Official Sony Vaio Fit multi-flip PC Owners' Thread

The support I'm referring to is actually Sony Europe itself and the repair wuld take place at their in-house service center. So they probably have the disc already, but as the warranty doesn't cover software related errors, they suggested me to buy the recovery discs to make sure I wouldn't have to pay 215$ if I sent the laptop in and it turned out to be caused by software (in other words I could keep the disc). Not doing so would be a gamble, either it's a hardware problem and I didn't waste 55$, or it's a software problem and I have to pay up 215$ for wasting their time and to cover the shipping cost.

It is somewhat confusing, but I've had basically the same scenarios on my mind the entire day and I agree that #1 and #4 seem the best. If I have to pay for an SSD it won't be for nothing at least.

I haven't decided which SSD I'd get but I took a quick look at Samsung's SSD and they offer three years warranty on their SSD and it doesn't really matter if I have to send it to Sony or Samsung if it fails in the future. Of course it'd be important yet again to know exactly what fails, but the next time I will have the recovery disc.

So I'll probably get the recovery disc first. And maybe the SSD as well, I haven't decided yet. But as I said before, I was planning to get one even before the laptop "broke". I just hope Sony would still accept it if it turns out it's the motherboard.

By the way, just to make sure: Does it matter if I have an SSD instead of the shipped HDD when I use the recovery disc? Because I mentioned this method already when I first spoke to the support and the guy I spoke to said the hardware had to match.

 

Not to worry about the Recovery install to SSD : it works. That's how I did mine and others here have done the same. "The hardware needs to match" doesn't include the internal drive, fortunately for us.

OK then. About SSDs : a lot of folks here have installed Samsung 840 Evos and Crucials (M500, M550 or MX100). I believe one or two have installed Seagates (SSD). If you are going with a drive smaller than 512GB (or 480GB), the Samsung EVOs are probably the fastest along with the Crucial M550. 480GB and above : you get equal speeds from the EVOs and all Crucials basically. Around here, the best deal for a 512GB SSD right now is the Crucial MX100. Just remember to make sure the SSD you buy is a 7mm thick drive, not 9.5mm (9.5mm SSDs are rare though).

If you do go with #1 and the Recovery install (to original HDD) fails, you could still send it in for a warranty fix (probably a new HDD). If you swap the drive and end up needing warranty work anyway (motherboard for example), you would just need to put the original drive back in because Sony would probably refuse to work on it with a different drive from the original. We have had members return Flips that had been opened (for more RAM or drive swaps) and no one has reported problems with Sony about this when the original parts are back in.

Let us know how it works out for you... and maybe we can help with the SSD swap as well.

 

So a friend of mine was quite impressed by my Flip 14 and is now seriously considering purchasing it, or at least one iteration from the 13/14/15 range. Anyone in the US here who'd know where these may still be available? Specifically in the NYC region. I remember someone mentioned they got a refurbished one from BestBuy. Is there a better solution than calling every single BestBuy or Sony Store in the area and asking for availability?

 

Can't help you with that, chuchugaga, but here in Germany it's equally worse.
So good luck with that - but if he is lucky to get one: Make sure you point him to this forum, too! ;-)

 

Of course! though I suspect I will become the victim of all his queries, seeing as I've bombarded this thread with enough questions of my own

 

@chuchugaga : I read your question yesterday and started to *work on it*, but I had to leave, had a big day, etc... so here I am with news no better than Calibrator's I'm afraid. Here's what I did : checked the US Sony store and found no traces of any VAIOs upfront, so I did a search on the site, only to find that all VAIOs are *discontinued* and to call them for suggestions on alternatives (= their new tablets). Then I checked the Canada store because I remembered seeing Flips on it very recently still ; they still have VAIOs listed on their home page, but when you browse through them, none are available online and you get that *Find a store* comment. And then I got a popup from a sales rep to chat, so I did. Asked if there were Flips anywhere in the US ; she started checking around and finally told me no, no more Flips, all discontinued. So I mentionned the Canada store still had them (sort of), she asked around again and told me IT were working to remove all traces of them as they did for the US store. So there... though I suspect some stores may still have one or two, but then you'd need to go on a hunt.

I've been keeping an eye on BestBuy (Canada) for months, and they stopped selling the 13 and 15 Flips roughly 2 months ago. They did offer the 13 Duo up until a week or two ago, but that's now gone as well.

Good luck...

 

I always maintained the opinion that Canadians are an awfully helpful bunch of people since I visited Canada a quarter of a century ago.
You just strongly confirmed that my opinion is still valid. Here's one to you, Sir! :thumbsup:

 

Mark - that's an awful lot of hassle to go through! Thanks for the info. I bought my Flip when it was already discontinuted. But I called up the store nearest to where my relative was living (who eventually bought it for me) and they said they had six left in stock. They even sold it for $1000 instead of the listed price of $1150 because they were keen to get rid of it.
I should mention that my friend does not mind a refurbished Flip either, so perhaps there are stores like Bestbuy who would have those but not list them explicitly on their websites?

 

Don't suppose anyone knows if the stylus buttons are able to be remapped with hotkeys or anything useful for artist applications?

 

I think the outlet might be your best bet. Here in Norway they've been available up till now - but when I went there just now they were running 25% off all refurbished VAIOs, and none were left.

As nice as the Flips are though, there seems to be as good or better options out there (or just around the corner) without all the hassle. The upcoming HP Envy x2 13.3" and (tada!) 15.6" with Core M looks very interesting (a bit of uncertainty about which pen though). Take a look over here: http://surfaceproartist.com/blog/20...ive-and-stylish-consumer-products-for-holiday

 

You probably have already seen/discovered that you can't do that in the system settings (only connect the buttons to the two default Sony apps, which I disabled immediately).
While I haven't done extensive research on that topic I *can* confirm that graphics apps often already work with those buttons. I use Clip Studio Paint (US name = Manga Studio) and it supports those two stylus buttons out of the box, for example.

 

The big HP would be the one I'd be interested in if I hadn't gotten a 15" Flip. According to the sparse info I read about two weeks ago (which is the one you linked to) it's supposed to be a bit slower and it maxes out at 8GB RAM (which isn't really bad, though).
It remains to be seen, though, if the 500GB hybrid drive is the only option or if there are also SSD variants - or if the drive is user-replaceable.
A new PC/notebook/hybrid without an SSD is pretty much "ancient" to me now! ;-)
On the plus side the CPU, while a bit slower that the Haswell i5/i7, should use significantly less energy which *could* mean a potentially less irksome experience at times (I suppose it still uses a fan).

 

I see a few Sony Vaio Flip 14A if you do a general search in Google.

Refurbished...
At Blinq.com for $623.19

In ebay for $499.95 and $699.99


New
Amazon for $1199.00
another for $999

TS

 

Thanks Calibrator. I've not travelled a whole lot, but I have heard similar comments and it always puts a smile on my face. Ther must be some truth to it, though having been on computer help forums for just over 10 years now, I've met helpful and wonderful people from all over. This forum included.

No hassle at all ! I've gotten pretty efficienty at searching online, and chatting with sales or support reps is always interesting and mostly fun
As twospirits points out, there are Flips to be found out there if you look hard enough ; with a bit of luck, you'd find a good one.

@KjetilV : I hadn't seen the new Broadwell (Core M) Envys. They could be a nice alternative indeed, Thanks for the linky !

 

Tried Photoshop, Zbrush, Mudbox and none let me assign the stylus buttons. Whereabouts in Clip does it let you change them?

 

1) Enter the "File" pull-down menu and then into the "Modifier Key Settings".

2) Scroll the list down, there are several settings related to the mouse, the pen and the touch screen.

3) There are two settings that affect the two keys on the standard Sony pen:
-> The round button (the one nearer to the tip) is the "Right click" (identical to the right mouse button)
-> The oval button next to it is the "Tail switch"

4) By clicking on the two big buttons next to "Right click" and "Tail switch" you can define the behaviour of the two pen buttons and assign commands/tools (use "Change tool temporarily" and then select the tool you want).

 

Anyone know if the Vaio Flip 13 supports AptX?

 

Hi Xero,

Google isn't being kind on this subject. I don't have an Apt-X device to test with, but if you do... then have a read here :

APT-X. HQ Audio over Bluetooth Now on Ultrabooks « UltrabookNews, Reviews and the Ultrabook Database

 

Well I guess the Flip 13 doesn't support AptX then since I do not get that message on my laptop (but I do on my PC). Oh well.

 

It's great to see not everyone buying into "one-size-fits-all" at least. As far as I understand the Core Ms will for the most part be slightly faster than the i3 Y-series - but with the ability to run without a fan. As well as the i5 runs in balanced mode at 800MHz I'd reckon that could be good enough - especially when it can do some pretty fast bursts (as long as they're short)... and if that's not your cup of cake, maybe the one below would be better : )

... and just to wet your appetites a little more (note Core M this time) - it seems Vaio wasn't down and out. Take a look at this thread. Quad-core with almost full Adobe RGB in a small package. Perhaps it's a good thing they're now a smaller entity better able to search smaller markets than what Sony could. Hopefully they bring it to market, are successful and able to expand to the rest of the world again (and maybe they'll make a 17" version some day too : ).

Learned something new from this thread again! Not exactly sure what I would change it to though (apart from swapping the eye-dropper for TAB... but that it seems I can not do). What did you end up changing it to?

... a bit giddy after playing with the new Adobe Illustrator touch mode today. Fantastic interface. Had really given up on Adobe, but today, finally it seems somebody other than Celsys is bringing us a little part of the future. Has anyone successfully been able to run Illustrator with the GPU though? It does work turning on GPU preview, but for anything other than zooming in and out it's much slower than having the CPU handling it - on my desktop it's buttery smooth though.

 

Didn't somebody post a while back that other styluses work with the Flip as well? Like the Surface pen? Is that true?

 

@twospirits: Really helpful of you. One slight correction, and some better news, regarding the units available from Blinq.com. The model for $623.19 is actually a used model, not refurbished. The good news is that as of this writing, there are three refurbished models for $688 and it's pretty easy to find 10% off coupons for Blinq (sorry, can't find one presently with quick search). As of this writing they are showing 3 of the refurb units available and I believe they are the last of the Sony refurbs based on my past experience with Blinq. That's a very good prospect as I have purchased many refurbs from Sony in the past and they have looked brand new as well as having updated drivers and any early stage "kinks" in hardware replaced with updated or better working hardware. I was about to be the bearer of good news by citing this link and then I saw twospirits' link. As it happens - don't hate me now! - they had one Open Box model - also for $688 - and I snatched it up - before even seeing this post. At their best, I find Open Box models the best after new because they are generally purchases that were returned barely touched, but with the box unsealed so they can't be sold as new. Because they haven't gone through the refurb process, they might have issues that will have been sorted and repaired in the refurbs. On the positive side for OB models: Sony will honor the full factory wtty for them as long as they haven't yet been registered by the initial buyer which is about 95% of the time because these units by definition have barely if ever been even fired up but with Sony's (and Best Buy's) liberal return policies people buy on a whim and think the better of it and return them for full refund within 14-30 days, depending on original seller. The reason you know they've barely been used is because even these units are inspected and tested and will not be offered as "Open Box" unless they're found to have been barely or never used; if they have significant wear they will be classified as refurb, put through the refurb process and sold in generic packaging and only waranteed for 90 days.

One more thing (I know a good bit about these because I've purchased quite a few from the Sony Outlet when Sony still made Vaios and I've purchased numerous items (laptops, tablets, phones) from Blinq and have always been pleased with their merchandise quality, best prices around and superb customer service which includes 30 day unconditional return in which they even pay for return shipping, even if you're only returning the unit because you've changed your mind about it, not returned it due to problems. You really can buy from them with virtually no risk and if you find something minor that's not 100% perfect (eg, I had one - a Samsung AB9+ with a battery that initially registered as 5% depleted and they took an additional $150 off the price which lowered an open box top configuration model (then unavailable new for less than $1,799) for a net price of $1,025. Been living for that particular unit for 4 months now and it is flawless, still salable for a $400 profit.

Good luck to all. If for any reason I'm not wild about my Fit 13 (i5, 8GB,128GB [replaceable] SSD) I will offer it up here before returning it to Blinq for a refund. I recommend monitoring the Blinq site, as they get new stock daily and, once they've acquired a few units of a particular model and it sells well, they tend to expand their supply through agreements with both retailers and manufacturers. Best of luck.

 

Well, to be honest, it's both my increasingly worse sight and my big hands that forces me to 15+" displays/touch digitizer screens... ;-)

Right now I'm pretty satisfied but I'm sure we'll see some sick Win10 tablets next year!

I'm sceptical about 17" tablets. 15.x" is already pretty big, bulky and heavy for a tablet and I don't see masses of people carrying even bigger/heavier stuff.
That's not to say that there isn't a use for them! I expect graphics tablets in that size like the Wacom Cintiq Companion, only bigger and for stationary use.
Similar to the 20" and 21" Sony AIO PC...

I haven't decided, yet, if I will change or keep the default pen settings but the pen wasn't the reason I found out about the settings in the first place: It was the touch behaviour that motivated me, like I described in another post. I wanted to be able to smear on the canvas with a single finger and pan/move the canvas with two fingers and I wanted to access the touch menu - just like the female Japanese artist did in that CSP youtube video (which was recorded with a Vaio Tap 11 but that uses more or less the Ntrig tech).

I don't use those apps but I'd like to have a version of Lightroom that is better adapted to hi-dpi displays and the touch/pen digitizer.

 

The Surface Pro 3 pen works very nicely - arguably better than the Sony pen. As a low-cost alternative you could get the HTC Scribe, not as nice but still useful and a good backup. The nTrig pens from the Asus Taichi and Acer R7 also works. The ones that won't work are Wacom pens like the one that came with the Surface Pro 1/2.

I'm a bit afraid me previously self-imposed limit of upgrading at the earliest every 3 years might not be able to hold any more : ) Windows 10 makes me a bit nervous though, but hopefully they'll pull through in the end and not send us back in time.

I wouldn't think masses of people would be carrying them around either, but hopefully enough. If someone really put in the effort I'm sure they could make it pretty light. When a Surface Pro 3 can be me made at 800g, I'd imagine one could make a 17" at 1600g. Like you mentioned though - what I'm really waiting for (and the years go by ...) is a huge one, give me something in the 30" to 40" range for my desktop so I can have basically the table as my screen (make the screen passive as well to make it even less realistic : ).

Oh wow - didn't know you could do that. That is a pretty amazing feature, and to even be able to configure it on a per brush setting.

 

My 15" Flip must last two full years since purchase (end of February which was great as most patches were already out and Win8.1 being stable) to rectify its costs to me.
While I'm pretty satisfied with the Flip I *do* see some things I'd like to be different. The thing I'm most annoyed with right now is the viewing angle of the hi-dpi screen when I use it as a drawing tablet as I hold my head in a 45 degrees stance.
In normal (notebook) use I have no problems as I use it in a certain, fixed position. The same applies when I hold it like a "standard tablet" (with support by my lap/legs). Then I enjoy the great resolution and the fine colors.
While I knew that LCD screens still aren't perfect I *did* expect more from the IPS LCD built into the Flip.
There are definitely displays with better viewing angles out there and for a drawing tablet the viewing angles are IMHO a bit more important than other parameters.
This is in fact one experience I had to get over a longer period of usage.

Also, my Flip was a compromise from the get-go as I'm now in a job-related commuting phase for a certain time period and I wanted a mobile all-in-one device, including a full notebook PC. This phase will have hopefully ended by mid-2015 so I'll take a hard look at the Christmas season 2015 to see what new devices come to the market. I'm pretty sure my next mobile PC will be a large tablet!
When (*if*) I buy it in early 2016 or later it will again have all drivers patched up and Win10 will be a stable system by then - and so I don't really worry about Sony not supplying Win10-drivers for the Flip (which is a definite possibility!). Win 8.1 really runs well right now - with the "Classic Startmenu"(?) add-on - of course. ;-)

So tablet specs do/will I need?

A full Windows PC, a 15.x" display is fine but for drawing I want better viewing angles as described above and the tablet must be lighter, perhaps 3 pounds. The 15" Envy comes close but is only 1080p. I'd like an OLED display but I don't expect one in a Windows PC in early 2016...
The trade-off I would accept are soldered-on RAM and SSD chips - but the battery must be user replaceable! A device with a fixed battery is a "disposable product" to me and I'll certainly not buy an expensive tablet (price isn't an issue as long as quality and performance are met) and throw it away when I can't even install third-party batteries in it! Perhaps I'll use my Flip only as a "pure" notebook in three or four years from now but I'll definitely make sure that the battery works!

I agree and I expect much lighter "bigger" machines thanks to improvements in battery tech and reduced power consumption. We already see that happening and in two, three years we will see machines that we can hardly imagine right now.

A 40" table display is sexy and I always wanted such a display desk since the movie TRON - from 1982 ! ;-)
When I saw one displaying a "pen & paper" RPG campaign ( on youtube) I saw many possible applications for it - but this is a niche product and the ones you can actually buy are very expensive so, realistically, smaller machines are the way to go, at least in the next several years.

The new Surface Pro is a nice machine but it meets a lot of compromises, like the sealed case as is common with other tablets. Still, there are tablets out there where the battery can be changed and the device isn't much heavier or thicker.
The same was true with the generation before it: When I compare the Surface Pro 2 with the Vaio Tap 11 - two comparable machines - then I would always get the Tap 11 as it can be disassembled quite easily (*if* I could live with the tiny screen, that is! ;-)).

 

Oh man... that's a nice prototype. Would be really nice to see this machine hit the streets as is (or close to that) with a full power Core i7 4760HQ (quad with multi-threading), PCIe SSD and ready for 16GB of RAM. And the big res screen of course. According to one source it would sell for roughly $1900 if it makes it to market. That's an understandable price for such a beast. The first "Power hybrid" ? I think so... hmmm..
(battery life probably sucks though, but hey..)

 

About Windows 10. I installed the technical preview a few days ago, as a virutal machine (VMWare Player). It's no large departure from Windows 8.1, really, except that it has a *better* Start Menu. Better but far from perfect, ; hope they enhance it for the final version. I do like the fact that they've finally buckled under the pressure of Desktop enthusiasts by making Metro an option, not an inevitable insult to those who work on non touch machines. For touch devices, one should also be able to tweak Win10 for optimum usability.

I spend most of my time on non touch machines, for now anyway, so I also use a third party shell ( Classic Shell in my case) for W8.1 and the feel is very much W7.

Upgrade time for me will probably come when SATA Express and/or M.2 PCIe drives and controllers are well established, along with DDR4 of course. Should be at least a year from now.

 

@Calibrator: OLED would be nice! At the top of my list would be less jitter at slow speed from nTrig (or better accuracy from Wacom) and longer battery life. USB 3.1 would be nice so I could make do with a single charger for everything, and HDMI 2.0 so I could hook it up to a 4k TV. None of this is very important though…

Mostly I want improvements in the applications - more intelligent software that understands what I want to do without me having to click on 5 buttons. The visions Adobe put forward the other day was very tempting with their first minor steps in Illustrator being a good start. Manga Studio is brilliant as a stop-gap between the old and the new - but it's not an end point, and the Modern version of OneNote was also very nice, but I'm getting impatient for the next step.

Do you really get better screens than the Flip on a laptop/tablet though? Comparing it to an iPad 3 and an Acer W511 they both behave similarly. At something around 45 degrees they loose a bit of brightness and the color temperature becomes ever so slightly tinted towards blue - never struck me as a problem though.


@Mark: Hopefully they'll be able to ditch a bit of the thin and light fashion - make it as thick as the cooling requires and as heavy as the it needs to be for good battery life (within reason of course : )

As for Windows 10, I just hope Microsoft keeps their eyes on the future, one where touch, keyboards, mice, pens and even speech can work together and you can pick whichever is the best tool for the task - it would be incredibly disappointing if the touch environment took a step back from where it is today.

 

hi it depends on the hardware (intel chips can work witrh aptx) and the right software!

I fpund this way to get aptx working when using the right software/treiber with some intel hardware:
TechNICK etc

 

Yes - but we shouldn't make the mistake to assume that *every* OLED display is equally great (similar to LCDs being not equally good in quality). Also: Newer OLED panels are much better than the ones from 2012 (like in my Note 2) - which weren't perfect but already very nice.

Perhaps not that important but these are features that will automatically get better with time:
- 4K - with 60 Hz! - should be supported by Broadwell and newer. I don't need a 24 Hz 4K mode as it's only good for movies and too slow for desktop use (not even speaking of modern 3D games because of the bad performance). 3K as in the 15" Flips is IMHO already good enough for normal viewing distances, though. 4K won't show much benefit on the built-in screens but would be valuable for hooked up monitors/TVs!
- USB 3.1 is very new and this is also mostly a "2015 feature". It *will* come.
- Digitizers will only get better but we'll see if they continue to stay in consumer devices or get resigned to "artist hardware" (graphics tablets, specialized tablet computers...). It's also great to see some solid Wacom competition in the form of Ntrig now!

I agree in general to this. The personal computing era is still young, though, with about 35 years now. Compare that to the thousands of years hammers and saws had to evolve! ;-)

However, Manga Studio / CSP is more of professional work horse and certainly not a product for everyone. It definitely has a learning curve but there are more accessible paint programs out there - but this usually comes at a price: Less features.
In other words: Don't expect Manga Studio / CSP to get much easier in the future - either learn it or get a different product.

The problem I have with Adobe software is that a) their stuff is often very custom with their own GUI conventions & miniature fonts sizes and b) their product/price structure is often either "Get the whole bloated professional shebang for oodles of cash!" or "Get a severely crippled home version for cheap!". The strategy behind that is clear but they offer nothing in between.
And instead of them having something for the "amateur middle ground" they now practically force people into subscription...

The one exception they have is Lightroom, which can be used by amateurs and professionals alike - for a very affordable price. I'm loving it for its thought-out workflow, feature set and expandability (using 3rd party software) but it seems to me that development has slowed down to a crawl with only minimal improvements in each new version - and for that I don't pay $80 a year (upgrade fee). IMHO they are in a "milking phase" right now and as long as my camera doesn't break I'll stay with the old version.

My point is that there *should* be even better displays - and that there *could* be better ones!

But it's ultimately the same as with high-end monitors: If you want quality you have to pay.
Example: I use a 24" EIZO screen at home which naturally came at a price - but it was well worth it to me. It has an S-PVA LCD panel with very good contrast, quick enough for games, colors aren't super-accurate as it isn't a DTP monitor but good enough and the viewing angles are way better than the ones on the Flip (not only because of the panel but also the more power-hungry CCFL backlight).
Now it's very hard for me to choose a better (bigger) display that fulfills my needs and I rather way another year instead of buying overpriced crap.

But, again, I consider the 15" hi-dpi Flip display a great display - but not 100% perfect for my needs (maybe 90%?).
I'd like to have better viewing angles and that's where I see significant room for improvement, even though it's an IPS panel.

The iPad3 was hailed for its image quality when it came out - in March 2012. That's 30 months from now and there have been steady improvements in display tech. Take a look at the newest LCD and OLED tablet displays! Not only has the resolution increased to "Retina" level or higher in most machines but color quality is much better now and many manufacturers offer newer panel tech: "Super-LCD" "IGZO" etc.

If the Acer W511 only looses a "bit of brightness" then it has a good panel in this regard (I don't know the machine personally) but my Flip display rapidly gets half(!) as bright. The solution can't be that I adjust the brightness all the time, depending on how I look at the display! The solution is a better display - in another device - sometime...

And, yes, there is surely a subjective factor involved and I don't want to blow it out of proportions. After all, I bought the Flip *after* I had seen it in stores and didn't notice a severe problem (yeah, I know: in stores, where you really can't judge displays, but this was my only life-like experience prior to the purchase...).

So, ultimately, this all boils down to two questions:
a) Would I buy the Flip again, after all my experiences and my current opinion? Yes.
b) Do I wait for a lightweight 15" Windows tablet with OLED screen and digitizer? HELL YES!
;-)

 

Hi guys....this is my first post in this forum..Im in market for new hybrid laptop ...
Im from India and Sony flip 15 & lenevo yoga2 13 are my only options..
links are as follow:

Buy Lenovo Yoga 2 Notebook (4th Gen Ci5/ 4GB/ 500GB/ Win8.1) (59-428504) Online at Best Prices In India | Flipkart.com

SVF15N12SN : VAIO® Fit 11A/13A/14A/15A : VAIO™ Laptop & Computer : Sony India

Im personally ln love with sony flip15 ..Although budget is not issue but deal on lenovo is good...sony will cost 1131 US$(69000 indian Rs) and lenevo 877$(53500 indian Rs)..
Im okay with fan noise issue..
Sony flip is bit hard to acquire here too..but i have found one item..I request all esteemed owners for suggestion on this..
Im going through early posts but im in urgent need so kindly reply..Thanks in Advance

 

You either fall in love with a Flip - or you don't. There really is no middle ground...

Both have only 4GB of RAM and the Yoga has only a 500GB harddisk so that's one reason (apart from the Sony brand name...).
On the Flip you can also upgrade/replace both the RAM and the HD if you want to some time in the future but I don't know about the Yoga.

Then you automatically don't have the Flip problem numero uno! ;-)

That would only be about 30,000 people - world-wide... ;-)

Forget the early posts in this thread - they were written about the same time the machine was just announced but nobody had one, yet.
Begin to read posts starting at the end of October 2013.

With the newest patches both machines should be more or less problem-free (unless you get one with faulty hardware, of course).
In my opinion the Yoga is a bit too small at 13" - but my eyes aren't the best any more without glasses.
I also don't like the hybrid construction of the Yoga (which other manufacturers seem to adopt, too), I'd rather have the flipping screen of the Vaio.
The keyboard of the silver Flips *can* be hard to read depending on the ambient light because of the backlit keys. On the other hand silver Flips don't show smudges as clearly as the black models.

 

To complement on what Calibrator has posted :

I'm not very familiar with the Yoga line, but my quick research on that unit tells me it has no digitizer ; I think it's the Thinkpad Yoga Pro that has a digitizer... but I could be wrong. If true though, anyone interested in drawing would be much better off with the Flip.

About hard drives : not only is that Flip's drive bigger (1TB vs 500GB for the Yoga), it is also a hybrid drive so faster to boot than the Yoga's. The Core i5 on the Yoga is faster by 0.1Ghz (1.7 vs 1.6 for the Flip), but that's negligeable in my book.

Graphics : that Flip model has the nVidia GeForce® GT 735M with 1GB DDR3 of dedicated memory + the onboard Intel chip (Optimus), which might be of interest to you depending on your needs. The Yoga has onboard graphics only.

Comparing the two is difficult, really.

 

If you had to buy the sony flip 15 again now (october 2014) where would you go to get a good deal on a sony flip 15?

http://www.blinq.com/detail/compute...Iv5CG25uzLEmu8apm32WOCcGaLSXkVhr2cRoCTC_w_wcB

It lists digitizer support. not sure I believe that. do all flip models have digitizer support or are some just touch screens?

 

I can't say where you can get good deals for a Flip as I'm living in Germany but I can't answer your second question:

*All* Flips have both a touch screen and a pen/stylus digitizer - regardless of the size (11", 13", 14", 15.5") - because it's the same module that supports both input variants, developed by a company called "Ntrig". The competing technology from market leader Wacom works differently and only supports digitizer input but not touch screens. It's also bigger if you done right and probably more expensive, which is why newer machines often sport Ntrig technology...

Here's the catch: Most Flip models, especially the cheaper ones, didn't come with a stylus and therefore many dealers didn't include the digitizer in the respective feature lists (probably because some angry customer would sue them)!

So the only thing you need to use the built-in digitizer is a compatible stylus - but thankfully you don't need the special Sony stylus as other products work, too, and the Sony Stylus is now hard to get, too, as Sony stopped selling them.

An example would for a compatible stylus would be the one for the Microsoft Surface Pro 3 but there are indeed more recommendations in this thread (I recall a cheap stylus from Acer). Don't get a stylus made for older Surface tablets, though, as they won't work - they use Wacom technology!

 

Thanks.

If I do want to get a 15 inch n trig convertible laptop for a good deal, where would you guys go? What do you think of the link I posted?

Sony VAIO Flip 14" Touchscreen Laptop i5 8GB 500GB Windows 8 (SVF14N13CXB) - BLINQ

I am willing to go down to 14 inch if I can get a significantly better price for the same amount of power

For example how do I know if this model
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SONY-VAIO-F...64414566?pt=Laptops_Nov05&hash=item4188962166

actually can use n trig

is the core i7 sony flip 15 significantly faster than a core i7 thinkpad yoga?

 

As Calibrator has already pointed out, ALL Sony VAIO Flip models have the N-Trig digitizer layer built into the screen. You may see the words "VAIO Fit" as you search, but be careful with names, because :
1) The VAIO Flip line is also called VAIO "Fit multi Flip".
2) The VAIO "Fit" only line (not "Fit multi Flip") has touchscreens but NO N-Trig digitizer layer.
So... as long as the word "Flip" is in the description, you know it has the N-Trig digitizer.

Are there other 15" hybrids with N-Trig digitizers ? Yes : the Acer Aspire R7. I don't know if there are others. There *should* be a new Flip line coming out from the company who bought the VAIO division from Sony, but we don't know when.

Sorry I can't check out your eBay link as it is forbidden in my country (and I'm sure it is forbidden for many members here who don't live in your country...). Perhaps you could simply copy/paste the product description/specs for us to see ? Thanks.

EDIT : Ok, I just hovered over your eBay link and got a full description for that Flip. Here's the spec sheet for it :
https://docs.sony.com/release/specs/SVF15N17CXB_mksp.pdf
It's has a few expensive options like the 2GB nVidia chip and Core i7 processor. You can see the N-Trig digitizer there in the list. The 1TB hard drive is a hybrid model, so faster to boot than a regular HDD. You could upgrade the drive to a SSD yourself.
Nice machine. How much are they asking for it ? Is it used, refurbished or new ?

 

Just noticed your last question. I'm not sure I understand what you are asking. Both have the same Core i7-4500U processor. I'll assume you meant overall performance considering other components then : the drive advantage goes to the Yoga because it comes with a SSD, and the Flip you are looking at doesn't. But you can swap the hybrid drive in the Flip for a SSD, if you want that extra speed (many here will swear by SSDs, me included). The RAM advantage goes to the Flip, with 8GB compared to 4GB in the Yogas ; the 15" Flip can also be upgraded to 16GB (the 14" Flip can hold 8GB max - one stick only).

Yoga doesn't come with a 15" (actually 15.5") screen, so advantage Flip here, if you want larger and don't mind the extra weight.

It all depends on your usage and needs. You'll have to decide based on preferences (and budget).

 

Hi everybody..
I've bought a FIT 15A last year (oct-nov 2013).
In the last few weeks, I've had some kind of display flickering (screen goes black, random vertical white lines), occurring at the boot of the unit.
I noticed that if I slightly move the lid of the notebook, the flicker often disappears and the unit works just fine.
Today, not even moving the lid will help the unit to work.
I can use my notebook through the hdmi out, since the computer is still running (even if the screen is completely black), so I think it's a vga-adapter problem or maybe a cable loose.
Someone had this kind of problem? What can I do to fix it?
Do you think opening the notebook can help (maybe I can see a loose cable)? Also, if I open the notebook, will my warranty go void?

Thank you
Simone

 

Hi Simone,

My memory isn't all that great but yes, we have heard of a similar problem here from one or two members ; I just don't know how/if they got it resolved. If I were to guess, I'd say it is a wiring problem. The Flip's hinge mecanism poses challenges for screen wiring, and it is likely that a tiny conductor in the flatcable has been damaged/broken. Opening the Flip's case would not expose this problem ; you'd need to disassemble the screen as well IMHO.

Opening the case doesn't necessarily void the warranty. But since your Flip is still under warranty, I would send it in for repairs, considering the complexity of the task at hand...

 

I have never posted an item for sale on here, but I do have 2 new flips for sale. I have one 13a and one 14a, both with i5 and 8gb ram. Both are brand new (open box, please ask me details on that), and I will include the BestBuy receipt for full warranty.

Hope I am not braking the rules. I see that several people are looking to buy flips so I thought I would offer what I have.
I have been around for a while, I just dont post much. PM me if you are interested.

 

Yes, it's most likely a defective flatflex cable and I don't think that it's simply a loose connection that the end user can fix. Also there is no "VGA adapter" as the display unit use a special bus to interface directly to the graphics unit.

While most likely I wouldn't say that the defect in the electrical connection is necessarily in the "rubber hinge" section, though.
I have seen several "classic" notebooks which appeared sturdier and had the same symptoms - but the defect was caused by a weak connection between the flatflex cable of the display module and the "glass" panel of the LCD. This bonded/glued connection even fails in LCD TV sets - even though those don't have any kind of mechanical stress like a notebook lid.

In any case it all still boils down to a defective connection anywhere between the main hinge and the actual panel.

Yes - and I'd strongly advise against opening the display unit!

It's a) very hard to open on your own (perhaps impossibly so without visible damage) and b) you can't simply replace the flatflex cable with any other one. We are talking custom parts there. So even if you successfully manage to open the display - what then? How do you reliably test it for a defect? And even if you find out which cable is broken - how do you actually repair it?

Sony (or their service contractors) also won't open the screen to repair it but simply exchange the whole display lid, IMHO. This is simply cheaper to them and often the owner will pay (handsomely) for it anyway.
As the machine in question is already nearly a year old and still under warranty (is it?) getting a new one would also probably be the most desirable solution...

We had this topic before but I'm still very doubtful that you can open the Flip at your leisure and still keep your warranty. After all, the case isn't meant for user servicing or upgrading, isn't it?
Yes, some users may have gotten away with it but were they on solid ground, legally? While I'm certainly no expert in US law I imagine that Sony could at least claim that the defect happened when the owner opened the machine...

Conclusion:
If you aren't an experienced service technician with access to (buy) spare parts you shouldn't even think about repairing the machine on your own.
If you still have warranty - use it, folks! That's exactly what you paid for in the first place!

 

While I will agree with you Calibrator about this particular case with the possibility of the screen cable being a problem on this individual's laptop, I do not always agree with the "Send it in for warranty" approach.
How many stories do we have to hear about warranty issues with covered devices, and the manufacture does not fix the problem. And just how many times have we heard the horror stories of products going in for a single repair and then being returned to the owner with multiple new problems?
I will say that I am a repair tech by trade (not PCs though). Maybe I am biased, but I just do not trust companies to do what they promise. As times goes on, companies are getting increasingly lazy. They want you to give them the big $$$ and shut your mouth if there is a problem. Sony does it, HP does it, even Apple does it.


I would advise you to carefully open the bottom panel of the laptop. ONLY IF YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE DOING SO! If at any time you do not feel you are confident in what you are doing, STOP! When you start questioning your ability to do what you are attempting, you begin to become frustrated or impatient. Mistakes become much more likely at that point so you are much better off just stopping right there.
If you are going to try to open your flip, a heat gun or blow dryer will help a lot. Get that rubber strip good and warm before trying to peel it off. Use plastic to pry (credit card) instead of metal so you dont damage your laptops body. Take each screw off and set it to the side in the same shape of the laptop (think visual). Drawing a quick layout of your laptop is a good way to help on this. Set each screw on your drawing where it came from on the laptop. This way you dont even have to think about where they go, its right there in front of you.
Also be careful taking those back feet off. Each foot has a little plastic nub that comes off the bottom panel of the Flip and sticks into the foot for stability. You do not want to break those off. Get them warm and try to pull the straight up once you get a corner started peeling off.
Check your lcd cable to see if it is loose. If it is not, I would put it back together and send it off for warranty. Be careful, take your time. Remember, the tech that is going to work on your laptop is going to have to take it apart just like you did, so if you didnt damage anything, who is going to know that it was opened before?
Last words of advice: TAKE YOUR TIME... I can not stress that enough

 

Personally I found that going direct to Sony and buying off their website to be the cheapest option. They often have special offers on like a free extended warranty or hard drive upgrade for no extra cost. That way you can put together a model that suits you best for the right budget.

 

@oddoneout : it looks like Sony stores no longer sell Flips, or any other VAIOs for that matter. At least not in North America. They sold the VAIO line a while back and are now showing them as *discontinued* on their web sites and at brick and mortar stores. BestBuy has run out as well, unless they get new batches.

The VAIO line was sold, and the new entity appears to be serious about selling Flips again. They even have prototypes that look promising, but we don't know when/if they'll be ready for market.

===

@fire3element : you make a good case for your opinion. Problem for me is that we're on a forum and have no way of knowing what each individual is capable of doing, etc... and some may take your word as gospel and plunge into something they're not capable of doing... and possibly make things worse. When you read the thread here, you get a sense that all participants have the minimal technical skills required to open an ultrabook, but that's being optimistic, in my opinion. Getting the bottom cover off of these is not easy, as you've pointed out, unless you've done it before. Having to open one of these for the first time while being stressed over the possibility of breaking something is a lot for some people to handle. Thus sending it in, although not 100% safe, takes that responsability out of your hands. It's never an ideal situation, I agree with you here, but troubleshooting a screen malfunction is not within reach for the mere mortals, so to speak.

 

LMAO. I like how you ended that comment
I can agree with you on that and can echo, DO NOT ATTEMPT THIS IF YOU ARE NOT FAMILIAR WITH WORKING ON A LAPTOP. Things can go south quick, not worth the risk.
If you have taken apart any recent electronic device in the last 5yrs and are familiar with the little internal clips that are used to keep plastic panels on, it is not that bad once you get the rubber feet off.
This laptop is also thin and flexible once all the screws are out. You can flex the laptop a LITTLE once you have all the screws out to help release some of those tabs, then work your way around from there. I believe the best corner to start from is the rear back where the power button is. The power adapter opening is kind of set in and will hang up if you try to pull the case right off. Start at the rear back where the power button is and work your way around clock-wise. Not terrible, you just need to be patient and not rush it.

Hope that helps anyone out.

 

thanks guys, in the end I decided to go with Sony support, so I called today, opened the practice, and in just half an hour they called back: they are sending a courier to pick up the unit tomorrow or the day after, and they say that in 5 working days (hopefully) the unit should be repaired.
I'll let you know when and in what conditions the unit will be back!
Thanks everybody for support!

 

Ahh I wasn't aware that was the case. I guess I don't read all those marketing emails and stuff enough
It's a shame, because I stayed with Sony because of the build quality and my last laptop lasted 4 years before I decided I wanted something more powerful. At least I have a 5 year guarantee!

 

You only have to read some tech-news - or Sony/Vaio threads like this one to stay informed. ;-)

For the time being the new "Vaio" outfit will operate only in Japan but here's hope that they will eventually make the products available in the rest of the world.

Competition and more manufacturers are always good for the customer and while the notebook/laptop market is in a decline right now ultrabooks have a bright future according to analysts - and it makes sense: Ultrabooks are highly portable, complete computers (regardless if Windows-, Linux- or Mac-based), powerful enough for most computing applications and with many interfaces to be the centerpiece of the home(office) computing station.
Combined with networked storage you also don't need to carry large (and heavy) amounts of storage around anymore - an SSD suffices nowadays which is not only lighter but also much quicker.

If the prototype shown at the Adobe event is anything to go by we can IMHO await good things from Vaio in the future!

 

Here's a follow-up to the Samsung EVO 840 SSD problem mentioned in earlier in this thread as this SSD is very popular and several members use them in their Flips:
Samsung supplied the patch very punctually yesterday (October, 15th) and offers it via download on this site.

Important:
The file you want to download is called "Samsung Performance Restoration" and is NOT in the firmware section but in a separate one.
Samsung also supplies a PDF file with instructions to explain the process and several variants.

As I'm an EVO 840 user myself I wanted to get rid of the problem as quickly as possible as I'm in the process of moving right now.

The patching process went without a hitch on two machines (on the Flip and my main PC) but some words are in order:
- The patch is a single executable that must be installed on your system like a normal program. You then only start the utility via a regular icon and follow the process. Take note of the warning messages and confirm them.
- It's recommended that you have at least 10% free space on the SSD you want to patch. This will make the patching much faster and less complicated (if you absolutely can't free space then you have to follow the instructions in the PDF for that scenario!).
- It's also very recommended that you make a drive backup of the SSD that you want to patch! As the Flip only supports one drive/SSD you will end up to backup everything on it (preferably as an image).
- You then should save your work and close all other programs.
- My recommendation is to clear all the browser caches and delete all temporary files you don't need as the process takes more time when the SSD is fuller.
- First, the patch utility transfers a new firmware (not available separately!) to the SSD and then will ask you for a shutdown. This is normal and explained in the instructions.
- After you reboot the system the utility will start again and automatically begin to treat the SSD. It apparently works on a low-level basis which means the Windows file system doesn't know what is happening.
- It's very recommended that you don't start other programs as this will slow down the patching process and ***may*** result in problems! Also the machine is very slow to work with during the process according to several users.
- Depending on the size of the SSD and how full it is the process can take anywhere between 10 minutes and several hours so don't worry if it takes long. Make sure you connect the Flip to your power supply and that your energy settings don't shut down the Flip, though...
- Attention: If you get a message that a new drive/device has been connected to the system and that it needs to reboot *ignore* that message for now! On some systems (like my main PC) this message came because the new firmware of the SSD made it appear as a newly installed drive. Simply let the patch process run its full course then reboot the machine afterwards!
- After the process is finished the program will simply show "Complete" or something like that in its window. Everything should be fine now and if you haven't gotten a "new device" message then you don't need to reboot the machine.

Good luck with the process and let's hope that the problem was solved by Samsung!