Defective Nvidia chipsets in your current Vaio?

Hi guys,
I would be very happy to know how to fix/repair or reflow my GPU nvidia properly and in a secure way, I lost my FZ21Z 3 days ago.
In fact, I think that's not a really USER problem, it should be a SONY and NVIDIA problem. Does not seems fair that the USER that buy a "TOP" laptop and pay EU$ 1800,00 (like me) and need to be responsible to disassemble and clean dust, fans and stuff!!!
I'm VERY DISAPOINTED!!!!!!

 

I think I have the same problem with my 4 month out of warranty VGN-AR61M and I'm currently going through the pointles exercise with Sony of try this and that to reach a verdict of a cooked Nvidia GPU, which to me is a premature failure of a component.

I suspect the outcome wil be a choice of -
A) an overinflated repair cost from Sony to repair a fault that will happen again
B) buy a new laptop (No way a Sony again)

I have a friend that works for the BBC, and he has suggested that I contact the BBC watchdog programme. If more than 20 people post a related problem to them from the same manufacturer, they will consider investigating it (there are well over 20 on this forum alone with a similar problem to mine).

A petition is fine but it does not give as much public awareness to a poor product and customer service as a nation TV programme running an article. Here in the UK, BBC's watchdog has huge leverage even with manufacturing giants.

A drop in sales alone from people who see the report and no longer want to buy a sony laptop would probably wake Sony up to address to the problem.

I'll be registering my camplaint with wachdog by the end of this week, when I suspect Sony will stop listening. I think its worth a try as it looks as tho you guys have hit a brick wall with your complaint routes so far.

So is anyone with me?

 

I think a little bad publicity would help our cause. I'm sure there will be more than a few people here who are willing to join you. If my wife's SZ crapped out, I'd be happy to file a complaint too.

 

I bought me VAIO VGN-FZ11 a year and a half ago (which means it's out of warranty in the UK) and the problems being described in this forum started last week. Inititally I thought it was a simple case of over heating so I disassembled the unit and cleared out the dust. It worked but 20 minutes later it reverted back to the old issue (lines, across the screen, blurred/hazy screen, enlarged icons). I restore the factory settings but still no joy. I can't believe that after spending £900 on a laptop and a year and a half later it doesn't bloody work becuase of the expensive graphics card that I barely pushed to its potential

 

It is really interesting that Sony kept insisting that all their notebooks do not contain any faulty Nvidia 8000 series GPU while Apple are generous enough to extend the GPU warranty on their MBP (with Nvidia 8600 GPUs) to a total of 3 years. Sony should learn from Apple on how to handle customers' concerns/problems in this respect.

You guys probably can tell which company I'm going to switch to in the future for all my computing needs.

 

Thought I’d provide an update to the post I made a few months back.

A few months ago when my FZ11Z GPU died I did manage to get it fixed by a local laptop repair shop at the cost of £120. I said at the time I’d update if I had any significant news – I have – It died again!

After 5 months the GPU has packed up again with the exact same symptoms – I’ve had the machine to pieces to see how dirty it was inside, and apart from a little dust in the cooling fan (not enough to cause overheating) it was very clean.

I have however been using AutoCAD and producing quite a number of high resolution 3D renders which probably demanded a bit of effort from the GPU – but this GPU should surely be able to handle that kind of work.

Anyway I may at some stage attempt to refloat solder the GPU as described a few posts back by LordWalrus (thanks for the info) but generally I’ve really lost interest in it and I don’t think it’s worth spending any more money on this disappointing piece of junk.

Very P***ed off, very disappointed – I will buy a new computer sometime soon – most certainly one without an Nvidia chip and one that is most certainly not a Sony....probably not even a laptop....at least I’d be able to swap out the GPU!

 

I'm sorry to hear that. It really is unfortunate that Sony still do not want to own up to any kind of Nvidia GPU problems. Oh well, I guess what we all learn from all these GPU incidents is what Sony are really made of. That is "great notebooks but unreliable support." Sad but true.

 

I'm with Diatex! I have sent my story to UK watchdog at the BBC. If we need 20 to get a reaction then we only need 18 more people to contact them.

Here's the link:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/watchdog/gotastory/

 

Do you need to be from the United Kingdom?

 

I missed that Watchdog post....I’m seriously considering that as a possibility...only I haven’t tried to contact Sony at all since it appears to be a complete waste of time.

I was out of warranty and needed my machine back quick, hence I took a punt at my local repair shop – this was before there was any mention of the heat gun approach which I highlighted a while back (and for which LordWalrus kindly supplied the method later).

I did sign the online petition at the time that my GPU failed. Maybe I should start hassling Sony and join the Watchdog camp.

I think I’ll need to approach Sony first to get the knock back from them (they’ll never know that I or the repair shop has had the back off anyhow and I’m out of warranty anyway)...and then I’ll join the Watchdog link - even if I don’t get my machine fixed it’ll be sure satisfying to see their arse kicked in public!

Let’s do it...there must be enough of us by now

 

Hello all. Just an update from my post a few months back regarding my failed NVidia GPU on my FZ290. MY GPU failed 3 months out of warranty and Sony obviously was surprised that it happened when I called. After researching a bit on the internet and realizing that I didn't have any real options with Sony, I decided to contact American Express because of their Extended Warranty. Since I was covered under their time period, I started the process by sending the laptop to Sony for an official estimate for the repairs. $749 for the estimate plus $80 for proper shipping and insurance. After I got the estimate from Sony and sent it to AmEx, it took them only 3 days to credit my card $830. The whole process took about 3 weeks. Now, I didn't get the computer repaired by Sony because it'll probably break again in a few months or somewhere down the line. Instead, I'm going to take the $750 (minus $99 for a diagnostic fee Sony charges if you get an estimate but don't get it repaired from them, just another way for them to kick you while you're down i guess) from AmEx and buy a new netbook or small notebook from another manufacturer who actually takes responsibility for their products.

So in conclusion, although i'm still stuck with a broken laptop (it still functions as an oversized netbook now basically, but no HDMI or Blu-Ray), I'm content that I was covered by my credit card company, as I'm sure many of you will be too if you choose this route. So good luck to all of you with your problems. This is the last time i'll be on the Sony forums as I no longer plan on purchasing future Sony Computer products due to my experience with this Laptop. (On a side note, this was my 3rd customized Sony laptop, so they lost a good customer)

 

I have a Vaio FZ21S and also have problems with the Nvidia chipset.
Screens with Green Vertical stripes come up when starting up and Windows keeps crashing. Wonder what Sony is going to tell me. Just contacted them.

 

Smart move. With other companies, you get more dependable & reliable service & support, in the "rare" event of similar issues. Good luck.

 

I can't wait to find out either especially if it is out of warranty. It seems to quite obviously be a nvidia chip that has died.

 

I updated and described my whole story concerning faulty nVidia chip at Vaio forum:
http://club.vaio.sony.pl/clubvaio/pl/pl/forum/viewthread?thread=55888&offset=90#289053

What can I say: I will buy Vaio notebook in the future, but never nVidia.

Good luck!!!
Wiaterek

 

Just called the company where I bought my notebook today, since Sony informed me that my warranty was 1 yr. They contacted Sony and informed me that they managed to increase warranty to 2 yrs.
Sony will pick up the notebook and repair it for free. Nice!

So try to call the company where you bought the notebook and ask them what they can do for you. Good Luck!

 

Just called the company where I bought my notebook today, since Sony informed me that my warranty was 1 yr. They contacted Sony and informed me that they managed to increase warranty to 2 yrs.
Sony will pick up the notebook and repair it for free. Nice!

So try to call the company where you bought the notebook and ask them what they can do for you. Good Luck!

 

Hello everyone

I was searching for FZ motherboard in ebay and i came across an item list with the title Repair your faulty FZ mainboard.
Here is the link:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Sony-VAIO-VGN...s_CA?hash=item3ef71f1cfc&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

I asked them if they change the mainboard with a new one, but i didnt get any clear answer from them.
Here is their description of the service they provide:

We have repaired many of these laptops - the problem is that the graphics chip starts to come away from the motherboard. This can be repaired with the correct knowledge and equipment so you do not have to replace your motherboard.

And it seems they dont change the mainboard:

So don't buy a second hand motherboard of dubious origin with little or no warranty

Anyone know if there is any way these mainboard can be repaired without changing the mainboard? will i get the same Nvidia 8400 or it will be replaced by some crappy chips.
BTW they are based in UK same as me.
Thanks

 

Most likely they are using the trick described elsewhere in this thread (or a related thread) about re-flowing the solder between the GPU and it's substrate. But that is a temporary fix, as the issue of a disparity in thermal expansion between the substrate and the solder will still exist. This will result in the possibility of cracks in the solder reappearing again at some point. It is a cheap fix and given the right equipment and care, something that you COULD do yourself.

Gary

 

I had a crappy HP that had the same problem. Nvidia in laptops suck!

 

Hi, just thought I would add my story: The nvidia gpu on my FZ190 died out of warranty. I went the route of buying a used motherboard off ebay. My vaio is now up and running again! The new motherboard cost $220 with shipping, which is a lot less than a whole new machine. Though I suppose it may fail with the same problem. The A1273689A version of the motherboard seems be be most readily available on ebay. My original motherboard was a A1273688A. Fortunately they are compatible. Swapping the motherboards is not too difficult, but it takes a couple hours and there are lots of delicate connections which can be broken if you aren't careful. This page: http://www.insidemylaptop.com/take-apart-sony-vaio-vgn-fz220-repair-power-jack/ saved me from completely mangling my vaio.

 

Here's my story:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=388999


Dear Mark,



Sorry for getting back to you this late...I have been out of the state for the summer.

Also, thanks for making the support and effort to lend a helping hand; however, I have already solved the issue through my credit card company with which I used to make the purchase of this laptop.



This is the method that I would also recommend EVERYONE else who has a similar problem with their thinkpad to follow. Call your credit card company with which you used to make the laptop purchase. Most credit card companies will have an extended warranty coverage (+1 year after manufacturer's warranty has expired) on purchases up to around $10,000, YMMV. Explain the issue you have with your laptop and notify them of the faulty Nvidia gpu present in the laptop, which is the main problem that's causing all of these issues (esp the 3 beeps). You will get a full refund of the price that you purchased the laptop. Firstly, they will most likely send you a prepaid box with which you will use to send your laptop into your credit card company's own diagnostic center. There, they will evaluate the problem with the laptop and conclude that a repair is not the best possible solution to a defect.



The above is the BEST route to use. I suggest this because after sending my laptop to a plethora of 3rd-party repair shops, one after the other concluded that the Nvidia GPU is indeed defective, a conclusion I easily arrived with myself yet one that Lenovo consistently denied on the phone. Sending in your laptop and paying an exorbitant fee to have it repair will only "buy you another time-bomb" which will inevitably fail in the near future. Afterall, Lenovo will just replace the motherboard with the same defective gpu soldered onto it. There is no way to "fix" this defect.



The heart of the problem lies with thermal bumping that plagues the G84M core and all other cores in that same family. (Note: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nvidia_Quadro) The Quadro 570M is based off of the notoriously failing 8600M gt, both of which use the same faulty G84M core. Nvidia, at first, attempted to hide this issue from the public, and until only recently, they have come out truthly to admit the issue. It seems from everyone else on Lenovo forums that this problem has finally caught up and showing its face. The number of users with this very same problem will only rise as time passes because these defective GPUs have reached their failing point through the many power cycles of typical laptop usage.



This is where I lose faith in LENOVO/THINKPAD products. Many other OEMs, including Dell, Sony, and HP, have issued a public notice to all their laptops containing the defective chips. Yet, Lenovo has done nothing. Other OEMs sought to "remedy," though only TEMPORARILY, the overheating and prematurely failing chips with BIOS updates, even though these updates do NOTHING but merely elevate the fan speed to max RPM, hoping to keep the chips running cool enough until they are out of warranty at which point you are basically left with an expensive doorstop. Yet, Lenovo did not even try to acknowledge the problem. Nvidia even agreed to pay back part of the costs for OEMs to repair/replace the defective chips ( "The chipmaker said in July it was taking a one-time charge of $150 million to $200 million to cover expenses relating to the glitch." Source: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-10063844-37.html ). Thus, OEMs have discounted or even issued free repair notices for laptops affected. Even so, Lenvo insists that we pay the $450+ repair fee without acknowledging the issue at hand. To make it worse, Lenovo has quietly gone and replaced all their laptops with AMD/ATI radeon branded gpus, effectively isolating and cutting support to the older laptops containing Nvidia chips.



This whole ordeal has truly tainted my perspective on the quality, indestructible, and "customer-always-comes-first" characteristics that were previously only held by Lenovo/Thinkpads. Afterall, that is the only reason I purchased my T61p. I wanted a reliable work machine that will last me through college and beyond, never expecting that it will suddenly fail one random morning when I go to turn it on. Now that I am searching for a new laptop to purchase, I am very hesitant about buying another Lenovo. Don't get me wrong here...I blame Nvidia for the issue that has caused my laptop and many others to suddenly perish. However, the fact the Lenovo did nothing to step up and address the issue makes me very worried about their dealings with any possible future issues if I were to purchase another product from them.

 

Actually, to this day Sony still refuses to admit there is any issue at all.

Gary

 

Didn't Sony release a BIOS update along with other OEMs to keep the fan 100% 24/7 ?

 

Nope, that would be admitting there is an issue. They refuse to admit there is any problem at all. Read back through this very thread for more detail.

Gary

 

Been a while since we heard anything about it. Jen-Hsun Huang (president and chief executive officer of Nvidia) recently disclosed some more information:

Nvidia exceeded their original estimates (on cost for repairing/replacing) the defective chips by $119 million.

It's interesting because the article mentions that Nvidia "negotiated agreements with affected customers, making it easier to estimate repair costs and their financial impact." It's not clear whether they were referring to the OEMs (as their customers) or the end users (who purchased the computers).

Nvidia takes [additional] charge for faulty graphics chips

 

O' it's quite clear they are talking about the PC makers.

"Nvidia's customers, such as PC makers"

Nvidia could care less about enduser pass thru customers with 2-3 year old laptops. If companies like Sony don't even acknowledge the problem, the anger is on Sony.

"However, the costs are a small distraction and haven't impacted Nvidia's ability to launch new products, Huang said."

He even said so himself. They have no shame!

Cheers,

 

looks like Sony is finally responding to the defective Nvidia GPU in Japan. The annoucement came out on August 4th and Sony will fix for free for the models shown in the annoucement even if they are out of the 3-year warranty.
Not really sure if other regions will follow the same routine like in Japan, but it's a good start.

Edit: added the translation from Google translate.

Edit2: great news! looks like the US and Canada are all covered. Check the links above for more info.

 

So what about Europe??

Edit:
And it excludes ome model, e.g. the SZ ( think there were one or two cases of an SZ failing...)

 

I suppose it's better late than never for all those Vaio customers who have suffered through warranty denials. Also looks like they will reimburse those who paid for the repair in the past.

I am disappointed Sony took so long to acknowledge the problem but at least they are at last.

Cheers,

 

Thanks for posting this.

 

I think it's only a matter of time before they acknowledge the SZ series as well. It's omission is likely do to use of the model's hybrid graphics which would definitely impact the volume and frequency of reported incidents when compared to the other two.

I would be interested to know what the retail numbers were across the three models. It wouldn't surprise me if the SZ lead in raw sales. That would make it the most expensive out of the three to repair (for Sony). Perhaps they're trying to sit on it for as long as possible; they've only now started to break even in certain divisions.

I wanted to get the article quoted in case they change anything. (This is the US one.)

 

Quite possible.
Good job on quoting it, but put the link on the beginning as well as the date

(+ rep)

 

I mentioned in the sticky thread, but it's probably worth mentioning again. If you click on the link in Sony Support (USA) on how to determine if you have an affected nVidia chipset, the list of affected chipset is much longer and pretty much covers every GeForce 8xxxx.

I think Sony eventually will have to include SZ, after they hammer nVidia and get nVidia to cough up some dough, because it's really an entire nVidia fleet issue and it's really hard to say SZ is not affected.

 

Is it? I thought I remembered hearing that once Nvidia found the issue they changed the materials being used. After all it was not a design problem, it was a materials selection issue. The problem was with the difference in thermal expansion characteristics of the substrate and the solder bumps. So it might be that latter versions of the chips were not affected. Again I do NOT KNOW if this is the case or not, merely speculating.

Gary

 

I've seen the same mentioned on here too, but the SZ was manufactured at the same time as other Vaios.

I'd highly doubt that the SZ got revised chips and the FZ old ones...
Its the same manufacturing date (give and take a few weeks)

 

It is great to hear that Sony is finally doing something to the faulty Nvidia GPUs.

However, I feel sorry for those Vaio FZ owners who sold their broken notebooks (some being parted out) for cheap earlier when they encountered this Nvidia GPU problem & Sony did not want to fix it for them for free. I would be very mad if I'm one of them.... This does makes me wonder who had the "genius" foresight to predict this & snap up some of those "broken" Vaio FZs for cheap!

 

According the nVidia's official stance, yes, chipsets manufactured at a later date using newer process should be fine. But as DetlevCM has mentioned, most SZ are manufactured at the same time as these other models, and frankly most of the SZ parts were manufactured before nVidia announced the problem -- remember that SZ's replacement Z came out last August, a month after nVidia's announcement.

On the other hand, when I said this is a fleet issue, I meant the fact that nVidia to this date still claims (correct me if I am wrong) only a small portion of GeForce 84xx & 86xx chipset yet you can clearly see in Sony's list of chipset affected it covers many more -- not really that surprising, since Dell, HP, & Apple's extended warranties also cover many variants of GeForce chipsets instead of just 84xx & 86xx.

So long story short, I don't think Sony has much of defense here and it is probably inevitable that they will include SZ later.

 

Hmmm, two problems for me, the omission of the SZ series and there's still absolutely no mention of the problem (as far as I can find) on the UK site at all

I'm not sure if mine would be covered or not anyway, because I sent it away to a company that was going to try to repair it without replacing the motherboard (using a BGA rework station to take the graphics chip off, clean it up, and replace the balls of solder underneath I think), but they couldn't get it to work... something about an unworkable BGA chip surface. Well actually it was repaired once, worked for about 20 minutes after I got it back, but then broke again, so I sent it back to them and then that time they said they couldn't fix it.

They refunded what I'd paid to have it repaired anyway, but since it came back from them the second time, it doesn't boot up at all anymore... so I'm not sure what exactly they've done to it. It's just been sitting in a drawer in my desk ever since then anyway... would be nice if Sony would do something with it.

 

I rang Sony UK on Tuesday after reading the posts above and explained the distortion issue on my FZ laptop due to the NVIDIA defect. They have taken it back to be assessed and hopefully repaired for free. Fingers crossed they don't ring me and say they can't do it for whatever reason.

I rang Sony over a month ago when the issue first occurred and they couldn't have cared a less and were quoting astronomical repair costs. So maybe they have now changed their tune and accepted their quality error.

I'm worried though because I got the laptop repaired in London by an independent repair shop, who were a lot cheaper than what Sony were quoting (but it only last 3 weeks before distortion returned) and then carried out a reflow on the laptop myself (which worked, but only lasted 3 days), and I fear they may notice this and use it as an excuse to not repair/replace the defective NVIDIA unit.

Here's hoping it all goes well and my laptop is back in working condition with a new GPU by next week.

 

lol that sounds familiar... I wonder if it was the same place that repaired my SZ?

 

Unfortunately my SZ was sufferring from the same defect as well
My NVIDIA card cannot be powered on since two months ago. How can we get Sony informed that the SZs are having the same defects also?

 

Nice one EJLL...

Me too, I rang Sony after reading that they are now beginning to admit that there is a problem with some GPU’s. I also had my GPU refloated at a local repair shop and it lasted a further 6 months before crapping out again. The Guy I spoke to on the Club Viao help line admitted that this is now a known issue for some models (sorry SZ owners). They’re collecting my machine by courier later in the week and will investigate the problem – I’m informed that if the issue is found not to be with the GPU I will face a charge of £146.00 for their trouble! However if it does come down to a faulty GPU a new motherboard will be fitted free of charge – I’m told with a newer, reliable version of the GPU.

My chief worry is that they’ll notice the repair work previously done and use that as an excuse to wriggle out of the deal – though I had the machine apart and I can’t see anything obviously amiss. I’m also worried that my copy of Windows is not the OEM - it’s Vista Business, I blew away the Sony Vista Home Premium OEM as it was so slow and problematic.

I’ll update with news as soon as I get it.

 

You better make a backup of your hard drive. If it does not have the "stock" OS installed, it is VERY likely that the service folks will put the "stock" one back on before they test it. This is pretty standard procedure.

Gary

 

My FZ Vaio laptop is back from Sony UK with the motherboard/GPU replaced free of charge!
And relax.......

 

I had the insight to pick up an FZ a couple months ago, but the kid told me it had a Blu-Ray drive!! what a jerk... it's a cdrw/dvd-rom.

 

Which FZ model do you have?

 

FZ11 - hopefully it will last another couple of years

 

Great news EJLL....I'm waiting for the courier to arrive right now to collect my FZ11...hope I get the same result as you...

 

Hi,

I have an FZ21Z that has just come back from Sony Repair.. and guess what....

The problem is more worse than before!!!! i cant believe it. on the repair sheet it states they have replaced the moterboard.... looks like with someone elses faulty motherboard

Spoke to them this morning.. but need to phone back later.. as the Case progress takes a while to update.. looks like it will be going back..

sigh