New Sony Vaio Z speculation/news thread

but Z is a 13....

 

he's being sarcastic.

but i would LOVE for the highest-end GPU to be included in the separate GPU unit. provided it is of sufficient size so that it won't fry itself out very quickly.

 

Make me feel like a jerk . I still don't get the joke and it just looked like he mistook the number. I will stop being so "helpful." Can u explain the thing so a dope could follow it?

 

The basic premise is this: IF i have to lug around an external unit (that may or may not need its own power source, it had better be worth my while. Like some have pointed out, a notebook need only be so light before you get diminishing returns from reducing weight.

If i'm going to pay a grand more for performance equal to the 15in MBP albeit in package that weighs a pound less, then please count me out.

 

he's saying that you can't expect the sony z 13" to have a high-end GPU when EVEN the macbook pro 13" can't fit it in.

 

hmm...
time to comment
Alienware M11x R3 is 11.6" but rumored using 540m

source
Alienware M11x R3 packs GT 540M graphics

and Alienware M14x is 14"? but rumored using 555m

source
Alienware M14X - Powerful, yet portable (UPDATED) - Dell News and more

now vaio z form factor is 13.1" so can possibly fit 550m underclocked?

 

ANAND review of dual core sandy bridge concludes that its an incremental upgrade over Arrandale and doesn't offer substantial savings in power over the quad core Sandy bridge units. This explains why Apple didn't bother going the dual core route in the MBP 15 and 17(they are known to favor power efficiency over speed).

 

The MBP 13 doesn't have an external unit I have to lug around. If you're going to inconvenience your consumers you'd better make it worth it. Especially at the prices that Sony charge.

 

My thoughts exactly!

 

the gt 550m underclocked is the gt 540m, or a gt 540m underclocked is a gt 525m, or a rebranded gt 525m is a gt 435m, or a underclocked gt 435m is a gt 425m.

aside that the vaio z wont pack the gpu in the body itself, since its not in the body it wont be constrained by its cooling, and since the expectation is to carry a whistler, so no nvidia, and if its a whistler it would probably need a separate psu, since thunderbolt can only provide 10w of power, I would be excited if it was a higher end gpu

 

what are you talking about? the MBP 13 is HEAVIER, lower-res screen, can't run windows effectively(its honestly nothing special when you install windows on it), and ALSO doesn't have a discrete GPU.

you're paying less, but you're getting less in every regard(except OS?), except for the on-chassis GPU, which is equal.

i honestly have no clue what you're trying to say here.

 

I'm wondering about this new Z : once thunderbolt becomes popular on laptop, it looks like any company will be able to provide additionnal external device with a graphic powerfull card... it means we would not need to stick with sony's external device, and could upgrade graphics upon will ? ...
there might be tierce companies building external devices compatible with any laptop with thunderbolt ?

 

My point is that the inconvenience of having to deal with an extra box with associated cables that I have to remember to carry along combined with the increased risks of loss or damage detract from the advantages of the base Z when you consider the price delta.

I'm not interested in just specs but overall convenience and usability. I believe the MBP 13's processor is bottle-necked by the GPU so the nominally faster processor in the Z would just be for bragging rights. In real use, the MBP will run any productivity software you need.

To summarize, I would much rather carry one slightly heavier/bulkier piece than two smaller/lighter pieces due to convenience even if they were the same price. For MY use, the Z had better have a top line graphics card and an elegant connection solution for the external box or I'll be looking elsewhere.

 

I agree, however the external device might allow for graphic upgrades during the laptop life. What if Sony releases new graphic device in a year, that works with the june2011 vaio Z ?

You could get a new AMD HD 7750 to upgrade your HD 6750 and so on. Right now to my knowledge it has always been impossible to uprgade graphic internal chip.

However what makes me doubtful about this is that Sony plans on soldering memory, cpu, and maybe SSD ?? it goes against upgrades policy.

 

i was writing a big post breaking down the comparison between the Z and the macbook. it seems like you're not considering the fact that they both have the same IGP...but i'll digress.

Sony Vaio Z w/o external GPU > MBP 2011
(excluding cost)

agreed?

 

im confused, why are people going on and on and on and on endlessly about the bluddy graphics chip in this thing? its a 13" ultraportable, surely if anone cares about any kind of real gaming on it then theyd buy something bigger with a sensible sized gaming screen and more power in the first place. if i was that bothered about gaming i would NOT be buying a 13" ultraportable in the first place (ESPECIALLY not at the price sony charges for the Z).

i was going to buy the current z until i saw that sandy bridge was out and the current z was a bit old (and like hell am i having my pants pulled down over the price of a year old model!). its a bit irritating, when i first looked at the current z i thought AT LAST an ultraportable with good battery, decent power, optical drive AND a proper size ssd, just about perfect. All they had to do was take the current Z, update the cpu/sandy bridge/graphics, and thats it, job done. instead they seem to be taking the best ultraportable by far, and screwing around with it for no reason? from the first page of this thread "will be drastically different from the current z", WHY?!? is the current Z broken in some way or is it the best out there? if they wanted to screw around like this, fine, but do it on a new model instead of screwing with a flagship model which isnt broken in the first place.

 

Actually, I am. Hence my comment regarding the GPU being the bottleneck in the system. If the GPU is the bottleneck, who cares if other parts are slightly faster?

Agreed (with caveats )

 

Observation: the Z noobs seem to be the ones who are most confused by Sony's plan to change the mission of the model, rather than just improving it with SB (I would add: newer battery technology and strengthen the lid somehow) and name a new model as the thin/light. I know the answer to that is: "they did that, but they renamed the old model 'SA' " and gave the new thin/light the "Z" moniker. I happen to think the SA is an imperfect "upgrade" of the present Z but that aside, it sure would have been less confusing if they left the Z brand on the "complete" model and created a new, er, letter for the new thin/light. Again, it's probably not a real loss for consumers (except, again, my reservations that the SA seems less classy than the Z), so it mostly boils down to a questionable marketing decision by Sony. From what I've read on this thread, it's been a Vaio practice over the years to play "musical alphabet" with its models, so I guess it works for them somehow - perhaps the "Z" is meant to stand for: "classiest, most expensive" rather than have continuity of the model's core mission? [scratches head...]<scratches head=""><scratches head=""></scratches></scratches>

 

Beaups said that laptop has to be specially designed in order to drive INTERNAL display with external graphics card

 

ahhh so your saying if i want the current z but an updated version, i should look at the SA (*rushes off to look*)

edit: hmmm SA only seems to have 128gb ssd not 256, and cant tell for sure but looks thicker and heavier than the old z too (and at 5.5hrs rated battery i think thats also less?)?

 

lol how can the sa be the "upgraded" version of the present z when it's a different size notebook

the sa is much closer to being like an upgraded version of the s.. which makes sense

id argue that they completely got rid of the concept of the present z, which was a DTR in a 13.1 chassis

 

I don't see how it would affect what i wrote... Anyone can build anything.
The external device could in theory be updated with new gpu. Some chinese low-cost company could produce devices compatible with Z as well, why not.

 

Because the Z is an all-in-one ultraportable powerhouse. Because if we wanted just a ultraportable w/o any discrete gpu, there are MANY options out there, but for those who needs (or wants) what the Z offers, that's all they have. Also, I bought my Z because it was small, yet powerful and i game on it (i use a 25" external monitor though). For me, a college student, the Z is the perfect laptop for me, powerful as heck and light so i can drag it with me everywhere.

I do agree with this sentiment, but Sony must have noticed the attention and interest Apple is getting with the MBA's and their X series was pretty fail, especially when they powered it with an atom. This way, they can tap into the same market as the MBA and with the SA they can challenge the 13" MBP. I don't claim to know what they're up to, but it sort of makes sense (although it's ironic as Sony is probably the most Applish PC manufacturer out there with it's Sony tax, but they do offer hardware configs no one else does)

 

Quote from this thread:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/son...iscussion-sonys-next-new-13-3-laptop-224.html

Just a hunch so don't bash me (lol). Maybe the Z will be discontinued and the SA is somewhat the replacement for the VPC-Z. However, this speculated new Z, which is indeed expected to launch, is not a Z successor, but will be a different model name and marketing for Sony - an added series to the Sony lineup.

I say this because, in this thread, I see this post. Then I read " a temporary replacement". And often times, facts get skewed. Does anyone know if the new Z is a Z Series? Also, the price of the SA is virtually the same price-point as the Z - expected to be over $2K. And SA is speculated to be thinner than SB or SC.

 

I won't count on that ever happening. This is going to be similar to their docking stations. After every new successor has been released for a certain line (eg. VPC-Z replaces VGN-Z), the older docking station cannot be used with the new notebook successor.

It will be typical Sony, in the sense that they'll continue to do their best to squeeze out every single penny from their customers whenever they can. Therefore, when they do replace the new GPUs, it will come with the full successor to the then current line, which means you'll just have to s**k it up & fork out the money for the full complete package (new notebook with its accompanying GPU /optical drive external box in this case).

Good luck.

 

so... does anyone know of any new ultraportables that have a full voltage sandybridge processor and a dedicated gpu in 1 unit?

am i correct to assume that the upcoming hp elitebook ultraportable is like that?

 

the issue with the 'update' is this. the Z was such a multi-faceted machine that many people bought the same machine for many different purposes.

obviously you bought the machine for its strong GPU in an ultraportable format. that is the gamer's perspective on the machine.

i am interested in the machine for its high-res display, full-power CPU, and SSDs in an ultraportable. this is the perspective of a programmer.

see how that works?


sony has clearly decided to specialize the machine further in order to bring significant(it its opinion?) enough improvements to get you to buy the upgraded model.

 

I agree with you to a certain extent. You've definitely got a point with your comments.

However, it seems to me that Sony is basically taking a gamble as it looks like they are probably "heavily" pressurized by Apple's MBA & Samsung's Series 9 ultra-portable notebooks. Another reason may also be that the current VAIO Z series is not really selling as well as many of us here think it is, which may force Sony to take this "risk" on taking a new approach. Of course, the aforementioned reasoning is just my speculation, which may or may not be true.

At the end of the day, Sony going with what they plan to do with the new Z successor will mean that they're going to lose some existing customers while gaining some new customers (not attracted by the current offering). Will Sony eventually be successful with this new Z successor? I guess only time will tell. One thing I can be sure of is that if this new approach does not work out well for them in terms of sales, approximately 1 year from the release of this new VAIO Z series, Sony will revert back to the all-in-one machine similar to the current VPC-Z series.

 

Re: Onboard S/B video for CAD Stuff (from 2 pages ago)
I was at the local Fry's yesterday. I didn't see the new Sony S/B laptops but came across a new 13" Toshiba S/B laptop. For the fun of it... I was looking at its WEI scores. The onboard Intel S/B video is something like 5.6/5.7 and 6.2! That's much better than their ~4.5 onboard video score in the previous generation (similar i3/i5 class). Hmmm.....

 

I think it is totally wrong. I truely believe that this laptop was (IS still) selling very well despite its high price range. On some hardware french forums the Z topic is always on top of the list, like in most ultraportable forums.

Lately the Z came out of stock because of Japan problems, at least i guess that's really what happened. A few days later, in some famous hi-tech shop here the Z came out of stock as well. It was damn fast ! They used to sell the Z13A7 and the Z13M9 and came out of stock in a few days.

Look at this page : (no clue if i am allowed to post such links? sorry if not)
▷▷MGMI.fr - VAIO - Portables Gamme "Ultra-Mobiles"

They sell 2 different top of the line Z13 at about 3000 €. A few days ago there was still about 30 of each. Now only 10 and 9 of each. And out of the 30ish Z13A7 and Z13M9 only 2 of each remain.

So unless they just throw them away, i think this computer is still selling fast...

 

I think it is pretty well believed that the SA will carry the torch for the present Z, and equal or exceed it in most aspects, but the details you know kinda depends on your source for rumors, er, I mean, facts about the SA as it will be configured (able) in the US. My understanding is that it is not yet fully fleshed out, and definitely not fully revealed by Sony. I get my best information from Rachel, a Sony forum mod here, who I think has some insider info - or does the best research. She has not said what the maximum SSD size will be or the battery options, but she thinks the weight will be close to the present/outgoing Z. I am hard pressed to believe a SB cpu model with at least the same sized battery won't do better than the present, which actually ranges from 3.5-6 hrs, depending on so many use variables. So I don't know the source of your 5.5, but if that's an estimate under load, using the discrete gpu or looping HD video, it's a big improvement, if it's just for web surfing, and it's accurate, it's still a bit better than the present 6 cell does in the Z.

See below for the latest poop on the SA from Rachel. She'll probably chime in on this as well.

Rachel
Little Miss SuperMod



Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,832
Rep Power: 29


Re: Sony SA Series Discussion Sony's next new 13.3 laptop
<hr style='color:#EEEEEE' size='1'> Yes, the SB has been released but the SA hasn't and looks like it will do so around early June.

SB
GPU- Lower end models come with a 6470M and higher end models come with a 6630M. You can also cto with a 6630m.

Resolution is 1336x768

Chassis is made out of magnenisum and Aluminium palmrest

It's also meant to weigh heavier at approx 1.75kg but it's been weighed in at 1.69kg by a forum member.

SA

All models come with a 6630m card

It will use carbon fibre reinforced plastics and Aluminium palmrest.

It will also have a higher res 1600x900

It was meant to be lighter at approx 1.46kg 3.2lbs but that waits to be seen.

It's also going to be offered in different colours.

I think it's meant to use a better webcam

..............................................................
Possibly the SA might be a bit thinner

 

At the risk of repeating myself, saying the same thing more than once, pressing a point I have pressed before, (funny, right? ), I think Sony has the most ludicrous product line marketing scheme I've ever seen in a major computer manufacturer - or for any high ticket consumer durable, up to and including automobiles. I'd say Apple is at one end of that spectrum, with relatively few models with continuity of model designations through refreshes and upgrades, Lenovo is pretty much the same (a new "X" ultraportable every year, with a tablet companion, and so on up and down the line), and even HP has reasonble consistency in its Pavillion (DV/DM) and Envy lines (though it keeps adding Pavillion products to make sure there is isn't a single niche they don't have covered: a 14" - DM4 - and 14.5" - DV5 might be considered overkill, lol). Then there's Asus, which appears to aim for 3-5 products in each market segment, just to be sure they capture not only the long endurance/integrated weak gpu/aluminum 13" and 14" as well as similar configurations in choice of bamboo and plastic and the same for DTRs, netbooks and budget lines; at least you know that if it begins with a U and has a bunch of numbers and letters after it, it will be anywhere from 12" - 14" , have a mushy keyboard and long battery life, and is likely to change designs and components available at least monthly, and cost $700-$849 no matter what its configuration! Dell's lines are more like Sony's - just look at their "Studio", "Studio XPS" and "XPS" lines over the past 2 years; the Studio 15 alone has been reincarnated and expanded thrice since late 2009! But Sony really wins the crown for "retiring" model designations mostly every 1-2 years and coming out with something a little better and something a little worse than the newly retired model, until soon they will be vying with Asus for the number of models that begin with the same letter (Sony's pick this year appears to be "E," which didn't exist last year and now has, like 5 variations), but pretty soon will have a product line for most of the alphabet, though it isn't shy to go with double-letter models, which should give them plenty of room to expand to, well , 26X26 separate models!

All kidding aside - well, most anyway - you'd think a product which is known to migrate every 6 months or so, would develop more loyalty if it evolved consistently. It makes more sense that MBP 13 C2D 2010 owners would be jazzed to trade up to the MBP 13 SB 2011 model. Same with old to new MBA. There seems to be so much confusion and overlap in the E, C and S lines - and now even Z --> SA seems to be the logical migration path so add Z to the list of confusing, inconsistent model designation, such that an owner of one looking to upgrade can be confident only that he/she is probably going to be buying a different model designation next year than they had this year or last. Personally, I think it cheapens the brand and it's products (but don't tell the people shelling out $2,000-$5,000 for slightly better and/or slightly lighter versions of what they can buy for half the price and lose just a a feature or two and gain a couple of ounces to a pound; the scheme seems to work on them, and they deliver lots of "Sony tax" profits, at margins that would make Apple blush. [continues scratching head..."they must know something about marketing that no one else has figured out..."...[mumbles...]

 

it was probably the SB i was reading about, i dont think it actually specified exactly what it was just "new S with sandy bridge".

that SA does sound ok, 1366 res would be too low but 1600x900 would probably suit me quite nicely, just hope its matte. and provided it DOES have the battery life, and optical drive, and 256gb ssd, and everything else on it is up to scratch on par with the current Z then id certainly consider the SA (but thats a lot of if's).

just a shame they didnt do a basic current Z upgrade, as others have said it is unique in that it has the power, ssd, optical, battery life and no other 13" has (shame it also had/STILL has a ridiculous price like no other 13" has but then thats sony for you, living off their old tv/walkman name for probably 15 years longer than they should have got away with).

 

@ lovelaptops . I don't though have any inside info. I'm not engaged with computers outside of this forum. Like a lot of members here I just randomly check places online and might find some info about the SA. Also, for some things I have a good memory about what's been previously posted about things more factual and i may just summarise what's already been posted. There are some members no doubt who do have some inside connections.

@ ewokuk the SA will most definetly likely come with 256GB RAID drives. The SB already offers this. Some models have also been sighted online-

emev posted some info about the SA1Z9E-

VPC-SA1Z9E 13.3"/i7-2620M/8GB/256GB SSD/HD663M 1GB/WIN7PRO/1.46KG zwart, 2.799,00

Battery capacity is smaller at 50w but judging by SB owners' feedback 6hrs battery life looks like it's possible with the SB/SA. Sony as well list the standard battery life up to 7hrs and up to 14 hrs with the smart battery.
According to the UK website the higher spec Z models was rated up to 5hrs battery life and the low end model was rated up to 7.5hrs.

I know some prospective Z owners might be intereted in the SA but there is a thread to discuss about the SA so further discussion about the SA at times may be better placed in the SA thread.

 

Nothing proves they will not simply upgrade Z.
What people call new Z may be something else(another letter?).
Beside the SA is not the Z.
Nothing proves that 1,5kg SA is its weight with battery.
Well wait and see?
By the way it is unsure if SA will have full HD option.

Everything written at this time is just rumours isnt it.

 

What do you guys believe the reason for moving the GPU outside the laptop is?

1) Design/Portability - make the laptop thinner, smaller, lighter, etc.

2) GPU Technology - technology increasing with non-discrete GPU's making them not required except for things like gaming

3) Capability - Does moving the GPU outside the laptop allow for some capability (like 3D)?

4) Future Vision/Strategy/Technology - Does Sony have some secret capability that they are laying out the foundation for?

5) None of the above

 

probly a combination of 1) and the possibility of having a stronger dGPU

 

The current Z is perfectly capable of 3D, I haven't tried games in 3D but it does a fine job with 1080P Blu-ray 3D.

 

The Z can also be thought of as the testing ground for technology that may be suitable for other models. Given that (a) people may not need muscular GPUs all the time, (b) the trend is towards thinner laptops, and that (c) integrated chips are getting more powerful, Sony may be looking at having external GPUs as a common platform across all its models.

 

Pretty much all of the above, plus battery life.

• The Whistler XT is a serious GPU. It will suck battery like crazy. My gaming laptop has the predecessor chip, and it gets one hour of runtime on battery. This GPU is only going to be usable while plugged in.
• The integrated graphics will run pretty much anything just fine, with the exception of newer games. From what I've read, games like Left for Dead and World of Warcraft are no problem with the integrated graphics.
• Leaving off the optical drive and GPU puts the Z into the weight class of the MBA and Toshiba 700, the lightest ones around. It also gives excellent battery life, which was the main shortcoming of the current Z.

I think this is a really exciting design. I just don't see any downside. (Except perhaps for hard-core gamers, who should be buying an Alienware or equivalent anyway.)

 

On another note...

I see much gnashing of teeth over whether there will be a 1080p display option. I'm interested in why people would want this. Wouldn't a 1600x900 option already have pretty darned small text on a 13" display?

 

I've got the 1080 screen and love it. It's great for working on PS and Illustrator where extra desktop space is nice to have without needing a second monitor. I scale my DPI to 125% and use ctrl+ + on webpages and everything is fine. (But my eyes are also pretty good)

 

Its all personal preference. I wouldn't want to lose the 1080P option. But I wouldn't want to force it on everyone as well, leave that as the only display option, especially those perhaps but not as good vision.

I'd really like to see the Z come back! I hope Sony didn't kill it off for good.
: (

 

I'd like 1080p precisely because my vision isn't that good. A 10 pt font at 1920x1080 is a lot more readable than a 10 pt font at 1360x768, especially for serif fonts.

Right now, my Z is 1600x900, but I would like higher.

 

I use the Z primarily to run Visual Studio 2010, that is what pays the bills. 1080P is a must for me. Just this morning I had breakfast at a local cafe and got some work done. Sure the screen is small but I have just as much real estate as when I used the laptop at the desk hooked up to my 40" 1080P BRAVIA. If they drop 1080P on the new model there is no chance I will buy it.

 

And added to these, if you do photo/video editing on your lappy then you can fit more of the image on the screen since the toolbars are smaller as well as having a better perception of the image sharpness due to more pixels (i.e. you look at a BIGGER picture with FINER rendering).

I have 1600X900 and can't wait to change to 1920X1080.

Anyway, this is an old dispute going back to the last gen, so let's not open this Pandora's box Horses for courses / personal preference.

 

Here's the lineage so far:

S series 13.3" -> SZ series 13.3" -> VGN-Z 13.1" -> VPC-Z 13.1"

now Z was the obvious "upgrade" to the SZ, and the screen size changed. You're saying it can't change back? just want to clarify.

Just a crazy thought here, but imagine if you could own one external GPU unit and use it for a 13" or an 11" VAIO. that would be cool. The old docking stations always had to be tied to a particular notebook model since they had to have the same footprint. Since that restriction is now gone it's not out of the question that Sony could be really nice to us and make the accessories universal. Though I do realise that Beaups said the external unit would be "bundled".

 

Thanks folks. Wasn't trying to bicker or open Pandora's box. Was just interested in what people thought.

 

Thanks for the info beaups!
I would also like a 1080p display.

 

I'm kinda warming to the new Z concept. Graphics would only be of rare interest to me so the external unit on an as needed basis may work out well.

Based on the comments here, it sounds like I may be one of the few interested in buying the new Z as described. Of course, that could change is someone comes out with a 4lber with a quad-core.