Win10x64Pro upgrade from Win8.1 thoughts and musings...

Then I apologize, I used Dude as you seem to want to be off the beaten path. May not mean smart leader(s) but it is where the big money is and where the market in the end will trend.

 

Then I'm sure you won't have any problems posting your balance sheets (or the relevant portions thereof) for the fiscal years of when you migrated yourself and your associates to Windows 7, 8 and 10, as your claims of increased productivity should have resulted in increased in revenue and profit.

Show us all what we are doing wrong.


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This is one area I disagree with you. Just because M$ says it will increase productivity. They have been saying that for so long now and it's kinda getting "old" . All IT department's must look at the cost savings and the budget they have to work with. With a new OS the cost goes up but the budget stays the same. W7 runs very good with no down time and stays within budget. Maybe down the road it will be there but now no.

 

Good ol' tiller ... "it works for me so it must work for everyone else"...

 

The Balance Sheet won't show that info. The P&L statement will.

And as soon as I deposit your certified cheque for the value of my companies, I will be pleased to show it to you (as it will be yours, then).

 

If you've been following along; it doesn't work just for me. It also works for the clients I've setup with Win10 too... sigh...


Along with another 14 million or so enterprise clients too...

 

I am not taking what MS or any other company states at face value. I do the required work to verify that for myself.

Saving money today is good for the bottom line for the next few quarters. Spending money/time wisely will give results indefinitely. And right now; $$$$ are not needed to move to Win10 (except for support costs which as I have repeated before; just like with Win8 Beta so long ago... it took me ~10 minutes to make the O/S (Win8, 8.1 and 10, each) do what I need it to do and also benefit from the underlying improvements too.

IT departments that look at (mostly) the bottom line will be frozen to act. The doing gets you the benefits; (not the synthetic/spreadsheet analysis of the same).

 

The smart money is the businesses that take (calculated) chances and mostly lead their sectors. The big money that follows too late will wither and die.

This has been proven time and again.

 

See:
http://www.winbeta.org/news/windows-10-holds-9-desktop-os-market-inches-towards-billion-installs


Old (and useless) O/S's keep falling, Win10 keeps climbing (9% market share end of November). Will it hit a billion installs in 3 years? Probably.

This is data for 4 months in. Not bad for sheer 'stats'.

More importantly, it is fully functional as a main O/S today and can only improve.

See:
http://www.extremetech.com/computing/191541-windows-10-the-best-hidden-features-tips-and-tricks


The link above gives some good tips (and some not so good...) of why Win10 is great, today.

 

If you work for any company every department has a budget they must say within. They don't give you a blank check and say do what you want. If you are in IT you for one should know that. The budget is there for a reason. Without one a company can go under fast. Yes we have no choice but to watch our $$$$.

 

Pretty much this and Microsoft knows what they're doing

1. Because Its a free OS unlike the others
2. Microsoft is still pushing Win 7/8/8.1 users to upgrade to 10 with annoying popups
3. The Average PC user dont know the negatives about Win 10 until they install it for themselves
4. Windows 8.1 users who upgraded thought it was going to be a better OS than Windows 8/8.1
5. People upgraded to test it out, since its a free OS (Reason #1)

 

Who said I was in IT? Lol... I'm a photographer...

But I also run a few companies, have used computers for many, many decades and have at least a few acquaintances that are above me in any and all things I have accomplished too (but which I constantly learn from).

Budgets are great, but they do not lead a company to greatness. Neither does an abundance of $$$$ make a company great either (by default). And as I've said; 10 minutes to 'educate' employees/clients, ~1 hour to install the free Win10 (including setting up the options to best benefit the user...) and then simply compare and contrast to how much time is spent on maintenance vs. previous O/S's and also how much smoother and more efficient workers get their tasks completed.

Maybe, that is the problem, huh? Those IT people really know how to hold on to their jobs...

Thank goodness that I don't have that problem; I can just use the tools that are the most effective, period.

 

Try not to conveniently ignore the replies I've already made. See post#207.

OS/x is also a free O/S, yet it has (in less than 4 months...), in all in incarnations, fallen to less than what this 'horrible' Win10 has gathered in market share.

MS is pushing Win10 to everyone, granted. They have finally figured out that supporting not only a billion different devices, but also a million different O/S's and their combinations (SP's, security updates that get installed, or not, etc.) is not the way forward for them any longer.

But please, go on and defend your points 3 & 4. In point form, please.

The people I've upgraded to Win10 (clients, family, friends and my employees) don't care what O/S is running as long as they can do what they want. NO complaints after a little 10 minute orientation (if they even needed that).

Win8/8.1 is an ancient and decrepit old O/S in front of Win10 - I know NOBODY that has actually used Win10 for longer than a day want to go back to that first baby steps of the way things are done now: Win10.

 

You have no idea what you are talking about as far as rolling out an OS, or what considerations are entered into to decide how / when to expend resources.

In the wider world of experienced professionals that really are responsible for this day to day as their full-time responsibility, your comments made no sense.

You shouldn't enter into this kind of conversation with professionals that do take these responsibilities seriously, you look as you would expect, clueless.

Even as an individual, responsible for your own work flow, pushing others into a buggy new OS release they don't need, you look irresponsible.

Please enjoy Windows 10, and take some nice Photo's

 

No, you have no clue of my capabilities or responsibilities (at all).

After I evaluated Win10 to my satisfaction on my personal systems; I rolled up my sleeves, updated my business, personal and my employees workstations and any others' computers that paid me to do so and showed them quickly and effortlessly how to use their 'new' system. Rolling out an O/S? Not that hard. I've installed (and re-installed) WinXP a bazillion times for my company since 2000 to about 2007...).

By the end of this month I expect to have over 500 installs/setups of Win10 under my belt (personally). Sure, that isn't 10K to 100K installs, but it more than gives me an idea of what is involved in moving systems, software and people to a new O/S with the least amount of issues and setbacks.

I'm also far from clueless, or irresponsible. It may look like that on this superficial forum interaction we get with each other, but your opinion of me is not important. Trying to defend your position is (and you're not doing that too well...).

The point is that the people I support (employees and clients) have trusted me on these issues for a long time. Yes, they were surprised when I seemed to do an about face with Win10... but like I told them; if you find it hindering you in any way; go back to your previous O/S. None have. Because the bogus issues that people keep coming and repeating here haven't shown up for the properly prepared and optimized installs I do for them and myself.

Oh... and 'gaming' is not one of my critical points of whether Win10 gets a passing mark from me or not (even if many of the installs I've done are being used for that by the owners, successfully (afaik)...).

The conversation you entered into is that Win10 is allowing me (and others) to be more productive than any O/S we've had before.

This isn't a conversation of IT professionals that faultily see any new O/S as 'buggy' without prior and in-depth investigation.

I'll again point to the 14 Million Corporate/Business/Small business clients that are using Win10 as we speak. What, are they daft in your eyes too?

If you think they are; I suggest you start your own thread and try to defend your points against them (if they care enough to show up).

But in this thread, you are making comments that make no sense and appear a little clueless yourself.

 

You are ignoring the experienced recommendations of people that do this professionally.

That it is unwise to use a newly released OS for production work.

Windows 10 offers no performance improvements over Windows 7/8.1 that will be useful at the desktop. Pick one and stick with it, and be productive.

Telling people they will reap great benefits from upgrading from Windows 7/8.1 to Windows 10 is untrue.

And, as far as servers go, that small improvement in IO performance pales in comparison to real storage servers in the same dedicated role.

Windows is not a good dedicated Storage Server OS.

Your thread posed the question, "Win10x64Pro upgrade from Win8.1 thoughts and musings...", and you have received learned answers from those that have been through these problems over many years, and we know for a fact that any new OS release needs baking before production.

Windows 10 is still a sticky raw mess, still in formation. The recipe isn't complete. As it can't decide what purpose it serves.

It's tough to watch you respond, and read the responses you make, as we know you are asking for trouble down the road, or sooner.

I do hope it works out for you

 

Really I new you were not in IT because how you were answering our questions .

 

Still ignoring the topic and comically attacking me personally. Cute.

 

The only experience I depend on is my own. None here have shown the 'dangers' of which you speak.

Win10 does offer better performance than Win7/8.1 - if only less maintenance each day/week/month required by the user (me) personally. But there are many more ways it excels over it's predecessors too (read the thread).

Again; I am not telling anyone to upgrade because of 'great benefits' - I don't know their workflows at all. I am stating that the systems I've upgraded for myself, my business/employees and my clients have shown significant improvement and am asking what other's experience with Win10 has been.

From first post, quoting myself a mere 5 days after Win10 became available worldwide:

So far, others including yourself have been guilty of telling me what I should do, rather than simply share their glory/horror story with Win10 as I asked.

I have made it 'work' out for me for the last few months already.

I don't use Windows as a storage server. That is what NAS is for.

hmscott said:

Easy to spew forth the expected/canned reaction to MS' products. But what specifically about Win10 is still forming that older O/S's can do?

The O/S is not the one to decide the purpose it serves - that is up to the user to decide how applicable it is to their uses.


sigh...

 

It's odd that Windows 10 made me rediscover Linux and re-embrace Windows 8.1 Pro. Good thing there are still choices. If 95% of my Steam games ran on Linux i'd jump ship tomorrow for good. The good news is that SteamOS is moving forward and more PC developers are embracing Linux.

 

I just have to ask, you are being serious here?

 

When it comes to what goes on in my companies, yes; I am.

I am long past needing to depend on external expert's opinions on many varied topics.

The O/S has long been off the table of anyone I may consult for many decades now.

(A security 'expert' came and told me that I need to be running Windows XP - just a few short years ago - if I wanted to fully utilize the latest and greatest security hardware. Needless to say that was the last time he stepped into my office... Especially after I asked why and his answer? Things just work better on XP. Duh. I was running Win8.0 at the time).

 

All I can say is wow. That is such flame bait, and I took it, Grrrrrrrr..........

 

And if I had someone came in and tell me I needed to run the latest and greatest OS and drivers all the time I'd send them packing too.

 

I like this one. Nice... *which criticize the company for the performance of Windows 10* and this one *this is just another sign that things are not going exactly as expected for the Redmond-based software giant*
@tilleroftheearth you've been very fortunate to have 100% success on all your upgrades. Not everyone has had the same experience as you .

http://news.softpedia.com/news/wind...soft-for-poor-system-performance-496880.shtml

 

No I am not attacking you and if I did come across sounding that way in my last post I am very sorry. We just disagree on.....how a IT dept is run and how you think it should be run.

Anyways back on track...I will look at installing W10 (maybe) in another year or so on one of my laptops if they fix many of the bugs in it. Until then I will be staying with W7

 

Wow, so this whole thread was created by one individual's personal preference of a particular OS and trying to make the case for everyone why they should move on and accept Windows 10 hook, line and stinker. After using Windows 10 and giving it a fair shake, I came to my conclusion that the negatives still outweigh the positives.

 

Thanks for mentioning that you gave it a 'fair shake' and you found the negatives to outweigh the positives.

But, without telling us what those negatives were, it is a less than complete statement.

Care to elaborate?

 

Again, I must ask; which bugs prevent you from using it today?

 

As I've already stated, many, many times; Do not upgrade. Clean installs need only apply (if you're looking for the best performance and bug free experience.

What can I say about a random user and how bad they've treated the O/S previously to doing the upgrade or how appropriately they tracked down and installed the proper drivers for their system(s) beforehand?

What I do know is that even the few systems I have 'upgraded', in place, have kept working without issues. In fact, many issues were fixed after the upgrade on at least a few of those too (things like Java not working properly for certain banking sites, etc.).

And this issue received 200 posts from just over 2 weeks after the O/S was introduced. Not impressive or important to me in the least...

Obviously just some anti-MS little boys and girls that smelled free money and decided to write up (make up?) their horror story and jump on that little bandwagon (that seems to have gone nowhere, btw...).

I am not discounting everyone's negative experience here; but the billions of combinations of O/S's, Programs, drivers, hardware and full/partial updates (security, features or otherwise) applied to those systems would make any logical person not to expect things to go smooth for each and every one.

Like I've said; I've seen two failures myself - but a clean install fixed those right up.

Now, what did these people do? Try to get a lawyer... sigh...

 

Why? If it really was proven in your workloads to actually be the greatest O/S?

 

I'm not quite following you here?

 

This time not biting. Seriously I am done with this thread though.

 

Your "proven" is strictly anecdotal and subjective. Any IT dept would have to calculate time and costs for training. On top of that they are not going to say yes until they are 99% sure the OS is stable. Windows 10 in it's current form is not a complete and totally working product.

Back in the 90's when I worked in data centers I was responsible for thousands of workstations for the City Govt. I had recommended Lotus Ami Pro (Windows based) when they were using Wordperfect DOS. I told how great Ami Pro was and suggested they consider it and replace the archaic WP for DOS. The idea was shot down before I finished saying Ami Pro. It was shot down for the reasons I listed: product was new, not proven to be a better alternative, unforeseen bugs, they had to retrain all the secretaries, at a considerable cost to the City. And retraining workers LOWERS productivity because of the learning curve.

That's how business and IT depts look at when considering a switch.

 

I agree , I am done too. Some just don't get it....bye

 

Why are you answering for HTWingNut?

Your example is not even in the same ball park. Windows 10 is not suggesting a different workflow at all. Just a better one (especially going forward).

Even a user that worked only with Windows 2000 could be brought up to speed from that buggy and archaic O/S would need less than 10 minutes to learn how to 'get things done' today.

I know how business and IT depts think. But keeping a view on the bottom line for this quarter is very short sighted, no matter how big your business is...

 

I really don't get your 'participation'? Asking questions now offends you?

Or, did you run out of things to defend your position(s)?

 

The problem is that you see this modern colored tile Os almost hassle free. It is not... Just from your point of view . Even if you have the proper hardware and doing everything flawlessly as many have done, there is still too much bugs with this Os. Maybe in a year or two but not now... In addition Mocro$oft have to change its policy on enforced patches and drivers. The problem with forced drivers and patches remove many from wanting to have this pastel tile OS. Telemetry also makes the choice easier for many to not use this tiled junk. You may like telemetry, forced driver installation and forced patches but many will avoid that. I know much can be fine-tuned in this colored tile junk but not everyone wants to be forced into this job...
Don't forget that there are many tens of thousands who do not like this Os and they experienced - will experience much more trouble when they use this new Os in the coming period(1 or two year). Everyone knows that a new Os have diseases. Therefore will many Os users wait until these are rectified. I wish you Good luck with the use of this new colored tile Os. It COULD be that NSA is not interested in your pictures. But you never know .

 

In your opinion, that is.

Well, first and foremost, W2K was not buggy at all for those of us who ran it on proper hardware.

Secondly, jumping from W2K into Vista/W7 - let alone any newer MS offering - would require a lot more than 10 minutes for just about anything and anyone...

Well, my own experiences pretty much mirror Roadster's...I have yet to see a serious big business environment adopting W10. Most of the ones I deal with - which are upper-tier-Fortune 50 companies - are still on W7 and will remain there for the foreseeable future...fixing what's not broken is a proven path to disaster and these folks know it all too well...

 

OK, that is what was needed, prodding with flame bait to stay in the thread, this now is closed!