New Sony Vaio Z speculation/news thread

It's a physical button, but how do you know pressing it doesn't trigger a software program to disconnect the PMD (eg: unload the devices in Windows)?

Translation of the screenshot:
1. Shut down all games, video players, web browsers, and other applications that use graphics.
2. Press the UNDOCK button.
3. Confirm that the IN USE light has turned off.
4. Disconnect the docking station cable from the main unit.
CAUTION: If you disconnect the docking station cable while the IN USE lamp is on, you may lose unsaved data and the computer may become unstable.
[ ] Do not show this message again.

Previous Z used nVidia Optimus for switchable graphics. New Z2 now uses ATI in the PMD. Although ATI does offer a similar switchable graphics system, availability is very low (we don't know if it's even present in the new Z2), and it's simply not as mature as Optimus. The fact that Sony suggests you close all apps before disconnecting the PMD suggests to me that ATI's version of switchable graphics is not present in the Z2.

Again, under normal conditions, this isn't really a problem. Just take the extra 10 seconds to close apps and press UNDOCK. The problem is what happens when the PMD loses power, and how does the Z2 handle disconnects during standby/hibernate.

So what happens if you get a BSOD while the OS is in the middle of sending data to the disk?

 

^^

I don't think the Z used optimus...otherwise the graphics switch wouldn't have been there.

 

i only stated that there is a physical button rather than a software button, didn't mention anything about the physical button triggering a program

i assume it triggers some sony software that in turn gives you some form of notification, however, it's possible that the sony software isn't necessary to dock/undock from the pmd

and the Z has never had optimus

 

Optimus was present, but you had to hack your way around with custom INFs to get it up and running. I don't know if Sony simply used a proprietary driver to hook into existing Optimus compatibility to add support for the manual hardware switch, or if Optimus was disabled completely.

Of course, if the Z2 UNDOCK button is the same as the Z1 hardware switch (just a trigger to unload devices), then there's no real difference in how you would disconnect the discrete GPU under normal conditions. But it still doesn't address what happens if the suddenly PMD loses power. Since the one review showed how disconnecting the cable without first properly undocking (arguably the same as if the PMD lost power) causes a BSOD, it doesn't look very promising.

 

Your thinking is correct.

 

all in all if the new Z has the GPU switching problem, i think i will be able to fix via driver or patch anyway

 

I don't think it does. nVidia only announced Optimus in Feb 2010 [1]. First laptops were available in March/April 2010 [2], by which stage Z was already out wasn't it?

The nVidia GPU probably supports Optimus, but I don't think Sony uses it.

[1] NVIDIA Optimus Technology Delivers Perfect Balance Of Notebook Performance And Battery Life
[2] NVIDIA Optimus automates graphics switching, promises the best of both worlds -- Engadget

 

actually that's exactly when the Z was released here in the US. Leaked at CES, announced in Feb, available for preorder in March. However, i think sony just took it's experience from the VGN-Z which also had a graphics switch (it was on core 2 duo, so the mobo actually had both an iGPU and a discrete one!)

 

...replaced post with corrected version, above.

 

There is one thing you're leaving out of the equation: Windows. Macs run like crap in Boot Camp, like 25%-50% worse, and most of the target market will, I believe, want to run Windows. Enter the Sammy 9, which will also cream the MBP's performance and battery life in Windows, though it will have to cut price and have a 256GB SSD option to match Apple.

Sony, meanwhile, seems glad to price the Z at a 50%-100% premium to all competitors, thus the 256GB Z2, at some $2,500 is, right where they want to be, with a 0.5 lb weight advantage and nearly $200/ounce saved price premium . Seems they are determined to keep the Z from serving anything but a tiny, exclusive niche market.

I truly dread the idea of the Air becoming the professional/business class must-have fashion accessory, as this will catapult Apple into the forefront of yet another key market segment - ours - with a total of 2 products. And it will happen; I just don't want this thread to perpetuate the fiction that it is a superior product for most users. .

(Exits, stage left, looking discouraged but hopeful, and dazzling the stage with a blinding reflection of "VAIO" from the spotlights above onto the seemingly weightless computer below in his hand)

 

^^

Not to mention that the white Macbook is discontinued (or should I say, replaced). As far as ultraportables go, the Air gives the best bang for the buck, but the Z gives more bang

 

Why? It's stock standard PC hardware, and Apple provides an OK set of drivers.

No one I've spoken to has complained about PC performance on their Mac. And I haven't noticed anything terrible on the various Macs that I have.

 

Agreed. Amazingly, the Z1, if made today with same previous-gen. hdwe and sold for $1,599 with 256GB SSD quite doable, would be a far better bang for the buck than today's MBP - more bang for same bucks. Not that this could happen, but it says something if you could get an all-around better UP notebook using last year's components. Hmm, didn't someone introduce a "refresh" of their UP notebook in late 2010, using early 2009 C2D LV cpu? Can't recall what it was called, but it definitely had "Air" in the name.

 

It's known that battery life suffers greatly when running Windows on a Mac (when compared to the Mac running OSX).

sigh, sometimes (fine, all the time) I wish I could run Sony's Z division.

 

I think it only applies to the 15 and 17 inch models though. You can't turn off the discrete card when running Windows on those, but on the 13 inch, there is no discrete card.

 

even with VGN-Z you didn't need to close all the apps in order to switch GPU, though it does show you warning message some apps are running or so.

I agree screen flicker is annoying, but I guess it has to be done that way, as you physically shut down one GPU before second kick in.

Question: If I want to watch movies via ATI, do I need to plug HDMI cable in PMD or I can still plug it in laptop? And is there any difference (quality-wise) watching HD movies via HD3000 and ATI?


Cheers,
Miki

 

You're hired! What will be your first new product? Features, price?

I would have to research it as to reason, but it is about more than just discrete vs. integrated graphics, because the overall cpu performance (eg, Cinebench, PC Mark Vantage, geekbench, etc.) is significantly lower in Windows mode, as is the graphics performance, whichever gpu it might be using. I will look up particulars.

While on the subject, I will take the opportunity for a couple of pot shots:

Screen: New MBA uses same 13" display; average brightness of 300 nit pales next to Sony Z1 at 360 and Samsung 9 at 400! Contrast ratio decent at 640 but exceeded by both Z1/Z2 and S9 by about 200 pts. resolution of MBA is 1440x900 vs. full 900p or 1080p for Z1/Z2. Subjectively, the MBA 13" display is good, but not even close to the Z's - 900p or 1080p. Did I mention that the MBA is the only one with a GLOSSY display? Hmm, what were they thinking?

Thanks for the free kick in the teeth - late night/early morning special.

 

I really think you're underestimating the hatred towards windows and overestimating how much users care about the OS relative to the hardware itself - there are TWO consumer OSes, but there are MANY chassis.

the macbook air 11 is likely going to be the entry level laptop for anyone with some degree of money. Honestly, i hope i'm right. PC OEMs are utterly pathetic with their chassis designs*. I have no confidence that they will reach the design level of the MBA, but maybe, JUST MAYBE, they will split the difference between what is out now and the MBA*.

ps, before someone starts bringing up the vaio z2(NO WAI), i'm talking about being able to afford a chassis of that quality at more entry-level prices.

 

Of course, there's a key difference between switching the Z1 and Z2. With the Z1, when you change from speed to stamina, the PC does not have to make that change - it can wait until it's done everything it needs to do, software wise, before changing (which is done on startup if you make the change when the PC is in sleep mode). With the Z2, if you physically disconnect without letting it "do its stuff" (e.g. by ignoring the pop-up or with the PC off), it has no choice but to try to cope with the new situation. I can see why that could result in BSODs, unless the drivers are very well written.

 

Here are 2 pics of the Z2 vs Macbook Air 13"
???????????:Core i???????????MacBookAir???????Z21?????????????

 

I popped into the Tottenham Court Road Sony store yesterday to see if they had a Z2 on display yet, and as it happened they were just unpacking the display model they'd been sent. I managed to get a few minutes with it.

It is really thin! It's only just thick enough for the ports to fit.
When you pick it up it feels like it must be a hollow mock up, but it was working It feels noticeably lighter than my Z1.
The trackpad seemed fine, and unlike other pads with integrated buttons it didn't get confused between touch and button clicking as the black strip at the bottom where the buttons are is not touch sensitive, there is room to hold the left button with your thumb and drag using a finger without it moving the pointer to the bottom left of the screen. Better than the Z1 then as it's buttons are a little too thin.
The keyboard has a lot less travel, I only had time to open notepad and type a sentence and it worked fine for me, no missed characters. It's just different. The backlight on the keyboard doesn't illuminate around the keys now, just the symbols and a pale green and blue.
The screen was a 1600x900, seemed much the same as the Z1 (i.e. very good).
New hinge, I liked the way it lifts the notebook to give space for airflow, I didn't get to sit with it on my lap though, closest I got was sitting the hinge across my outstretched palms, it didn't feel at all sharp so I'm hoping it will be okay on a lap instead.
PMD - I saw it briefly, it is quite thin and compact, must like any other external usb dvd drive except with the neat slot loading. Personally I don't think I would get it, and just get a usb blu-ray or dvd drive for a fraction of the price if I wanted to be able to play discs.

 

Yes... I am wondering if *only* a more extreme solution similar to VMs will work, i.e. the Windows OS needs be suspended the moment the disconnect is detected. After the suspension the important bits that are related to the external GPU will then have to be (1) found and (2) altered to work with the internal GPU. If this can be easily done, it would have been achieved with the Z1 (i.e. we won't have a message telling us to close certain programs before the Z1 switches GPUs).

And before this switching can be done, there is the prior issue of OS state suspension. Windows might run in a VM, albeit a much trimmed down version, but what will that VM run on? Another Windows OS? Not to mention the possibly non-trivial decrease in performance running in a VM...

 

It's nice to know I stand apart from the crowd.

 

Yes, not many people wear hats these days.

 

With the refresh of the MBA, Apple has re-positioned themselves as the leader of heavy, slow but relatively budget-priced ultralight clunkers.

Is there a set of specs out on the new Z's 1080p screen?

Three. I'll likely be installing Linux Mint on the new Z if the graphics will work. I'll definitely be installing LibreOffice. Why buy crappy Microsquish software when I can get better for free? (although I'll probably send in a donation.).

 

anyone here know what is the weight of sony z11 with out battery?

 

It is the exact same screen as the Z1

 

IIRC the battery is 380 grams so subtracting that from the 1.4 kilos of the Z1 it's approx 1020g, or 1.02 kg.

 

I humbly corrected it. Hope I do not offend anyone with the above correction.

MBAs are heavy & slow? You might want to check out the following link, even though I humbly think that benchmarking doesn't mean anything.

Early Benchmarks Reveal New MacBook Air Rivaling High-End 2010 MacBook Pro - Mac Rumors

 

I think he means slow as a reference to the ULV processors.



In terms of things I'd like to see done to the US market:
Offer more options (wireless cards, colors, etc.)
Offer the ability to not have the PMD which will increase sales since it's a lower price point and I suspect many users won't have a use for the PMD.
Offer the "entry" Signature Z with 8GB RAM instead of the weird 6GB.

Although that isn't asking for much, it's more of a "when pigs fly" statement.

 

^thats only cuz of the ssd. and the mbp isnt sb

 

Yep, you're totally correct.

However, based solely on those benchmarks only, I cannot help but think that my VAIO VPC-Z1 (not counting the dedicated GPU power) is only slightly better than those new MBAs.

 

Time to get a z2!

 

so roughly around the weight of new z more or less, now i get an idea. just remove my Z battery damnnnn it is so light

 

I would love to, but I simply cannot afford it right now.

I just bought my very high spec VAIO VPC-Z13 notebook (brand new) in mid-May for quite a good chunk of money. Worse of all is that I can see myself losing at least 50% of the price I paid for it selling that right now, which isn't really a smart thing to do. Now, I really regret being too rash in buying my VAIO Z13 notebook. I should have been a bit more patient.

 

My Z weighs even less after removing the dummy express card

 

Well, the new MacBook Airs are out... and I have to admit, I am EXTREMELY disappointed in them.

I wasn't expecting anything huge, but I was expecting a jump in battery life. Apparently they have slightly LESS battery life.

Does anyone know if Sony ever has huge coupons or sales, like $400 off or something for the Z, based on past history?

 

^Where do you find that new Z has more battery life??? Is there a comparision with the same program/setting?

 

Sure, heavy and slow compared with the new Z. The updated Air is about the weight of the SA/SB while using ULV processors. Compared with the Lighter-Than-Air Z which is significantly faster, has higher resolution, brighter, higher contrast displays, and up to double the RAM, the new MBA is a clunker but may be suitable for some budget-minded shoppers.

 

With the slice battery, it has MUCH more battery life.

11" MBA - 4.5 hours

13" MBA - 6.5 hours

Sony Z w/o slice - 5.5-7 hours

Sony Z w/ slive - 10-12 hours

 

Macbook Air has an attractive design but, honestly, I prefer the Z2.

No doubt the new Macbook Air is going to sell ALOT of copies.

For someone who doesn't game or use graphically intensive programs (the majority) I'd see no reason to purchase a Macbook Pro over a Macbook Air.

You know Sony is pricey when they are at a 70% premium to Apple lol.

 

The problem is that (if I'm not wrong) Z value are from a different website.. am I right??? It's not the best way make a comparison of life battery between different review from different website (probably different way of test)..

In addition, why does Z endure only for 10-12 hours with sheet battery?? Sheet battery is a little more capacity, so it's at least strange..

Anyway, I'm changin' configuration.. probably this one:

i5 2540m
4GB ddr
NO PMD
NO sheet battery
Backlit Keyboard
SSD 256GB 3rd gen
Premium Carbon
900p/1080p (didn't decided yet... can somebody tell me how is visualization of desktop at 900p ON a 1080p on old Z?? I'd like to understand how is it.. bad or not)
I'd love to put 8GB ddr but it costs too much.. I can barely afford this config, with 8GB it would be impossible for me.

 

Have you used a VAIO X before? If so, how does the Z compare to the X? I'm worried the travel is going to be a problem - I've read several reviews that have noted the keyboard's less than stellar feel.

Very nicely put. There will be a day when the general public associate premium ultra-thin with Apple's MBA, if they have not already done so. It isn't really Sony's fault - they have done everything they could to stay on top of the pack with regards to the ultra-portable category. Apple's just banking on several valid factors that have steered the crowd largely toward them, namely - OSX, form factor and the brand name.

The latter 2 is entirely in Sony's court to fight. I've always thought of Sony as the premier laptop maker. No other brand out there makes better laptops than them. They have also always been ahead of the curve with laptop technology.

Nevertheless, OSX has been the single largest factor in the bid to make the MBA (and MBP) the kings of the laptop sphere. Just a cursory glance around the laptop wielders in town has seen one too many Apple logos abound. Most of my friends are so fond of OSX that they swear by it. On the other hand, Windows users aren't too keen (or defensive) to stand by it. It seems almost religious, doesn't it?

 

I swear by Windows. I have a Mac sitting on the floor in the corner gathering dust. OSX is great for some specialized task and any basic tasks. When it comes to getting real work done Windows is where it's at. To be fair my work calls for C# development with Visual Studio. If I was paid to do Java development then I guess a Mac would work just as well for that. For surfing the web, and sending emails a Mac is pretty great for most people.

When I go to the coffee shops around here I see either new Macs or ancient DELLs that just won't die. My girl and I are probably the only people in town with VAIOs. I do live in an economically depressed piece of crap town though (the capital city, LOL). A new Z2 would be like 2 months pay for most people around here.

 

AMEN! Those OLD OLD OLD OLD OLD Inspirons that EVERYONE seems to have...

 

There is no doubt that that period of time was Dell's most successful days....

 

Sheet battery seems essentially to double battery life. Not sure why you find that strange. 10 - 12 hours seems pretty sweet to me, but I have been working from a Dell that gives under 3.

I am sympathetic to your limits on spending but wonder why you might choose the carbon fiber and 1080p over the additional 4GB ddr? In the U.S. the extra ddr costs $200. Although the carbon fiber and 1080 would be great, isn't the ddr more essential? I am Just asking this for my own curiosity, since I also am trying to figure out what I "need" and what I could leave out to hold down cost.

 

u from south east asia?

 

If the inner battery which is 4000 mA can reach 7 hours.. that's why I find odd only 12 hours and not 14 with the sheet battery that is 4400 mA...

Well, we can say that in part, is not from my budget, that's why in this case I want a powerful, very light, well made ultraportable. 1080p here is +40€ and Premium Carbon is +20€.. 8GB ddr is +155€ .. at the moment, my limit is near 2100-2150€ ... not 2250€.. I know it's only 100€ plus (without premium carbon and 1080p) but.. I have other plan with those 100€ XD
Anyway, we'll see.. maybe I'll obtain some extra budget in some way. For sure, Premium Carbon and 1080p it's not so important..

 

LMAO so true about the coffee shops.

OSX is visually attractive I just can't switch over.

I actually tried at some point but PCs just have so much more customize-ability it seems to me. It was the equivalent to trying to change my shooting form in basketball.