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    Windows 10

    Discussion in 'Windows OS and Software' started by WhatsThePoint, Sep 30, 2014.

  1. bolt.pt

    bolt.pt Notebook Evangelist

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    If you want to safely test it, I'd advise to install it in a virtual machine or at least a VHD. No messing with partitions that way, and you can get rid of it whenever.
     
  2. Spartan@HIDevolution

    Spartan@HIDevolution Company Representative

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  3. KernalPanic

    KernalPanic White Knight

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  4. brncao

    brncao Notebook Evangelist

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    So they skipped Windows 9 and went with Windows 10 huh?

     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 12, 2015
  5. Apollo13

    Apollo13 100% 16:10 Screens

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    To me, Windows 10 is Windows 6.4. When I tell my close tech friends that I'm on Windows 5.2 or Windows 6.1 or am doing some retro gaming on Windows 4.1, they know exactly what I mean. Same with 6.4.

    While some of the features, notably the command-line improvements, do look nice, I haven't actually installed the preview yet (though I have downloaded it). The privacy policy KernalPanic mentioned is half the reason, with other life events being the other half. It's kinda draconian, and while I get that they're trying to catch bugs and get usage stats and so forth, it's the type of thing that means I wouldn't really want to put my development projects on it, nor my Steam account... nor anything else that I'd actually intensively use it with. Which becomes an issue because otherwise I'm not really evaluating it. Collecting information about files and characters that are typed... doesn't quite go hand-in-hand with keeping closed-source development private.

    I do hope they get rid of the magnifying glass search, or at least have an option to disable it, though. It seems like the evolution of the Address Toolbar in XP that was removed in SP3 (but never removed from 5.2), which let you type in any address such as C:\Windows or Microsoft Corporation into the toolbar in your taskbar and go there (either in Windows Explorer, or your default browser). It never really caught on, perhaps because it's not really much if any more convenient than just going over to Windows Explorer or your favorite browser and using that to get where you want to go. But at least it didn't auto-populate with celebrity gossip news from MSN. That screenshot on HowToGeek reminded me of why I always change the home page for IE on any computer for which I wind up using IE more than twice a year or so (which fortunately isn't very many computers).

    Sure, you could always just not use it, but inevitably there'd by times I'd accidentally click on it and get Justin Beiber news instead of the Start menu... no thanks.
     
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  6. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    Not a fan of VM's but I do recognize the need. I prefer a dual boot as then I can also experience the software on the current hardware. Install went smoothly it just did not want to cooperate with Windows 7 on a MBR. This could well be my specific hardware. I do not have a true UEFI or regular bios. The bios here has a UEFI compatibility setting. Even then you never enter a true UEFI bios. Leave it so Samsung.
     
  7. James D

    James D Notebook Prophet

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    This makes me think twice if I need to install it on 2nd partition. And I don't want to use VM because afraid to make my current OS way dirtier. I always use Uninstall Tool for deleting all remnants of uninstalled programs.

    MS, this are Golden words. To find out what OS to create you must look how people modify the look of current OS by third-party software and customisation! Some people used rocket dock with transparent launch links and some used gadgets. THEN WHY THE F... DID YOU CUT AERO WITH ROUNDED WINDOW'S CORNERS AND BROUGHT SQUARES WITH COLOR Palette OF SICK EPILEPTIC DESIGNER?!
    I guess I will write this feedback
     
  8. a3s

    a3s Newbie

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    Windows8=Windows7-Windows4=Windows3
    so
    Windows10=Windows8+Windows4=Windows7

    You don't want to ask. Windows 9 is Windows 8 Stasi Edition
     
  9. bolt.pt

    bolt.pt Notebook Evangelist

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    Yeah, for some reason that button is trying to become the "Internet Button" of Windows 10. You know, as less-knowledgeable people use to call Internet Explorer, and if the IE button goes missing from the desktop they go "hey, the internet is gone!". Add some celeb gossip or other mainstream stuff in there and there you have it, random entertainment for the average dude out there.

    Now I'm hoping that is removable in the future, and at the very least you can configure it to get the crap celeb stuff out of the way.

    Aside from that, it would be nice to have Control Panel and PC Settings harmonized. PC Settings should be the metro version of Control Panel, not have unique features. I don't really have any qualms about anything else I recall.

    Well, you can do that with a VHD, it's just a virtual partition, won't mess up your disk scheme and whatever else. At any rate, always do keep a full backup image of your current OS just in case, we never know when sh*t hits the fan.

    Here are some instructions if you're interested:

    Virtual Hard Disk - Create and Attach VHD - Windows 7 Help Forums

    Virtual Hard Drive VHD File - Create and Start with at Boot - Windows 7 Help Forums

    I've installed Windows 10 TP that way in my Vaio SVS15 (it also has a sort of UEFI, although I keep the partition scheme as MBR) and it works flawlessly. No driver problems whatsoever, which sort of amazed me with all the crap laptop drivers usually are. I've had to download a couple of them from Sony support site (fingerprint reader and stuff like that), but 95% of the hardware was recognized by Windows as default.
     
  10. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    Thanks, I would not have thought of using a VHD but my issues are much deeper. There are two physical drives and an iSSD. My primary SSD is dedicated to the OS. My space to use for the other OS would be from the secondary HDD. Also my system is well known for issues with OS and the iSSD. Besides all this the bios treatment of UEFI is funky, see all the Samsung bricked issues with Windows 8.0 and 8.1. This threw out a chkdsk error for c:\, e:\, g:\ (Windows 10 partition), and my iSSD on f:\, this besides before that starting up windows 7 and it claiming it needed to do a repair. Got myself out of it once, not looking forward to a round two. Full backup or not!
     
  11. a3s

    a3s Newbie

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    yes, like chrome 43922.9.16
    or web234874567.0
    it's the Newer and Improveder Version Number, version 349123394547.0

    but really, I'd pay for security maintenance and hardware driver maintenance. $80 for 10 years is 0.8 per year.
    XP is still the best, so let ms create a secure XP. and non-microsoft developers can continue to create better file managers, browsers, email clients, and so on.

    think of the OS as you think of a shower valve. You operate the valve much the same way as humans operated valves 100 years ago, but the seals need replacing far less often, and improved safety works without your conscious attention, for example, the anti-scald feature.
     
  12. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    For me the Windows 10 Anti-Scald feature did not work too well. :)
     
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  13. Pirx

    Pirx Notebook Virtuoso

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    So you got burned, too, eh?
     
  14. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    Singed not burnt, pulling away from the install and applying a little TLC solved everything. Just have to treat the system like it is a big kid throwing a temper tantrum. :)
     
  15. Apollo13

    Apollo13 100% 16:10 Screens

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    Indeed, the classic IE = The Internet. It's always been possible to remove the IE button though, so hopefully the same is true for the Internet button.

    I do agree that if it were configurable, that also would make it much more tolerable. If I got AnandTech headlines when I accidentally clicked on it instead of celebrity gossip news, it would go a long way towards making it palatable.
     
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  16. Falco152

    Falco152 Notebook Demon

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    It be nice if they bring back the search charms bar in a similar way they did for W8.
    Shortcut keys to explicit search categories

    (It pretty much replaced my use of the start screen and start menu use.)
     
  17. James D

    James D Notebook Prophet

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    I just thought how great 8 could be if they designed it not by mental people.
    Just imagine! people can decide how to open charms-bar: clicking on the very edge and swiping or as it is now. People could put their own shortcuts there and some specific settings launcher from big list, slider of brightness if I want, gadgets or metro apps, triggers and macroses. GOSH, HOW GREAT IT COULD BE IF PEOPLE COULD MODIFY ALL IN IT! People could delete useless stuff like that inet button.
    MS, whole MS is just mental because they live in another reality and amount of money they have protects them.
     
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  18. Spartan@HIDevolution

    Spartan@HIDevolution Company Representative

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    And Windows 10 is no different from what I have read so far. I did not and am not going to waste one second on any OS with this metro crap / diff. control panels for diff. things

    Just give me the better hardware support of Windows 8 / 10 and slap it on to Windows 7 and you have the best OS in time!
     
  19. bolt.pt

    bolt.pt Notebook Evangelist

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    Also Windows 8 is lighter on resources than 7. And the task manager and the Win + X menu. Yummy.

    I don't think I would have a single reason to go back to 7 ever, but well, that's just me :p
     
  20. Spartan@HIDevolution

    Spartan@HIDevolution Company Representative

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    but 8 loses in every benchmark you throw at it compared to 7 so all those "better optimized for newer hardware" "faster boot" , etc, mean nothing to me
     
  21. bolt.pt

    bolt.pt Notebook Evangelist

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    That is a lie.

    I'll follow through with some examples from the top results I got by googling "windows 8.1 vs 7 benchmarks".

    From a 2012 analysis: Gentlemen, start your benches: Measuring Windows 8’s performance | Ars Technica

    Another source from 2012: http://www.zdnet.com/windows-8-vs-windows-7-benchmarked_p3-7000002671/

    From another point of view, more recent, less emphasis on benchmarks: Windows 8.1 vs. Windows 7 – Which is best for you? | IT PRO

    More recent benchmarks: Windows 7 vs Windows 8.1 Gaming Benchmark Comparison

    BF4 testing from HardOCP: HARDOCP - Conclusion - Battlefield 4 Windows 7 vs. 8.1 Performance Review


    Again, I don't see a single reason to go back to 7 ever unless you have compatibility problems in some way (which would be rare, since Windows 8.1 has better HW compatibility than 7 across the board).

    The upgrade from 7 -> 8 was almost free, and 8 -> 8.1 free, so that was a given. I can understand that right now people may not want to pay whatever is the full price for the Windows 8.1 disk, though, especially with 10 just around the corner.
     
  22. StormJumper

    StormJumper Notebook Virtuoso

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    Here we go again...W8 is faster but not by much(need to get off the koolaid) and endusers want to go back to W7 not go W8 after the W8 Debacle/hardware/driver problems. This is the real comparison. Why else would you think Corporation/Institutions are going to W7 Sp1 because W8 is a waste of working hardware drivers and lack of training evolution. All those endusers, I talked to so far instead of upgrading W8 to W8.1 some of which went to Mac instead and some went looking for used W7 installed and now happy. Now if that doesn't tell you evidence then you missed the boat. For all the bells/whistles of W8 it has alienated more PC users then bringing in more that is the real test of how much a O/S is accepted. You can go on all the benchmark but the endusers are the real benchmark of a O/S acceptance and W8/8.1 so far has become a dismissal failure... given a "F" grade....
     
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  23. Spartan@HIDevolution

    Spartan@HIDevolution Company Representative

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    Those benchmarks mean nothing to me, I have benchmark comparisons for both 7 and 8. My laptop actually came with Windows 8.1 but I wouldn't use that even if you paid me. Don't want no stupid metro interface running in the background, don't want my control panel options split across 2 portions one for metro and one in the classic control panel, don't want no mediocore Wireless Networks Management. Don't need any OneDrive integration into the OS, the list can go on forever.....

    Enjoy these.....

    Samsung 850 PRO 256GB Single SSD Setup:

    AS SSD Benchmark with IRST 12.8.0.1016 (W7)

    [​IMG]

    AS SSD Benchmark with IRST 12.8.0.1016 (W8.1)

    [​IMG]


    PassMark Performance Test @ 4GHz with 4810MQ [W7]

    [​IMG]

    PassMark Performance Test @ 4GHz with 4810MQ [W8.1]

    [​IMG]

    AMD Radeon R9 M290X Crossfire with Driver 13.251.3.5 (W7)

    [​IMG]

    AMD Radeon R9 M290X Crossfire with Driver 13.251.3.5 (W8.1)

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  24. Pirx

    Pirx Notebook Virtuoso

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    That means very little, since it mostly shows your lack of insight into professional and enterprise computing needs. Suffice it to say that there's very good reasons why, in professional environments, Windows 8.x has been the most thoroughly rejected version of Windows ever. Good-old Windows Vista was a raging success compared to Windows 8.x.

    P.S.: I will say that anyone arguing performance differences between Windows 7 and Windows 8.x just makes a fool out of him/herself. The differences between the two are so minute, one way or another, as to be laughable. That includes boot times, by the way, on modern hardware.
     
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  25. KernalPanic

    KernalPanic White Knight

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    Windows 8 does indeed have better hardware compatibility... with touch devices and tablet features.
    With anything desktop using a mouse as your primary input device, Windows 7 is just as good.
    Note, this is not a rip on Win8 in any way... I consider them equals with Win8 having an advantage in touch devices ONLY.

    Windows 8 performance out of box is slightly better than Windows 7 performance.
    However, if you are even moderately competent,(meaning you can read, search on Google, and follow instructions) Windows 7 will be pretty much equal.
    A reminder that most of your audience here is head-and-shoulders better than that.

    That being said, the performance differences between 7 and 8 are not really conclusive in any way shape or form. I would not consider performance in any way to be a determining factor for using 7 or 8 as they are so close that it just plain doesn't matter.

    Where Win8 fails is software compatibility and user interface. Everything else is pretty much equal or very slightly improved.
    Anything else is someone selling you something.
     
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  26. Jobine

    Jobine Notebook Prophet

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    If you use windows 8.1 you will be downvoted to hell flamed because it is not only hated by linux fans, but also by die-hard windows users alike.

    Personally i just don't care what everyone else thinks and i use whatever suits me best. For me, I have improved battery life and UEFI boot logo integration on Windows 8.1, and i run Slackware Linux as my dual boot.

    Also Classic Shell fixed most of my gripes with Windows 8, i haven't seen the start screen or charms bar in ages.
     
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  27. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    The market has spoken on Windows 8.x, end of story! New story (and back on topic), will the company learn from its mistake(s) and actually make a better than Windows 7 OS/UI or suffer a second marketing failure?
     
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  28. Spartan@HIDevolution

    Spartan@HIDevolution Company Representative

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    Very true, Windows 8 is gone, why do Windows 8 users feel the need to pop in every Windows 7 or now Windows 10 thread expressing how great Windows 8 is? Truth is, it isn't, that's why 90% of the world prefers Windows 7. If you're happy With Windows 8, please be, at the end, it's what works best for you. Truth is, if Windows 8 was so great as some say, then Microshaft wouldn't have released Windows 10 so fast to clean up their mess.
     
  29. SL2

    SL2 Notebook Deity

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    I wouldn't call it fast. Yes, at first it sounded like W10 would show up earlier than expected, but now they're saying mid 2014, which is close to 3 years after W8. W10TP was released more than 3 years after W8DP. Either way, MS needs W10 now.
     
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  30. bolt.pt

    bolt.pt Notebook Evangelist

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    8.1 being faster wasn't my point, just it not being any slower. I don't care much about benchmarks, never was my argument, just wanted to show that it is a pointless argument altogether.

    Also I've installed Windows 8 on dozens of computers (mostly cheap laptops) and never had anyone ask me to go back to 7. All those people were end-users, most would easily represent your average Joe and they wouldn't know Windows 7 from 8 with a few interface tweaks here and there. And no, I did not install a single Classic Shell or similar software.

    The only hardware problem encountered so far being in old AMD laptops (like 2008 old) in Windows 8.1 due to some changes in the boot process. For the rest of them, equal or better than Windows 7 in device recognition.

    It became trendy to dislike Windows 8. Everyone that I know that mocked Windows 8 had no idea what they were talking about, but still they bashed it;

    Now, Windows 8 is far from perfect, and I think that forced changes with the Start Screen and stuff like that irked people, and there I give reason to people: don't force changes for the sake of changes.

    This is a great article in that sense (it was linked before in this very thread, just mentioning it again): It’s Time to Criticize Windows 10 While We Still Have a Chance

    And were we talking about enterprise / professional computing needs? I wasn't, and I think the post I quoted wasn't as well. Commenting my insight of enterprise / professional needs doesn't make any sense, since you don't know me and it's a topic I haven't yet touched.

    That aside, I agree with your other statements, it's pretty much the point I was getting to.

    And again I say: I see no reason to go back to Windows 7. It's not faster, it's heavier on resources; Interface? Should be easy enough to change if you care.

    I don't care about benchmarks, just wanted to show you that what you said isn't true.

    The "stupid metro interface" is something I don't see and I don't care about it; Windows 7 is not lighter, even without the "stupid metro interface".

    I don't know about your PC Settings usage, but I think I used the options present only there like once or twice in the past year. It doesn't make the slightest difference for me. That said, my opinion is that the settings should be mirrored in both places, one for Desktop and the other for Touch, and it makes little sense like it is now. It is feedback I gave to MS already.

    About the Wireless Network Manager, that was stupid. I don't see the point of removing the ability to fully manage Wireless Networks from a decent interface rather than CLI. This did not affect my use in any way (nor does affect the average Joe), since I don't need to remove Network Profiles I'm not connected to, but a decent manager should be brought back by MS. Feedback given, as it should. You could use WinFi or something similar meanwhile if you really needed that.

    OneDrive integration makes sense to me (although it could be better, maybe in Windows 10), but you can opt out very easily, especially if you don't use a Microsoft Account to sign in. Doesn't affect me or the average Joe in any way, just don't enable it if you don't want it (like I did).

    You have your own reasons to not wanting Windows 8, 9, 10, whatever. Each one to his own.

    But it seems to me that the things that nag you are completely invisible to the average user out there. Except the UI, but that is easily changeable.

    I mostly agree with you. Haven't seen any worse software / drivers experience, if anything better in all PCs I've worked on / configured for other people, and have no gripes about the UI myself (easily fixable, but Windows 10 finally brings choice back which is a plus). You probably have a different experience, but hey we can't all be the same :p.

    At any rate, I don't get the hate Windows 8 / 8.1 brings on some people; hence my posts.


    Windows 8* :p.

    I don't use Classic Shell and also haven't seen Start Screen / Charms Bar in ages ^^.

    I don't care a bit about the Start Menu, I just use Win + W / S / F to search for whatever setting / app / file I want, and Win + X or CLI for the management stuff. I can understand that people like to use Start Menu, hence my joy of seeing an improved version of it coming back with 10 (choice is power!).

    I use Linux Mint (some OpenSUSE in the past) for my Unix needs, but I've heard good things about Slackware as well. Good that it works out for you ;)
     
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  31. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    Bolt, we all wanted Windows 8 when it came out looking to be an improvement on Windows 7, until that was changed. If it is true that Windows 10 will finally be the improvement to Windows & we will want that. The only discussion belonging here of Windows 8 is that it is, at least in name, being replaced.

    All our hope is that is not the only thing happening. If this is just a name change with some new lipstick for the prior UI version then it is dead out of the gate. As it stands today little has been done, even maybe not as much, as add on apps accomplished for the old UI. So we are here waiting to see if they will keep their word and listen to the PC community.
     
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  32. tijo

    tijo Sacred Blame

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    You mean like windows 7 users pop in Windows 8 threads? I've seen that behavior coming from both sides. In the end, any member is free to post as long as they respect the forum rules and I see this thread is very slowly heading downwards again. Windows 10 being the next version of Windows, it makes sense to discuss it from the perspective of both 7 and 8.x users. Ultimately, the thread is about Windows 10, so getting back to that topic is a good idea, but it's going to be hard to discussing 10 without discussing certain aspects of 8 and 7. Also, anyone who gets in the Windows 8 vs 7 debate whether they started it or not is equally guilty of thread derailing in my opinion.
     
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  33. KernalPanic

    KernalPanic White Knight

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    More news on my experiences with 10.

    I am going to focus on what really matters to me... software actually working.

    My experiences with a few other older "user" type programs have indeed turned out positive.
    One of the most ancient programs I still have to install that never worked in 8/8.1 worked marvelously without modification on 10.
    It actually a win3.1 program... so this is a giant step forward IMHO.

    One of these programs (an older accounting program that always broke when I opened check printing - dubbed appropriately "check print") finally showed signs of starting to work as well. This is not a complete victory as the window never completes drawing, but usually at that point I can get compatibility settings to finish the job for me. (In 8/8.1 it doesn't even pull up the check to print... it either crashes or freezes.) I'll keep fiddling with this. The suggested settings are win8 compatibility... lol!)

    Database programs running a local database still confound 10. I can't even get them to start to troubleshoot. Oddly enough, the same program calling a database off the windows 10 machine (even another workstation... even a windows 7 workstation) works fine! I keep thinking this is a permissions or security problem. (the database in question is the sample database for the program)

    Cisco Anyconnect hates Win 10 period. It doesn't seem to matter what I am connecting to. Anyone get it to work?
    I tried the suggested compatibility mode. (oddly enough win8 mode once again) Same program, same target works in win7. Why am I not surprised?

    Has anyone gotten a USB->serial to work and stay connected to any Cisco device for longer than 2 minutes?
    Mine keeps kicking me... and this is with me making sure there is traffic so it isn't some silly power saving thing.
    I've tried every setting I can think of and a couple different programs and a couple different USB->serial adapters. Same programs and adapters work in 7 no problem.
    If you got it to work and stay connected, which program and which USB->serial adapter?
     
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  34. ATG

    ATG 2x4 Super Moderator

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    No surprise here lol Cisco's VPN software installations have always been hit or miss in my experience, for example once after many hours of troubleshooting I had to reinstall Windows7 to make it work..
    In this case I suspect the problem is in the driver and I doubt it will work until Cisco releases a genuine W10 driver and even so it still might not work.. :p
     
  35. Jobine

    Jobine Notebook Prophet

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    The fact that you can run programs that were written 20 years ago on a fully modern and (mostly) secure OS still boggles me. While windows does lack proper command-line tools, i still respect microsoft for preserving binary legacy, something Apple has trashed a long time ago (R.I.P Rosetta).

    And before people tell me "oh just update your programs"... not always easily done if you work in the industry and single licenses cost thousands of dollars.

    Still a bit pissed that i can't run 16 bit binaries on Win64.

    Most of the hate towards Vista was because of it's buggyness, which was caused by high system requirements at the time, and a new type of driver. But look now, Windows 10 is still compatible with most vista drivers (released 9 years ago?) and since the hardware requirements haven't changed since, today's tablets now effortlessly run something a 2004 pentium 4 couldn't.
     
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  36. tijo

    tijo Sacred Blame

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    Yup, then there is software that might not be available anymore and don't get me started on the software to operate lab equipment that costs thousands of dollars but that still runs on Windows XP, etc. or the cost of updating said software. Sometimes, it feels like some of those equipment manufacturers can't make decent software if their lives depended on it.

    ANSYS software tends to be pretty expensive, especially if you go for the cluster license. Any time you see "contact us to get a quote" instead of a price tag on software, you know it's gonna cost ya! If you are running an earlier version of the software, it's likely that it's what you'll be running for quite some time.
     
  37. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    There is no longer a 7 vs. 8 debate, even the company is moving on. The thread needs to concentrate on Windows 10 being an actual success and the company, IN ITS OWN WORDS, actually listening this time! Truth be told, and I so hope that I am wrong, I do not trust or believe them.

    We are not stuck on aero, nor other features. We do not want or need Windows 7 back, we already have that. Give us a better OS and UI and we will flock to it. To that end if they ignore their steadfast consumer base again though they will do so at their own peril.
     
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  38. baii

    baii Sone

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    I give up trying to use the feedback app~~

    anyways, I think it would be nice to bring back more win7 elements for the desktop side. ie, It is so silly to pick wifi connection in the charm bar... put that back as a pop up bubble thingy.
     
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  39. tijo

    tijo Sacred Blame

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    What I meant was the 7 vs 8 discussion that started popping up in this thread like in every Windows thread lately. Better to stop it before it actually gains momentum and the thread really derails.
     
  40. StormJumper

    StormJumper Notebook Virtuoso

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    Problem is their own actions speaker louder then what they are trying to do and what people actually see come out of development.

    Sounds simple but those W7 features were useful something a first from M$ to make. But from all the advice they seem to have a collective memory loss in remembering from W8 tester I doubt a New O/S will bring them back. Some have moved on as well to Mac and Linux and Chrome O/S as result of what M$ did. Not what the users did...M$ is the primary party to blame here.
     
  41. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    If they have nothing better, than I say bring it back. Again who am I to say. What I mean in the end is we are not stuck, we can easily move on, but to move on just for the sake of moving on is not always an good thing.

    Edit; as an example of not trusting M$, in 02/2013 they put out a patch for IE 10 and beyond KB2670838. This is now a mandatory patch for IE 10 and 11 and on a lot of Windows 7 systems it is to supposedly help bring the Windows 8 experience to windows 7. Well what it does to a lot of systems is break DWM and Aero Glass. Some have had other issues with it as well. To date they have not fixed this patch and the Aero issues, so here they are giving yet another reason not to upgrade to Windows 8, they are trying too take away Aero!

    I should note this pulls aero from by P79xx (GTX260m) but the patch does not pull it from my NP700G7 (GTX675m). So this is a fixable issue.
     
  42. Mr.Koala

    Mr.Koala Notebook Virtuoso

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    I would be really great if you can get it running with a few thousands of dollars. In many cases what needs to run is abandonware and no one wants your money. I can't even recall for how many times I've tried to bring ancientware back into production by dusting off old machines, running old OSes in VMs or drinking WINE.
     
  43. Apollo13

    Apollo13 100% 16:10 Screens

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    Indeed, Windows' backward compatibility is impressive. I'm still waiting for the first report of software that doesn't work on Windows 10 (but does on 8.1 32-bit) because it does a check like: if (windows.version.startsWith("1")) to do something different on Windows 1.x from Windows 2.x. Since, theoretically, most Windows 1.x software probably should work with Windows 10 32-bit.

    And it is indeed a bummer that 16-bit software won't run on 64-bit Windows. I almost went with 32-bit Windows when I built my desktop in late 2011 because of that; greater RAM only narrowly won out and then mainly because I figured with a 1 GB GPU, I'd be considerably below 4 GB total on 32-bit. But nonetheless, it would be nice to be able to run 16-bit software (or software with 16-bit installers) easily on 64-bit Windows. And I'm pretty sure it's just a Windows limitation, not an x86-64 limitation.
     
  44. TANWare

    TANWare Just This Side of Senile, I think. Super Moderator

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    Off topic but you are always below 4GB on a 32bit OS. as far as 1GB vram, is it shared memory?
     
  45. tijo

    tijo Sacred Blame

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    Yes, it is a Windows limitation, Microsoft made the decision to cut support for 16-bit with Windows 7 x64. That being said, I'm kinda surprised they kept it for so long, if it's just the installer, maybe it could be worked with somehow though. I personally consider bundling a 16-bit installer with a 32-bit program laziness, but that won't help the people having to deal with said issues because the software vendor was lazy.

    That got me curious does x86 10 still support 16-bit?
     
  46. Dufus

    Dufus .

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    16-bit in x64 is not a windows limitation while 4GB in a 32-bit OS is. Use a VM in x64 for 16-bit. 1GB Graphics card will likely use ~256MB of 4GB addresses for 32-bit.

    Yes, W10 32-bit will run 16-bit although NTVDM is not installed by default.
     
  47. Spartan@HIDevolution

    Spartan@HIDevolution Company Representative

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    I just did a clean install of Windows 7 and as I was going carefully through the updates, I didn't see any KB2670838. Has it been removed?
     
  48. S.SubZero

    S.SubZero Notebook Deity

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    There's two things here:

    1. XP Mode = 16-bit apps in Windows 7 x64

    2. While MS decided not to directly code in a 16-bit subsystem, that's partially because the work to do so would be large compared to the 32-bit support, which the processor does natively. The x64 architecture doesn't directly support 16-bit code except if you (aka the OS) provides the entire infrastructure to do it.

    x86-64 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    ...which XP Mode, or any virtualization software, does.

    (also, XP64 in 2005, four years before Win7, was the first x64-based OS from Microsoft)
     
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  49. StormJumper

    StormJumper Notebook Virtuoso

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    Don't know about you but I had to rebuild my complete system for my Desktop and hopefully I don't see it but I have to check my offline download to see. I finally broke down and got a SSD 256gig for my main boot.
     
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  50. Spartan@HIDevolution

    Spartan@HIDevolution Company Representative

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    Now you will experience super turbo performance that you'll never be able to use an HDD anymore! :) Congrats dawg
     
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