not one yet on the normal tech sites. Only 6970 v. 480s, or single GPU comparisons.

And Doodie, I believe we were both in the same 2old2play Halo clan.

Once again, thanks for the replies everyone.

 

No, but companies do need to start writing more write multi-threaded apps. This can be a bit time consuming in terms of development and quality assurance. Writing multi-threaded applications or apps with Inter-Process Communication takes time. As any good craftsman will tell you, it can be done, but things need to be carefully planned out and you must execute on that plan.

 

I'll whip anyone's butt on Space Invaders or Asteroids!

 

I wish you were hearing what I'm saying though.

By the time that extra power can actually be put to use (think 3 years)

1. The CPU will be available at a much lower price.

2. You'll probably be looking at a brand new machine anyway, because the advancement of technology. even a year from now, the single GPU machines will destroy what is currently available n SLI or Crossfire, at a much cheaper price.

It just makes zero sense to spend the money now, instead of later.

But, whatever, I digress.

 

This will always be true but by that logic you should NEVER spend your money because it will never be the best time to do so

 

Jumping in on this one...

If you have no objection to upgrading GPUs at a later date, then why not save a little $$$ and go w/ a non-eXtreme CPU.

Upgrading the CPU when bottlenecked would be no different than upgrading the GPUs when you feel you need to. If you're going to do mostly word processing and current day gaming (using no virtual machines, multiple OS C/C++ compilations, etc.), the CPU won't be your bottleneck at this point in time.

Just my $0.02.

 

JUst popped over there and posted........and by looks of things, Seagate admitted XT's are not raid friendly, but heh, I kinda knew that As for power saving issues, I would possibly agree, but the same thing on multiple drives ? eh......donno.

Now for a update....no issues so far. End update

 

Yeah, but now I'm scared for my RAID mirror! Never thought I would dig up problems with RAID altogether.

On the Seagate Support forum front (see post a while back), looks like I may have an answer from them shortly as well.

 

Keep us update on what Seagate tells ya.....I just sent Xotic support a email with a link to that post with the "don't use these for raid" comment.....verry telling.

As for your Array...you arent raid5, and everything I have herd from Sager and Xotic is the issues are confined to Raid5 with those drives.....

Now the question arrises, if Sager said these drives are not for Raid....and Sager is offering that option.....where do we go from here ?

As for the XT's I pulled, they are now happily sitting in other systems doin a fine job, I ram SMART tests on them and those drives are fine.......

so in conclusion:

XT's = fine (at least mine are, others seem to have issues...)
Raid5 = Fine
XT's + Raid5 = Bad juju

 

Talking about games im having prob with BFBC2 it keeps on hard crashing my bby tried almost every thing just now having talks with EA representativ its driving me crazy since MoH Tier 1 ,crysis ,MW2 ,Black ops ,SC2 ,all the C&C are running great
On a happy note just reinstalled win7 64 bit using USB stick 20 min later ready for drivers

 

I am gonna summarise your arguement.....it makes zero sense for YOU to spend the money now instead of later.

You are useing the same arguement people always use against high end, pricy systems...its a waste, its over priced...yada yada yada.....

The person spending the money makes the descision about wether its worth it to him/her.

Your opinion is valid to YOU but a blanket statement like that is just wrong.

I put that extra power to work every day, I run multiple VM's daily, and can bind each seperate VM process to a different processor, that is a HUGE win for me.

 

Yes it is true that the Clevo x7200-Sager NP7280 "fully decked out" is for those who want ( for whatever reason) "The World's Most Powerful, Fastest Laptop" right now...
_

 

Far too low . Enabling "Loudness Equalization" or using a third-party software helps a lot though.

Just a tiny opinion in this regard, I do not seem to experience fan cycling at all - the laptop is dead silent most of the time, perhaps the fan is engaged only after a certain temp value is reached. I was afraid that the x7200 fan is going to annoy me as well - yet, very surprisingly, this heavy duty powerhouse is, probably, the most quiet and unintrusive laptop I owned - and I owned quite a few. (I tend to keep room temperature around 15-16 Celsius though, so take it with a grain of salt)

 

My Alienware 9750 cord is 70" (just that 2nd part of the cord), my laptop before that, Dell Inspiron was 70". The NP7280 is only 48", and because of the laptop and brick weight, it needs the longest cord of all, but I'd be happy with 70".

 

Haha, I don't know how to read Celsius, 15 degrees sounds cold. My room is 70 degrees Farenheit. The fan cycles high/low even when idle/screensaver -- core temp (highest) reads 60-65 (I think that one is Celsius).

 

70f is about 21c

"70f to c" in Google gives you the conversion. Google is awesome for conversions like that lol

 

Ah - maybe that is the reason... My CPU temps are 47-49 when idle, so I do not get too much of a fan activity at all.

15 Celsius is 59 Fahrenheit

 

His main use is gaming, so so I gave him a GAMER's perspective. Period. The one thing you can't say, is that my opinion is illogical. Right? Am I factually incorrect?

The CPU will never be used, in the near future, for what he does. Why sugarcoat it, just because it zomg cool to buy the fastest thing available?

VM, rendering, data crunching? Of course. Gaming? Set the money on fire. Yes, it's my opinion but in the context of the discussion it's also the cold, hard facts.

But, obviously I hold no one check book hostage, so blow whatever you want, on whatever you want. Feel free to ignore my opinion, because it's not my money in the end. Hell, buy a Ferrari, just to drive on side streets, and pick up your kids. But please don't try to call me out, when I call a waste a waste.

It's not even that serious.