Z1 + ViDock + GTX 570 > FTW (the Z2/PMD killer)

My next upgrade is to replace my 128GB SSD raid with either dual Intel x18 160GB drives and a 600GB SSD in the ODD bay, or dual Crucial 1.8 256GB drives and Crucial 2.5 512GB drive in the ODD bay. It is going to come down to availability. That will be either 920GB of SSD or 1TB of SSD, either way... try sticking that in your Z2! NOT GONNA HAPPEN!!

Don't get me wrong, I'll be buying a Z2 soon, but the fact that you can't upgrade the drives means I need to get the funds together to get 512GB right out of the gate.

 

You've got to do it big, and in order to do that, you should try and beat the 1TB SSD configuration from the Japan spec Z14 just for kicks.

Are the largest 1.8" SSDs currently 256GB and likewise 512GB for 2.5"?

 

PM me... I will hook you up on the Crucial drives. I have two 256GB to get rid of and you have been a great help to the community.

Also, I seemed to have found a smokin' hot deal on Z2 config's. I am not going to post the details for a mad rush, but those of you that want to PM me, I will share the details.

 

Largest 2.5" is Intel 600GB, I am pretty sure the biggest 1.8" is 256GB
I didn't know the Z14 came with 1TB, where do you see that?

Thanks PM sent

 

Sony Z14 was only available in Japan and was released around December or so of 2010. The ONLY difference between the 14 and 13 is that it had the option for a 1TB SSD in Raid 0- (So maybe there are 512GB 1.8" SSD? Or it's 4X 256GB SSDs sandwiched together?) It was on the Sony JP website, don't know if it is any more.

So I guess, have you ever considered a 4X 1.8"SSD in Raid 0?

 

TripleDot char 10

 

yea... but I only have 3 cables. The 4x setups in the Z series were all sandwich drives with the FFC cables. I have the 2X mSATA for the main drives and the SATA for the optical drive. How would I hook up more?

 

Added 3D mark comparison to the first post

 

^Did you run 1280x1024 when testing the Z2? Does it make a difference?

In all honesty, I think your setup is very cool, but it's not really similar to what the Z2/PMD is after. I mean you have a 300W monster on your desk, no internal lcd support, no boot while plugged in, no usb 3, etc.

I'm not knocking you, I just don't see it as competition to what the Z2 is after.

 

You can drive the internal display.
I ran the default settings for 3DMark, it was running on my WQXGA monitor with the desktop at full resolution, I don't know if that makes any difference.

The VAIO boots while plugged in, I solved that problem. No USB3 is true, and the size of it is rather large. I think that 90% of what it does is exactly what the PMD does, better graphic performance when docked.

 

If you apply the ViDock approach to a Z2, you would still have a USB 3-compatible port that you wouldn't be using for the PMD. Although, as I've discussed, for me the Z1 + ViDock isn't a Z2 killer, a Z2 + TB ViDock (when available) will be a killer compared to anything remotely comparable. CC's work on Z1 +ViDock may end up quite influential for some Z2 owners.

 

yes the port on the Z2 will work as USB3 when you are not docked

 

Does it drive the internal display? All I've seen is speculation. And we have up to date optimus drivers, and no nvidia watermark?

90% of what the Z2 dock does? Optical drive, gigabit ethernet, usb 3, power and charge the laptop?

 

USB 3 and portability is the only difference from my view. Since the drive is already in the Z1, and I have no need for another network jack. And since we know the ViDock is not something you would tote around, the power jack is a non issue.

Just waiting for Sony to ship. I want to see true gaming scores. Overclocked and optimized.

 

The vidock setup will surely smoke the Z in gaming. Cowboy doesn't game, though I bring up Ethernet and power because one of the points of a dock is a quick, single connection to access all your peripherals. The vidock doesn't provide that. Well, the z2 dock doesn't either if you don't want to use USB audio, but it's a lot closer than the vidock in my opinion.

I think it's a cool setup, especially for gamers, I just don't see it as a "Z2/PMD killer".

 

@beaups I have a Z1 dock and the ViDock so all I am really missing is USB3.
Lets not forget that the ViDock drives WQXGA monitors and the Z2 can only drive WUXGA monitors. That is a pretty big difference.

As I noted the the Z1 + ViDock gets nearly double the 3DMark Score of the Z2 + PMD, that alone would justify the "killer" adjective.

I am planning on purchasing the Z2 just as soon as I can find $4,500 that I don't need to spend on something I don't need. (shouldn't be too long) I am kind of going to be taking a leap of faith hoping that Village will come through with a LightPeak compatible ViDock. Without WQXGA support the Z2 will only be useful to me as a portable.

 

^Ah I hadn't considered you were using the regular Z dock as well. Fair point. You do have to shut down and reboot every time you dock and undock with the vidock, or no?

ViDock is "killer" in 3d performance. PMD is "killer" in working properly, connectivity, portability, convenience, and power consumption.

I'll be receiving a couple Z2's tomorrow (for good, finally). I'll run them through their paces, but I wouldn't expect gaming performance to be anywhere near your 570 setup.

 

I don't have to power down to connect/disconnect
I wouldn't say that the PMD works any better than the ViDock, either one if you just rip the plug out, you are going to have a problem, need to un-dock first.
I think the power consumption is a moot point, the PMD has a big brick, mine has 2 bricks, so what? The PMD is more portable, but again, so what?

I just don't understand the argument, bottom line is performance. Dragging the PMD around is not the intended usage scenario for the Z2. I only need my ViDock, or PMD in the near future, at home/office for work. It is not like the PMD runs off of batteries.

The only place the Z2/PMD wins is portability, but they made a helluva lot of sacrifices to get there. I still want one, because it is new, and expensive and Sony, it seems only logical that I should have it.

 

^You don't understand the argument or just don't agree?

I personally think the vidock is a far inferior solution, with the exception of 3D performance. I've gone over the points - usb 3.0, charge passthrough, ethernet, portability, power consumption, ability to drive internal display (you still won't confirm this works for me), and asthetics.

I think you've mentioned it doesn't play nice with Sony's drivers, so you have to hack the bios to enable static switching, right (losing dynamic switching)? Not to mention, according to others here, a 570 draws too much peak power for the vidock - stability.

Again, I sincerely think it's a cool setup for the hardcore gamer. It's just not a "Z2+PMD killer". IMO, of course.

 

I really don't have a clue. Maybe order the cable that the quad raid computers have if possible?

 

Don't agree. Anyway the real PMD killer will be the ViDock for Z2/LP.

That cable is proprietary FFC for the sandwich drives. If I could get my hands on that and the sandwich drives that the Z14 used for the 1TB RAID... then I could still use the ODD bay for one more SSD. I don't think that is going to happen.

 

If anyone is interested, I have a 2 day old ViDock 4 Plus unit I am selling. It didn't end up working out for me in my usage scenario. Send me a PM, US Only.

Y2J

 

Just to expand a little on my above post. The Z13 definitely has issues with the ViDock 4 Plus. The jumpers on the unit have no effect of being able to boot with the ViDock 4 Plus plugged in, it doesn't POST with the jumpers in or out when the ViDock is plugged in. As far as gaming, it works pretty well when you are playing on an external monitor. I tested MLB2K11 on a 1920x1200 monitor with a 570 and it was able to keep the FPS around 60. The problem is when you try to use it to drive the internal LCD, mine is the 1600x900 version, the FPS are limited to under 30, which is less than what the GT 330M gives you. Then I have the hassle of getting error 43 on the GT 330M when I try to install any non-Sony drivers. Seems to be Sony did a little something different on the Z13 that makes it not as friendly with any non Sony video drivers, ie, I can't get any Non-Sony video drivers to make the GT 330M to work without the error 43 and I have tried several things....

Y2J

 

Sony didn't do anything different with the Z13, all of your problem could be fixed with software tweaks and maybe the BIOS hack. Seems to me that you are giving up rather easily. There is a thread that explains a lot about how to get all of this stuff working well http://forum.notebookreview.com/gam...rds/418851-diy-egpu-experiences.html#nonvideo

 

Well, if you consider the fact that I spent nearly 35 hours on this project already and my intention was to be able to easily plug the ViDock in when I am at my desk, and then be able to disconnect the ViDock, and reboot using the internal GT330M when on the road or traveling without having to uninstall nvidia drivers and reinstall the Sony hybrid drivers I'm not sure I am giving up to early. It seems that I can't find any posts of anyone with a Z13 that has successfully installed Optimus drivers for the internal Nvidia GT330M which seems to be my biggest issue right now, not so much the ViDock. Still looking though.

Y2J

 

why not do the BIOS hack, then install my modded 330M drivers, then the drivers for the 570? You can then just use the tri switch to disable the 330M at you desk, and enable it when you need it on the road. I don't need to re-install drivers to switch GPUs

 

So dumb question, what position should the tri switch be in when I am trying to get Optimus drivers working with the internal GT 330M? I was assuming Speed, but maybe I am wrong...

Thanks,

Y2J

 

yea you have it right. As far as I am concerned the Optimus drivers are crap though. Too many issues, just use the Vanilla drivers with the INF mod.

 

35 hours to setup a vidock to semi-working status? I wonder how many minutes it takes to get the PMD working correctly? The PMD is obviously the far most elegant solution. The only reason a vidock makes any sense to me would be if for some strange reason you could not possibly have a desktop AND are a hardcore gamer or progammer/coder with a 30" screen.

I love my Z1, it's the greatest piece of tech i have EVER owned. When I'm home though, I use my desktop 90% of the time. If you have a vidock setup, you essential have a desktop setup as you can't as easily pick it up and move to the living room or bedroom as you can with a PMD. I respect the fact that half the fun of the vidock is getting non-standard hardware to work in a way it was never intended to work, but sometimes it's just not worth the blood, sweat and tears

 

Well I don't know what 35 hours was spent on. It didn't take me long to get mine working just the way I wanted it to.

You are right in the sense that this setup is for a small niche, but I don't see that as a fault. We are a small niche here. When you come to the forums it seems like everyone is into the Z... but that is because everyone here is into the Z. We are a very small niche.

Anyway I am glad I tried this out, I have a great solution that works for me now, and it seems that I have inspired Crystal to make a whole bunch of noise to get us a ViDock for the Z2 which will actually have the bandwidth to do some serious work.

I assure you getting a WQXGA going was worth the effort. Honestly that effort was mostly just buying the parts, getting it working was maybe an hour or two of trial and error.

 

WQXGA is a treat, i agree. Whenever I have to get my 30" to downgrade to 1920x1200 to match the flanking 24's for some eyefinity gaming, I can't wait to move back up once I'm done.

I plan on replacing the U2412's with the U3011's future replacement so that I have triple 30's and it will be fantastic once I have a Z with a mini-dp that can output WQXGA to them, might use my future Z at home more often over my awesomely mighty but space heater-ish desktop :\

 

Yes, triple U3011 is what I am eventually shooting for. My dream would be to have a GTX590 (or whatever is boss after that) hooked up to the Z2 with three U3011's.

 

Why not seek a refund instead of incurring a $$ loss for your efforts?

Getting a refund for a VD4+

There have been recently discovered issues with VT's hardware and breaches of licensing agreements that are presented below for VD owners to evaluate and perhaps pursue to obtain a refund. Those being:

1) VT's expresscard 2.0 compatibility claim has discovered to be false in practice by a Series-6 (pci-e 2.0) Lenovo X220 + GTX570 here. Unless that is resolved, it may mean connecting your VD4+ to a future Series-6 system is not going to provide x1 2.0 (doubling) of bandwidth.

2) VT have been violating the DIY ViDock/eGPU Setup 1.x software's free for non commercial use license for what appears to be at least the last 6 months, supplementing their hardware with this software to disable the GT330M on a Z11-Z13 VD4+ implementaton. This is shown in their support email here. Without a mechanism to disable the GT330M, the Optimus driver will not engage nor will pci-e compression. Running a Optimus eGPU on a notebook also requires modded INF files containing desktop driver entries which users of production systems may not want to use since it gives the WHQL warning.

Without Optimus' pci-e compression engaged a NVidia card like a GTX570 will benchmark lower than than the GT330M. You'd see a 3dmark06 of around 5.5k, whereas a desktop would see > 20k so is nowhere near the wild claims of 90% of a x16 2.0 desktop performance VT make.

 

This is why I strongly contest the claim of "Z2+PMD killer". It's a neat hack, nonetheless.

 

I did not sell mine after trying to use it for months only because I was lazy to put it on ebay (and somehow I expected a miracle). Guess what... miracle happened today. I hacked the z1 rom and changed vga to static (as suggested earlier). Then I booted with the graphics to Stamina --- did not work. rebooted with graphics to Speed --- viola ! Repeated multiple times and works smooth every time. (one more thing, I removed both jumpers to give 8 sec delay to VD4+ -- again as suggested earlier in the forum (Thanks ComputerCowboy! for both tips).
So it seems like the intel graphics driver was causing the problem.
The VD4 customer service, with my months of communication with them, was lousy and useless!
It was a pain looking at unusable 2560x1600 monitor sitting on my desk for 1 year! what a relief !
(My setup was Z1 + ViDock4+ + Asus 5670)

 

^ awesome... glad I could help. Feel free to give me some rep

 

I'm starting to think that the fact that my Z13 has built-in wireless is what is causing my headaches. I tried the Bios hack yesterday and set the bios to static. When the switch is set to stamina I installed the Intel drivers. I then reboot and try to plug in the GTX 570 and the Standard VGA graphics adapter turns to a yellow exclamation along with the Bluetooth adapter and my wireless adapter. Maybe there are too many devices on the PCI bus? The only time I successfully could get the dock to work was to use the DIY eGPU menu and disable the GT330M and then run compaction, and I believe I got it to work that way...After all of this, I may just jump on the Z2 bandwagon...as I like the flexibility it offers and may suit my needs better...I am less busy at work today, so I am going to play around with it a little more...

 

You should boot in stamina with the ViDock already connected. Then you can hot plug it as much as you like. Hot plugging doesn't seem to work very well if the system is not booted with the ViDock first. I had the same sort of issues with WiFi/BT not working.

 

Have been keeping a very beady eye on this thread. Thanks to ComputerCowboy for his efforts in not only pursuing this but sharing the experiences! If only I'd read all this before buying a Matrox TH2GO and another dell 24" only to discover multiple 24" will not work with my Z1's HDMI port, ffs. But never mind, that hardware now sits at work, and that runs well with a 2 1/2 yr old dell work laptop that has a DisplayPort, and my productivity and happiness in the office has been boosted a a result ;O)
So here is the dilemma. As a Z1 owner who isn't bothered about gaming, but keen for 2 x 30" U3011, should I get a ViDock4Plus, a GeForce GTX570 for the z1 or would the money be better spent on a Z2 with PMD?

 

You can't run two U3011's with the Z2 PMD, well you can but they will be running at WUXGA not WQXGA. We are working on a Z2 solution, either modding the PMD or getting a ViDock/DIY eGPU solution that plugs directly into the Z2. It looks like we will eventually be successful getting the Z2 to drive an eGPU of your choice, however this is speculation at this point, and it might involve a complex hack to the PMD.

You have a Z1 and you want to run 2X WQXGA right now? The Z1 with a ViDock or DIY eGPU is the way to go. It works, it is tested, it is proven. There are some things that make it less elegant than the PMD, as beaups likes to point out but, the elegance factor won't concern you very much when you have WQXGA on your desk.

 

Just an update, it seems the latest Intel HD Graphics drivers don't play nice in this setup, if I go back to the 15.21.12.64.2321 drivers, I can get the 570 recognized. Right now I have it in Optimus mode, now I need to figure out how to disable Optimus mode. It seems when running on the Internal LCD, the FPS in games are limited to 30FPS, which sucks for gaming. It does work alot better on an external monitor connected to the 570 in Optimus, getting at least 60FPS in some games, but it is a bit rickety. Now I want to try it on just the external monitor I have here without Optimus, I think I should just be able to install the standard Nvidia drivers and see if that improves performance.

Y2J

 

That is the way I have it here, and it is nice.

 

Well I just installed the latest 280.26 drivers and it seems to be working with the external monitor. Now I need to try and reboot in Speed mode and see if I can get the internal GT 330M to work. Still not sure if the setup fits me or not, but at least I am making progress!

 

Use these drivers for your 330M
http://forum.notebookreview.com/sony/602497-latest-vpc-z1-330m-drivers-bios-hack-people.html

 

Run setup.exe or just choose the driver manually?

 

run setup, that will work, it will give you a warning about not being certified, but that is OK, I certify it

 

I am very interested in this type of setup. This looks like the best ultra-portable on the market. I'm a programmer, so it'd be very helpful to have the 1920x1080 screen with such a portable laptop. I also play games in my free time. I am worried about CPU bottlenecks with an eGPU. I'm worried about how GTA IV (one of my favs, but games like Metro 2033 are also very CPU intensive) will perform with the dual core in the Z1. Should I just go with a desktop + Z1 setup? That would cost me much more and it would be so convenient to have everything on the same machine.

 

A desktop will give you much better performance, but you won't be able to take it with you. If you want only one machine then the Z1+PMD is the best you are going to get. I really can't comment on game playing or eGPU bottlenecks, I don't game. I can say one thing... if you are not in a big hurry, you might want to wait and see how the Z2 PMD project comes out. The Z2 has a faster CPU, faster RAM and if an eGPU can be made it will have 4x the bandwidth of the Z1 eGPU.

 

Hi guys, wondering if you can help?

• Have the done the BIOS hack and set static VGA
• Have uninstalled all graphics drivers (intel, and nVidia )
• have installed an older version of the intel drivers - Win7Vista_64_152113 (yes have tried newer ones at this step too)
• Have installed ComputerCowboy's modded nVidia 330M Version 280.26 drivers (after running the inf mod program)
• Have installed the GeForce GTX570 (evga) into the ViDock4Plus after removing the jumpers

Can't seem to get the z1 to recognise the 570 at all. There are blue lights inside the vidock, but the only way I can get the fan to kick in (very loud!) on the 570 is to plug it in after the z1 has booted, windows still does not recognise the card, Tried installing the 570 drivers from the CD, but they don't install as I get a "Your graphics driver could not find compatible hardware" error. Do I need to run the inf mod on the 570 drivers or something?

Any help would be really appreciated!

 

Yes you need to add the GTX570's hardware ids to the nvidia MOBILE driverset. Have a look in the egpu thread here. You find prepared driversets where you can just apply the 330M's mod and you are ready to go. Because of the fan issue, make sure you plugged in the two extra power cables to the GPU.